Autism, serotonin, dopamine, and a potential role for therapeutic psilocybin

[Neonatal RRT]

Background:
Roughly 25% of autistics have significantly elevated serum/blood levels of serotonin. In fact, there is a suggestion that the higher the concentration of serum serotonin, the more severe the autism, and it could be used as a diagnostic marker. Interestingly, these same individuals also have low concentrations of serotonin in the cerebral spinal fluid (CSF). Which suggests there isn't a problem with production, but rather uptake. There are several genes involved with the brain's uptake of serotonin and it would appear that in certain individuals, mutations in these genes are, at least in part, responsible for low serotonin in the brain.

Autism is also one of the "low dopamine neurological conditions". There are at least 3 known gene mutations associated with autistics that result in impaired dopamine metabolism. Serotonin modulates the gene transcription involved in dopamine production.

Psilocybin is a chemical produced by certain species of mushroom and are often referred to a "psychedelic" or "magic" mushrooms. Psilocybin in the blood (inactive) will be metabolized to psilocin (active compound). Psilocin mimics the chemical structure of serotonin and binds to the same receptor sites in the brain, but with a higher affinity. Serotonin receptors, when activated, may trigger a wide range of reactions effecting the glutamine:GABA (excitatory:inhibitory) neurotransmitter balance, enhancing the dopamine production system, it diminishes the "gating system" that separates otherwise independent regions of the brain allowing them to communicate with each other (synethesia for example), it diminishes the inhibitory signals from the amygdala's (fear centers), etc.

Because psilocin has a higher affinity for the serotonin receptor sites than serotonin, itself, there is strong evidence that at least some of the genetic mutations affecting serotonin binding may be bypassed/nulled/made void.

How psilocybin may help in certain variants of autism:
1. Psilocin is able to bind with the serotonin receptors with a higher affinity than serotonin and activate the cascade of reactions that serotonin would otherwise perform.
2. It may improve or normalize the levels of dopamine in the brain.
3. It may improve neurotransmitter balances.
4. It may improve mental clarity and cognition.
5. It may reduce anxiety.
6. It may improve social behaviors.
7. It may improve sleep quality
8. It may reduce depression, rumination, and suicidal ideation.

Legality:
In some countries, possession of psilocybin mushrooms is legal. In others countries, it is not. In the US, it is legal to purchase psilocybin mushroom spores and mycelia for "research purposes". It is also legal to purchase all the materials and grow mushrooms. It is not legal to possess psilocybin mushrooms. If you do choose to cultivate these mushrooms for personal use, do so discreetly. The companies that sell the spores and mycelia will not respond to questions regarding cultivation. There are many sources online as well as books for that purpose. Once you grow mushrooms to maturity, you can extract the spores, take tissue samples, etc. and use these to reproduce more.

In some areas of the country, psychologists may use psilocybin therapeutically, under supervision, to guide a person through an intense, full dose, "psychedelic experience" that has shown efficacy in alleviating PTSD symptoms and severe anxiety conditions, to stop smoking, and to stop other harmful addiction behaviors.

Microdosing and the Stamets Stack:
This is using about 1/10th-1/4 the dose that would trigger a psychedelic experience. You're using it as a medication, not for recreation. You should not be impaired in any way and you can go about your normal daily activities. Typically 3-5 days a week, the lower the dose, the more days, the higher the dose, the fewer the days. Dosing can vary from person to person, from the psilocybin concentration in the mushrooms, and from a developed tolerance. Studies of microdosing psilocybin mushrooms or synthetic psilocybin alone have not shown significant effects. However, mycologist Paul Stamets discovered that dosing psilocybin mushroom plus Lion's Mane mushroom plus niacin (flushing type) resulted in an additive effect, as he describes, a 1+1=3 response in the brain. The "Stamets Stack" has been proven to improve cognition, brain growth, social behaviors, and measurable improvements in neuro-motor skills. Lion's Mane and psilocybin have synergistic effects, the niacin (B3) acts as a vasodilator to improve absorption across the blood-brain barrier. It is non-addicting. There do not appear to be any adverse side effects. Half-life in the body is around 90 minutes and clears the body within 12 hours, but the brain growth and remodeling effects remain. Positive effects can be felt within a few doses and continue to improve over the next several weeks.

The 2024 PSILAUT study will be examining the effects of psilocybin therapy for autistic patients.

My anecdotal experience with the Stamets Stack: It works very well for me for improving my mental clarity and cognition, keeps me relaxed during the most stressful of work days, and improves my social behaviors significantly enough that others notice, and improves my sleep quality.

I am not suggesting that this will work for everyone. Not everyone will have the same genetic mutations associated with serotonin and dopamine metabolism. Chances are likely that some people will not respond the way that I do. To each, their own.

PM me if you want to learn more on the topic.

 

[Mary Terry]

Psilocybin mushrooms are native to some parts of the US. They naturally grow in cow manure all over the south. I've seen them all my life in cow pastures. They can cause death at high doses and they suppress the involuntary muscles like the ones responsible for breathing and cardiac functioning. If someone is going to mess around with psilocybin, best to buy it in a pharmaceutical form to avoid the toxins that naturally occur in it.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

Psilocybin mushrooms are native to some parts of the US. They naturally grow in cow manure all over the south. I've seen them all my life in cow pastures. They can cause death at high doses and they suppress the involuntary muscles like the ones responsible for breathing and cardiac functioning. If someone is going to mess around with psilocybin, best to buy it in a pharmaceutical form to avoid the toxins that naturally occur in it.

I don't know how to identify mushrooms. There are plenty of books out there, but there are so many similar looking mushrooms out there in nature that are toxic, if not lethal. Furthermore, if you grow mushrooms, you know that the morphology can be different from one mushroom to the next, even with the same genetics. Knowing that, even with an ID book in hand, I wouldn't go out in nature and start picking mushrooms. Personally, I would just assume not do that. To your point about "toxins" in P. cubensis, as you've pointed out, they tend to grow in manure, and depending upon the field and what that cow ate, then the mushrooms will likely contain whatever chemicals are present. Around here, mostly pesticides and PFAS. Pharmaceutical form, I would agree would be the safest form, but for most of the world, it simply isn't available.

The other consideration with P. cubensis, as was found with Cannabis, is that pharmaceutically isolated compounds are not nearly as effective as the synergistic mixture of bioflavonoids, terpenes, and other compounds found in the organic sources. Sometimes nature does create something better.

The good news is that there are Psilocybin cubensis mushrooms that have been cultivated for many decades with known genetics, and psilocybin concentrations, as well as hybrids. There are sterilized growing medias available and well-established cultivation guidelines.

The bad news is that when inexperienced people foolishly and irresponsibly consume high doses as if it were some sort of "party drug", bad things can potentially happen. Experienced people know that you have to be in the proper frame of mind and in a safe environment well before taking these "psychedelic trips". It's nothing like getting drunk or high, it's a whole different thing. You also start with very low doses and work up the dosage to assess your individual tolerance, as each new batch of mushrooms will have a slightly different concentration of compounds. Personally, I've never gotten anywhere close to having "a trip". I'm too much of a control freak. The vast majority of research in this area, as well as usage is with much lower doses and using it as an actual medication to help people become better versions of themselves.

I would not "throw the baby out with the bathwater" in this case due to a relative small number of foolish, irresponsible people making bad decisions when these compounds can be dosed more responsibly and effectively to help a lot of people.

 

[Mary Terry]

I don't know how to identify mushrooms. There are plenty of books out there, but there are so many similar looking mushrooms out there in nature that are toxic, if not lethal. Personally, I would just assume not do that. To your point about "toxins" in P. cubensis, as you've pointed out, they tend to grow in manure, and depending upon the field and what that cow ate, then the mushrooms will likely contain whatever chemicals are present. Around here, mostly pesticides and PFAS. Pharmaceutical form, I would agree would be the safest form, but for most of the world, it simply isn't available.

The other consideration with P. cubensis, as was found with Cannabis, is that pharmaceutically isolated compounds are not nearly as effective as the synergistic mixture of bioflavonoids, terpenes, and other compounds found in the organic sources. Sometimes nature does create something better.

The good news is that there are Psilocybin cubensis mushrooms that have been cultivated for many decades with known genetics, and psilocybin concentrations, as well as hybrids. There are sterilized growing medias available and well-established cultivation guidelines.

The bad news is that when inexperienced people foolishly and irresponsibly consume high doses as if it were some sort of "party drug", bad things can potentially happen. Experienced people know that you have to be in the proper frame of mind and in a safe environment well before taking these "psychedelic trips". It's nothing like getting drunk or high, it's a whole different thing. You also start with very low doses and work up the dosage to assess your individual tolerance, as each new batch of mushrooms will have a slightly different concentration of compounds. Personally, I've never gotten anywhere close to having "a trip". I'm too much of a control freak. The vast majority of research in this area, as well as usage is with much lower doses and using it as an actual medication to help people become better versions of themselves.

I would not "throw the baby out with the bathwater" in this case due to a relative small number of foolish, irresponsible people making bad decisions when these compounds can be dosed more responsibly and effectively to help a lot of people.

Psilocybin is easy to identify where I live. Back in the 1960s and 1970s, many people picked them, ate them raw, put them in peanut butter sandwiches to conceal the taste, brewed them into tea, and had magic mushroom parties. They contain cyanide. Overdoses were common and some deaths resulted. It is not something to play around with in its natural state.

 

[Outdated]

Psilocybin mushrooms are native to some parts of the US. They naturally grow in cow manure all over the south. I've seen them all my life in cow pastures.

We had a problem here back in the 80s with vigilante farmers that were sick of their paddocks getting trampled by teenage mushroom hunters. Even if it's only salt pellets you're not allowed to shoot people.

We have two main species of magic shrooms here, and Neonatal RRTs instinct that it's not a good idea to eat anything unless you're absolutely sure about it is sound. It's not easy to identify mushrooms from pictures, a lot of them look so similar that the only real way to be sure about them is by smell.

At the time I was growing up using mushrooms was quite popular and completely legal, because of this the general knowledge of them in the mainstream public was quite good and I've never heard of anyone overdosing.

We do have a lot of hospitalisations here from people eating mushrooms for food though. A lot of our mushrooms look so similar to what's found in Europe and Asia that a lot of migrants eat them and end up very ill.

 

[Mary Terry]

We had a problem here back in the 80s with vigilante farmers that were sick of their paddocks getting trampled by teenage mushroom hunters. Even if it's only salt pellets you're not allowed to shoot people.

We have two main species of magic shrooms here, and Neonatal RRTs instinct that it's not a good idea to eat anything unless you're absolutely sure about it is sound. It's not easy to identify mushrooms from pictures, a lot of them look so similar that the only real way to be sure about them is by smell.

At the time I was growing up using mushrooms was quite popular and completely legal, because of this the general knowledge of them in the mainstream public was quite good and I've never heard of anyone overdosing.

We do have a lot of hospitalisations here from people eating mushrooms for food though. A lot of our mushrooms look so similar to what's found in Europe and Asia that a lot of migrants eat them and end up very ill.

There are many psychedelic shrooms in the US, ranging from psilocybin to peyote. If someone wants to harvest wild mushrooms, it is best to take classes from an experienced mushroom hunter who can identify them. I can identify some local edible mushrooms like hen of the woods, chanterelles, trumpets, polypores, and morels but due to the risk of accidentally picking a poisonous look-alike mushroom, I don't eat them. I just like to see them growing on our tree farm. Some even glow at night in the woods.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

As I suggested, (1) there are ignorant, foolish, irresponsible people in this world. I am all for handing out "Darwin Awards" to these people, and (2) you don't need to go mushroom hunting now-a-days when there are several sources for professionally cultivated species.

 

[Outdated]

(2) you don't need to go mushroom hunting now-a-days when there are several sources for professionally cultivated species.

We've been running a lot of public medical trials in different states recently and so far there haven't been many strong objections. It may soon become another of the mainstream drugs that can be prescribed here.

I haven't had mushrooms since I was young, I'm not really sure that I enjoyed them all that much but it was sort of an exciting thing to do because they were only around for a few weeks of the year.

 

[TBRS1]

I've never heard of a mushroom that contains cyanide - if cyanide were in a mushroom, the question would be where it came from.

It is very easy, however, to misidentify a Deadly Gallerina as one of the Ps. varieties, or to make a mixed collection with a few Gallerinas, especially if it is somebody with a great desire to get high, but little knowledge that even one or two Gallerinas will kill them in a very painful way.

Gallerinas are never picked by edible mushroom hunters because they look nothing like any edible. They do, though, look a lot like several species of Ps. mushrooms.

Actual Ps. mushrooms are not toxic, even in MASSIVE doses (but massive doses are not at all fun. They won't kill a person, though.).

The dosing that Neonatal RRT is describing is tiny, sub - threshold doses, in which a person is affected, but does not feel "high," not even a little. Maybe comparable to drinking a quarter of a can of beer - if that.

 

[vergil96]

How is a small amount of psychodelic mushrooms that increase serotonin differrnt from SSRIs?

 

[Neonatal RRT]

How is a small amount of psychodelic mushrooms that increase serotonin differrnt from SSRIs?

Great question. SSRIs slow down the metabolism of serotonin, making what serotonin there is available for longer.
Furthermore, SSRIs typically work on the serotonin 1A receptors, which tend to be inhibitory, whereas psilocybin (psilocin) acts on the serotonin 2A receptors which tend to elicit a more excitatory response via enhanced glutamate release, at least while psilocin is in the receptor (short-term response). Hence, the "psychedelic trip" experienced with high doses. Interestingly, once psilocin has broken down and is out of the system, it results in an enhanced inhibitory response (long term), enhanced empathy, decreased depression, decreased anxiety, etc.

There are people who feel absolutely awful on SSRIs and I think this speaks to that person's genetics. As I suggested in my OP, there are a handful of genes that are responsible for serotonin production as well as the metabolism. If there are mutations in these genes, which is often the case with autism, then SSRI responses, as well as, psilocybin/psilocin responses will vary.

The active compound, psilocin, found in P. cubensis, for example, does not raise serotonin, per se. Because psilocin and serotonin are nearly identical in chemical structure, psilocin can fit into the serotonin receptor sites and trigger the cascade of reactions that serotonin would. It's a serotonin mimic.

 

[tree]

Psilocybe cyanescens - Wikipedia

"Psilocybe cyanescens, commonly known as the wavy cap or potent psilocybe, is a species of potent psychedelic mushroom. The main compounds responsible for its psychedelic effects are psilocybin and psilocin. It belongs to the family Hymenogastraceae. A formal description of the species was published by Elsie Wakefield in 1946 in the Transactions of the British Mycological Society, based on a specimen she had recently collected at Kew Gardens. She had begun collecting the species as early as 1910. The mushroom is not generally regarded as being physically dangerous to adults. Since all the psychoactive compounds in P. cyanescens are water-soluble, the fruiting bodies can be rendered non-psychoactive through parboiling, allowing their culinary use. However, since most people find them overly bitter and they are too small to have great nutritive value, this is not frequently done."

 

[Forest Cat]

That's interesting, the Liberty Cap (psilocybe semilanceata) is common around here where I live, I don't know if it's correct but I have read that it is one of the most potent mushrooms. It's very popular. I have picked them several times but I have always been sceptical about taking such things, because I know I'm likely to have a bad experience. And I don't want to take the risk of wrecking my mind. But the microdosing sounds different.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

That's interesting, the Liberty Cap (psilocybe semilanceata) is common around here where I live, I don't know if it's correct but I have read that it is one of the most potent mushrooms. It's very popular. I have picked them several times but I have always been sceptical about taking such things, because I know I'm likely to have a bad experience. And I don't want to take the risk of wrecking my mind. But the microdosing sounds different.

I stick with what I know to be a known cultivar.

As I suggested above, even with my home grown mushrooms there can be enough variability in morphology that if translated to wild species, even if I had an identification guide with me, I would not be confident enough to consume them. Best to let them lie. There are thousands and thousands of species and there are enough of them that look quite similar that I wouldn't be confident in my identification. Just me, but I would rather purchase the spores or mycelia from a reputable retailer and be more confident in what I am getting.

I put my fresh mushrooms in a dehydrator, grind them into a powder, and put them in capsules. I have an accurate scale, down to the 0.001g. Each capsule has a known weight and the powder is a homogenous mix of all the mushrooms in that batch, eliminating the inevitable variability that is present from one mushroom to the next. Each capsule will be contain the same amount +/- 0.002g.

Like you, I have zero interest in losing myself, however temporary, in some sort of psychedelic trip. I know that many that have claim it is such a powerful, positive, and life-changing experience and in the case of PTSD, anxiety disorders, and addictive behaviors, these experiences are very quick to snap people out it. I don't have these issues. I like being in control. I'd much rather do something that is conservative, but with strong evidence of efficacy. The Stamets stack with Lion's Mane (Hericium erinaceus) and niacin (vitamin B3) really works for me. In fact, the days that I do dose, it acts as a nootropic, enhancing my cognitive abilities and positively affects my sensory system, and I know that it is doing something because my brain will actually have a slight tingling sensation. I know that it's actually making new connections because people will notice "something different" about me afterward. I receive a lot more positive recognition at work now. However, I digress, it is highly likely my experience is my own, although many other microdosers are doing it because of their own positive effects.

 

[Outdated]

I just started looking to find out the latin names of the mushrooms we used to hunt for here and found an alarming amount of misinformation and misidentification. A lot of the problem seems to come from confusing and misleading information from other countries and is compounded by the fact that a great deal of our flora and fauna has never been formally identified.

By far the most common species in Australia is what we grew up calling Gold Tops - Psilocybe subaeruginosa. Official information says that these are only found on the east coast in subtropical regions - wrong, very wrong. They can be found throughout the entire country, from the tip of Cape York all the way down to Hobart, from Sydney to Perth to Broome. These days they are most commonly found in public parks and nature reserves where councils have put down wood chips and pine bark as a ground cover.

The other main mushroom we looked for is known to us as Blue Meanies but these are a very different species to what grows in the US and South America with that name. They look very similar to a lot of pictures I've found but I've not been able to find a picture that looks right and I can't find a latin name for them either.

They look similar to the picture below, except that they are bright blue or purple in colour. They are also tiny, the largest cap I've seen on one was still smaller than my thumb nail, and they only grow in the colder climates, Tasmania, Victoria, South Australia, southern New South Wales, and likely in the south of Western Australia too. They're also a common mushroom in New Zealand.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

I just started looking to find out the latin names of the mushrooms we used to hunt for here and found an alarming amount of misinformation and misidentification. A lot of the problem seems to come from confusing and misleading information from other countries and is compounded by the fact that a great deal of our flora and fauna has never been formally identified.

You're confirming my observation, as well. There's enough "look-a-like" species out there that are flat-out deadly, if not make you horribly ill, I'm not willing to take that risk. What may be more helpful is a guide that is more local. For example, I live in Michigan, US. If you go online, you can find field guides for all sorts of things like trees, rocks, birds, plants, etc that are specific to Michigan. I might be more inclined to use a mushroom identification guide that is more specific to your area.

Furthermore, the photo example you have here, this is enough for perhaps one psychedelic trip or about a few weeks of microdosing. Once the mushrooms are dehydrated, there's not a lot left as they are mostly water. This is where growing them at home in a large bin has its advantages, amongst other things.

Amazon.com This is probably one of the better field guides out there from Paul Stamets.

 

[TBRS1]

Always use AT LEAST three different guidebooks to identify a new (to you) species of mushroom.

BE SURE you can follow the detailed taxonomic details. If you don't EXACTLY understand "The cap is 1.6–8 cm (0.6–3.1 in), conic to convex with a central papilla when young, becoming broadly convex to plane with age, retaining a slight umbo sometimes surrounded by a ring-shaped depression. The cap surface is smooth and sticky, sometimes with white universal veil remnants attached..." you can't identify the mushroom.

Trying to identify many mushrooms by looking at a photo (or, also, using an AI mushroom identifying app) is a complete waste of time, and DANGEROUS. Mushrooms are highly morphogenic - the same mushroom has many different forms and colors, depending on their growth history.

If a mushroom has a toxic look-a-like, always assume your specimen is toxic. Prove that it isn't before you eat it.

All hallucinogenic mushrooms look far more like toxic mushrooms than is comfortable. There are several easy to identify edible mushrooms, but no easy to identify hallucinogenic mushrooms.

 

[Mary Terry]

I apologize for digressing, but all this discussion of mushrooms made me think of truffles. I know I would benefit from some truffles food delicacy therapy but at over $3,000 per pound, I can't afford it. They are so expensive!

So, I looked up growing truffles at home, and yes, it can be done in many places all over the world. They like to grow among oak trees, and we have hundreds of those of all ages - mature, middle aged, young trees - but I don't know if the right fungi spores are here. Even if they grow here, I'd have to train a dog or horse to find them.

 

[TBRS1]

I looked up growing truffles at home, and yes, it can be done in many places all over the world. They like to grow among oak trees, and we have hundreds of those of all ages - mature, middle aged, young trees - but I don't know if the right fungi spores are here. Even if they grow here, I'd have to train a dog or horse to find them.

Bad news is that, despite inoculated truffle trees being planted now for over 30 years, they are not producing.

Only the people selling the trees are making any money.

I see lots of cultures being sold for mushrooms that can't be grown.

 

[Outdated]

So, I looked up growing truffles at home, and yes, it can be done in many places all over the world.

I don't know if these are local species or if they've been imported but Australia has a thriving truffle industry.

Truffle Hill: Home of Australia's Finest Black Truffles
Home of Australia’s first black truffle
Yarra Valley Truffles