College

[Chair]

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[Chris]

I take it your talking about college in the American sense - our (English) University. I intend to and see no reason why I shouldn't. Living arrangements might be a bit of a pain though, I'd have to be with Willow (same uni, etc).

With 'College' as it stands in English terminology, I've been coping fine so far, really.

 

[Ruby_Aspergic]

College is hard and stressful for me but it has nothing to do with autism. I attend a top 20 university and am an overachieving idiot who takes on too many obligations at once.

On that note, it is 7am and I have not slept, again, because I am studying. It's the first day back from spring break and I am already pulling all nighters. Life sucks.

 

[Sipe]

I`m planning on going to university. Somewhere in Sweden so I can practice my Swedish there. But what I`m going to study? No idea. Maybe philosophy, art, history... Something that interests me. And when I know which university I want to attend, I go there. If I fail at fist time, I try again. I keep trying until I pass. Simple as that. To be honest I don`t even know what I want to do in the future. I don`t know what kind of job want but I`m sure I will figure it out soon.

And I don`t believe that you need a "good" job to have a good live. In this case, by "good" job I mean a job which pays well. Money is only one part of wealth. The main thing is that you like or even love your job. So my point is that you might not need to go to college/university if your dream job does not need that much education.

And a piece of advice to that social anxiety thing; Even if you are not social type of person you can still cheer yourself up by doing things you like. Feeling sorry for about yourself does not help you at all. And if you really want to become more social, then decide that "I`m going to change, I`m going to be more social." And then take some small steps which helps you to be more social. For example start saying good morning to your classmates, or try to hat with during breaks and so on. If you just believe in yourself then miracles will happen. I used to be very angry and depressed person before I started to try this positive thinking. If this helped me it will help you too.

Sorry, if I went a bit off topic.

 

[Emor]

Ouch. Studying philosophy in a second language?
In the English sense I'm like, a bit over a year off College xD. I'm going to open-evenings currently for them and I'm like, 99.9% sure I'll be going to one. But I might drop out, but I sort of doubt that too.
I don't know when I'll be independent but I'm hoping like 18 maximum tbh, though I can see why that would be hard.
I also don't know if you can get well-paying jobs which would be worth all the debt I'd be put in for the subjects I'm interested in :|.
I don't really like to think about what I'm going to do tbh, because I have no idea.
I think I'll be able to keep a job though, but the cost could be too much(lots of stress, possible depression, etc.)
In terms of University, it'd have to depend on how well I do in College.
.
I don't see the point in going to University unless you're some sort of genius and I'm not.
That was a really controversial statement and doesn't make much sense because there's hundreds of reasons but yeah.
EMZ=]

 

[krisi]

My experience with college has been interesting. I voted, "Yes, I find it easy," because I took it to mean, "do you find college classes easy?" So, yes, I have a very good time in my classes and with the material I study. The thing about college (or University) is that you can choose to study what interests you, so the learning comes more naturally.

However, if you look at the "big picture" of the last four years of my life, it's been very difficult, because of all the factors outside class. I've had to transition into and out of three different living spaces, and those transitions, especially the first time, transitioning from home to my freshman dorm, were very, VERY difficult. That dorm was a freshmen-only dorm, so I again had to transition back home for the summer, and then into a different living space. Then there are roommate situations. Living with someone else is very, very difficult, and don't think that living with a friend makes it easier--it's much, much more difficult and can entirely ruin your friendship (it's not like this for everyone, but I'm not the only one who has gone through this).

Then, if you choose to do extracurriculars or have a job while you are in college, that creates extra scheduling and extra short-term transitioning. I don't have a problem with short-term transitions (class to class, whereas a long-term transition would be home-to-dorm, dorm-to-apartment, etc), however, having too many of them without a lot of structure can become a little overwhelming for me.

How I have coped? Sometimes well, and sometimes not. I have more meltdowns when I am stressed. Sometimes I engage in self-agressive behaviors, even though I know it's not good for me. The best ways I have of dealing with things is taking an hour or two to myself, shutting the door, and just being alone on my bed, often playing with play-doh (that's really soothing to me). If you can find something that is soothing, like taking a shower, rocking, holding something soft, feeling deep pressure, or something of the like, it can really help when you're feeling anxious.

Your life experiences have been much different than mine. Do you currently live at home with the people who raised you? One suggestion I might make would be to go to college/university near your home, and at least for your first year, continue living where you have been living. It creates one less transition, and you would have a space you can go back to to be alone. I can tell you that if I hadn't dormed my freshman year, though, I wouldn't have "grown" as much as I did, even though it would have been less stressful staying at home. However, I think you could experience the same "growth" putting off living away from home for a year or two.

I have a friend who has social anxiety (but not autism in any form) who could better describe her experiences with college/university, but that's not something I have much experience with. I tend to be more "outgoing but socially oblivious" than being anxious in social situations. I do know that there are more treatments and more counselors who understand Social Anxiety than there are who understand autism.

Also, please remember that not going to college does not mean that you haven't experienced much in life. I have several friends who have not gone or have not completed college, and they have experienced much more in life than I have. They have traveled, had full-time jobs, started families, and done many things that I am unable to do right now because I am in school.

I hope this helps, and I hope I have answered your questions...

 

[Calvert]

 I might go to University at some point but I wouldn't go on my own. I'm in college at the moment and I hate it a lot due to the people who go there and the fact i'm on my own. My poor attendance means i'm repeating a year. I have friends at my age who are nearly finished University but I haven't even started yet. One thing I wouldn't want is the debt so I wouldn't apply for a student loan. Student loans are probably the worst thing about University. 

 

[Ruby_Aspergic]

I hear you on the loans. I am probably going to have 200k in debt before I finish.

 

[ergop]

I attended Community College for 2 years and for the most part... it was high school all over again, but a bit more secluded. Since there were so many people and it was rare to have classes together, I didn't interact with anyone apart from class groups. Now I am in a private trade school and it's alright... My outlook on life has improved significantly ever since I accepted myself within the past year and stopped changing myself to make friends. I don't talk to people much, rather I sit on my own and use my laptop or work on assignments. There are a few girls that seem to need my companionship so they will talk to me every now and then, but honestly I'd rather not talk to them. (conversations are mostly gossip =/ )

Even though I have never been to a University or State College, I would assume (from what I've seen) that it is much like anything else in life. We have to practice coping in difficult situations and just try to live through to the end.

I think I've chosen the best profession for me by the way. Court Reporting! I will make a decent salary, be able to sit in a court room taking down what people say on my machine, observe and be impartial to the situation. In school I just practice all day on my machine with a few academic classes... I'm just happy that I won't have to work under a boss or have to play office politics. Heh... it's one of the abilities I lack.

Well... too much typing - Wow... this adds up fast :S


P.S. I pretty much failed my first year or two of Community College due to attendance (I drove to the school but didn't go to class before) and lack of drive for a certain profession. Looking back... I might have done much better if I had something to strive for... though I would have to really struggle through the class groups and politics =/

 

[Ruby_Aspergic]

I am confused. Court reporting is almost entirely automated these days. They have a digital recorder or camera in the court room and a transcriptionist, who likely does not make a livable salary, listens to the audio at home or in an office and types it up. My mom has been a "court reporter" for 20 years now and has never gone to court. You also only need to pass a certification test to do it, no specific education is required.

 

[Chris]

I hear you on the loans. I am probably going to have 200k in debt before I finish.

How do you even get a loan that big for college? I was looking at doing university in America a few months ago, but dropped it when the financial aspect seemed impossible. Then my interests changed anyway...

 

[Ruby_Aspergic]

I did two years of community college that I paid for out of pocket and with academic scholarship. Then I had to take a 50k loan to finish undergrad at a university. Then I'll be taking approx. 50k for each of three years of law school. The loans for my BA are private student loans cosigned by my parents, the law school loans will be what are called grad PLUS loans. But that's only if I start working on my credit ummm like now. Cuz I don't have enough credit history to take a loan myself right now and my parents can't cosign for anymore.

 

[Dani Evar]

Along with Asperger's and dyspraxia, I have been labeled as 'twice-exceptional gifted', or simply 'severely gifted'. So, school has simply never been fun to me. It has been greatly abusive. I have been utterly clumsy and unmotivated there, no matter how structured the system has been.

Though I'm a research scientist now, what you call 'University' has been utterly daft, risible, and mediocre---as it's almost entirely unreviewable and insignificant---to me. Honestly, I've learned nothing from my so-called 'education'; the best things I've ever experienced there have only been a few stunts, tacky delusions, and plain mimicry.

I'm not proud or anything (hell no), but I did most advanced reading while still a sapling; and intellectual reading isn't the same as intellectual creativity, while my goal has always been pure scientific creation. Hence no reason for me to be proud of my mere past as a 'prodigy'.

My passion for science, art, knowledge, understanding, and philosophy exists, along with my authentic abilities/gifts, independently of academic rationalizations (especially post-modern academic characters).

One must be capable of self-integrity, creativity, authenticity, deconstruction, and post-structuralism.

The intellect, let alone Genius, exists as a nacre along with science and art, but, it remains independent of academia. As soon as one enters University, one finds them 'passively select against extreme originality and thus genius'. It's very crude but highly effective for NT's (those easily conditioned by environmental reinforcement, or, as Skinner would put it, reinforcement, punishment, and extinction). This was the cause of my suffering. I eventually overcame boredom and epistemic solitude in that setting though---only for the sake of being authentically creative. But every person is different and that kind of 'victory' over any kind of setting (of otherness) should not be grossly imitated. We should assume nothing, we should only know our natural abilities and passions.

I'd suggest you critically review the whole structure of the society first, including academic rationalizations, before deciding where to harbor your true passion in life. And if you decide to finally pursue a University career, that's OKAY, just be an honest, daring, fearless intellectual, and do make a DIFFERENCE.

Too many people have spoken nicely about education. The buzz, democracy, and all. And, the fact is that there are too many professors and University graduates today than, say, (at least) 30-40 years ago, which isn't surprising. So do fear MEDIOCRITY, or a constant mediocre influx of academic employees in this post-modern age. I won't bother much about that boring topic here. But here's a unique, Heideggerian contrasting reflection, that might help in your personal decision-making:

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Chris Langan on Academic Rationalizations

http://www.megafound...s/Academia.html


Academia attempts to justify its monopoly over technical information by:

1. Claiming to be the preeminent guardian and seeker of truth and knowledge.

[False. Academia does not pursue the search for truth and knowledge for its own sake, but only in conjunction with various economic and political criteria. In fact, this claim is little more than a ploy designed to channel every dime available for education and research into academic coffers. Meanwhile, academia's standardization imperative fosters ideological conformity rather than intellectual freedom, tending to enforce a degree of specialization severing interdisciplinary connections and limiting knowledge.]

2. Claiming to be the natural habitat of genius, especially in fields requiring a combination of high intellect and extensive knowledge.

[False. A strong case can be made that academia, by actively selecting for intellectual conformity with the ideas and opinions of instructors and those who dominate their fields, passively selects against extreme originality and thus against genius, meanwhile maintaining nearly impregnable barriers against gifted outsiders who lack its credentials.]

3. Claiming to welcome all participants in the search for truth and exclude no one who might be essential to its success.

[False. University applicants are not screened for intellectual creativity, profundity of thought, or work already accomplished. Screening is mass-oriented and, where not based on economic or sociological criteria, tautologically based on academic records and superficial tests of academic achievement. Moreover, compulsory university attendance places extreme, discriminatory financial burdens on those of limited means, while standardized curricula steal critical time and energy from those with important work already in progress. Instead of reaching out to those of special intellectual ability, achievement and independence, academia continues to offer them just what it always has: a pious mixture of phony egalitarianism and stonehearted bureaucracy.]

4. Claiming to be the only organized body with the ability and authority to provide accurate technical information.

[False. Academia has no way of knowing whether or not the most knowledgeable or talented minds in any given field are members of its community, particularly in fields which do not require direct access to privileged data or unique equipment under its exclusive control.]

5. Claiming to be the sole means by which one can master an academic discipline.

[False. Any sufficiently intelligent, motivated person can master abstract principles without attending lectures or paying college tuition. Only where a student requires hands-on training is university enrollment necessary. Raw intelligence is a better predictor of both learning ability and job performance than is level of education.]

6. Claiming to be the sole means by which experts can prove themselves qualified in their fields.

[False. Conceptual mastery of most fields can be determined through standardized testing. Furthermore, "expertise" means crystallized intelligence, which can tend to displace fluid intelligence in the course of education. Thus, where an expert might try to apply outmoded techniques to novel situations on the arrogant assumption that his own training and experience suffice to handle "anything", an intelligent person with less invested in training would more quickly admit his ignorance and synthesize an appropriate solution from first principles.]

In short, academia has arrogated a position which it is not necessarily able or entitled to fill, and may in the process be disseminating misinformation and misleading the public. This situation is especially serious in those fields for which standard scientific methodology is inadequate or inappropriate. There can be little argument that organized higher education is a social necessity, and that the world's colleges and universities have been integral to many of the benefits presently enjoyed by society. But the popular respect and power with which society has repaid it have made it dangerously forgetful ... forgetful that its own value resides largely in the genius of individual minds that exist independently of it.

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A little more about my overall personal experience with school in Aspergerian terms:

http://www.aspergic....__20&#entry5358

 

[Ruby_Aspergic]

When I was in k-12, I was considered twice exceptional for being gifted and having dyscalculia. But they wouldn't let me take a gifted curriculum because my math scores were too low, and wouldn't let me into special ed for math because everything else was too high. So I was stuck in mainstream education even though that was not where I belonged no matter what way you looked at it and was always either mind numbingly bored or far beyond my depth (I am nine years behind in math). Total waste of time. Were it not for the internet I'd have learned nothing by now.

 

[Chris]

This was before Willow was in the picture.

 

[142857]

I tend to agree with Evar, there are far too many university graduates and people with higher degrees around. Including professors. There are too many fields now where a degree is a must-have, where once you were judged more according to what you actually knew about the job and what you had achieved.

Of course, my point of view on the matter could be tainted by my lack of a degree. I've had a crack at studying for a degree a couple of times but I simply lack the organizational skills and the concentration. At my most recent attempt I already knew that I had ADD, but I decided to give it a crack without any medication (ritalin etc). I don't really know why I thought that would be a good idea.

At work I'm probably better known for my occasional superman efforts than for my consistency. But overall I've done okay, had some well paid jobs, pulled some very big projects out of the toilet almost singlehandedly. I'm old enough now and have a quarter century or so of experience, so I guess that some are prepared to overlook the lack of formal qualifications.

 

[release the bats]

In my field, a masters degree is a traditional requirement. So I have one.

 

[The Penguin]

I did found college easy for me since I was doing a trade I like.