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Hi, I'm Judi. I recently found out I am autistic and would like to ask if anyone has experienced rare reactions to foreign objects in the body?

JudiNolan17

New Member
Hi, I'm Judi. I recently found out I am autistic and would like to ask if anyone has experienced rare reactions to foreign objects in the body. Objects such as synthetic mesh for hernias or dissolvable stitches. Is this something other neurodivergence experience?
 
You mean like having cameras inserted into awkward places, such as a colonoscopy? That is one of my worst ever fears. PAP tests hurt like anything too, hurts so much that I can't bear it at all and so cannot have the procedure done. I just have to live life hoping and praying that I never get bowel cancer or cervical cancer, or any symptoms that suggest I might need to have one of those procedures. I just can't bear it, being poked and probed in the most socially awkward areas.
 
You mean like having cameras inserted into awkward places, such as a colonoscopy? That is one of my worst ever fears.
^ It was one of my worst fears too. I had my first one last year. I'm not just making this up and I'm not exaggerating: It was actually incredible how much of a "nothing" the procedure was. To the point that when I'm due for my next one I'll have no fear about it at all. You don't feel a thing, no pain and you sleep and wake up seemingly in the same few seconds.
 
Hi, I'm Judi. I recently found out I am autistic and would like to ask if anyone has experienced rare reactions to foreign objects in the body. Objects such as synthetic mesh for hernias or dissolvable stitches. Is this something other neurodivergence experience?

What do you mean by reaction?
 
^ It was one of my worst fears too. I had my first one last year. I'm not just making this up and I'm not exaggerating: It was actually incredible how much of a "nothing" the procedure was. To the point that when I'm due for my next one I'll have no fear about it at all. You don't feel a thing, no pain and you sleep and wake up seemingly in the same few seconds.

Thank you for saying this because I have been asked to have that procedure and worried about it a lot. I am more afraid of them finding something wrong though, I live in high-stress already, I could not manage serious bad news.

I have had surgeries several times though and the anesthesia has been pleasant or not a problem each time. Propofol is the only good sleep I have ever had.
 
We tend to have special sensitivities to lots of sensory inputs, including implants that others don’t seem to notice.

I had a vasectomy with tiny titanium clips (8). I was told I would never feel them but I feel them all of the time.
 
I have had surgeries several times though and the anesthesia has been pleasant or not a problem each time. Propofol is the only good sleep I have ever had.

Anesthesia is an incredible thing. It's such a deep sleep it's like not existing for a period of time.

Also, it's natural to worry about a worst-case scenario, but that likely wouldn't be the case. It's common for them to remove benign or questionable polyps. Even with the worry, better to have the procedure done and have them finding something even if it would be cancer early enough to take care of it. I worked with a guy that had a section of his intestine removed from cancer; he recovered fully and without complications and didn't have his life altered.
 
We tend to have special sensitivities to lots of sensory inputs, including implants that others don’t seem to notice.

I had a vasectomy with tiny titanium clips (8). I was told I would never feel them but I feel them all of the time.
Agree: I have titanium clips from gallbladder removal, and they are always there
 
Hi, I'm Judi. I recently found out I am autistic and would like to ask if anyone has experienced rare reactions to foreign objects in the body. Objects such as synthetic mesh for hernias or dissolvable stitches. Is this something other neurodivergence experience?
No reactions on my part. I have titanium in my arm and synthetic mesh.

Now, having said that, the body can produce antibodies against anything that it perceives as foreign, including one's own body (autoimmune diseases). This type of reaction has little to do with being autistic.

Some autism variants are known to have an hyper-responsive inflammatory response in the form of excessive cytokine production. In these individuals, it does not make them more susceptible to disease, as in a "weakened" immune system, but rather, the opposite, in the form of excessive inflammation that can worsen the course of a disease if and when they do get sick. It can also trigger excessive inflammation from surgeries, injuries, even post workout in the gym. I happen to have this condition. I almost never get sick, but when I do, it's always a bad course and takes me a long time to recover.
 
Thank you all for answering. It’s like my body rejects all forgein substances. I have strong reactions to different medications, metals, and the “desolvable” stitches. I’m worried that if they insert the synthetic mesh in my stomach to repair my hernia that I will always be sick from it. Has anyone had a reaction like this? Am I worrying over nothing?
 
Thank you all for answering. It’s like my body rejects all forgein substances. I have strong reactions to different medications, metals, and the “desolvable” stitches. I’m worried that if they insert the synthetic mesh in my stomach to repair my hernia that I will always be sick from it. Has anyone had a reaction like this? Am I worrying over nothing?
Most of the things they use in operations are designed to be inert and not react with the human body at all. If you're getting reactions from these sorts of things I think you should certainly raise this with whoever is speaking to you regarding your hernia operation.
 
Hi, I'm Judi. I recently found out I am autistic and would like to ask if anyone has experienced rare reactions to foreign objects in the body. Objects such as synthetic mesh for hernias or dissolvable stitches. Is this something other neurodivergence experience?
Hi I am Sander.
I have had many allergies that come and go but also auto-immune conditions, all my life.

Both are caused by a strong immune system, that doesn't accept "normal" proteins like pollen but also rejects my own proteins... I did some research and found the following, possibly interesting for you, things:
1. Autistics have more often Allergies and Auto-immune reactions than neurotypicals.
2. Autistics have different working of the Cortisol hormone (stress-). In stead of doubling after waking up and slowly returning to "normal" as in Neurotypicals, it does NOT rise after waking up, but slowly goes down during the day as well and somehow in the night comes back to the autistic morning level, possibly causing sleep rhythm disorders.

Cortisol is lowering the Immune response of the Immune system, so a lower Cortisol level means a stronger Immune system and so more allergic and auto-immune reactions than with Neurotypicals, who have ~double the Cortisol levels during the day.

So it could be that your immune system is repelling foreign proteins in the materials that you talked about.
Maybe this can help you discuss it with your medical doctors.
I have links to scientific publications on this if you want to see those.

Sander
 
Hi I am Sander.
I have had many allergies that come and go but also auto-immune conditions, all my life.

Both are caused by a strong immune system, that doesn't accept "normal" proteins like pollen but also rejects my own proteins... I did some research and found the following, possibly interesting for you, things:
1. Autistics have more often Allergies and Auto-immune reactions than neurotypicals.
2. Autistics have different working of the Cortisol hormone (stress-). In stead of doubling after waking up and slowly returning to "normal" as in Neurotypicals, it does NOT rise after waking up, but slowly goes down during the day as well and somehow in the night comes back to the autistic morning level, possibly causing sleep rhythm disorders.

Cortisol is lowering the Immune response of the Immune system, so a lower Cortisol level means a stronger Immune system and so more allergic and auto-immune reactions than with Neurotypicals, who have ~double the Cortisol levels during the day.

So it could be that your immune system is repelling foreign proteins in the materials that you talked about.
Maybe this can help you discuss it with your medical doctors.
I have links to scientific publications on this if you want to see those.

Sander
Yes! I believe this may be exactly what is happening. I have had my cortisol levels checked and this is true for me. Thank you very much! Yes, could you please share the links?
 
Hi, I'm Judi. I recently found out I am autistic and would like to ask if anyone has experienced rare reactions to foreign objects in the body. Objects such as synthetic mesh for hernias or dissolvable stitches. Is this something other neurodivergence experience?

Reactions to medical inserts are not specific to autistic people. Autistic people experience them, but so does everyone else. Sometimes a body just rejects things.
 
Yes! I believe this may be exactly what is happening. I have had my cortisol levels checked and this is true for me. Thank you very much! Yes, could you please share the links?
Me too. I had never heard of cortisol levels being the opposite of normal. I also have autoimmune disorders.
 
Cortisol regulates your body's stress response, metabolism, inflammation, blood pressure, and blood sugar. Generally, cortisol levels increase when you are under psychological or physical stress. It mediates the fight-or-flight response, but if there is no immediate physical threat to overcome, an elevated cortisol level is both damaging and exhausting.

Your amygdala, which generally controls the fear response, tells your hypothalamus to release cortisol if you experience fear or physical damage. It is a vestige of the days when humans had to worry about being chased by predators but not useful today for 99% of situations.
 
Yes! I believe this may be exactly what is happening. I have had my cortisol levels checked and this is true for me. Thank you very much! Yes, could you please share the links?
OK. The links.
Not all research is pure scientific. Many are financed by the Pharma Mafia (like Ritalin) or Behavioral therapists (Like ABA, CBT). So i am careful and sometimes i disagree with conclusions they make. But i look at the facts they find. Not at the interpretations...
OK.

Autism Linked With Stress Hormone Levels:​

->Autism Linked With Stress Hormone Levels

Normally, people have a surge of this hormone [ stress hormone cortisol ] shortly after waking, with levels gradually decreasing throughout the day. It is thought this surge makes the brain alert, preparing the body for the day and helping the person to be aware of changes happening around them.

However, a study led by Dr Mark Brosnan and Dr Julie Turner-Cobb from the Department of Psychology at the University of Bath, and Dr David Jessop from the University of Bristol, has found that children with Asperger Syndrome (AS) do not experience this surge.

Absence of a normal Cortisol Awakening Response (CAR) in adolescent males with Asperger Syndrome (AS)​

->https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0306453009000638?via=ihub

Our ability to react to change is modulated by the hypothalamic–pituitary–adrenal (HPA) axis, a feature of which is a dramatic increase in cortisol upon waking, the Cortisol Awakening Response (CAR). This study examined whether the CAR was evident in 20 adolescent males with Asperger Syndrome (AS) and 18 age-matched typically developing (TD) controls (aged 11–16). Whilst a significant CAR was evidenced in the TD control group, this was not the case for those with AS. A normal diurnal decrease in cortisol, however, was evident in both groups.

My remarks on both articles (they describe the same research from 2009) is the conclusion. They conclude on the hypothesis that some behavior of Autistics is based on the low level of Cortisol compared to NT's.
But that is just a side-remark. (I found other more important influences/cause, but that is another story).

A more broad intro to Cortisol:

Cortisol and the Immune Response

->Cortisol and the Immune Response

What is Cortisol?​

Cortisol is a steroid hormone, classified as a member of the glucocorticoid family of hormones. Cortisol is involved in a plethora of physiological processes in order to maintain homeostatic conditions in the body (McEwan et al, 2007). Cortisol is produced by the adrenal gland in response to stress and reduced levels of blood-sugar (Kamba et al, 2016); however, importantly cortisol is also released in a circadian fashion under homeostatic conditions (Krieger et al, 1971).

Key Takeaways​

  1. Cortisol, a glucocorticoid hormone, is crucial for stress response, immune regulation, and maintaining homeostasis.
  2. It modulates inflammation through specific molecular pathways and is essential in the body's response to stress and blood sugar levels.
  3. Dysregulated cortisol levels are linked to various diseases, including autoimmune disorders and certain cancers.
  4. Its role in cancer therapy is complex and varies depending on the type of cancer.
OK. Next.
Next article is rich, but voluminous and very detailed.
I give the link, but do not advice to read it and trying to understand it.
I noted a remark in it that i highlight out of it, since it supports one of my own hypotheses.

->Transcriptome analysis reveals dysregulation of innate immune response genes and neuronal activity-dependent genes in autism

Short: "...implicating dysregulated microglial responses in concert with altered neuronal activity-dependent genes in autism brains. These observations provide pathways and candidate genes that highlight the interplay between innate immunity and neuronal activity in the aetiology of autism."
This means:
In Autism, Neuronal processes (brain activity) influence the immune system. This is remarkable the opposite of that the immune system causes some parts of Autistic behavior.

OK some more background of the link between Autism (ASD Spectrum) and the immune system:

Association of Food Allergy and Other Allergic Conditions With Autism Spectrum Disorder in Children​

->Association of Allergies With Autism Spectrum Disorder

Conclusions and Relevance In a nationally representative sample of US children, a significant and positive association of common allergic conditions, in particular food allergy, with ASD was found. Further investigation is warranted to elucidate the causality and underlying mechanisms.

Next:

Immune Dysfunction and Autoimmunity as Pathological Mechanisms in Autism Spectrum Disorder​

2018->Immune Dysfunction and Autoimmunity as Pathological Mechanisms in Autism Spectrum Disorders

Outstanding questions and conclusion:​

The evidence that immune dysfunction likely plays a role in the etiology/pathophysiology of ASD is becoming substantial. Familial autoimmunity is a common risk factor, and maternal autoantibodies and inflammation during gestation significantly increase the risk of having a child with ASD. Furthermore, individuals with ASD have significant immune dysfunction and inflammation. They also suffer from immune-mediated co-morbidities much more often than the typically developing population, including GI dysfunction and dysbiosis. The presence of autoantibodies in individuals with ASD is increased, and evidence of neuroinflammation has been substantiated both in vivo and in post-mortem brain tissue. Although the plethora of evidence identifying a connection between autoimmunity, immune dysfunction, and ASD (summarized in Figure Figure3)3) is tantalizing, it still leaves many mechanistic questions regarding the impact of immune system dysfunction on the development of ASD.

Again i make the note that i have strong reasons to doubt that Auto-immunity is (a) cause of ASD.
In stead i pose the hypothesis that ASD is the cause of auto-immune reactions.
For example: The fact that statistics show that mothers who have Auto-immune reactions more often have Autistic children, could also be that because those mothers (age 20-40) are NOT YET DIAGNOSED autistics themselves.
I show this picture, because it has a lot of information in it:
Afbeelding1.jpg


OK... Last one...

Another Step Toward Defining an Immune-Mediated Subtype of Autism Spectrum Disorder​

I would not name it a "subtype". i would name it "ASD is an Immune-Mediated 'Disorder'."

2018->A Step Toward Defining an Immune-Mediated Subtype of Autism Spectrum Disorder

Children with ASD were significantly more likely than those without ASD to have food allergy (11.25% vs 4.25%), respiratory allergy (18.73% vs 12.08%), and skin allergy (16.81% vs 9.84%). The likelihood of the child having ASD more than doubled among children with food allergy compared with those without food allergy; children with respiratory and skin allergy were also significantly more likely to have ASD, but at a lesser magnitude. While no sex difference was found for food allergy, boys with ASD were significantly more likely than girls with ASD to have respiratory and skin allergy.
...
In the Discussion section of their article, Xu and colleagues1 review other aspects of immune dysfunction reported in ASD, including abnormalities in peripheral immunoglobulins, imbalance of T-cell subsets, and increased levels of proinflammatory cytokines in postmortem brains of patients with ASD. Considering the significant association between food, respiratory, and skin allergy in children with ASD reported by Xu and colleagues, in conjunction with numerous studies documenting aspects of immune dysfunction in patients with ASD and specific animal models of ASD,7 evidence continues to mount that an immune-mediated subtype of ASD should continue to be pursued and defined.

OK.
I hope this info can help you to prevent wrong choices to be made.

Sander
 
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Thank you all for answering. It’s like my body rejects all forgein substances. I have strong reactions to different medications, metals, and the “desolvable” stitches. I’m worried that if they insert the synthetic mesh in my stomach to repair my hernia that I will always be sick from it. Has anyone had a reaction like this? Am I worrying over nothing?
It might just be the lesser of two evils. Potentially getting another hernia or chancing a reaction to the mesh.

I would chance the mesh.
 
It might just be the lesser of two evils. Potentially getting another hernia or chancing a reaction to the mesh.

I would chance the mesh.
I had a hernia and had a mesh implanted. It hurts when I move in a certain way. The tissue where the mesh was attached is stretchy, but the mesh itself is not. When I move in such a way as to stretch that area, it gets pulled on around the edges where it is attached.

For me, it is an occasional pain, but my mother-in-law, who also had hernia surgery, complained about it constantly. It was still much less painful than a hernia, which has the potential at least of becoming life-threatening
 
It seems like the mesh could be removed if it’s a problem, but I have never heard of that being done.
 

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