Something like autistic spectrum disorder which isn’t ASD?

[Jumpback]

I was in high school diagnosed with OCD and then I have been diagnosed with anxiety disorders and ADHD. I can see why people think OCD, I am not sure about ADHD, anxiety disorders definitely fits. But the issue is something greater than this. I identify with a lot on here but don’t think that I seem ASD enough if went in for a diagnosis unless they listened to my historical accounts from childhood/early adulthood, because I have kind of learned to pass or something

With me, I would say that the thing I identify most with is executive functioning deficits. Like I repeatedly pay for gas then drive away without pumping the gas in my car because I just forget, I can’t be neat, I can’t do things like organize a vacation, I can’t organize tasks, basic things like going to the store and remembering to buy birthday cards are stressful, I have difficulty letting go of the past, etc

But I also have other autistic traits, like I hate wearing anything but sweat pants or cotton shorts because jeans bother me, I can’t look people in the eyes when talking, I have very strong interest, I hate change, etc. But I am not able to stand still or focus enough to find my place as a computer coder or something.

So I was looking through things and I noticed executive function disorder which fits in a lot of ways, but this isn’t a DSM thing. I am adopted and have met my biological mother and she said my biological father was abusive, so I wonder if I have mild brain damage or something

I’m just kind of curious what other people have been diagnosed with or think they might have which looks like ASD but isn’t ASD. I wish I had access to a DSM V manual, but I am not sure that would help. Sort of, honestly, I think a bunch of things that would look different if viewed through fMRI imaging of the brain get lumped together under ASD because scientists don’t know any better, and/or insurance companies need simple explanations or something.

But I am just kind of curious about what other people have been diagnosed with or how they fit but don’t fit or whatever the he double hockey sticks else

 

[risootser]

You may believe in incomplete fingerprints or not. Some like to rely on those.

I really think DSM needs neuropsychiatric disorder not otherwise specified.

 

[Trophonius]

Psychological diagnosis are complex because many of the disorders are poorly defined and vague, because at the time being we don't have the knowledge to make more precise definitions. Autism is one of those disorders.

The most relevant thing that happened int the DMS-V is that a few formerly separated disorders are now under the "Autism Spectrum Disorders". Because of the change of criteria, something "which looks like ASD but isn't ASD" now it's probably ASD, but taking in consideration that the higher (meaning more functional) you go up the spectrum the more diverse are the people diagnosed.

 

[Nitro]

I was in high school diagnosed with OCD and then I have been diagnosed with anxiety disorders and ADHD. I can see why people think OCD, I am not sure about ADHD, anxiety disorders definitely fits. But the issue is something greater than this. I identify with a lot on here but don’t think that I seem ASD enough if went in for a diagnosis unless they listened to my historical accounts from childhood/early adulthood, because I have kind of learned to pass or something

With me, I would say that the thing I identify most with is executive functioning deficits. Like I repeatedly pay for gas then drive away without pumping the gas in my car because I just forget, I can’t be neat, I can’t do things like organize a vacation, I can’t organize tasks, basic things like going to the store and remembering to buy birthday cards are stressful, I have difficulty letting go of the past, etc

But I also have other autistic traits, like I hate wearing anything but sweat pants or cotton shorts because jeans bother me, I can’t look people in the eyes when talking, I have very strong interest, I hate change, etc. But I am not able to stand still or focus enough to find my place as a computer coder or something.

So I was looking through things and I noticed executive function disorder which fits in a lot of ways, but this isn’t a DSM thing. I am adopted and have met my biological mother and she said my biological father was abusive, so I wonder if I have mild brain damage or something

I’m just kind of curious what other people have been diagnosed with or think they might have which looks like ASD but isn’t ASD. I wish I had access to a DSM V manual, but I am not sure that would help. Sort of, honestly, I think a bunch of things that would look different if viewed through fMRI imaging of the brain get lumped together under ASD because scientists don’t know any better, and/or insurance companies need simple explanations or something.

But I am just kind of curious about what other people have been diagnosed with or how they fit but don’t fit or whatever the he double hockey sticks else

https://cdn.website-editor.net/30f11123991548a0af708722d458e476/files/uploaded/DSM%20V.pdf

 

[menander]

Do you have access to a good Neuro-psychologist who could test? It's too hard to speculate. The tests are like 10 hours long --or 6 if you are speedy. There is no other way. The brain is too complex and hidden to try to look at itself. But others can!

 

[unperson]

NVLD is a close cousin, not sure about specific exec function deficits, mine get bad when stressed, but unstressed it's ok. Might be worth seeing a professional, cos exec function stuff can be very annoying.

 

[Jumpback]

Do you have access to a good Neuro-psychologist who could test? It's too hard to speculate. The tests are like 10 hours long --or 6 if you are speedy. There is no other way. The brain is too complex and hidden to try to look at itself. But others can!

Unfortunately I do not have insurance at the moment

 

[Jumpback]

NVLD is a close cousin, not sure about specific exec function deficits, mine get bad when stressed, but unstressed it's ok. Might be worth seeing a professional, cos exec function stuff can be very annoying.

I looked up NVLD and I definitely get why you would suggest this because they do to seem to be very similar, but it couldn't be this due to “NVLD can be conceptualized as an imbalance in thinking skills—intact linear, detail oriented, automatic processing with impaired appreciation of the big picture, gestalt or underlying theme.”

I almost have an opposite issue from this and potentially ASD????? where I see the big picture and underlying theme, but not the details. Like I see the forest but not the trees, instead if the trees but not the forest. Maybe.

Or like I get that this thing needs to get done and why, but I can’t manage to work out the logistics of accomplishing it without getting overwhelmed

I guess part of what confuses me is the stereotype I have in my mind of people on the autism spectrum of being good at details and specifics or maybe numbers, which makes ASD people sometimes be able to be computer programmers, but I am almost the opposite. I go to grand ideas about artificial intelligence based upon this or that, but I can’t actually sit still and program/code, or even have much interest in doing this. I am really just interested in how like human stereotyping might relate to artificial intelligence, due to mental shortcuts humans use to save time and such things. But, again, much of my assumptions of ASD are coming from my own stereotype of what someone on the scale is supposed to look like

 

[Jumpback]

Psychological diagnosis are complex because many of the disorders are poorly defined and vague, because at the time being we don't have the knowledge to make more precise definitions. Autism is one of those disorders.

The most relevant thing that happened int the DMS-V is that a few formerly separated disorders are now under the "Autism Spectrum Disorders". Because of the change of criteria, something "which looks like ASD but isn't ASD" now it's probably ASD, but taking in consideration that the higher (meaning more functional) you go up the spectrum the more diverse are the people diagnosed.

My thinking is along the lines of yours. Like I look at ASD on the DSM and it looks so vague that it looks a little like guidelines to judge an art show by or something, not serious number oriented science like Physics or math. Like:

“Persistent deficits in social communication and social interaction across multiple contexts, as manifested by the following, currently or by history (examples are illustrative, not exhaustive, see text)”

Your reasoning that it probably ends up being ASD is probably right according to the DSM, but it might be just because that this is the closest thing that fits rather that it being a truly accurate categorization.

 

[risootser]

I guess part of what confuses me is the stereotype I have in my mind of people on the autism spectrum of being good at details and specifics or maybe numbers, which makes ASD people sometimes be able to be computer programmers, but I am almost the opposite. I go to grand ideas about artificial intelligence based upon this or that, but I can’t actually sit still and program/code, or even have much interest in doing this. I am really just interested in how like human stereotyping might relate to artificial intelligence, due to mental shortcuts humans use to save time and such things. But, again, much of my assumptions of ASD are coming from my own stereotype of what someone on the scale is supposed to look like

Neuropsychologist who tested said that I'm too focused on details. Then I said that I flunked that test because vision impairment which also affects eye contact. I also said that I always had hard time with focusing minute details in front of me. Then she said it was because of my visual impairment which made me not like it. Then I said this is not really true because I have invested insane amount of time learning those because I like challenges but that is not motivation because those were necessary stepping stones in my education and understanding stuff. Like I sucked at hidden images but I forced myself to learn it because I had to pass the freaking test at uni geometry. BTW I still suck at it but due to practice I probably beat random person from a street in it. It is like suddenly my education made me autistic and changed my history.

She was full of circular reasoning. She just wanted to believe herself and not listen to me.
I just said that things might not be like what she wants but she just added again that I failed the test because of focusing details which was actually just another way around. It really made me desperate. I totally understand people back in the days who couldn't get out of the institution after gaining sanity. She was like nurse Ratched from One flew over the cuckoo's nest.

So all in all. I just said that my case is not clear and she is trying to fit me in like a square peg in a round hole. I was not a person to her I was a stereotype who was also expriencing sensory overloads altough I do not experience those. Luckily psychiatrist said that my case is not clear during a meeting.

 

[Jumpback]

https://cdn.website-editor.net/30f11123991548a0af708722d458e476/files/uploaded/DSM%20V.pdf

Thank you for sending this link. I keep trying to look through it on the iPad, but iPad has issues with it if I scroll down too far. And it's really long. I'm going to have try try again on the computer when I have time. I just want to kind of figure out once and for all if its ASD on something more obscure.

 

[Jumpback]

Neuropsychologist who tested said that I'm too focused on details. Then I said that I flunked that test because vision impairment which also affects eye contact. I also said that I always had hard time with focusing minute details in front of me. Then she said it was because of my visual impairment which made me not like it. Then I said this is not really true because I have invested insane amount of time learning those because I like challenges but that is not motivation because those were necessary stepping stones in my education and understanding stuff. Like I sucked at hidden images but I forced myself to learn it because I had to pass the freaking test at uni geometry. BTW I still suck at it but due to practice I probably beat random person from a street in it. It is like suddenly my education made me autistic and changed my history.

She was full of circular reasoning. She just wanted to believe herself and not listen to me.
I just said that things might not be like what she wants but she just added again that I failed the test because of focusing details which was actually just another way around. It really made me desperate. I totally understand people back in the days who couldn't get out of the institution after gaining sanity. She was like nurse Ratched from One flew over the cuckoo's nest.

So all in all. I just said that my case is not clear and she is trying to fit me in like a square peg in a round hole. I was not a person to her I was a stereotype who was also expriencing sensory overloads altough I do not experience those. Luckily psychiatrist said that my case is not clear during a meeting.

Thanks for giving details about your experience with this. I'm scared something similar might happen with me and I walk out even more frustrated than when I walked in. Like there is clearly something different, but then it's like if you don't exactly fit ASD, then you have nothing. Like I have a pattern of things, like I think about 8 times I have went in the store and paid for gas, but then by the time I get to the car I have forgotten that I bought gas and just drive away without pumping it. I'm sure that other people do these things like maybe once during their life times when they are stressed out, but 8 times?

 

[Els]

Thanks for giving details about your experience with this. I'm scared something similar might happen with me and I walk out even more frustrated than when I walked in. Like there is clearly something different, but then it's like if you don't exactly fit ASD, then you have nothing. Like I have a pattern of things, like I think about 8 times I have went in the store and paid for gas, but then by the time I get to the car I have forgotten that I bought gas and just drive away without pumping it. I'm sure that other people do these things like maybe once during their life times when they are stressed out, but 8 times?

The executive functioning deficits you feel are the most important trait can be caused by a lot of different stuffs. Autism is one of them, but there are many others. A doctor might have a larger view about what could cause those issues and might advice you to rule out some other things you/we don't think about becaue we're not doctors. There are many things that can cause problems in executive functioning, I personally don't know enough to advice anything else than asking a doctor and see what comes out of the conversation.

I think she explains very well to understand what the criterias are and how it works.

 

[Jumpback]

The executive functioning deficits you feel are the most important trait can be caused by a lot of different stuffs. Autism is one of them, but there are many others. A doctor might have a larger view about what could cause those issues and might advice you to rule out some other things you/we don't think about becaue we're not doctors. There are many things that can cause problems in executive functioning, I personally don't know enough to advice anything else than asking a doctor and see what comes out of the conversation.

I think she explains very well to understand what the criterias are and how it works.

Thanks for the video. I think that I might come across a little like her, where she seems more normal. In her case she kept talking about what she was like when she was younger and how she’d learned to mask things, that’s kind of the same with me. I think that I would have fit the DSM V criteria when I was younger, but not know, so I would have to be diagnosed on what I was like in the past like she was.

I have a great deal of difficulty with psychs due to a history of sexual assault type issues. I had to try for on off for 2 years and then aggressively for almost 1 year to try to convince someone just to let me try adhd medication, due to this. It’s like I say things but they don’t listen to me and assume other things

Like due to these two things of coming across as more normal and everything turning to chaos if I mention sexual assault things, it would be a challenge to convince someone to take this seriously, so that’s kind of why I am trying to figure things out for myself

 

[Fino]

I don't get it. You sound autistic to me.

 

[Jumpback]

I don't get it. You sound autistic to me.

Thanks, it's just confusing since I can manage to pass or something

I have had like advantages of having a nice family and a stable upbringing in a rural setting where I could be by myself and so on. But this might make things more confusing when it comes to whether or not I have ASD. Like if I was abused as a child maybe autistic traits would have overwhelmed me and I just would have been diagnosed a long time ago or something.

Then I have a secondary issue of being sexually assaulted by a couple after I moved to the city to go to college, which further confuses everything since the couple is gay

Like if ones background is really stable and then all of a sudden they are far more upset than they might normally be it maybe ends up sounding like repressed homosexuality or all manners of disorders or something

I kind of suspect that since I had things really easy the ASD wasn't obvious, but this sexual assault after I had been drinking triggered ASD type things, but people misunderstood what had happened

 

[Fino]

I can pass easily. I could pass as a socialite if I put in the effort. Being able to pass is normal.

 

[Els]

Thanks for the video. I think that I might come across a little like her, where she seems more normal. In her case she kept talking about what she was like when she was younger and how she’d learned to mask things, that’s kind of the same with me. I think that I would have fit the DSM V criteria when I was younger, but not know, so I would have to be diagnosed on what I was like in the past like she was.

I have a great deal of difficulty with psychs due to a history of sexual assault type issues. I had to try for on off for 2 years and then aggressively for almost 1 year to try to convince someone just to let me try adhd medication, due to this. It’s like I say things but they don’t listen to me and assume other things

Like due to these two things of coming across as more normal and everything turning to chaos if I mention sexual assault things, it would be a challenge to convince someone to take this seriously, so that’s kind of why I am trying to figure things out for myself

I understand.

 

[risootser]

I find that psych workers are too worried about my feelings. It is very hard to have a good relaxed and honest conversation with them that goes in true depths. No feelings spared. Well, I do not put any weight in it so why should they. I'm the customer. Their adaptation skills are too assuming instead of probing which I prefer. There has been multiple times when I wanted to say: "Please, probe me as hard as you can!"

 

[Jumpback]

But how do you get taken seriously to be diagnosed if you pass I kind of wonder

And I actually have multiple unusual experiences around the same subject, my roommate before my ex-gf decided he was made gay by developing a psychotic illness and he killed himself. I don't know why things involving the same general subject have reoccurred.

When I was going to get medication I would lie about a bunch of things, talk my way out of seeing social workers or psychs that they want you to see, because the second I start mentioning these things heads start to spin. It feels like it would take about 3 minutes to completely dismiss all talk about ASD to get to if the real problem was trauma or my repressed homosexuality or what other secret things is wrong with me.

I find that psych workers are too worried about my feelings. It is very hard to have a good relaxed and honest conversation with them that goes in true depths.

Even worse than this, when they just start looking for what the real issue is after you've just told them what the real issue is

Like there was one PhD psych at this place I was going to who could diagnose ADHD, so I had to go through him, but the second I mention sexual assault issues he either decided it was trauma or became upset with me for my homophobia, which does not exist, and he refused to give me the ADHD test, even though I clearly fit the criteria (though I might fit executive function issues from ASD better)