Autistic Children and the Education System.

[Outdated]

I thought this story was very interesting, the struggles these kids go through fits with my experiences of half a century ago.

These are all 'school can't' kids, but they're thriving in different ways

 

[FayetheAspie]

I'm so glad that I was homeschooled and that my Mama knew how to work around my ADHD by letting me have exercise/dance breaks between classes, letting me wiggle around in my seat even popping up on my knees and back down while doing my lessons so long as I was working on them. I know that a public school setting would have most likely had negative impacts on my grades and learning. Do people with ASD only relate to needing extra breaks and permission to shift around in their seat?

 

[Outdated]

Do people with ASD only relate to needing extra breaks and permission to shift around in their seat?

I think that's more ADHD than ASD. Others will need to clarify there, I'm pure ASD and and I can't really relate to that constant need for activity.

I was academically brilliant but severely suffered socially. If allowed to learn at my own pace I could have finished high school by age 9 and had a PhD by the time I was legally old enough to leave school. But I wasn't allowed to study at my own pace, I was deliberately held back and they tried to force me to learn how to fit in with other kids, which was something I was simply not capable of doing.

 

[FayetheAspie]

I think that's more ADHD than ASD. Others will need to clarify there, I'm pure ASD and and I can't really relate to that constant need for activity.

I was academically brilliant but severely suffered socially. If allowed to learn at my own pace I could have finished high school by age 9 and had a PhD by the time I was legally old enough to leave school. But I wasn't allowed to study at my own pace, I was deliberately held back and they tried to force me to learn how to fit in with other kids, which was something I was simply not capable of doing.

I got high grades and was one year ahead in school. I took extra science classes in high-school by choice. On the other hand though, I was behind other children when it came to emotional age development. I enjoyed playing with baby/toddler toys into my early teens and enjoyed pretend play all the way into my late twenties. Between my advanced intelligence and my childlike personality and interest, I needless to say was not very accepted among my peers as a teen. If discussing academics, I would talk over their heads and be trying to teach them science facts that they neither understood nor had any interest in. If I wanted to play, they had outgrown playing and wanted to talk about things like makeup and dating that I was not interested in discussing.

 

[Outdated]

School was just a traumatic waste of time for me. At the beginning of every year they give you a set of text books, I'd sit down and read them over a weekend. Eidetic memory, that was the entirety of my studying for the year. My time in school, even during classes, was spent reading science fiction novels and pretending the class didn't exist.

A lot of the time I didn't even bother going to school, both parents worked full time, I used to sit down the end of the street and watch for Mum to drive off to work and then go home again. I always got straight As in all subjects.

 

[FayetheAspie]

School was just a traumatic waste of time for me. At the beginning of every year they give you a set of text books, I'd sit down and read them over a weekend. Eidetic memory, that was the entirety of my studying for the year. My time in school, even during classes, was spent reading science fiction novels and pretending the class didn't exist.

A lot of the time I didn't even bother going to school, both parents worked full time, I used to sit down the end of the street and watch for Mum to drive off to work and then go home again. I always got straight As in all subjects.

It sounds like you were probably in the profoundly gifted category.

 

[Outdated]

It sounds like you were probably in the profoundly gifted category.

I was, but the public education system is designed to be as much a social institution as an educational one, more emphasis on the social than the educational. This simply doesn't suit most autistic children regardless of their abilities.

I learnt more from my grandfather than I did from going to school and he died when I was 11. My last 5 years of school were spent just waiting until I was old enough to get out of there. They didn't start paying any attention to my differences until I was 14, a decade too late. I did sit a series of IQ tests - 172.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

I am trying to sort out who my grand daughter is, may be gifted or profoundly so getting more from this site than
watching experts and U-tube let me know what to expect. I was am just bright enough to fit in with the system as it was at the time. Still sorting out who I am, Just want to in position to help the next generation

 

[Neonatal RRT]

In a related situation, it has become clear that many young people for various reasons are not "classroom" learners.

We went for decades with this idea that the only way to "get ahead" in life was with a college degree. Lately, though, what this also means is that those that graduate, at least in the US, are strapped with 10's if not 100's of thousands of dollars' worth of educational debt, and no guarantee of receiving a job, they can't afford a home, to have children, and so on. Furthermore, with AI and humanoid robots entering the job market within the next 5 years, most of those office jobs will be lost.

Having said that, at least in the US, we are now in the midst of a cultural shift away from university education and a renewed push into the skilled trades. Currently, we are in a critical shortage of all manner of skilled tradespeople, perhaps by millions. With a relatively short hands-on training program, perhaps some applied math skills, perhaps some apprenticeships, people can walk into a salary well above $100,000/year.

I can see an opportunity here for all those "twice exceptional" autistics to get themselves into a skilled trade where they are working with their hands and raking in some serious cash.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

I was frugal, made enough funds with cleaning out chicken barns and other such jobs to pay my tuition boarding costs and a bit of borrowed funds from government that, I Paid off within my first year of working. University would have cost double, one of the reasons I picked college. Either way put away funds for my kids both graduated with similar diplomas to myself without debt. younger son only complaint, now is is current employer has him in golden hand cuffs.

 

[vergil96]

The education system doesn't sit well with me either. Not tragically so, but I prefer to learn in my own pace and way. No way I'm going to attend a postgraduate degree now!

 

[Outdated]

Having said that, at least in the US, we are now in the midst of a cultural shift away from university education and a renewed push into the skilled trades. Currently, we are in a critical shortage of all manner of skilled tradespeople, perhaps by millions. With a relatively short hands-on training program, perhaps some applied math skills, perhaps some apprenticeships, people can walk into a salary well above $100,000/year.

This hasn't started in Australia again yet but it's desperately needed, especially so in the trades sector. Some employers are starting to realise once again that genuine talent far outstrips any formal qualifications and that a lot of qualifications aren't really worth the paper they're written on, especially so in the trades sector.

That was another thing that contributed to my burn out. I'd never had a formal qualification for anything I did but when I was young no one cared, I demonstrated knowledge and ability and that was good enough. More than good enough in most situations, I was very good at what I did and was a bit of a prize catch.

After 2000 there started being more and more demand for formal qualifications and the idea of putting myself back in to a school situation was not something I could cope with. A lot of formal qualifications are ridiculous here now, just to be a gormless grunt in a warehouse shifting boxes around you need to do a 3 month full time course to be certified in Warehousing 1 & 2.

 

[Outdated]

I am trying to sort out who my grand daughter is, may be gifted or profoundly so

Try to avoid putting a label on her, when people do that it restricts the way they think about the child and none of us are ever just one thing.

I loved my grandfather very much, he was always quiet and calm and he was always teaching me things in simple no nonsense language. That was what I wanted more than anything else as a kid - knowledge. My grandfather always had something new to teach me, from simple bush survival tricks to things like magnetism and molecular alignment.

For smart kids knowledge is like vegetables - as much as you can push through the front of their heads.

 

[Shamar]

I think that's more ADHD than ASD. Others will need to clarify there, I'm pure ASD and and I can't really relate to that constant need for activity.

I was academically brilliant but severely suffered socially. If allowed to learn at my own pace I could have finished high school by age 9 and had a PhD by the time I was legally old enough to leave school. But I wasn't allowed to study at my own pace, I was deliberately held back and they tried to force me to learn how to fit in with other kids, which was something I was simply not capable of doing.

I got poor grades in school mainly because it was so excruciatingly BORING. By the sixth grade, I had exhausted the potential of the school library, and there was nothing they had that was not childish or insipid. In third grade, my teacher recognized there might be a problem, and the school district psychologist (they only had one for all schools in those days) gave me a battery of tests, and said I needed to be moved from the slow learners to the most advanced class they had. The school said no because my grades were too low (I suspect they just didn't want to be bothered, and/r admit they made a mistake). I continued to be excruciatingly bored.

I came across this meme the other day, which I think says a lot.

 

[Shamar]

In a related situation, it has become clear that many young people for various reasons are not "classroom" learners.

We went for decades with this idea that the only way to "get ahead" in life was with a college degree. Lately, though, what this also means is that those that graduate, at least in the US, are strapped with 10's if not 100's of thousands of dollars' worth of educational debt, and no guarantee of receiving a job, they can't afford a home, to have children, and so on. Furthermore, with AI and humanoid robots entering the job market within the next 5 years, most of those office jobs will be lost.

Having said that, at least in the US, we are now in the midst of a cultural shift away from university education and a renewed push into the skilled trades. Currently, we are in a critical shortage of all manner of skilled tradespeople, perhaps by millions. With a relatively short hands-on training program, perhaps some applied math skills, perhaps some apprenticeships, people can walk into a salary well above $100,000/year.

I can see an opportunity here for all those "twice exceptional" autistics to get themselves into a skilled trade where they are working with their hands and raking in some serious cash.

Yes, I have all sorts of skills and can do many things. The problem is, I did not have a piece of paper that said I had those skills, and thus was unable to find work that used them. I was competing (and losing) against people who had no practical skills and could do nothing, but did have a piece of paper that said they were trained.

 

[Outdated]

I came across this meme the other day, which I think says a lot.

That one tears me in two. I always did have a bit of that elitist attitude about me but at the same time I've met and befriended a lot of people from all walks of life and I understand just how harmful that elitist attitude can be.

There needs to be allowances made for bright children just as much as they already make allowances for those that struggle, but to try and exclude any from the range of the intellectual spectrum is wrong.

I relate to the boredom bit though, I read a lot of novels.

 

[Dillon]

Honestly the education system just does not care to a degree that would have these students more successful and be willing to express themselves without all these limitations schools like to set “oh we want to teach you hands on skills but instead here is a benchmark test so you can pass on to the next grade” I don’t know about anyone else but in the U.S especially in Texas, students have to deal with the STAR test and if students don’t pass it not only they only fail the grade but it penalizes teachers as well where the teachers performance review is impacted. People just think oh students will be able to learn if they just study well what about the stress that not only puts on individuals with ASD but ADHD and dyslexia. This is partly the reason why quite a bit of autistic teens and adults are either underemployed or unemployed right out of highschool as school districts are more worried about making money from state standardized tests instead of educating them to be successful wether that be financially, learning how to live independently acquiring basic home ed skills, etc.

 

[Outdated]

Honestly the education system just does not care to a degree that would have these students more successful....

For me it was exactly the same thing but from the other end. I was brilliant and I knew it but I wasn't allowed to shine. They doled knowledge out like war rations then spent the entire rest of the year repeating the same lesson over and over again. They insisted I go at the same pace as the rest of the class, I learnt far more outside of school than in.

.... learning how to live independently acquiring basic home ed skills, etc.

For this part we had no choice. I had a very dysfunctional family and both parents worked full time, the old man worked two jobs. So from an early age we cooked and cleaned and looked after ourselves because if we didn't no one was going to do it for us. There was always food in the house and we were always provided for but there was hardly ever anyone else there.

 

[Dillon]

For me it was exactly the same thing but from the other end. I was brilliant and I knew it but I wasn't allowed to shine. They doled knowledge out like war rations then spent the entire rest of the year repeating the same lesson over and over again. They insisted I go at the same pace as the rest of the class, I learnt far more outside of school than in.


For this part we had no choice. I had a very dysfunctional family and both parents worked full time, the old man worked two jobs. So from an early age we cooked and cleaned and looked after ourselves because if we didn't no one was going to do it for us. There was always food in the house and we were always provided for but there was hardly ever anyone else there.

I love to learn new things and I knew I was capable of achieving quite a bit from an early age but just like you I rather not hear the repetitiveness of topics being brought up constantly when I already know of the general knowledge and how to do it. It was a constant thing throughout highschool where in each grade I went through I didn’t feel like I was learning something that was ground breaking but the same thing oh let’s go over covalent and ionic bonds, gotta learn that algebra and don’t forget English. At that time I would just draw in class at times but of course I would get in trouble with that. I learned more from independent learning at my own home where I am able to learn more new knowledge as I’m learning about myself.

I have a brother who is also ASD who went through the same grade levels as me; we are also twins. His case is much different from mine as he’s not able to live independently on his own to the point he struggles to cook meals at home, doesn’t understand the complexity of money or doesn’t even know how to tie his own shoes. For him he knows it’s embarrassing to have his Mom help him with living care but this are skills all from elementary to highschool never bothered to provide extra support and resources despite all the promising talk. Instead though let’s just keep someone like my brother in a locked up classroom and watch movies all day. To me that’s not stimulating but it’s insulting on the intelligence on these disabled individuals like my brother in this case.