Difference between learning disability and autism

[Misty Avich]

I know people can have both but I'm talking about one or the other.

I was reading in an article about a young woman who had fetal alcohol syndrome (she was born with lifelong intellectual disabilities due to her mother consuming alcohol whilst pregnant. The girl has always lived with her parents who look after her, but when she was 27 she got raped (don't know the details of where and why), and got pregnant. Unfazed by the rape, she also seemed unaware that she was pregnant even when her parents tried explaining to her, and as her bump grew she just went on living in her childlike little world.
She didn't understand what was happening to her through birth but the baby went to be adopted. She knew what the baby was but didn't have the emotional skills to bond or look after it.

She wasn't autistic but her fetal alcohol condition still caused her social and emotional ineptitude, as well as the typical intellectual disability. Some spectrumers believe that everyone in the world is socially adept except autistics, even if a person is disabled by severe intellectual development delays they can still have normal conversations, understand body language, make friends, get dates, etc. But intellectual disabilities is a lot more than just having difficulty with reading and writing. It often includes a whole range of inabilities that has an affect on their daily functioning. Sometimes people like that can seem even more socially inept than some autistic people. For example, my social skills are advanced compared to this girl.
I believe you need some intellect to be able to be socially adept too. A person isn't exactly going to succeed socially in an NT world if they can't talk properly, can't look after themselves, need 24-hour care, and are oblivious to the world around them.

I was speaking by age 2, while it said this girl couldn't even walk or talk, just made odd humming noises and seemed blank and just delayed in everything. She attended a special school from age 4 up until age 18, and she's unable to work. She has one friend who she meets at the MENCAP group she goes to, who has downs syndrome and the mind of a 3-year-old.

This is why I don't believe that 99% of the population are normal and autistics are the only ones who aren't normal. Autism isn't the only neurodivergent.

 

[Suzanne]

I am learning that too!

I tend to say now: rather than being on the spectrum; that probably they are neurodiverse, which is us too.

I have at last, a real friend and she is not autistic at all, but there definitely is something of a neurodiversity about her, since we understand each other very well.

I believe that if one was diagnosed at a young age with ASD, it is easier for them to not believe they are the only "unique" ones. However, when one has struggled all their lives feeling different, but not knowing why and very much later in life discover it is due to being on the spectrum, I guess we tend to "hold it close" and not allow others, who it is suggested could be not on the spectrum, but also not neurotypical and well, this site is for Aspergers/Autism and thus, we do have a little bit of... freedom to be ourselves.

I learnt to read when I was 9 and was put into a special school. However, evidence shows, that it was extreme bad parenting, which caused me to be slower than normal. I went from not being able to even write my name, to getting an award for the best reader in the school!

When I turned 16 and about to leave school. I asked the head if I could take some exams, so that I could leave school with at least something postive to go out into the world. I was told: you are too stupid. You wouldn't pass, so why try!

I went to college when I was about 22 perhaps and did pass exams.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

This is why I don't believe that 99% of the population are normal and autistics are the only ones who aren't normal. Autism isn't the only neurodivergent.

You are correct.

99% of the population are not "normal", per se. Neurodivergence occurs quite frequently, as many people who are artistically creative (actors, comedians, writers, painters, philosophers, so on and so forth) are often neurodivergent. Many people who, for many reasons, do not seem to "fit into society" are often neurodivergent. Autism is only one of many types of neurodivergency.

Some who are neurodivergent are autistics, although most autistics are neurodivergent. Imagine a Venn diagram.

 

[Misty Avich]

The way I see it, NT means a person who is not born with any developmental delays or disabilities. But it does start getting more complex when you add mental health disorders caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain or abuse. I think a person with schizophrenia or bipolar are NTs if all their symptoms are kept under control on medication and as long as they're taking their medication they can hold down a job, relationship, etc. I suppose people with those disorders who are unable to function even with medication are not NTs.
Criminals, drug/alcohol abuse, sexuality and religion don't come into the neurodivergent subject so we'll just forget about those (I once had someone say being gay is neurodivergent but I don't think it is, as it's a sexuality type, not a developmental disorder).

Neurodivergence mostly covers things like autism, ADHD, learning disability, epilepsy, Fragile-X, downs syndrome, Soto's, and all those that affect the social or intellectual part of the brain and usually are from birth. All these can cause a child to be different from their peers, be developmentally behind in different areas, and may need support.

Not sure about Tourette's or dyslexia? Like I said, it gets complicated.

 

[Nervous Rex]

Yes, a lot of people don't want to put in the mental effort required to actually understand, so they classify any mental condition as "something wrong". In their minds, a learning disability, autism, dyslexia, or any other condition is simply "something wrong".

It's just lazy thinking, or lazy people not thinking at all.

 

[Jumpinbare]

My adopted son's biological mother was on alcohol and crack cocain while pregnant. He is intellectually disabled and needs support to function in daily life. He left home at 18 and lived in a city park a few towns away.
He became very good at finding well-meaning people to take him in. So apparently his ability to read social clues was not badly affected. Unfortunately, his laziness always got him tossed out after a few weeks.
He eventually found a young lady caring enough to look out for him, but stern enough to keep him working. She is above average intelligence and assertive enough to keep him out of trouble (hopefully). They just had a baby this week, so here's my first granddaughter

 

[Alexej]

They just had a baby this week, so here's my first granddaughter

Congratulations on the first grand daughter

 

[The Pandector]

I guess I’m just not getting it. I’ve heard that some cases of autism are due to postpartum disease or injury, but I understand autism to be a genetic disorder and suspect that other cases merely mimic autism. Please bear with me.

If I have a virus that damages a nerve and I can no longer walk, am I then considered neurodivergent? I don’t think so, because there’s nothing divergent about my nervous system, it is simply damaged. Understand here, I’m trying to learn the lingo.

So, I would apply the same logic to, for instance, fetal alcohol syndrome. There was nothing inherently wrong with the forming body, but it was chemically damaged. I don’t understand why we would lump in this sort of condition with people who’s bodies actually do have inherent divergence from the norm.

Along those same lines… I don’t understand why we say someone who was born and will always be severely intellectually disabled, is ‘developmentally delayed’. It’s not a delay; they’re not going to catch up at some point. While I understand that an individual who is genuinely autistic can also be severely intellectually disabled, that doesn’t justify calling everyone with mental insufficiencies neurodiverse. Otherwise, why not just assign some point on the IQ scale and say everyone below that level is neurodivergent?

I’m not arguing that we understand the causes of autism well enough to be overly dogmatic. But, don’t we have enough to begin using language that reflects what we do know? In my mind, nerve damage does not equate to neural diversity, and I have a neurologically-enforced problem with inspecific language. Help.

 

[The Pandector]

My adopted son's biological mother was on alcohol and crack cocain while pregnant. He is intellectually disabled and needs support to function in daily life. He left home at 18 and lived in a city park a few towns away.
He became very good at finding well-meaning people to take him in. So apparently his ability to read social clues was not badly affected. Unfortunately, his laziness always got him tossed out after a few weeks.
He eventually found a young lady caring enough to look out for him, but stern enough to keep him working. She is above average intelligence and assertive enough to keep him out of trouble (hopefully). They just had a baby this week, so here's my first granddaughter View attachment 118955

Wow. That kid is obviously reverse engineering the camera.

 

[Misty Avich]

I guess I’m just not getting it. I’ve heard that some cases of autism are due to postpartum disease or injury, but I understand autism to be a genetic disorder and suspect that other cases merely mimic autism. Please bear with me.

If I have a virus that damages a nerve and I can no longer walk, am I then considered neurodivergent? I don’t think so, because there’s nothing divergent about my nervous system, it is simply damaged. Understand here, I’m trying to learn the lingo.

So, I would apply the same logic to, for instance, fetal alcohol syndrome. There was nothing inherently wrong with the forming body, but it was chemically damaged. I don’t understand why we would lump in this sort of condition with people who’s bodies actually do have inherent divergence from the norm.

Along those same lines… I don’t understand why we say someone who was born and will always be severely intellectually disabled, is ‘developmentally delayed’. It’s not a delay; they’re not going to catch up at some point. While I understand that an individual who is genuinely autistic can also be severely intellectually disabled, that doesn’t justify calling everyone with mental insufficiencies neurodiverse. Otherwise, why not just assign some point on the IQ scale and say everyone below that level is neurodivergent?

I’m not arguing that we understand the causes of autism well enough to be overly dogmatic. But, don’t we have enough to begin using language that reflects what we do know? In my mind, nerve damage does not equate to neural diversity, and I have a neurologically-enforced problem with inspecific language. Help.

It is quicker to say "developmentally delayed" than "developmental learning disability". I never know what to really call it. It's best not to get too hung up on words.

Neurodivergence is how the person is affected in their learning, behaviour, etc, not what caused their differences in the womb. The girl in my OP was still neurodiverse.

 

[The Pandector]

It is quicker to say "developmentally delayed" than "developmental learning disability". I never know what to really call it. It's best not to get too hung up on words.

Neurodivergence is how the person is affected in their learning, behaviour, etc, not what caused their differences in the womb. The girl in my OP was still neurodiverse.

So then, the adult brain trauma victim has also become neurodiverse? Meaning, given that their learning and behavior are affected? Or is the difference simply pre- or postpartum trauma? If it’s trauma related.

Just an opinion, words are all we have, so I do think a lot about what individual words convey. Why I was asking, I guess. Found out a few years ago that the word explains a great deal about my, ahem, exciting life, so I tend to concentrate on the implications of the term.

BTW, I’m not offended by any use of the term, but I’m on a long drive to understand what it means to autistic people.

 

[Misty Avich]

If they were born with impairments then they're obviously not NT.

 

[Jumpinbare]

My 87 year old mom and my granddaughter. She seems very alert, thanks to her mom NOT doing drugs and alcohol during pregnancy