Hi Everyone

Hi Everyone!

I wanted to say hi, because I have been reading a lot of the forums and it really helps my understanding your process better, so I wanted to say thank you for sharing your experiences and insight.

I'm not technically neurotypical, I have a pretty hefty case of ADHD that I was diagnosed pretty late in life. There is still a lot for me to learn about my own condition, but I have gotten myself in a situation where I need some input from your community, because I think I'm emotionally involved with an aspie. I say that cautiously, because I don't want to make any assumptions, but I used to date a man that was diagnosed with high functioning autism a few years back. At that time, I did a lot of research to be able to communicate effectively and support his needs. That means that I have a base understanding that is meshed with my understanding of ADHD and the overlap with autism. So, that all that being said, let me tell you what my situation is:

I have a close friend whom I met on a dating app about a year ago and I've felt very drawn to him pretty soon after we met. He is a wonderful person that I genuinely enjoy spending time with and flat out adore. I think I like him more than any other person in my life. He's a little odd and has a number of intense interests and a weirdly compelling way of communicating. It's very precise, uses a lot of references, and is long winded without being boring or overwhelming. None of that bothered me, but it was notable. I just didn't give it much attention, because I have a lot of odd ADHD quirks myself, that I try to communicate clearly.

After we met, maybe two or so months of texting a lot and meeting up a couple of times and after an large amount mixed signals from him, I took a leap of faith and asked him if he would be interested in dating me because I like him a lot and I would like to see where this goes. He declined very politely and told me that he wants to be friends with me and that he values our friendship very highly. I responded that it's okay since I haven't really developed any deep romantic feelings yet, and that I would love to build a real friendship. Side note: Of course, I felt disappointed, mortified, and awkward for a while, because rejection is never easy, but I also didn't understand because everything was going so well and we were such a good match considering out core values, hobbies, and interests. At some point, I just figured that he wasn't attracted to me and let it go.

We continued talking almost daily and meeting up about once or twice a week as our schedules allowed (he tells me that he talks to me more than to any other person in his life). Every time we do hang out, it's great, we start talking and laughing and suddenly it's 6 hours later. I noticed a lot of similarities between his behavior and my ADHD and at some point just assumed that he must have ADHD and was just never diagnosed.
Fast forward a few months and I started to see a lot of traits that my ex who is an aspie exhibited as well (it literally came to me as an epiphany less than two weeks ago in the middle of the night).

I considered the thought that my friend might have high functioning autism and a lot of his behaviors started to make sense (especially not understanding why people react in a certain way to specific triggers and his communication and responses to my communication that was very uncommon for NTs in my experience). Now, I have to add that I'm very open about my personal struggles and have sought his advice regarding that in the past. My ADHD is not a secret and he knows that I am very sensitive and compassionate towards things like mental illness or whatever impairments we are given and need to navigate. He confides in me about all kinds of stuff and he knows that I am a safe space to talk about anything, but now I am in an odd position.

If he does really have ASD, he masks well, which would imply that he knows that he has it and he has been working on coping mechanisms etc. If he does know, why hasn't he told me? Should I ask him? Is that offensive? Is he scared I'll disappear if he tells me? What if I'm wrong? Am I doing him a disservice by assuming that he is an aspie? And then... what if he has ASD but he doesn't know and just adjusted to his environment over the years... I don't know what to do.

He told me once that he spent a long time during his childhood in therapy. I didn't pry or asked why, I just listened to him vent. I always believed that people will tell you what they want to tell you when they are ready.

Now I am stuck in this weird new dynamic where I if I could get confirmation I could adjust my communication to accommodate his needs better. I could tell him that I have a good amount of knowledge in regard to the subject and he would likely feel a lot more comfortable around me if he knew that. But, Again, what if I'm dead wrong? Then I'd just offend the guy if I bring it up.

I don't want to deceive him or test him or anything like that. The thought makes my stomach turn. I know that essentially, nothing is going to change between us. ASD or not, but if I am right, I wouldn't want to be his friend any less. If I'm honest, I want to more than his friend, because I'm absolutely smitten with him, but he rejected me once and I'm not going to push that subject. I'd just make a fool of myself.

My takeaway now is that I decided to adjust my communication style accordingly so that if he really has ASD, it'll be easier for him to understand me. Maybe I'm right and maybe he'll feel comfortable enough to tell me, but I can't push that.

What do you think? I know I can't get any real answers unless I'd flat out ask him, but it's a sensitive topic and I don't want to make him upset. I would really appreciate your input, though.

Also, I want to add that I have a high EQ and a good amount of experience in translating NT behavior to ND people. If any of you need some help navigating a situation, let me know. I would like to help and also learn.

Hello and welcome to the forum @aka_RIN.

I think instead of adapting your communication style because of what you learned about autism, you could focus on developing clear communication with your friend and find out what communication style works best for the both of you together. Every autistic person will be slightly different in how they communicate best, and you will have your own needs, too. So it sounds like the much more important thing is to figure out how the two of you can communicate best with each other rather than following some protocols that you learned about autistic people.

You don’t need confirmation of whether he is autistic or not to simply learn about him and ask him questions about what sort of communication and socializing is most comfortable for him, while also sharing the same about yourself.

Rodafina said:

Hello and welcome to the forum @aka_RIN.

I think instead of adapting your communication style because of what you learned about autism, you could focus on developing clear communication with your friend and find out what communication style works best for the both of you together. Every autistic person will be slightly different in how they communicate best, and you will have your own needs, too. So it sounds like the much more important thing is to figure out how the two of you can communicate best with each other rather than following some protocols that you learned about autistic people.

You don’t need confirmation of whether he is autistic or not to simply learn about him and ask him questions about what sort of communication and socializing is most comfortable for him, while also sharing the same about yourself.

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Thank you for your input. I might be overthinking the whole thing. I just want to do right by him. I think you are right too, because I also don't want our dynamic to change by me picking everything apart either.

Welcome my personal opinion: it sounds like you two are close and have already built trust. I think it makes sense to bring up the topic of autism when the timing feels right. If he doesn’t know he is autistic, this self discovery may really help him. It is suuuuuch a hard thing to decide on though. I question whether my best friend has autism and have been considering bringing it up to her. The fear is for the conversation to cause harm in any way.

Glad to have you with us, @aka_RIN

I'm in agreement with Rodafina. Communication is a two way road. A road that has to be flowing in both directions. If one side is blocked off, there is not a compromise being made. Just a unhealthy amount of effort from one side.

One of the big things that is shared between autistics and ADHDers, is the socail misunderstanding of how things work. But part of helping him, is also helping yourself. If he is autistic and his no idea. Then the information will likely come as a surprise. But if he is aware, like you suspect. Then a conversation about how you two can communicate better is definitely advised. Either way. It's not a bad thing to try for better understanding and communication.

One thing to keep in mind is that outer reactions will not match internal ones, always. Especially for us guys. But if it is the case that he is unaware. Then he will likely try process this and want to know more when he is ready.

Hi @aka_RIN and welcome.
Just to say initially that was a really nicely written post, very clear and well laid out, and seemed to be well considered and open minded.

There can be so many reasons for your situation regardless of whether he would diagnose specifically as ASD my thought would be for you to try and not focus on possible conditions too much, and focus more simply on the dynamic between you that works.

He may well be aware of his condition whatever it may or may not be, but maybe puts off opening up due to past experience. It's a common story that many autistics have felt cruelly rejected even abused because they so misjudged a potential partner, or even were simply vulnerable to abusive and controlling people. Whatever the cause and circumstance these things can overshadow the reality (of having nothing to fear in this case) and the previous hurt received can be powerful enough to have a long lasting effect.

But then he may well not know (as many here can attest to, following what can sometimes be an epiphany of realisation, even always know something is terribly wrong in the world (as perceived) actually realising you really were born different to a profound degree can be something that some would rather not face, and some it simply never occurs to them. You may have experienced something along these lines yourself with your own condition?

But I think the point is that it's mostly better not to push too hard. You can and already have modified your behaviour, but it need not be spoken aloud as being anything, all people do this (changing behaviour according to the relationship dynamics) to some degree anyway. My best thought (not that I'm the best example of autistic agony aunt! ) may be to talk about your ex in passing, or maybe a little about your ADHD, but without attaching any significance, rather just giving a bit of personal history in conversation - but also basically opening the door a little, then leaving it for him to take a step inside when/if ready to.

It is nice to have you with us, aka_RIN.

You say the guy you are interested in has rejected you romantically? I take it that he is single? What is his relationship history like?

Some autistic folk who are romantically inexperienced might not like being 'asked out' in the traditional way. I'm not sure what the solution to that would be?

blitzkrieg said:

It is nice to have you with us, aka_RIN.

You say the guy you are interested in has rejected you romantically? I take it that he is single? What is his relationship history like?

Some autistic folk who are romantically inexperienced might not like being 'asked out' in the traditional way. I'm not sure what the solution to that would be?

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Thanks for your response! Yeah, I'm not sure how to approach it either or if it is smart to get too caught up in it. but, that's correct. He rejected me in the past and I'm not the kind of person that disrespects that, so I won't push for that at all. I accept his choice and while I would be open to more, I'm content where we are at too.

We don't talk about past relationships often, but he has given me glimpses and from the sound of it, he wasn't treated great and past partners did try to control him to an extend. I understand that this makes it harder to trust. I personally got out of a manipulative and abusive relationship about 2 years ago. That's the reason I feel like I can't trust my intuition anymore, because if you ask me to go only by my gut feeling in this situation, it would seem like he is very much into me. but... who knows? you know? Frustrating.

Boogs said:

Hi @aka_RIN and welcome.
Just to say initially that was a really nicely written post, very clear and well laid out, and seemed to be well considered and open minded.

There can be so many reasons for your situation regardless of whether he would diagnose specifically as ASD my thought would be for you to try and not focus on possible conditions too much, and focus more simply on the dynamic between you that works.

He may well be aware of his condition whatever it may or may not be, but maybe puts off opening up due to past experience. It's a common story that many autistics have felt cruelly rejected even abused because they so misjudged a potential partner, or even were simply vulnerable to abusive and controlling people. Whatever the cause and circumstance these things can overshadow the reality (of having nothing to fear in this case) and the previous hurt received can be powerful enough to have a long lasting effect.

But then he may well not know (as many here can attest to, following what can sometimes be an epiphany of realisation, even always know something is terribly wrong in the world (as perceived) actually realising you really were born different to a profound degree can be something that some would rather not face, and some it simply never occurs to them. You may have experienced something along these lines yourself with your own condition?

But I think the point is that it's mostly better not to push too hard. You can and already have modified your behaviour, but it need not be spoken aloud as being anything, all people do this (changing behaviour according to the relationship dynamics) to some degree anyway. My best thought (not that I'm the best example of autistic agony aunt! ) may be to talk about your ex in passing, or maybe a little about your ADHD, but without attaching any significance, rather just giving a bit of personal history in conversation - but also basically opening the door a little, then leaving it for him to take a step inside when/if ready to.

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Thank you so much for the response. You're right. I don't think I can muster the courage and just flat out ask him, but I can certainly bring up times in which his communication was awful and how it made me feel and maybe start by talking about those kind of things. If he's aware, he may eventually tell me as he catches on to me being open to it.

daniegirl6224 said:

Welcome my personal opinion: it sounds like you two are close and have already built trust. I think it makes sense to bring up the topic of autism when the timing feels right. If he doesn’t know he is autistic, this self discovery may really help him. It is suuuuuch a hard thing to decide on though. I question whether my best friend has autism and have been considering bringing it up to her. The fear is for the conversation to cause harm in any way.

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Thanks for your post! Oof that's such a tough topic to discuss. I always feel like I'm prying into people's personal business.

Xinyta said:

Glad to have you with us, @aka_RIN

I'm in agreement with Rodafina. Communication is a two way road. A road that has to be flowing in both directions. If one side is blocked off, there is not a compromise being made. Just a unhealthy amount of effort from one side.

One of the big things that is shared between autistics and ADHDers, is the socail misunderstanding of how things work. But part of helping him, is also helping yourself. If he is autistic and his no idea. Then the information will likely come as a surprise. But if he is aware, like you suspect. Then a conversation about how you two can communicate better is definitely advised. Either way. It's not a bad thing to try for better understanding and communication.

One thing to keep in mind is that outer reactions will not match internal ones, always. Especially for us guys. But if it is the case that he is unaware. Then he will likely try process this and want to know more when he is ready.

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Thank you. Communication is just hard in general. I just always feel that if it is easier for me to make the adjustments, then I should make the effort. We already have a really nice and valuable friendship, but I know that is in part because I don't take poor communication or complete lack thereof personal. I think a lot of people get really offended if you forget to text them back and things like that.

aka_RIN said:

Thank you so much for the response. You're right. I don't think I can muster the courage and just flat out ask him, but I can certainly bring up times in which his communication was awful and how it made me feel and maybe start by talking about those kind of things. If he's aware, he may eventually tell me as he catches on to me being open to it.

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I think time can be a valuable resource, in that taking as much time as you reasonably can, and you have a need for his support too, it's not all one sided (though it's very positive that you know not to assume things without stopping to think, and have been rational and considered).

aka_RIN said:

If he's aware, he may eventually tell me as he catches on to me being open to it.

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Absolutely! "Softly softly catchee monkey" as they almost certainly never said, ever!

Sometimes, especially for vulnerable people who have been badly hurt in the past, and as frustrating as it can be, time for someone to begin to trust enough to open up a little can't be avoided, it's simply a fundamental part of the equation, and patience rarely doesn't pan out for the best, as long as it doesn't start having a toxic effect on yourself, and realistic and unambitious (initially at least) expectations can help protect your wellbeing, which is just as important.

Also, if he isn't aware (although awareness isn't a simple yes/no thing in many cases) sometimes the casual inclusion of how it's been a part of your life - in some ways, having ADHD to talk about with your experiences keeps it from unintentionally hitting home for him a little more than he's ready for. He can discuss it without having to feel vulnerable doing so, and on getting used to you feeling safe to tell him about these things may help him start to think more about how it could relate to himself...

(...maybe! I'm only going on my own experiences and learning, I don't know anything about him and I'm no expert on any of this, I could be completely wrong! I'm just trying to make suggestions to consider - you already seem quite good at considering things carefully).

Boogs said:

I think time can be a valuable resource, in that taking as much time as you reasonably can, and you have a need for his support too, it's not all one sided (though it's very positive that you know not to assume things without stopping to think, and have been rational and considered).


Absolutely! "Softly softly catchee monkey" as they almost certainly never said, ever!

Sometimes, especially for vulnerable people who have been badly hurt in the past, and as frustrating as it can be, time for someone to begin to trust enough to open up a little can't be avoided, it's simply a fundamental part of the equation, and patience rarely doesn't pan out for the best, as long as it doesn't start having a toxic effect on yourself, and realistic and unambitious (initially at least) expectations can help protect your wellbeing, which is just as important.

Also, if he isn't aware (although awareness isn't a simple yes/no thing in many cases) sometimes the casual inclusion of how it's been a part of your life - in some ways, having ADHD to talk about with your experiences keeps it from unintentionally hitting home for him a little more than he's ready for. He can discuss it without having to feel vulnerable doing so, and on getting used to you feeling safe to tell him about these things may help him start to think more about how it could relate to himself...

(...maybe! I'm only going on my own experiences and learning, I don't know anything about him and I'm no expert on any of this, I could be completely wrong! I'm just trying to make suggestions to consider - you already seem quite good at considering things carefully).

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Thanks!
And I do that already, since I learned that explaining my experience makes it easier for people to understand and respond. I brought up once that it's hard to cope with when plans fall through last minute or if my schedule gets shaken up unexpectantly and that it plummets my mood and sometimes it's really hard to snap out of it and he was in enthusiastic agreement about that. Or things like being overstimulated and needing to decompress etc. I know everyone is different and I don't expect him to have the same experience than I do, but I figured he'd feel more inclined to trust me if he knows what I'm dealing with.

I don't sense anything toxic from him, he could be a little less vague and more decisive at times and the texting etiquette is sub par, but he's a very supportive and caring friend and I can't imagine him trying to harm me in any way. At least not on purpose. I'm a patient woman and we have nothing but time. My problem is just that I need a certain degree of clarity to function correctly in any relationship because I tend to ruminate and feel helpless. However, that's really more my problem and not his

aka_RIN said:

... but I figured he'd feel more inclined to trust me if he knows what I'm dealing with.

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What you've already described about his enthusiastic engagement when talking about these things seems like a really positive thing already. It's not so much having the same experiences as each other, as having real experience living with the impact of these things which can be otherwise almost invisible to other people (who are thus less inclined to believe there's any significant issue). You may not understand what an individual symptom may be like to live with, but you understand what it's like when no-one else knows or appreciates how difficult it can be to live with and have the patience not to jump to conclusions.

There could be a myriad of reasons why he'd rather say nothing about himself for now that have nothing to do with you in yourself, and for someone who is autistic he seems to be showing a lot of trust already, and you sound well equipped to give it a go and see how things pan out, I hope they work out for both of you whatever happens.

aka_RIN said:

My problem is just that I need a certain degree of clarity to function correctly in any relationship because I tend to ruminate and feel helpless. However, that's really more my problem and not his

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I think you're 100% spot on there, and that's what I would see as the pivot of your relationship and where it could go - have you fully considered whether if he really was unable or unwilling to engage in a closer relationship in the near future, could you be friends without it becoming toxic? Obviously only you can judge, but it seems to me an important question to consider because it would help guide your way forward and inform you of whether you might one day have to make a choice that could have a painful outcome, but could equally not, or even maybe reduce a negative outcome, either way you'd be better prepared. Those are difficult rhetorical questions and no guarantee answers are forthcoming in a definitive manner, at first at least, but just considering things (which you're already doing) means your understanding will improve which is a positive step forward, and it can sometimes just takes time for that clarity to become, well, clear I guess! .

Boogs said:

What you've already described about his enthusiastic engagement when talking about these things seems like a really positive thing already. It's not so much having the same experiences as each other, as having real experience living with the impact of these things which can be otherwise almost invisible to other people (who are thus less inclined to believe there's any significant issue). You may not understand what an individual symptom may be like to live with, but you understand what it's like when no-one else knows or appreciates how difficult it can be to live with and have the patience not to jump to conclusions.

There could be a myriad of reasons why he'd rather say nothing about himself for now that have nothing to do with you in yourself, and for someone who is autistic he seems to be showing a lot of trust already, and you sound well equipped to give it a go and see how things pan out, I hope they work out for both of you whatever happens.


I think you're 100% spot on there, and that's what I would see as the pivot of your relationship and where it could go - have you fully considered whether if he really was unable or unwilling to engage in a closer relationship in the near future, could you be friends without it becoming toxic? Obviously only you can judge, but it seems to me an important question to consider because it would help guide your way forward and inform you of whether you might one day have to make a choice that could have a painful outcome, but could equally not, or even maybe reduce a negative outcome, either way you'd be better prepared. Those are difficult rhetorical questions and no guarantee answers are forthcoming in a definitive manner, at first at least, but just considering things (which you're already doing) means your understanding will improve which is a positive step forward, and it can sometimes just takes time for that clarity to become, well, clear I guess! .

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Being in a relationship at any point or ever was never a condition for my friendship. I like him, yes, but that doesn't mean that a partnership is in our future. Relationships take hard work, commitment, and dedication. That is a choice you have to make every day continuously over years. It's not just raw emotion. I don't think it is a problem if we are friends and remain friends. On the contrary. I value friendship very highly in my world. And as much as I adore him and fancy his life, my infatuation isn't a basis for heartbreak or anything like that. It's not like I was ever in love and I'm experienced enough with my emotions to not spiral into resentment or "being hurt." If he doesn't take action, it'll just fizzle out in my experience. Plus, we've known each other for nearly a year. It's not like we just met. I'm content being friends. I'm still dating other people too. It's just that the ball is in his court if he wants something else. However, eventually the day will come when I commit to someone else, or he meets a woman he wants to be with and that's when we'll have to figure out if we truly built a real friendship or if it was a situational thing. (I'm overthinking again lol).

Hearing from all of you helped. It's difficult discussing all this with my friends. They lack the detailed thought processes, I think. I'll definitely report back if anything changes or if I find out anything else. For now, I just plan to enjoy our time together and have fun.

Trying to tell someone is very tricky and although sometimes it works out well it also can backfire, sometimes pretty dramatically. I haven't been in that situation myself but have read people relate the various reactions they get. My own approach would likely be not to. But if the subject came up naturally I would be honest.

aka_RIN said:

Being in a relationship at any point or ever was never a condition for my friendship. I like him, yes, but that doesn't mean that a partnership is in our future. Relationships take hard work, commitment, and dedication. That is a choice you have to make every day continuously over years. It's not just raw emotion. I don't think it is a problem if we are friends and remain friends. On the contrary. I value friendship very highly in my world. And as much as I adore him and fancy his life, my infatuation isn't a basis for heartbreak or anything like that. It's not like I was ever in love and I'm experienced enough with my emotions to not spiral into resentment or "being hurt." If he doesn't take action, it'll just fizzle out in my experience. Plus, we've known each other for nearly a year. It's not like we just met. I'm content being friends. I'm still dating other people too. It's just that the ball is in his court if he wants something else. However, eventually the day will come when I commit to someone else, or he meets a woman he wants to be with and that's when we'll have to figure out if we truly built a real friendship or if it was a situational thing. (I'm overthinking again lol).

Hearing from all of you helped. It's difficult discussing all this with my friends. They lack the detailed thought processes, I think. I'll definitely report back if anything changes or if I find out anything else. For now, I just plan to enjoy our time together and have fun.

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You sound very grounded and less in need of advice than many, though I realise confirmation can also be a valuable thing! Even if it's just to say, "he may, or may not!"