Decision-making process - adults with High Functioning Autism.

[MROSS]

A list of three books covering the complicated decision-making process.

- 'The Art of Thinking Clearly' - by Rolf Dobelli.

- 'Blink: The Power of Thinking Without Thinking' - by Malcolm Gladwell.

- 'Thinking, Fast and Slow' - by Daniel Kahneman.

RELATED: Internet content focuses on the challenges of adults with High Functioning Autism e.g., Aspergers with decision-making processes.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

For myself:
1. How to reduce my quick-witted, impulsive responses that often have an emotional "edge" to them. Cursing before thinking.
2. How to slow my thinking down, often requiring me to eliminate emotions from contaminating my thoughts, especially in stressful situations. How to be the calmest person in the room.

One thing I learned from high-performance driving school and was reiterated while watching in-car videos of NASCAR drivers. "The fastest drivers have the slowest hands." This is good advice in other aspects of life, as well. To be in a state of mind that is calm and assertive. No negative emotion. No stress. Peaceful, thoughtful, anticipatory.

You see the same thing with the great martial artists, Muhammad Ali, Sugar Ray Leonard, Bruce Lee, etc. When they were at their best, they were relaxed, quick, anticipatory, and simply picked their opponents apart.

I see the same with our physicians. When they are in a calm, relaxed, assertive mind, they are at their best. When they become emotional, they not only make poor decisions, but they get everyone else around them emotional to the point where their decision making is poor and even their fine motor skills are adversely affected. No good comes of this when someone's life is in the balance.

 

[vergil96]

- 'Thinking, Fast and Slow' - by Daniel Kahneman.

Good book, I enjoyed it a lot

I'm not sure what it has to do with autism, but a good book about psychology. The author is a Nobel Prize winner.

 

[Masked Man]

Honestly, there are times when I just pick something or flip a coin. I know I can't possibly analyze every single thing or I would be paralyzed.

Or the other thing I do is I flip the coin. If I don't like the answer then I know the other choice is the correct one.

 

[MROSS]

Good book, I enjoyed it a lot

I'm not sure what it has to do with autism, but a good book about psychology. The author is a Nobel Prize winner.

The three books listed in the original post might be helpful - even with the Autism Spectrum considered.

As mentioned, online content offers discussions specializing in how human idiosyncrasies e.g., decision making processes can be more limiting with the Autism Spectrum e.g., Aspergers than for NTs.

 

[MROSS]

Honestly, there are times when I just pick something or flip a coin. I know I can't possibly analyze every single thing or I would be paralyzed.

Or the other thing I do is I flip the coin. If I don't like the answer then I know the other choice is the correct one.

Yes, I sometimes apply methods similar to flipping-coins to make decisions on those smaller matters in life.

 

[Judge]

That's what insurance underwriting was all about to me. Making complex decisions of risk and monetary value with less than all the facts and in a short amount of time.

In hindsight this is one part of my life where I'm glad I was not aware of my autism. That knowing myself neurologically might have impacted my ability to make those tough decisions.

 

[MROSS]

The three books listed in the original post might be helpful - even with the Autism Spectrum considered.

As mentioned, online content offers discussions specializing in how human idiosyncrasies e.g., decision making processes can be more limiting with the Autism Spectrum e.g., Aspergers than for NTs.

'Executive functioning' is discussed as a part of how adults on the Autism Spectrum function.

The authors of the three books mentioned in the original post probably have an interest in better understanding executive functioning.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

If you really want a good overview of how and where our brain makes decisions, then it is the area of the brain called the anterior cingulate cortex (ACC). In other threads, I had mentioned that the ACC is the primary "switchboard" that activates several areas of the brain. Serotonin is the primary neurotransmitter, however, in many autistics there appears to be some genetic polymorphisms in the binding and transport of serotonin in this region, more specifically, the 5-HT2A receptor. In another thread, I had mentioned that psilocin, the active form of psilocybin (from "magic mushrooms") has a higher affinity for the 2A receptor than our endogenous serotonin, and as such, may have a therapeutic role in autism. The PSIAUT study will be examining this.

At any rate, the decision-making center is the ACC and has a primary role in autistic behaviors, thinking, and executive functioning.

 

[Captain Caveman]

Honestly, there are times when I just pick something or flip a coin. I know I can't possibly analyze every single thing or I would be paralyzed.

Or the other thing I do is I flip the coin. If I don't like the answer then I know the other choice is the correct one.

That is funny in a nice way, but practical as well.

 

[Captain Caveman]

That's what insurance underwriting was all about to me. Making complex decisions of risk and monetary value with less than all the facts and in a short amount of time.

In hindsight this is one part of my life where I'm glad I was not aware of my autism. That knowing myself neurologically might have impacted my ability to make those tough decisions.

I was just thinking about a ruler of a country in a type of monarchy or dictatorship system, where the decisions the leader makes can effect so many things so need careful thought before the leader makes them. Communism and Capitalist democratic systems are easier as one has more people to fall back on to check ones decision was the right one.
Some of the ideas that we have in the West about a dictatorship system are absolutely crazy, as people talk and form oppinions without thinking based on how they have been brainwashed to think. There are negatives and positives in each ruling system.
Why I am sidetracked into this line of thought is how I thought of what you said in having to make very important decisions quickly in an environment where yes or no isn't as simple as it seems!

 

[Neonatal RRT]

A list of three books covering the complicated decision-making process.

- 'The Art of Thinking Clearly' - by Rolf Dobelli.

- 'Blink: The Power of Thinking Without Thinking' - by Malcolm Gladwell.

- 'Thinking, Fast and Slow' - by Daniel Kahneman.

RELATED: Internet content focuses on the challenges of adults with High Functioning Autism e.g., Aspergers with decision-making processes.

It is one thing to instruct someone one ways of thinking via mindfulness, consciousness, meditative processes, etc. however, the flip side of the coin is actual ability to execute.

An analogy I am familiar with: I am reminded of my younger years when I was learning how to lift heavy weights for powerlifting competitions. Everyone is willing to help and show you proper techniques, how to make your body a better lever, etc. One can be physically strong, but not have the proper technique, and the weight will not move. Individual body mechanics will differ from one person to the next, some people have long legs and short torsos, other people have short legs and long torsos, so one person cannot mimic the other and achieve the same results. It takes an individual sometimes years of understanding and repetition, trial and error, muscle building, etc. in order to lift 2-3X your body weight. Yet, sometimes, people are still unable due to genetic differences in their neural densities in their muscles and can only recruit a limited amount of muscle fibers.

There is a similar phenomenon when it comes to thinking. Everyone is willing to help. Plenty of resources out there to read. One can put forth some concerted effort and some small gains can be made. However, one the known deficits within the autistic brain, and this is well-documented within the DSM-5, is decision-making/executive functioning, emotional dysregulation, anxiety, etc. The anterior cingulate cortex (ACC) appears to take on the primary role in all of this, and for many of us, an estimated 25-45% of autistics will not only have fewer 5-HT2A receptors than normal, but the receptor binding and serotonin transport system is adversely affected, ultimately leading to significantly lower serotonin, the primary neurotransmitter in the ACC. All of this can be quite frustrating and distressing to the affected individual. "Why can't I just be like them?" "I try and try and try and all I do is fail." "Whatever they are doing, it's not working for me."

What I am suggesting is that (1) with proper personal motivation and effort towards mindfulness and incorporating these techniques, there can be some improvements in day-to-day functioning, and with consistency, some neuroplasticity-related changes in the brain, but (2) also consider the potential limitations within the ACC. For some, making those meaningful, positive improvements in executive functioning will never happen without addressing the neurobiology, perhaps with medications.

 

[vergil96]

an estimated 25-45% of autistics will not only have fewer 5-HT2A receptors than normal, but the receptor binding and serotonin transport system is adversely affected, ultimately leading to significantly lower serotonin

Is it really so? Personally, I have had bad experiences woth SSRIs as a "cure all" and the "just be more positive approach". I am more prone to bad mood than an average person, however, it has reasons. As you kept on writing about serotonin, I thought you meant being unhappy from not addressing your own needs due to alexythymia, not an actual difference in the receptors. When in fact, you're not, am I right? I am in rather positive mood even in the presence of other problems for a consistent number of years now. I have simply addressed my emotional needs and sensory issues also contributed. Intense stimuli are very unpleasant and constant exposure of course will make you unhappy and anxious. Plenty of people I have talked to who have anxiety disorders have a similar experience of higher sensory sensitivity and being triggered by stimuli that wouldn't trigger an average person. Getting yourself out of the loop often means accepting your own senaitivity. There is nothing wrong with it, it's just different. Just my three cents.

For some, making those meaningful, positive improvements in executive functioning will never happen without addressing the neurobiology, perhaps with medications.

Generally speaking, I agree with this. You have to understand how feelings impact you through observation, it's where "flawed" decisions come from, not a lack of intellectual understanding.

 

[Judge]

Why I am sidetracked into this line of thought is how I thought of what you said in having to make very important decisions quickly in an environment where yes or no isn't as simple as it seems!

I can only say that if one must exist within such an environment, that dealing with potentially very risky decisions becomes routine. Yet at the same time knowing that if you make a mistake, it can be quite costly.

Maybe it's a akin to being a soldier, where it's advisable to become indifferent to the prospects of dying each and every day you must do your job if and when you are constantly exposed to forms of combat.

I suppose some can adapt to this sort of thinking, while others may be utterly incapable of it.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

Is it really so? Personally, I have had bad experiences woth SSRIs as a "cure all" and the "just be more positive approach". I am more prone to bad mood than an average person, however, it has reasons. As you kept on writing about serotonin, I thought you meant being unhappy from not addressing your own needs due to alexythymia, not an actual difference in the receptors. When in fact, you're not, am I right? I am in rather positive mood even in the presence of other problems for a consistent number of years now. I have simply addressed my emotional needs and sensory issues also contributed. Intense stimuli are very unpleasant and constant exposure of course will make you unhappy and anxious. Plenty of people I have talked to who have anxiety disorders have a similar experience of higher sensory sensitivity and being triggered by stimuli that wouldn't trigger an average person. Getting yourself out of the loop often means accepting your own senaitivity. There is nothing wrong with it, it's just different. Just my three cents.


Generally speaking, I agree with this. You have to understand how feelings impact you through observation, it's where "flawed" decisions come from, not a lack of intellectual understanding.

SSRIs work on the 1A receptors, not the 2A. The 2A receptors are found predominantly in the ACC and tend to be "excitatory". The 1A receptors are found downstream and tend to be "inhibitory". I am thinking this is why many autistics either feel awful on SSRIs and/or they simply don't work in the same ways as in neurotypicals due to the relatively low "excitatory" influence of the 2A receptors in many autistics. SSRIs, are attempting to prolong the influence of serotonin by inhibiting the 1A receptors, prolonging the excitation, but it's not addressing the real issue, that is the relatively low 2A receptor density and genetic polymorphisms in the genes regulating serotonin binding and transport.

Psilocybin/psilocin appears to have a higher affinity for binding to our 2A receptors than the endogenous serotonin, and appears to bypass the inherent difficulties in serotonin binding and transport. By mimicking serotonin, it can then trigger the cascade of signals needed for proper functioning in many areas of the brain regulated by the ACC.

My personal experience with alexithymia does not appear to have been significantly affected by my use of low-dose psilocybin. I am thinking this issue is more deeply rooted or perhaps is as a result of some other area of the brain. However, my ability to think more clearly, take in more sensory input, be more empathetic, be in a calm, assertive mood, my executive functioning, all of that has improved significantly to the point where others will comment upon it. My fine motor skills even improve significantly in the sense that I am not so "tensed up". I never really sensed I was "tensed up" until the day that I wasn't, and now I am much more aware of it when driving a car, walking, taking stairs, etc. I thought the motor skills decline was age-related, but after a dose, I am functioning much better. It's those 2A receptors doing their work.

I have never had the courage to try a full dose and go on a "psychedelic trip" which, for some, seems to be one of the most positive, life-changing experiences in their life. I am not sure if that would have any impact upon my alexithymia or not, but it has the potential to by unlocking areas of my brain that appear to be blocked or shut down, as this is the underlying mechanism of high-dose psilocybin, it unlocks all the "gates" that separate one area of the brain from another. One could only speculate.

The information about the serotonin system and more specifically within the context of autism, is to point out that there may be a combination of reasons why many autistics have difficulties with the neuroprocessing of emotions, sensory input, impulse control, and general executive functioning. That ACC appears to be a key part of the brain that controls all of that. PSIAUT study will glean some more information, but my anecdotal experience with psilocybin, as well as the experiences of thousands of other individuals, would suggest that there may be another option for the daily management of autism symptoms.

 

[vergil96]

My personal experience with alexithymia does not appear to have been significantly affected by my use of low-dose psilocybin.

Mine neither by SSRIs. I mean that I made myself unhappy but not realising what makes me upset.

However, my ability to think more clearly, take in more sensory input, be more empathetic, be in a calm, assertive mood, my executive functioning, all of that has improved significantly to the point where others will comment upon it. My fine motor skills even improve significantly in the sense that I am not so "tensed up". I never really sensed I was "tensed up" until the day that I wasn't, and now I am much more aware of it when driving a car, walking, taking stairs, etc. I thought the motor skills decline was age-related, but after a dose, I am functioning much better. It's those 2A receptors doing their work.

Personally, it is in line with my experience of stress and lots of people experience stress like this, it makes people worse at socialising, less attentive, causes "tunnel vision". It's what mental health professionals say about social anxiety too.

 

[MROSS]

That's what insurance underwriting was all about to me. Making complex decisions of risk and monetary value with less than all the facts and in a short amount of time.

In hindsight this is one part of my life where I'm glad I was not aware of my autism. That knowing myself neurologically might have impacted my ability to make those tough decisions.

Yes, I sometimes apply methods similar to flipping-coins to make decisions on those smaller matters in life.

Honestly, there are times when I just pick something or flip a coin. I know I can't possibly analyze every single thing or I would be paralyzed.

Or the other thing I do is I flip the coin. If I don't like the answer then I know the other choice is the correct one

Honestly, there are times when I just pick something or flip a coin. I know I can't possibly analyze every single thing or I would be paralyzed.

Or the other thing I do is I flip the coin. If I don't like the answer then I know the other choice is the correct one.

I sometimes make those decisions on the small things in life - by 'odd' 'even' numbers. A vehicle's odometer (via the odometer number that changes most frequently - the number changing every 1/10 of a mile). Digital clocks (the number that changes every minute).

Such methods can applied if it's not possible to flip coins.

 

[MROSS]

Agonizing over decisions can visibly irritate other people.

The German term, 'fisselig' (pronounced 'fissel thish') means flustered to the point of incompetence stemming from nagging.

Experiences relating to 'fisselig' can fill another discussion-thread.

 

[MROSS]

Agonizing over decisions can visibly irritate other people.

The German term, 'fisselig' (pronounced 'fissel thish') means flustered to the point of incompetence stemming from nagging.

Experiences relating to 'fisselig' can fill another discussion-thread.

ADDENDUM: The German term 'fisselig' sometimes 'comes to mind' in describing those situations on how other people may react to indecision.