Autistic child loves to sing..

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

I will be back posting a bit as our children are taking time off from homeschooling for the summer, so I had some questions and a request for those who like music, singing, or playing instruments, or for even anyone here that relates to Autism or Aspergers in any way. I would appreciate any of your feedback

As my ID name implies, we have two Autistic children. Our youngest, Dylan age 6 is still mostly nonverbal, and our oldest, Aaron age 8, is higher functioning. Aaron loves to sing, and started doing so about one and a half years ago, mostly for fun at holiday time, but as time elapsed he wanted to sing more and more.

Aaron told us he wants to become a super professional singer one day. In one regard, we want to temper his expectations, as the musical industry too may not be kind to those who have some quirks, etc, but we as parents see he has many musical abilities and see his passion there, and want to support him and lead him to where he wants to go with music.

Currently, Aaron loves singing karaoke in public. He is on break from that, as that starts up again in November, so we asked him if he wanted a vocal music instructor in the meantime, and he said "Yes, of course." So, we asked around locally and only one instructor was willing to work with Aaron, with many saying he was too young, but others implying it was the Autism.

Although the musical instructor we found for Aaron seems more into rock style, I found him to be very positive and communicative with Aaron, and open minded to learning the music Aaron wants to learn, like patriotic, softer rock, country, folk, broadway musicals, etc. I like his friendly and laid back style, as I witness that for the weekly one hour sessions with them both.

In general, we feel Aaron sings pretty well for a child his age, and based on his limited experience, and he never seems to get bored or frustrated with it, as we go at his pace and direction. Currently, it's music and singing, ipad maze type games, and science experiments that he enjoys the best, so we are focusing regularly on those.

Some questions we had are:

Is it realistic for an adult with Aspergers or Autism make music as a career? I know there are a few known successful singers with that condition, but not a whole lot. Are any here making a regular income off of music? You do not need to say how much, as Aaron seems more into wanting to be liked, to share his musical passion, and to have friends, than to make much money now.

Should we see his love for music at this age as fun, and tell him to just focus on that fun, or should we try to be more serious and prepare him early on as one of his possible career choices later, by training his voice daily, weekly, at this young age, etc, as long as he still desires such, though worrying if that could result later in despair if his expectations were set too high, or if they were not met later. Should we be honest now, or later, as he loves directness and honesty, and tell him we could not guarantee a successful career as a singer, as few in the arts or musical field become a star, but many could make at least some income if they were talented, put forth the effort, and/or had some luck in finding the right people, etc.

Should we put some of his public videos on youtube, as right now if you search there using keywords "Aaron, Autistic Boy Singer", you will see four of his videos we just uploaded on youtube, under that channel name. It is hard for us to know what the general public thinks of his singing, if they do not view or comment on the videos, so hopefully some here will look at them, and give some feedback, as we asked Aaron if he wanted us to keep the videos private for just family and friends, or did he want many others to view them through social media like youtube, which he is familar with, and he said, "I have few friends. I want many friends."

Aaron meets many children and adults daily at parks, stores, and at other entertainment places, but he keeps telling us he wants others to know he sings. So, if anyone here likes Aaron's videos, please feel free to give a thumbs up or comment on any of them, as he would appreciate that, and as we are clueless as parents how to generate much views, or interest. We have twitter, as I was into writing, but we have no facebook. I haven't used twitter in awhile now, as we have been busy with our children's daily desires and needs. So, if anyone here is very good with social media type issues, and likes to communicate positively with others or market that way, and wants to help Aaron in spreading the word about his singing videos, feel free email us privately, too, and we could work out something for that time and efforts, as social media is not a strength of ours.

Thanks.

 

[Progster]

Is it realistic for an adult with Aspergers or Autism make music as a career? I know there are a few known successful singers with that condition, but not a whole lot. Are any here making a regular income off of music?

When I first joined here, there was a lady who called herself Beverly who claimed to be a very famous singer, but was not open about her diagnosis and never gave her actual name to protect her identity so we never found out who she was - but that doesn't matter, she was proof that a person can have a successful career in the music industry with ASD - I think there are actually quite a few musicians on the spectrum, some open about their diagnosis, others not so, another musician on another forum mentioned that it was actually quite common.

Should we put some of his public videos on youtube, as right now if you search there using keywords "Aaron, Autistic Boy Singer"

My feeling is that you should not mention that he is autistic on YouTube - why do people need to know that? You want people to appreciate him for who he is, and appreciate his music for his ability, and not just for his autism - his music is important and having autism is incidental. Also, it might come across as patronising. He can decide for himself later whether he wants to mention his ASD or not.

 

[tree]

Somehow "Autistic Boy Singer" struck me wrong.
Like "Talented Seal Plays Piano."

Is the focus to be the child's singing ability?
Or on the supposedly remarkable feature of
his being ASD, and yet capable & talented?

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

When I first joined here, there was a lady who called herself Beverly who claimed to be a very famous singer, but was not open about her diagnosis and never gave her actual name to protect her identity so we never found out who she was - but that doesn't matter, she was proof that a person can have a successful career in the music industry with ASD - I think there are actually quite a few musicians on the spectrum, some open about their diagnosis, others not so, another musician on another forum mentioned that it was actually quite common.

My feeling is that you should not mention that he is autistic on YouTube - why do people need to know that? You want people to appreciate him for who he is, and appreciate his music for his ability, and not just for his autism - his music is important and having autism is incidental. Also, it might come across as patronising. He can decide for himself later whether he wants to mention his ASD or not.

Thanks for the feedback. We were debating this issue as well, and I bet about 50% here would be both pro mentioning and not mentioning. We are open minded to all input, as we are trying to learn what is best, and could alter our actions accordingly.

Many would say as you did, but let's say Aaron gets critiqued for issues or mannerisms when singing he cannot change and does not want to change? Lets say an unexpected lighting or sound sensory issue comes up at a performance. Would not the public understand and appreciate Aaron, any quirks, his efforts and his singing better should they know that about his condition?

Our feeling right now is Autism is a part of who Aaron is. He can never be like an NT, nor does he want to, so embrace it. There is so much negativity about Autism and related conditions because more persons talk about the negatives than the positives. Autistics can be hard working, talented and creative. Why hide such, in this world where others want to just find fault.

But, you make good arguments showing the other perspective as well. That is why we requested feedback. To learn more, and act accordingly. Thanks.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

Somehow "Autistic Boy Singer" struck me wrong.
Like "Talented Seal Plays Piano."

Is the focus to be the child's singing ability?
Or on the supposedly remarkable feature of
his being ASD, and yet capable & talented?

Thanks for the input @tree. It was straight to the point that he is Autistic and sings. I thought many on the spectrum like directness and the truth. See no harm in that title. It is about him singing. It makes no promises of more. Any specific ideas better are welcome.

 

[Buzzerfly]

In my opinion, I wouldn't take Aaron's singing too seriously (as not to foster misconceptions about the world around him or how, specifically, he will affect it). Nor would I make fun of or take too lightly his desperation to show others light.

It seems to me that the world, especially the part of it that "entertains" people, is too dark and perverse to put your kids' videos on YOUTUBE. And, you run the risk of looking like one of those parents of autistic children who try to capitalize on their children's goodness.

Since I've known you before, I'd still venture that is NOT your angle. In this case, you should know that singing can be a heavenly thing, but careers aren't. And Aaron should know that being a singer will not make him friends. He's more likely to find those in unlikely places. The most famous musicians don't even have friends.

If you, as his father, are wishing to connect with others, despite it being your nature not to, you might find an outlet separately from Aaron.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

Nice to hear from you again! I hope things have been going well for you all. Will update you privately later.

Thanks for the input on this topic, as we were not sure what to do, so we desired others' advice. My wife and I talked over several of your points, and from the other posts, and we think the risks of public exposure at this age outweigh the benefits.

I mean we do not even know if Aaron will later on want a career in singing, as his feelings can change later. If he does still want to pursue vocal music seriously later, he may want to perform just locally, or just even like instruct.

Although there are a lot of great persons in this world, there are many from all social classes, ages, genders, and national origins, etc. who we should not trust. Aaron can indeed make friends in other ways, so we will keep trying there.

Both my wife and I hate social media. We do not judge negatively those who like it, or get some benefit from it, but from my twitter experiences, everyone there who has attempted contact with me wanted something from us.

Unfortunately, I personally find social media to be more about business and who has the most facebook friends, than about communicating one-to-one civily, making real friends, helping others, and the like.

Although Aaron will continue with his vocal music instruction, and singing at home, as per his desires, we have decided to pull his videos that we had just put up a couple days ago. I mean, it is not worth the risk.

I mean, does it really matter anyway if others like or do not like his singing? As long as he is happy with and enjoys what he does, that is all that should matter. He will sing the songs he likes, sing as he is able or desires, and do so at his timing.

Focus not on competition with others at this age, but sing for fun right now to his family and real friends: Those who will give him support and feedback, because of care. Not try to please the others that do not want to be his friend but benefit.

 

[Progster]

I mean, does it really matter anyway if others like or do not like his singing? As long as he is happy with and enjoys what he does, that is all that should matter. He will sing the songs he likes, sing as he is able or desires, and do so at his timing.

I agree with this. He can decide for himself later if he wants a career in music. It is important that it is his decision and that he is included in any discussion concerning his potential future career.

 

[Nightingale121]

You have already put down the videos again, so I guess my comment is a bit too late, but I'll add my thoughts anyway. Maybe they'll be useful for someone else in the future.

My feeling is that you should not mention that he is autistic on YouTube - why do people need to know that? You want people to appreciate him for who he is, and appreciate his music for his ability, and not just for his autism - his music is important and having autism is incidental. Also, it might come across as patronising. He can decide for himself later whether he wants to mention his ASD or not.

Many would say as you did, but let's say Aaron gets critiqued for issues or mannerisms when singing he cannot change and does not want to change? Lets say an unexpected lighting or sound sensory issue comes up at a performance. Would not the public understand and appreciate Aaron, any quirks, his efforts and his singing better should they know that about his condition?

I agree with @Progster.
In addition to the points she mentioned there are also others to consider in my opinion, which are partly covered by the last two sentences in her post.
I agree with her that Aaron should be allowed to decide for himself later whether he wants to mention his ASD or not.
Until he can decide this you are in a way responsible for his privacy in my opinion and shouldn't publish health information about him like this.

Furthermore, the point about explaining Aaron's mannerisms by mentioning his ASD is based on the assumption that people in the general public are able to make the right conclusions and that they already have some knowledge about autism. This isn't always true though and mentioning his ASD could also have the opposite of the intended effect, not explaining his mannerisms, but rather causing others to make assumptions about Aaron based on their limited (and maybe stereotypical) knowledge about autism.

So, we asked around locally and only one instructor was willing to work with Aaron, with many saying he was too young, but others implying it was the Autism.

If I understand this correctly, these people probably had some prejudices based on Aaron's autism before even working with him. This is exactly what I mean.

Our feeling right now is Autism is a part of who Aaron is. He can never be like an NT, nor does he want to, so embrace it. There is so much negativity about Autism and related conditions because more persons talk about the negatives than the positives. Autistics can be hard working, talented and creative. Why hide such, in this world where others want to just find fault.

This is a good intention, but I'm not sure whether the general public actually gets this the way it is intended.
Plus, the "where others want to just find fault" relates to the point I made above. The negativity might be connected to Aaron without any actual reason just because you mentioned his ASD and these stereotypes and the negativity are in these people's heads.

This could get even worse in the long run as people might find these YouTube videos several years later, so Aaron would be "outed" to random people who he may not actually want to let know about his ASD. If he is old enough and decides that he wants to be open about his ASD and "come out" online in whatever way, then it's fine and his own decision. But right now I'd advice against making it public. He probably cannot see all the potential long-term consequences yet and you should protect his privacy.

As for now you could embrace Aaron as a talented and creative boy in public (if you actually want to post content about him publicly again) without mentioning his ASD.

I'm not against raising awareness about the positive aspects of autism and the talents of autistic people.
I just don't think that this is the best way to do this, "using" a child and their talents to achieve this by letting everyone know about their autism when the child cannot decide about this on their own properly yet.

His wish of wanting to have more friends and letting others know about his singing is understandable, but he can use his love for music in other ways than via YouTube videos to make new friends and letting them know about his singing.

Aaron meets many children and adults daily at parks, stores, and at other entertainment places, but he keeps telling us he wants others to know he sings.

This seems to me that he can handle group settings including other children.
Is there some sort of local music group for children he could join, e. g. a children's choir?
From what you told he seems to be more into singing on his own, but maybe trying this could be an option in addition to or as an alternative to his current singing with the vocal music instructor. There he could also meet other children who enjoy music and singing and maybe make some friends.
On the other hand this isn't as flexible as individual singing lessons, so there could be a conflict to this:

I mean, does it really matter anyway if others like or do not like his singing? As long as he is happy with and enjoys what he does, that is all that should matter. He will sing the songs he likes, sing as he is able or desires, and do so at his timing.

He cannot always sing the songs he likes in this kind of group setting and also needs to follow what others like and what's sung in the choir at the time etc.
He can still sing whatever he likes at home though, so with some balance this could work.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

@Nightingale121....

Thanks for your informative reply. We agree with most of what you and the others said, and like we said we acted accordingly by deleting the videos a few days ago. The choir is not an option though, as although he sings at a level above most others his age, with confidence and zero fear shown on stage or with singing in front of many audience members, he is socially at a five year level, and definitely stands out and would likely be bullied for doing atypical things in relation to peers his age and expectations there, like if he refuses to sing their choice of song which could be a religious one or seem silly to him, if he is impatient at the slow pace to learn each song, if he has any unusual physical mannerisms that might concern the instructors, if he runs off at the sign of sensiry meltdown, as that could take positive attention away from the others in the group, and as Aaron sometimes has difficulty following instruction, and acting politically correct in public.

For his karaoke singing at the child-friendly establishment, where he performed about fourteen songs so far over a two to three month span, we never mentioned his condition to anyone, as for karaoke singing, and in that place, the need is not so formal, with persons singing any way they see fit to the scrolling lyrics, with a mixture of persons who are amauteurs, professionals, or those who never sang at all. But, for choirs, contests, and more formal singing presentations, etc., it is not realistic to think a child with noticeable Autistic quirks is not going to be judged adversely regardless if the Autism is known, no matter their talent. In fact, they might be looked at in a worse light if some unexpected happening occurred on stage. I will give an example below.

Our child had also desired to sing at a singing contest for youth this summer, a singing category for the 8-11 year olds. We never mentioned his Autism to anyone there to those contest people or to anyone at that venue. We figured his talent was good enough to advance to at least round two which was his only desire, as as he just hoped to sing the accapella song on day one, and the instrumental song on day two, that he had practiced for a month to almost perfection. He did not care about first, second or third place, but for many others to hear him sing his two songs. All we cared about as parents was Aaron having fun, getting experience, and trying his best, trying to not make additional expectations.

Anyways, Aaron performed the first song very well on stage at that carnival atmosphere, with confidence, almost perfect pitch, and the tempo and dynamics seemed spot on too, for the lyrics. He put some feeling into the song, but admittedly not as much as a girl would. Well, I am the type who will not be biased about a family member's performance. If it was pretty good, average, below par, whatever the result, I would see that as it is yet be ok with it. But, on that day, he was the only eight year old and sang at least as good as the mostly all girls. I thought based on his size, cuteness and performance, and he was the only boy there for that age group, at minimum he was top three for the first round, and should advance as the top five advanced. All the other older ten to eleven year old girls sang their hearts out too, but some either forgot their lines, were a bit pitchy, or sang songs that were not audition type songs or did not seem to fit their vocals or presented image.

But, here is likely the reason why Aaron did not advance to round two. It was not the vocal ability, nor really the manner he presented the song, as he is very small and young and did very well. It was what happened before and after the song. When it was his turn to walk up on the stage he almost stumbled on the steps, then tried to grab and pry away the microphone from the dj guy, and the guy had to tell him to wait as he had some questions. Then when the dj guy read the card given him and asked Aaron "Where do you make your home?" and "How do uou spell your last name," he seemed confused and did not want to answer. He was not expecting such questions, but to sing. And after he finished singing, one of the three judges said, "Congratulations, you have great vocal range Aaron. Great job" to which Aaron replied with very confident tone, "Yes, I do."

Aaron knew in advance through our instruction to say please and thank you for compliments, but Aaron focused on the vocal range question and not the compliment on this day. They might have seen Aaron as being rude or arrogant, which he is not, but very polite at home and to others he knows. Had they known he had Autism, I guarantee he would have went to round two, and stopped Aaron from crying for several minutes, once he learned he did not make the cut, as they would have understood it was just a quirk, or limited social ability, and looked at his bravery and huge efforts as how many with ASD at age 8 enter such contests even. But, as he was presenting himself as a typical 8 year old to them, he was judged as such, and not given an accommodation he may be entitled by law to level the playing field. They judged based on four factors: vocal clarity, intonation, musical passion and stage presense. He likely got poorer scores for item 3 and 4.

The point if saying all this is not to change others' opinions about whether to mention the Autism or not now, as we already made our recent decision to let him decide when he is much older so we deleted the videos within two days of putting them up as we do see more risks of mentioning such now, but the purpose is to state that he will be judged just as negatively, by not mentioning the Autism, if he cannot for more formal venues, etc. hide certain issues, or act more politically correct. This puts extra pressure on him to be someone he cannot be, if his desire is to succeed or be liked now, as we only care about making him happy and keep telling him that. Failing in his eyes could harm his self-esteem ir future musical desires, like if less persons clapped because of perceived rudeness or limited social skills, or if he feels insulted by not getting to round two. I guess the answer is for now, ditch the contests, and not do group choirs. He seems more into singing at home, practicing with the instructor, and being more himself at karaoke child-friendly clubs.

For the reasons some of you mention or suggest, we never imposed any religion on our children, nor public school system. We are trying to protect our children from those possible harms and entities too and/or letting them make those choices once they reach legal age.