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Bottom-up thinking and impaired EF

royinpink

Well-Known Member
I’d like to discuss how bottom-up thinking impacts your approach to writing and/or work, using Temple Grandin and Michelle Dawson as a reference point.

This will be a 3-part post, so that you can skip to the questions at the end when you get tired of reading ;) Please do, though, because I'd really value any input you have!:
  1. My experience that led me to this question
  2. Temple Grandin on her own and Michelle Dawson’s research process
  3. Questions for you all!

1: My own experience

In preparation for leaving teaching and returning to school, I’ve been thinking about why sometimes it is overwhelming for me to start or to finish a research paper. In the past, this was a huge problem for me, and the overwhelm I experienced was a big part of why I avoided work until the last minute (or shut down, or faced penalties as the cycle got worse).

I’ve been looking for the ‘answer’ for ages, trying procrastination self-help books (which blamed my perfectionism and fear of failure) and trying to go through my childhood for ways I had learned maladaptive coping strategies and correcting them with positive self-talk, but never quite being able to overcome the problem. I think it’s not limited to one set of issues, and I’m sure a lot of it is accumulated guilt and anxiety over not being able to do things the same way or at the same pace that other people do them—especially since I was labelled ‘gifted’ rather than aspie or autistic and held to high expectations by my parents and, in turn, by myself.

Since receiving the diagnosis and doing research into Asperger’s, I’ve realized that a lot of my anxiety centers around things that place high demands on my executive functioning (processes that involve multiple steps, decision-making, organization, etc.) as well as things that involve uncertainty because I can’t see the outcome.

Of course, the experience of failure intensifies that uncertainty—but this is not unique to aspies or autistics. Everyone is more wary of trying something when they’ve failed before. That’s the purpose of fear—to warn us about potential dangers! This is a big reason why a lot of my therapy has been useless, and my specialist therapist has focused on getting me to communicate my needs and choose an environment that suits me, where I can experience success to reverse the process.

But still, there are some tasks that stress me out just because of the nature of the task, and I find that making a diagram or ‘visual notes’ (traditional notes are useless to me because my memory is good, and I get lost in long lists) helps to lower my anxiety about the task. This is a way of compensating for poor working memory and bottom-up thinking. I relate to what Temple Grandin has said about how bottom-up thinking makes her research process longer and less immediately defined than others’, and I wonder if something similar would work for me.

2: Temple Grandin on her own and Michelle Dawson’s research process (from The Autistic Brain)

Consider Michelle Dawson, the researcher who thought to look for references to autistic strengths that are buried in the literature. She's autistic. I can't say she made her conceptual leap because she's autistic, but I think she was more likely to make it because she herself possessed a fine attention to details. 'Dawson's keen viewpoint keeps the lab focused on the most important aspect of science: data,' Mottron wrote in a 2011 article in Nature. “She has a bottom-up heuristic, in which ideas come from the available facts, and from them only.”

Dawson had always approached her research with the same received wisdom, making the same unthinking assumption, as her mentors and peers—that studying autism means studying deficits. But that assumption was the result of what Mottron identified in himself as a “top-down approach: I grasp and manipulate general ideas from fewer sources.” Only when he’s come up with a hypothesis does he “go back to facts.” Dawson found it easier to free herself of the preconceptions inherent in top-down thinking because she was able to see the details dispassionately and in isolation. When other researchers look at her data about autistic strengths and say, “It’s so good to see something positive!” she answers that she doesn’t see it as positive or negative: “I see it as accurate.”

I completely identify with this attitude. For my undergraduate honors thesis, I wanted to explore the subject of sensory interaction. How does a stimulus to one sense, such as hearing, affect the sensitivity of other senses? I gathered more than one hundred journal papers. Because my thinking is totally nonsequential, I had to develop a way to make sense of the research.

First, I numbered each journal article. Next, I typed the major findings of each study on separate slips of paper. Some studies yielded only one or two strips of paper. Review articles prompted more than a dozen. Then I put all the strips in a box. I’d hung a huge bulletin board in my dorm room—maybe four feet by six feet. I drew the first strip out of the box and I pinned it just anywhere on the board. Then I pulled out the next strip. Let’s say the first strip was about the sense of vision, and the second was about the sense of hearing. So the second strip went on a different part of the board, because now I had the beginnings of two categories. I made labels for those two categories and pinned them to the top of the board so that they headed two columns. I continued to take strips of paper out of the box, one at a time, like drawing lots. I’d pick one, put it with the other strips in a category, create a new category, or throw out all the old categories and rearrange all the strips of paper. In the end, after I had finished sorting all the strips of paper into different categories of information, I began to see how the categories of information fit together to form larger concepts. […]

This process can be extremely time-consuming. When I was in college, it sometimes took me months of reading journal articles and posting scraps of paper on the bulletin board to arrive at the basic principle. Now I have a lot more experience sifting through scientific research. I no longer need an actual bulletin board on the wall, because I’ve got one in my mind. That’s why I trust my conclusions. I feel that my local bias frees me from the global bias that gets in the way of top-down thinkers.

Mottron identified the same pattern in Dawson’s research. “She does need a very large amount of data to draw conclusions,” he wrote in Nature. But, he added, “her models never over-reach, and are almost infallibly accurate.”

3: Questions
  • Do you have any similar experiences with anxiety about tackling long projects (or other tasks made difficult by impaired EF)?
  • Do you have any strategies you use to visualize or help you in some other way to go from bottom-up thinking to the big picture?
  • Do you think you would find Temple’s strategies (bulletin board, etc.) at all useful? Are there ways to improve on it or make it less tedious?
  • At what point does such a strategy transition from being an external, tangible process, to an internal, visual one? (Unlike Temple, I have always relied on visualization, but I need to feel 100%--no anxiety or distractions--for it to be a painless process)
  • Any other thoughts you have on the research process she describes (I honestly don't get how people can do research any other way).
 
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Do you have any similar experiences with anxiety about tackling long projects (or other tasks made difficult by impaired EF)?
Yes. For me, it's just STARTING it. I hate starting a new project because I always feel so lost and overwhelmed. If I can ever get the chance to sit down and let my over-analytical side take over, it's a cake walk. I love to sort and organize, so once I'm able to get it started, I have little trouble finishing it. Well, unless it's really boring, then it takes a while for me to get up the interest to work on it. :p

Do you have any strategies you use to visualize or help you in some other way to go from bottom-up thinking to the big picture?
Look at it once, put it away. Sleep on it for a few days. Pick it up again, look for patterns. Slowly but surely, start sorting that disaster out and make it comprehensible.

Do you think you would find Temple’s strategies (bulletin board, etc.) at all useful? Are there ways to improve on it or make it less tedious?
Personally I'd prefer to be given a computer and Notepad so that I can make a few lists and rearrange it as I need. My computer has a music player that wouldn't get in the way like the earbuds of an mp3 player if I did it with traditional methods. Or just a plain ol' notebook and a few sheets of paper where I can write down on each one the categories as they come to me, but that'd make rearranging a pain since I'd have to erase a lot.

At what point does such a strategy transition from being an external, tangible process, to an internal, visual one? (Unlike Temple, I have always relied on visualization, but I need to feel 100%--no anxiety or distractions--for it to be a painless process)
I guess when you've read it enough you can keep it in your head. At least, that's the principal experienced artists teach us lesser experienced ones. Practice, practice, practice until you've got it memorized and don't always need a reference to draw a hand or whatever. Same principal with studying I guess. Read, read, read, until you've got it memorized and can piece it together of the top of your head?

Any other thoughts you have on the research process she describes (I honestly don't get how people can do research any other way).
It's very interesting. And seems kind of obvious, you need to start any research by organizing it and piecing it together one by one if you want it to make any sense. Only sloppy people just throw it together without really looking at it first. The only odd thing I found about her process was a box. Oldschool researchers and strategists are fond of their pushpins.
 
  • Do you have any similar experiences with anxiety about tackling long projects (or other tasks made difficult by impaired EF)?
Yes, starting is my problem as well. This is more true when it is a task I dislike, such as doing dishes. Even though there is only one sink full of dishes and a few things in the dishwasher that must be put away, in my mind it looks like a monumental task that will take me days to complete. I KNOW it will only take me half an hour or less so, I put it off, then other things must be done and, before I actually get to doing dishes, there is three or four days worth of them piled up. (I do rinse and stack them after every meal so, it isn't as if they are coated in food or anything, just piled up and needing to be put in the dishwasher.)

Do you have any strategies you use to visualize or help you in some other way to go from bottom-up thinking to the big picture?
Yes, I make up a song about it, the first verses are the facts I know, the chorus is the summary of those fact, the big picture. Many things make sense to me as music when I can't make sense of them otherwise. Once I can sing it or play it on a instrument, then I understand it.


Do you think you would find Temple’s strategies (bulletin board, etc.) at all useful? Are there ways to improve on it or make it less tedious?
No I would find the bulletin board bulky, messy, confusing and a waste of time and space. I would prefer to use a computer where I can cut an paste and move bits of information about quickly and without wasting space and paper.

At what point does such a strategy transition from being an external, tangible process, to an internal, visual one?
When I have done similar tasks enough times to be able to use the techniques that work by wrote. The problem for me is tasks that NTs see as similar are not similar to me. Writing pop song about fire is in no way related to writing a folk song about a campfire to me but, I'm told those would be similar to an NT.

Any other thoughts you have on the research process she describes
For me, research means learning all that is available to learn about a specific subject or item. That may take a lifetime so, to me I am rarely finished researching a subject or item. I have been interested in music all of my life, i have played an instrument since I was five. I still have not finished researching music, I do not know all there is to know about music so, there is more for me to research.

That is where I run into problems with writing papers and reports and, the like. No matter what I write, it will be incomplete and, potentially inaccurate because I do not have time to learn all there is to know about whatever it is I am expected to write about.
 
Awesome replies, thanks, both of you! I'm off to bed but I'll respond to these first.

If I can ever get the chance to sit down and let my over-analytical side take over, it's a cake walk.
Even though there is only one sink full of dishes and a few things in the dishwasher that must be put away, in my mind it looks like a monumental task that will take me days to complete.

I am totally the same on both counts. I have had some truly shameful sinks full of dishes (especially when I get overloaded in other areas of life).

Your comments also help me clarify what I meant about how I find visual aids useful. For Temple, it seemed that she automatically set about creating an external way for herself to keep track of things and gradually made the process internal. For me, I tried to do it all in my head, even when doing it in my head was not the easiest or the best strategy.

What I discovered recently was that this was actually a source of anxiety for the exact reason Beverly mentions about dishwashing: when I don't have something external to refer to, the task is monumental in my mind even when I know how long it should realistically take and I know I can do it. Basically, I need the visual reminder to make that 'big picture' I can't see yet less scary and help me focus on the steps, reassuring me that after one step is another step.

I redesigned a lesson plan template recently to be more 'bottom-up' and fit the order and the layout for times that I see in my head. That way when I brainstorm or search for ideas and resources on a theme, I can write them down right away (before I forget them) directly onto the plan (creative use of the 'how will you build literacy skills' section), and later decide how to unify them into goals/objectives, then arrange them into days and times. Before I'd have like 30 open tabs on my computer--just a mess. My anxiety about completing it went down significantly.

It's true that motivation helps, and I think this is a big reason why procrastination worked (until college and employment, anyway) as a coping mechanism: when I had do-or-die pressure, I could be motivated enough to struggle through anything. But I didn't truly appreciate the cost to myself. Not only did the end product suffer, but I was on a constant emotional diet of stress, needing more time to recover afterward, not sleeping properly or at all. I would literally put myself through this every day because I knew if I allowed myself to sleep first, I would lose the pressure to get the day's work finished.

I really like this page on executive functioning and how they address motivation:

Parents often say: “My child is just not motivated. He can do what I ask if he feels like it.” Lack of motivation is an important reason for failing to complete tasks, but not all children who fail to complete tasks or who participate poorly in social activities have executive dysfunctions. So why is it that some children are so much less motivated to complete daily tasks and chores? What accounts for motivation?

Although there is more than one way to answer this question, the presence of executive dysfunctions is one of the factors that reduce motivation. If tasks are a burden on the child’s executive skills, he probably has to be highly motivated to complete them or else he will lose his motivation altogether.

Enhance motivation by simplifying the executive demands of the task. 1) Make tasks shorter, 2) reduce distractors, and 3) use visual supports. These are all strategies to reduce the executive demands of a task or activity, to increase motivation, and to increase the chances of successful task completion.
As for the need for visual aids disappearing with mastery, I asked because I'm not sure it's true. I can do these things in my head, it just stresses me out too much and I get a sense of impending doom about the impossibly large task ahead. But maybe that's because I haven't truly mastered any of these things? Still a new teacher, still a novice researcher, etc.? But I should think I'm not a beginning dishwasher! Maybe it's not just mastery that's required, but mastery, motivation, and calm (I wish I had an m-word for that to keep the alliteration).

Personally I'd prefer to be given a computer and Notepad so that I can make a few lists and rearrange it as I need. My computer has a music player that wouldn't get in the way like the earbuds of an mp3 player if I did it with traditional methods. Or just a plain ol' notebook and a few sheets of paper where I can write down on each one the categories as they come to me, but that'd make rearranging a pain since I'd have to erase a lot.
I would prefer to use a computer where I can cut an paste and move bits of information about quickly and without wasting space and paper.

It's interesting to me that you both mention computers. I find I get kind of myopic when I'm on the computer all the time...maybe if I had a large monitor so I could really see everything at once. But as it is, I like having pen and paper so that I can a) have physical contact with the paper, dunno why but I like it b) not be distracted by other open windows/programs or the nagging sense I should check my messages and c) can feel free to draw and arrange without worrying about the next step of what tools or formatting I can use to recreate that on the computer--it's simpler.

Yes, I make up a song about it, the first verses are the facts I know, the chorus is the summary of those fact, the big picture. Many things make sense to me as music when I can't make sense of them otherwise. Once I can sing it or play it on a instrument, then I understand it.

I love this idea!

I will have to address the thing about getting the research 'complete' later...after some thought :)
 
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I must sheepishly raise my hand with the dishes too. Back when I was cooking supper every night, the dishes were washed every day because it was part of my supper routine that while the stove or oven cooked away I would do the dishes as a way to keep me from constantly poking and prodding food that honestly needed to be left alone so it'd cook more deliciously. Then it became a matter of not wanting to do it simply because I didn't like being hunched over at a sink that made my back hurt. Kinda funny, now that we have a dishwasher, I'm no good at managing dishes. It's like I can take advantage of how much I dislike the smell of wet peanut butter (barftastic) and the feel of dirty plates. I'm trying to get into my mom's habit of rinsing them off and putting them immediately into the dishwasher after use, but we often have a set drying, so that makes it awkward.
 
Ashe, that is me, I do rinse and stack them after every meal but, there are usually clean dishes in the dishwasher, so putting them in there is not an option. If you find wet peanut butter nauseating, don't let anyone eat humus, that's even worse - it adds wet refried beans to the wet peanut butter problem. (Gag-a-licious.)

Don't get me started on the feel of dirty plates. Crumbly stuff is okay and I can handle mushy but slippery, slimy like meat gravy, egg yolk, avocado, and steamed okra make me physically shudder. I deal with them and get the plates rinsed but yuck.
 
Basically, I clean if it smells (because ew gross--hm, motivation again), but I am the queen of dust and clutter. It can easily get like the photos in Autisticook's post about cleaning difficulties. I used to share an apartment with another girl I now realize is on the spectrum. Her room was nearly waist-deep in clothing, and we had a truly amazing pile of recycling. Dishes...goes without saying.

Here, only the super-rich have dishwashers, so dishes get washed by hand in tiny sinks. At least the size limits how many dishes I can reasonably accumulate without having an entire kitchen full of dishes... this kitchen is newer than mine but gives you an idea of a typical middle-class setup in HK:

img4ba2cd325cb3b7.71824314.jpg


ETA: I knew I had a photo of the recycling pile somewhere. I attached it, but I chickened out and deleted it. Is anyone else brave? :oops:
 
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My recycling has become a pile in the garage and I really have to take it and the donations to their respective places in town before the garage feels any messier. I posted a picture of my sink with dishes in the thread post a picture of soemthing shiny. lol
My messes of some types of items will grow for a couple weeks but a few years back I started decluttering and disciplined myself to keep the surfaces clear. It has helped a lot,
  • Do you have any similar experiences with anxiety about tackling long projects (or other tasks made difficult by impaired EF)? Yes. It is similar to tackling the packing of a house to move. Overwhelming feeling of oh my I have got some kind of hubris to think I could accomplish this.

  • Do you have any strategies you use to visualize or help you in some other way to go from bottom-up thinking to the big picture? Yes. If it is an artwork project I buy a new sketchbook and dedicate it to the goal &/or problem. That way I can close it up and put it away to give my brain a true rest. The rest is as importsnt as the work, just like with exercise.

  • Do you think you would find Temple’s strategies (bulletin board, etc.) at all useful? Are there ways to improve on it or make it less tedious? I think that works for her but we all have to have a way that feels right for us. I have to see things. During university I got all A's on my papers because I dive in to them with a ferverish intensity and block out everything else for the time required. Sometimes I got sick when I was done, blew my immune system I guess.

  • At what point does such a strategy transition from being an external, tangible process, to an internal, visual one? (Unlike Temple, I have always relied on visualization, but I need to feel 100%--no anxiety or distractions--for it to be a painless process) No, it is all visual. As I research it has to be processed into visual as I go. Hence my lower functioning in the success of the resl world. I have raised two kids by myself and run a budget and household for 20 years though.

  • Any other thoughts you have on the research process she describes (I honestly don't get how people can do research any other way). Just what I said above. Having the wealth of time to focus reduces anxiety and unlocks the creative drive.
 
Here, only the super-rich have dishwashers, so dishes get washed by hand in tiny sinks. At least the size limits how many dishes I can reasonably accumulate without having an entire kitchen full of dishes... this kitchen is newer than mine but gives you an idea of a typical middle-class setup in HK:

img4ba2cd325cb3b7.71824314.jpg

Oh my gosh, that kitchen would be impossible for me to use, it's far to small and, I could not possibly even think of preparing food in the laundry room, which that also is. The toaster oven could not be on top of the refrigerator and, there is no oven, no grill, no blender, nothing I need in there.
 
Maybe Beverly is on to something there.
I am probably saying things you already thought of but I'll post anyway.
For serious projects I have to allow them to balloon up into very large entities in my mind. Normally goals and projects are purposely kept to a small footprint so to speak.
I don't like the messiness of the bigness, the voracious way it eats up energy. Hence the procrastination.
Maybe one needs to metaphorically shove other stuff into cupboards and off the counters. And then accept that as information builds the end vision may shift until that fateful moment when either it crystallizes from the ground up or one decisively makes an assessement to head a certain direction with it.
 
Do you have any similar experiences with anxiety about tackling long projects (or other tasks made difficult by impaired EF)?

Absolutely, every time. Doing research on anything there is a tendency to follow my interests in knowing something, or learning something new, or taking another direction or many directions. Until I have many, many ideas, many theses, and reject the original premise. Then I begin a new premise and move away from the new premise to another. I become lost in the research every time.

This happened in genetics research at university continually. Every idea was explored, until I ran out of time, and neglected the original idea. I felt that there must be a 'better' premise so I searched for it. Luckily my prof understood because we talked all the time, she would give me the 'focus' talk on a regular basis. Eventually I would do the original work, that I had proposed, which seemed boring after all the research, uninteresting, and dragged myself through it without much dedication.

The anxiety I have is usually related to the final paper, or piece, or result. My perfectionism ramps up, and I want to come up with something 'better.' It's likely now that the 'not good enough' scenario is related to AS but also to wanting to know everything about anything. I'm much more interested in the 'knowing & understanding' than any grade or reward.

Do you have any strategies you use to visualize or help you in some other way to go from bottom-up thinking to the big picture?

Yes I do, I learned to do this during my art degree with whiteboards and markers.

To focus I write words on a white board or any light coloured board or paper, related to summations or ideas, I write many ideas, even conclusions, I write down colours, emotions that I feel when I see the ideas made into words. I draw arrows connecting ideas that seem similar. I cross out some, I sometimes put in pictures or basic drawings.

I move on and condense the ideas on the next white board. I throw away the original white board, or keep it depending on the thought process and the project.

I keep the second white board around, and bring it everywhere in my personal space so that I can't get away from it, I put it in front of my bed, so its the first thing I see when I wake up. In the bathroom when brushing my teeth, its much like a brainwashing.

Then I hide it for a day or two. Which gives me time to not think about it, but actually I've now internalized the ideas. Now my brain is making connections, that I'm unaware of.

When I take it out again I look for some impression, some overall idea that encompasses all the ideas I've written there. I don't look always at the words I sometimes turn it upside down and sideways and walk around the whiteboard. I usually then have a final thesis.

This is a visualization technique taught in art, its interchangeable for many projects that I've done.
 
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Washing dishes: I discovered recently that its the 'noise' the dishes make clanking and banging together in the dishpan as well as the sound of water running makes me quite tense and anxious, its sets up a fight or flight response.

I wear construction or noise blocking earmuffs that look like headphones, and they mute the noise the dishes make in the sink. It's made an incredible difference, and I do the same thing when I vacuum.
 
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For me it's half that I hate the feel and smell of many wet foods and half my childhood.

We (my sisters and I) had to do the dishes by hand, and if there was a water spot on any of them, we got one swat with Dad's belt, a speck of food left on a plate meant 5 swats, and anything left in a glass 10 swats. If we did not do the dishes within 30 minutes after a meal, we got 50 swats and, forbidden from eating the next meal. So I associate dishes with a horrid smelling, horrid feeling punishment that I do not want or deserve.

Logically I know I am not going to be punished if I do not do them perfectly now, and I know the smelly, wet food will not harm me but, I still detest doing dishes.

That is one thing I miss about life on the road, I never had to do dishes while traveling or touring. The food either comes in disposable containers or, someone else is responsible for doing the dishes - the restaurant staff, hotel staff, Craft (on location food service) someone other than me.
 
I'm so glad to know I'm not alone here!

That is where I run into problems with writing papers and reports and, the like. No matter what I write, it will be incomplete and, potentially inaccurate because I do not have time to learn all there is to know about whatever it is I am expected to write about.

This seems to be very common to folks on the spectrum. In fact, in the post from Autisticook I linked to, she says:

Not only do I have problems with executive function, actually getting to the point where I can start cleaning and not overanalysing all the things I need to do and becoming completely paralysed from all the choices involved, I also have a problem with doing a half-arsed job. I look at a household chore and picture what the end result needs to be. And then I want to make that happen. I focus too much on the end result. And with housekeeping that means I usually end up feeling either overwhelmed or like I haven’t accomplished enough.

Because housekeeping is far more about doing a little bit each day and not worrying about getting it “done”.

And I can’t do that. Once I start, I need to finish it. I need to reach that end goal in order to get my dopamine hit. My happy buzz. My sense of achievement. My reward.

So instead, everything about household chores seems designed to make me feel like even more of a failure than I already feel I am.
For myself, these two things seem to intertwine. I like that she doesn't call it perfectionism, because I don't feel worried about it not being good enough. Rather, as she says, I just have a picture of how it 'should be' that I can't seem to alter or accept deviation from. And forcing myself to deviate from it triggers more anxiety that I have to cope with.

So this picture makes me anxious both because I can't visualize all the steps to get to the end result at once and get overwhelmed, and because I cannot be satisfied unless I attain it. Procrastination also makes this simpler: you don't have to choose, your time limit forces you to choose.

So while advice aimed at perfectionism does sort of apply to me because I do never feel good enough, I do talk to myself in 'shoulds', I don't have any consoling voice that celebrates each step accomplished, it also seems to miss the mark because it doesn't account for the impaired EF and the ultimate cause of my feeling 'not good enough' seems to be a bit different...I just have no concept of what a half-assed effort would look like or how to do it. Everything is black or white for me.

If it is an artwork project I buy a new sketchbook and dedicate it to the goal &/or problem. That way I can close it up and put it away to give my brain a true rest. The rest is as importsnt as the work, just like with exercise.

This is a good point. I need to learn to think of work just like exercise. Something you train and build up over time with breaks for rest.

During university I got all A's on my papers because I dive in to them with a ferverish intensity and block out everything else for the time required. Sometimes I got sick when I was done, blew my immune system I guess.

This is what I do...when I procrastinate. I envy that you do it immediately. When I try to do that (doesn't happen much now)...I tend to get in a bit over my head. In too much detail. Examining every possibility. Trying to complete something that will never be complete.

But yes, it does take a toll on the immune system. I hope you take better care of your body now!

As I research it has to be processed into visual as I go

I'm with you, here. Visual all the way!

Oh my gosh, that kitchen would be impossible for me to use, it's far to small and, I could not possibly even think of preparing food in the laundry room, which that also is. The toaster oven could not be on top of the refrigerator and, there is no oven, no grill, no blender, nothing I need in there.

Haha, the washing machines worried me for the same reason at first! :D The other common location is outside, on a patio/balcony (which is where mine is now).

I don't like the messiness of the bigness, the voracious way it eats up energy. Hence the procrastination.
Maybe one needs to metaphorically shove other stuff into cupboards and off the counters. And then accept that as information builds the end vision may shift until that fateful moment when either it crystallizes from the ground up or one decisively makes an assessement to head a certain direction with it.

Yes, I think this is good. My problem with planning has always been getting overwhelmed or becoming too rigid about the plan. So having a plan that is stored away or flexible would be ideal...if I could do it. I think accepting a shifting ending vision is probably like, a therapy goal, not an immediate solution. But it may be the only way.

Until I have many, many ideas, many theses, and reject the original premise. Then I begin a new premise and move away from the new premise to another. I become lost in the research every time.

This happened in genetics research at university continually. Every idea was explored, until I ran out of time, and neglected the original idea. I felt that there must be a 'better' premise so I searched for it. Luckily my prof understood because we talked all the time, she would give me the 'focus' talk on a regular basis. Eventually I would do the original work, that I had proposed, which seemed boring after all the research, uninteresting, and dragged myself through it without much dedication.

Haha, this sounds familiar! When I have a project I am truly interested in, I am really searching for the answer, not coming in with a predetermined understanding of what I'm going to say. And it does lead to getting stuck with the boring original plan. I'm not sure if this is me not being able to articulate the big picture until it's all over....well, it is, but I'm not sure if other people could articulate the kind of 'big picture' I'm after either, or if they just settle for a more limited or flawed hypothesis. Probably that's what they do. I don't feel I really want to compromise on that. Perhaps I just need to allow myself more time (like the book mentions, Michelle Dawson needed a lot more time and data).

The anxiety I have is usually related to the final paper, or piece, or result. My perfectionism ramps up, and I want to come up with something 'better.' It's likely now that the 'not good enough' scenario is related to AS but also to wanting to know everything about anything. I'm much more interested in the 'knowing & understanding' than any grade or reward.

For me this is complicated. I'm definitely not interested in the grade or reward. But apparently I have the "core belief" (CBT language) that I have to come up with something groundbreaking, so everything I do is held up to this standard, which makes it more of a "performance" which makes me anxious. Whereas if the pressure is off, I can pursue my special interests freely, out of love. It got to a point where that performance anxiety or perfectionism was so severe that it prevented me from accomplishing much, even in my free time where I judged myself and held myself to requirements to pursue special interests. I've had to learn to let go and just enjoy learning multiple times--I always seem to forget how and fall back into the pattern of setting rigid standards for myself.

Yes I do, I learned to do this during my art degree with whiteboards and markers.

To focus I write words on a white board or any light coloured board or paper, related to summations or ideas, I write many ideas, even conclusions, I write down colours, emotions that I feel when I see the ideas made into words. I draw arrows connecting ideas that seem similar. I cross out some, I sometimes put in pictures or basic drawings.

I move on and condense the ideas on the next white board. I throw away the original white board, or keep it depending on the thought process and the project.

I keep the second white board around, and bring it everywhere in my personal space so that I can't get away from it, I put it in front of my bed, so its the first thing I see when I wake up. In the bathroom when brushing my teeth, its much like a brainwashing.

Then I hide it for a day or two. Which gives me time to not think about it, but actually I've now internalized the ideas. Now my brain is making connections, that I'm unaware of.

When I take it out again I look for some impression, some overall idea that encompasses all the ideas I've written there. I don't look always at the words I sometimes turn it upside down and sideways and walk around the whiteboard. I usually then have a final thesis.

This is a visualization technique taught in art, its interchangeable for many projects that I've done.

This sounds like a great strategy, I'll have to try it!

Logically I know I am not going to be punished if I do not do them perfectly now, and I know the smelly, wet food will not harm me but, I still detest doing dishes.

Yeah, childhood patterns get wrapped up in this as well, making it hard to sort out. I think my perfectionism is very much tied to lack of positive reinforcement or support as a child.
 

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