In the moment. Dosn't plan or see consequences

[Undiagnosed]

My son is 14. He hasn't goten a diagnosis yet but I have deemed him Aspie. There is one thing about him that I don't read or hear much about being associated with Aspergers. He alsways seems to be 'in the moment' only. I mean like this moment in time that he is in right now is the only thing that matters. When he was younger I did get a certain joy in seeing this trait in him. He seemed 'happy og lucky' like he was content playing or whatever it was he was interested in the moment without thinking about tomarrow, later on, or anything else. Many times I wish I could be just a little like that. I always have to be thinking ahead or dwelling about something that happened before.

NOW hoewever he is 14 and expected (and needs) to have a certain amount of responsability. How can you when you only are into this moment? I mean he needs to go to bed and get some sleep becouse he has school the next day. The next day dosn't matter to him right now and he might stay up as late possable and then end up sleeping in school. He dosn't worry or think much about his grades untill it is time to get his report card. Then it's too late. He can't seem to plan anything ahead at all. He can't seem to find the importance of getting an education. He just pretty much goes about life one moment at a time never thinking about any consequence to anything he dose or dosn't do. He dose get in trouble a lot and almost seems that he dosn't understand why. I am very concerned about my son. He is headed for trouble and seems to be so cluless! He seems like he will just do anything and not care what will happen if he dose. Dose any one whith Aspergers not care about much of anything? Not care what the consequences are of your actions? Not care about an education? Not have a gole of any kind? I beleive I have Asperger's too but I don't have this trait. Even as a kid I was always labeled 'reaponsable'. I don't know if this fits anyting to do with Asperger's or if it is something else?

 

[King_Oni]

I'm somewhat like your son... and I'm 30. And as a teen I was even worse. Though I have my moments where I think through consequences, but I found they keep me on edge way too much up to being almost paranoid about possible consequences.

However; besides being diagnosed with an aspie, I've been diagnosed with mood swings (just not enough to be flat out bi-polar) as well as ADHD (which isn't all about not sitting still, but more of the hyperactive mental part). Those 2 combined make me act a lot more on impulse. And probably as a result not make me wonder about consequence. I can't say this would be the case with your son, but it could very well be something similar.

What I noticed, and this is something that actually happens with a lot of people on the spectrum (from what I've gathered and saw on documentaries) is that many have to finish a task before they can start a new one. This can be anything from education to work, to leisure activities. What I actually believe is, that this becomes problematic if there's not constant guidance around. Sending a kid to school and having a teacher guide him is fine. But he apparently needs to be occupied and guided a lot more than what has been the case thus far. If he comes home, then what? Some kids on the more low end of the spectrum actually need every day chopped down in easily digestible activities... every day, each day, to maintain structure and to get where they should be in terms of education and later maybe employment and all. Some learn to adapt to this behaviour in creating bite-size chunks themselves, some... and again, (mostly) the lower end of the spectrum, they might not and need guidance throughout their adult life in order to maintain some responsibility and structure.

Another thing to consider about impulsivity; I get a bit more reckless when I don't feel fine (or perhaps flat out depressed). I just need to do whatever makes me feel good. And while I'm older and can probably get away with it easier, it's something you could at least look into with your son. Does he even talk to you how he feels? If he doesn't, it might just as well be an indicator of him wanting to do what makes him feel comfortable and all at that moment (and I think it's fair to state that a lot of young teens like to stay up late, watch tv or whatever they do nowadays till late in the night. I rarely knew any teens that were different). Yes, I was tired the next day, but at least I had a lot of fun the day before. Honestly; that bad report card and the trouble I got from it was nothing compared to my mental wellbeing, even as a, in my case 12 year old (and probably younger even).

Also; the entire notion of consequence sometimes doesn't even work for NT's. Some people just cannot deal with that. Forcing it upon them will cause more stress and problems with them. Granted a fair share will get on the bad side of the tracks, but at least you as a mom recognize it and try to do something about it.

Perhaps it's also worth noting that it's not that consequence isn't the problem. The problem is understanding how consequence works. What might seem sensible for some (not paying attention in school causes bad results, which causes you to drop out, which causes you to do bad later in life if you look for a job) is a strange process for some. Have you ever talked about his future with him? Does he know what he wants to do when he's older? And does he understand what he has to do to achieve that? I know 14 is young, but it's not neccesarily just the "what do you want with your future"-talk, it's more so, seeing if he can create a backwards route on the notion of consequence for himself.

 

[Dragon's Tooth]

I dunno if this is necessarily an aspie thing though I have heard that aspies and people with autism lack the ability to fore see consequences ie stepping out onto a busy road without looking. I guess my husband would back that up because he's forever telling me to look for cars even though I'm pretty much aware of the situation lol. This has caused a few disagreements!!

But you have to remember also this is a TEENAGE thing. All teenagers lack the capacity to foresee the consequences of their action. I find it a miracle that any teenager survives to adulthood because of the processes in their brains.

The brain goes through four stages of thinking as it matures and develops. I never remember the first one but basically a person will out grow this by about the age of five. After that you get concrete thinking ie what you see is what you get. That's why when they give five year olds two containers one flat and long the other tall and skinny and put the same amount of water in the containers they will always pick the tall skinny one because it looks bigger. I actually remember being wowed by this as a child.

The next stage is the teenage stage. Teenage brains actually lack the capacity to for see the consequences of their actions. This is what this phase if known as. They take chances like driving too fast because their brains are all about the now and the reward the now gives them. At this stage of brain development the human brain cannot equate driving too fast with an accident for instance. Or having sex with a baby (which was probably an evolutionary advantage when we were cavemen) or taking drugs with dying or what ever. Their whole brain is set up to receive reward and get rid of the thing that stands in that way (often parents hence the arguments parents and teenagers have).

If your child is lucky they will have their brain develop into the adult stage which is the rational thinking. They can see what the consequences of their actions are. Not everyone gets here. This happens probably around 25 for males when the brain stops growing. However it is worth noting that the brain development of humans isn't always like this. Due to influencing factors (genetic conditions, drugs, alcohol, brain damage of any description, aspergers ... etc) a human brain can get stuck at any stage. And a lot just never seem to grow out of the teenage stage. I'm sure we all know an adult that just seemed to never leave his or her teenage years behind.

So while it can be an aspie trait you have to remember your probably not alone in this risk taking. All teenage parents are going through this about now. However the aspie-ness might be making it worse. As to how you can contain it ... I haven't raised a teenager yet so I can't advise on that. All I can say is that have an open and honest line of communication with your son. I had that with my mum and I believe that got me through my teenage years in on piece. Me and my siblings never really did drugs or drank alcohol or played up because we could always talk to mum about it. So instead of a lot of things being taboo in our house we could have an open conversation and it took away a lot of the forbidden fruit appeal of a lot of the trappings in life. Like cigarettes don't task good but teenagers will do it to rebel. If there is no reason to rebel and a teen can go to his or her parent and discuss how they don't really taste good with them then why would they do them? Where as if you come down hard on a teenager over this issue most teenagers I know will keep doing it because mum and dad said no.

Also this could be an idea is get him to get a job. My parents couldn't afford to give us luxury ... we had to go earn it. So I ended up getting a job to have a car, to have the clothes I wanted, to have money to go out with friends etc ... this is an important lesson for teenagers. I know when I have teenagers and they come to me and say "mum I want a car" or "mum there's this designer T shirt I want" then I will be going "here's an application to McDonalds ... off you go". Then they learn the real lesson about where money and gratification comes from.

Just my thoughts hope this helps.

 

[Undiagnosed]

Thanks for the imput. I gotta expand on the info a little. I know what you are saying about the 'teen age thing'. That is surley part of it of course as he is 14, however I have two older sons who have already been past this phase and were both had their'
teen' moments and issues this is different. They both (and myself when I was a teen) did have some sence of responsability and understanding of consiquences, and did think about the future and what a person needs to do today to make what you want to happen in the furture. I mean I know what it's like to be a teen and to have teens and what you are talking about. There is something about teen phase that dose override sensable actions. But this kid really just .... I don't know how to explain it.

To answer your question King My son has been asked many times what he plans for himself in the furture. It is becouse people ie his principal, teachers, etc. see that he seems to have no consern for his furture that he has gotten that question several times. When I talk to him about that he seems to be sorta clueless sometimes, dosn't know, dosn't care. One time he did start saying something about... 'I'm sure I could find something I could do without graduateing from school". That was one of his rare morments of giving true thought to something. He has gotten to the point that much of the time when an adult tries to talk to him about something like that or anything really that he dosn't wanna deal with he will try to say whatever will get them to move on and stop talking to him. I must have been a strange kid (yea I was) becouse I did go to bed early when I had to get up earley becouse I knew I hated to be sleepy and feel like crap all day. My son who is 18 now started planning for his colledge furture when he was in middle school and saw his older brothers class graduate and began to think about and understand the process. He made a plan and followed threw on it throuought high school. I wouldn't expect every 14 year old to be super responsable but this one is way to the other extream. And I aslo think it's something about him personally other than his teen phase becouse something about him has alswys been more that way.

 

[Dragon's Tooth]

so you real concern is that he doesn't seem to have a career direction in life? I don't see that as something to worry about as a teenager. I think teenagers are the least equipped to know what they want in life.

I wouldn't pressure him because he will do something he doesn't want to do to make you happy.

I was pushed as a child. I was forever told I would go to university and get a degree and make the family proud. But as an adult I have come to realize that probably never was my dream. I just got attention for being intelligent. Now I have a student loan that is nearly $100,000 because I was pushed into something I didn't want and frankly they don't care that this year my income will probably be a grand total of $0 and my husband will have to make the payments for me on my loan. All because I wanted to make my family happy and because when you are 18 you have no real concept of what signing a piece of paper means ...

Because he doesn't know what he wants to do with himself when he leaves school shouldn't be an issue. I bet a lot of teenagers have no clue. But he might. He might be afraid to tell you the truth because he fears you will ridicule him or be angry with him if he tells you the truth.

Honestly when I have kids I will push them to finish high school then take a couple years off to figure out what they really want in life before they go to uni or what ever. Half my debt is from trying to figure out what I wanted.

I get the feeling this is something your over thinking. Just let him be happy. That's the best you can ask for him in life.

I am now a volunteer with an animal rescue group and I couldn't be happier. I don't get paid but I get so much more in life. If only I had had the chance to explore that for myself before I got my massive crippling debt.

 

[epath13]

It's all seem to be a part of the way mind of many people on the spectrum works. There's this book I've read a few years ago: "living on the spectrum", I think. The author talks about this issue in the book.
From my personal experience, I've always known that it's hard for me to imagine myself in future. I mean, I could imagine how my future would look like, but there's always something missing. Some people explain it this way: for people on the spectrum its hard to process all the steps that need to be taken to achieve a goal, it's almost like we expect magically transform from current state into the next one. A good example, let's say a child want to become a doctor, once he gets to the point when he actually needs to go to college and do all the stuff that is required, he might freak out and not do it, because he doesn't see that those steps will help him to achieve the ultimate goal. That's why when teaching children and adults on the spectrum it is very important to get them engaged, so they can enjoy the process instead of focusing on the path and the goal. Some might be able to hold the ultimate goal in mind but some won't. I believe, when you trying to convince somebody on Autism spectrum to "clean up their act" etc, you need to see 1st if a person actually wants to achieve something, if a person has a goal. If he/ she does, that you might use it as an inspiration but it's definitely not enough. I've always compared myself to a blind puppy or a person who's walking in a fog and can't see anything besides what's next to me. So I realized later that if I didn't enjoy at least some of the steps, that helped me to achieve a goal, I would never move any further.
I think when a child is in school or even in college, it's good to set up a routine, a nice working schedule that would have necessary tasks but also enjoyable tasks. It's very important to figure out what a person on Autism spectrum enjoys and constantly return to it, look for enjoyable moments in the necessary tasks.
I think for many people on the spectrum its hard to accept responsibility. And if responsibility is something that he/ she has learned to fear, then as a result you will get one lost and depressed individual. All those causes and consequences can end up being mixed together and become very confusing.

I remember when I was a kid and didn't want to clean my room, my parents constantly repeated the same thing: "Don't you like things being clean and organized. Look at this bright room. Look, all your things are smiling now" etc
It's obviously wouldn't work for everybody, but somehow they were lucky or maybe sensed, that I loved things being organized and wanted my stuff to "smile" later a good technique helped me as well: being in a moment, absorbing everything that surrounds me in this moment and trying to feel it. that way, sometimes tasks that are commonly not enjoyable become enjoyable. There's obviously a risk to turn one of those tasks into a repetitive one, with no purpose. But it can be avoided.

See it this way, give 2 children a set of blocks with numbers from 1 to 10 and ask them to put put the blocks in order. One child will sort them right away, for another child more instructions are needed or he will just see a bunch of meaningless blocks lying around on the table. I think, for many people on Autism spectrum life might seem very confusing and if you tell them to do something about it, they will just get upset or angry. I'm not saying everybody is like that, but I can speak for myself: I have been and I am still the one who walks in a fog, but now I'm fine with it.

Hope this all helps, it might be a little scrambled

 

[Undiagnosed]

BINGO! Epath. That's what I'm talking about! I can sorta see it in terms of myself once you put it that way. I like to take things one close step at a time and enjoy the steps. When I have had a goal that requires something too far into the future and to much unenjoyable steps in between I have never been able to get there. Now I see the connection to my son. He is like that but probaly to the furthest extreem there is. He is absolutley in fog. I am conserned right now if he will ever get a high school diploma. He is in seventh grade for the second time right now. He hd so much problems that the school switched him to what they call 'alternitive shcool'. He only had three hours a day and can work at his own pace. The school and I both thought this would be a good answer for him but still he dosn't care enough to keep his points up and to stay awake during the three hours a day. He keeps getting put into suspension becouse of his non compliance and the next step if he dosn't turn things around is expolsion. He hates school and has never found even one enjoyable aspect in his eight years of school. Whenever they test his intelegance it is within normal range and so no one can understand why he dosn't get at least passing grades.

 

[Undiagnosed]

There was something else you mentioned King...Brain Damage. When my son was 18 months old he got ahold of a piece of meat and chocked. He lost oxygen for I don't know how long but it was long enough that he lost concioness and started to turn white and blue. I sometimes wonder if he is brain was damaged.

 

[King_Oni]

There was something else you mentioned King...Brain Damage. When my son was 18 months old he got ahold of a piece of meat and chocked. He lost oxygen for I don't know how long but it was long enough that he lost concioness and started to turn white and blue. I sometimes wonder if he is brain was damaged.

Don't think I mentioned brain damage explicitly, but it could be a possibility.

I don't know how dangerous it is for him. But I should state, that since my dad had a brain stroke about 10 years ago, he really changed and his ability to plan ahead and therefore acting more on impulse has increased greatly.

Can't say if that's with your son for sure. Guess that's where a neurologist might step in and assess if there's actual damage.

 

[Undiagnosed]

Acting on Impulse and ability to plan ahead is exactley what I am talking about. But of course he was 18 months old so the change wouldn't have been that noticable. I am glad I asked this becouse it has made me think this threw and brought me to the conclusion that I should ask his doctor to look into the possability of brain damage. It just isn't something I naturaly put together for a long time- problems he has as an older child connected to something that happened whe he was a baby. That incoddence did come to my mind one day in connection to his problems but I have kept in the back of my mind and thought about it from time to time. Now with him getting older and the demands and expectations of him getting more and more and I think it is something I need to check out. I was reading something fI googled that said brain damage can show up in cat scans. Do u know if your Dads was shown on a scan?

 

[King_Oni]

While braindamage wouldn't be noticeable at 18 months old, it can mess up mental processes in the long run. It's much like autism, where it's a neurological problem.

From what I understand my dad has had scans. He suffered a stroke at home and later when he was at the hospital he suffered another one (so he was already around professionals at the time). I should ask him to be sure and how they figured it out though. But I'm quite sure he had scans.