How do they know?

[DesertRose]

Ok, I want to say up front, I have a problem wording things, please have mercy, and this is nothing but pure inquisitiveness.

1. Autistics (NDs)(all levels, supposedly) have varying degrees of trouble putting their feelings and emotions into words
2. NT'S don't understand NDs, are different

My question of sorts, are a lot of ND's parroting what the researchers are saying because it's misunderstood, by both, or are NT's still at best unable to truly understand what is going on in order to explain to the world...

Poor attempt to rephrase:

If neither NT's or ND's understand each other, then is there a lot of parroting going on, or assumptions?

(I hope that is somewhat understandable, I'm exhausted now. I warned y'all I had trouble wording.) :-O thank you!

 

[Progster]

I think that some parroting goes on on both sides, both NTs and NDs. Perhaps not parroting, that's not really the right word, more absorbing ideas and terminlogy.

NTs adopt terminology and scientific jargon found on websites devoted to autism, because they are trying to understand or learn about autism and if the information is found on an autism website, they assume it to be correct. They may also absorb and start using terms like "neurotypical" or "stimming" or "meltdown".

NDs are trying to understand themselves, they may not have the words to describe their experiences, so they might read about other people's experiences, see how that person describes them, and use, or copy, their words to describe their own feelings. Like NTs, they may also absorb and use terminology found in literature and websites, such as "neurodiverse" or "stimming" - not really 'parroting', more a familiarity with these terms, and using them because they help them to express themselves.

or are NT's still at best unable to truly understand what is going on in order to explain to the world...

No, not as far as ASD is concerned, because they don't experience ASD for themselves and are the outsiders looking in. All they can do is try to explain what they observe, they can't know what it's like because they don't experience it. An autistic person might have a completely different way of explaining the same behaviour. For example, many NTs complain that their ASD partner is cold, aloof, doesn't care, they can't reach them emotionally. From an ASD perspective, they have had a stressful day and need alone time to unwind, or find too much intimacy overwhelming, and so spend time alone, or want to pursue their own interests and don't need to be constantly talking to the NT partner or doing something with them.

 

[MrSpock]

NDs have varying degrees of trouble putting their feelings and emotions into the same system of boxes that is designed to fit NT feelings and emotions.

Since our feelings and emotions don't fit into this system properly we can't express our feelings and emotions properly. Any discussion of our feelings and emotions using this terminology is set up to fail.

It's possible that in a system set up to describe what is going on in ND neurology we would make as much sense as NTs do in the current system. NTs might be as unable to express themselves in 'our' system as we are now.

It's possible that we're branded incompetent when we're really just incompatible with this particular system, and that many of us simply accept the label 'incompetent'.

@DesertRose is this a fair assessment of your idea?

 

[DesertRose]

NDs have varying degrees of trouble putting their feelings and emotions into the same system of boxes that is designed to fit NT feelings and emotions.

Since our feelings and emotions don't fit into this system properly we can't express our feelings and emotions properly. Any discussion of our feelings and emotions using this terminology is set up to fail.

It's possible that in a system set up to describe what is going on in ND neurology we would make as much sense as NTs do in the current system. NTs might be as unable to express themselves in 'our' system as we are now.

It's possible that we're branded incompetent when we're really just incompatible with this particular system, and that many of us simply accept the label 'incompetent'.

@DesertRose is this a fair assessment of your idea?

Yes, I think so. It's basically, if neither understands the other, then are their research papers, and conclusions actually correct.
I have a really hard time trying to both understand and convey it all.
It would be great if someone could invent a helmet that took ones mind's understanding, and could put it on another's head, then the other person could see what they were talking about. (I think I just blew a capacitor...haha)

 

[Judge]

Consider the lack of parity between the two neurological profiles. That according to the CDC for every 68 Neurotypicals, only 1 is Neurodiverse. That for the vast majority of Neurotypicals, they have no incentive for even attempting to understand Neurodiverse perceptions. That only those who know or come into routine contact with Neurodiverse people likely have any interest or curiosity to learn more about us. The rest don't.

Then factor in those who have established the medical science of Neurological differences are overwhelmingly Neurotypical rather than Neurodiverse. All in all this can make for quite an "uphill battle" for Neurodiverse people to be heard, let alone properly understood.

In essence there isn't so much parroting- or assuming going on when you measure it against the amount of indifference by a majority of society. For Neurotypicals, they see no need to even bother explaining the world they live in. Leaving a burden of proof left largely on the Neurodiverse to prove to the contrary.

The sad reality is that an overwhelming social majority isn't apt to particularly care whether they neurologically perceive two percent of society correctly or not. Perhaps the one redeeming factor is the possibility that our numbers are statistically much higher than existing sources acknowledge which may come out in time to alter the equation and lessen societal indifference.

 

[DesertRose]

Side note, agreeing wholeheartedly:

....the possibility that our numbers are statistically much higher than existing sources acknowledge...

Absolutely!
Since my son was informally diagnosed, I've been researching and trying to learn more about this. What I've discovered is a family full of Asperger's /Autism characteristics, mostly on my dad's side. I certainly think it's a bigger statistic than currently thought.

 

[Judge]

Side note, agreeing wholeheartedly:


Absolutely!
Since my son was informally diagnosed, I've been researching and trying to learn more about this. What I've discovered is a family full of Asperger's /Autism characteristics, mostly on my dad's side. I certainly think it's a higger statistic than currently thought.

I'm inclined to believe there are substantially more people on the spectrum who are unaware of it. People like myself who "fell between the cracks" going un-diagnosed because the science was in a fledgling state at the time.

Where we just adjusted and masked our traits and behaviors as best we could, without really knowing why. Functioning well enough to be considered eccentric, but not necessarily autistic.