Empathy and ASD

[Clueless in Canada]

Whether or not alexithymia is part of an individual's autism package, I frequently see it stated that one of the many autism traits is "Difficulty understanding others' feelings." I puzzle over this and what it means. I have difficulty reading others' feelings but I can understand them if they are explained to me. Is this not perhaps a poorly worded trait description or is it just that my own personal variation is difficulty in reading the physical signs of feelings?

Perhaps I am hung up on semantics. That does happen.

What is your experience? Do you distinguish between reading/recognising/identifying emotions and being able to understand them when someone tells you what they are feeling?

 

[Fino]

I can only definitively identify if someone is expressing a positive or negative emotion, but beyond that I'm just guessing, unless it's very obvious.

Of course, if someone says, "I'm mad," I'm sure we can all understand that because we know the word and what it describes. I'm guessing they mean, "Difficulty understanding others' feelings without having them explained," or something like that. So basically receiving an explanation through their body language, facial expression, tone of voice, etc.

I try to practice, but it's hard because I think it's a thing that not everyone is honest about their feelings if you ask them directly. Right? There have been times I've insisted because I was so sure, such as with a student who seems to be in a bad mood, and I ask how they're doing and they say good, and I ask if they're tired and they say no, and I ask what's wrong, and they say nothing, and I ask if they're sure, they say they are, and I tell them it seems like something is wrong, and they say there isn't.

Then it makes me confused if I'm at all capable of reading any signals at all! *goes mad*

Anyway, re-reading my post, it sounds like maybe it's exactly what they meant in their silly little sentence.

 

[Clueless in Canada]

I can only definitively identify if someone is expressing a positive or negative emotion, but beyond that I'm just guessing, unless it's very obvious.

Of course, if someone says, "I'm mad," I'm sure we can all understand that because we know the word and what it describes. I'm guessing they mean, "Difficulty understanding others' feelings without having them explained," or something like that. So basically receiving an explanation through their body language, facial expression, tone of voice, etc.

I try to practice, but it's hard because I think it's a thing that not everyone is honest about their feelings if you ask them directly. Right? There have been times I've insisted because I was so sure, such as with a student who seems to be in a bad mood, and I ask how they're doing and they say good, and I ask if they're tired and they say no, and I ask what's wrong, and they say nothing, and I ask if they're sure, they say they are, and I tell them it seems like something is wrong, and they say there isn't.

Then it makes me confused if I'm at all capable of reading any signals at all! *goes mad*

Anyway, re-reading my post, it sounds like maybe it's exactly what they meant in their silly little sentence.

Okay, thanks for writing all of that because that is very similar to my experiences too. I am also like that with a partner. I constantly ask if they are okay and are they sure and I think something is wrong. I am fortunate to be with a guy who thinks it's sweet that I care and doesn't mind all the asking. Phew!

I do slightly better with positive emotional expression than negative, in that basically I can tell an expression of affection or joy fairly easily but anything in the neutral to negative range just confuses me and I tend to panic and think something is my fault or mistakenly thing the person is not nice. I need really obvious demonstrations of niceness. LOL

 

[Fino]

I'm exactly the same way! And specific emotion isn't as important when it's positive, because who cares? People are happy!

But negative--are you mad, scared, frustrated, confused, tired, concentrating intensely, excited, passionate? It all looks the saaaaaammmmeee!

 

[Fridgemagnetman]

But negative--are you mad, scared, frustrated, confused, tired, concentrating intensely, excited, passionate? It all looks the saaaaaammmmeee

To define is to limit...

Excuses out the way .

My own feelings aren't well defined,so I guess it's hard to guess others.

Angry and okay used to be the gamut

 

[Clueless in Canada]

To define is to limit...

Excuses out the way .

My own feelings aren't well defined,so I guess it's hard to guess others.

Angry and okay used to be the gamut

To have no limits is chaos and my tolerance for chaos is low. But yes, I struggle to understand my own feelings too. I think defining them or understanding them ends up a requirement if we are going to try to have relationships with others. When in doubt, my best explanation of a feeling is overwhelmed!

 

[Fridgemagnetman]

To have no limits is chaos and my tolerance for chaos is low. But yes, I struggle to understand my own feelings too. I think defining them or understanding them ends up a requirement if we are going to try to have relationships with others. When in doubt, my best explanation of a feeling is overwhelmed!

Mine is - I was getting along fine till you asked me how I was.
Now I have to work it out .

Back to angry

 

[Clueless in Canada]

Mine is - I was getting along fine till you asked me how I was.
Now I have to work it out .

Back to angry

Your angry face seems to be upside down.

 

[Fridgemagnetman]

Your angry face seems to be upside down.

That's not my face

 

[Clueless in Canada]

That's not my face

I struggle to understand emoticons almost as much as human faces. LOL

 

[Fridgemagnetman]

I struggle to understand emoticons almost as much as human faces. LOL

Yeh I tend to use the same one

 

[Nauti]

I can't even organize my thoughts enough to attempt to answer this, or even questions about behaviour and personality. It all seems so variable to me.
I think, yes, I need clear communication or I am confused and anxious due to the uncertainty.
Even then, it takes me a bit of reflection, often, to understand, if I ever, even, do understand, where someone else is coming from and how they are feeling and what they would like from me.
If they ask, I am over the moon, because it is clear (by over the moon, I mean, I am pleased and relieved and empowered to act in a helpful manner).

 

[Progster]

What is your experience? Do you distinguish between reading/recognising/identifying emotions and being able to understand them when someone tells you what they are feeling?

Similar to you - I don't read people easily and often don't pick up on people's moods, and I rely on people to tell me what they are feeling (which usually they don't, they expect you to be able to read them), or for people to explain things for me. I don't always understand when people explain to me, though. I can understand if I have had a same or similar experience, but if I haven't been in the situation, then I don't really know or understand what they are feeling or the reason for their actions - it's not intuitive to me to know. Often things seem illogical to me where I would react or feel in a different way in that situation and I just don't 'get' it.

There have been times I've insisted because I was so sure, such as with a student who seems to be in a bad mood, and I ask how they're doing and they say good, and I ask if they're tired and they say no, and I ask what's wrong, and they say nothing, and I ask if they're sure, they say they are, and I tell them it seems like something is wrong, and they say there isn't.

This happens to me, too. I think that your instinct that something is wrong is correct, but then the student doesn't always want to open up and becomes evasive - or they might not know themselves what is wrong, not be able to pinpoint a specific problem, or they just have low mood/low energy and kind of shut down.

 

[Gracey]

If I’ve been through what I think they’re describing,
I know how I felt and guess they might be feeling something similar.


The tone of voice and sometimes words used can give clues.

Other than that, it would have to be obvious,

Crying,
Anger,
Laughter ... I still don’t know exactly what’s up with them
but I know the ‘Done thing’ or etiquette is not to ignore them and carry on like nothing is happening.

 

[onlything]

There have been times I've insisted because I was so sure, such as with a student who seems to be in a bad mood, and I ask how they're doing and they say good, and I ask if they're tired and they say no, and I ask what's wrong, and they say nothing, and I ask if they're sure, they say they are, and I tell them it seems like something is wrong, and they say there isn't.

Ah, yes, frustrating. But if you ask more than twice/thrice and they still say it's fine/nothing, it's also a subtle (not so subtle for NTs it seems) message that they don't want to talk about what's wrong or they don't want to talk to you about what's wrong. What it means is that you need to drop the subject or they'll get upset at you - like, 'I'm not, don't you get the hint?!' upset. You can always try another time or just be around to show you care - if you do.

Or you just mixed a message and there really isn't anything wrong. Duh.

 

[Fino]

Ah, yes, frustrating. But if you ask more than twice/thrice and they still say it's fine/nothing, it's also a subtle (not so subtle for NTs it seems) message that they don't want to talk about what's wrong or they don't want to talk to you about what's wrong. What it means is that you need to drop the subject or they'll get upset at you - like, 'I'm not, don't you get the hint?!' upset. You can always try another time or just be around to show you care - if you do.

Or you just mixed a message and there really isn't anything wrong. Duh.

If only there were some way to know, like in a trivia game where they tell you the answers after...

 

[onlything]

If only there were some way to know, like in a trivia game where they tell you the answers after...

It's easier if you get some knowledge on overall body language - it's absurd how many little nuances are in each conversation. There are a lot of different resources, especially books, out there like 'The body language bible', 'The definitive book of body language' or even 'Games people play' etc. They can be rather overwhelming though with the amount of the little things people just seem to know.

 

[Fino]

It's easier if you get some knowledge on overall body language - it's absurd how many little nuances are in each conversation. There are a lot of different resources, especially books, out there like 'The body language bible', 'The definitive book of body language' or even 'Games people play' etc. They can be rather overwhelming though with the amount of the little things people just seem to know.

I just added them to my reading list! Thank you!

 

[the_tortoise]

I think it can also mean difficulty understanding why a person feels a certain thing (unless it is explained...or perhaps even after it has been explained -- like you can't understand the explanation), even if you can do the reading/identifying bit.

 

[Fino]

^That reminds me. I was recently baffled by the waves of sadness and surprise in response to the death of an elderly man in a choir I accompany. My boss didn't really even know him and even if he did, I can't understand why someone would be surprised or sad that the thing we knew would happen did happen. Maybe I'm just a psychopath.