rosewater
Active Member
Hi everybody! (warning, long post ahead)
First post on the forum
Great to meet you all. I hope I have not offended anybody with the title of this post. A few months ago I met a person who I initially thought to be an Aspie. However, shortly after I became convinced he was a psychopath. After a while I have realized -and so has confirmed his therapist- that it's not psychopathy and most likely high-functioning autism. Here's the story.
I've had a couple of Aspie friends and even though they are all very different to each other I identified some common signs in him. He was not shy but certainly did not know how to interact with people very well (he's 29, I'm 26). He came across as socially awkward and very blunt. He also had a dark and unusual sense of humor that I found quite amusing. I thought he was endearing, different and very intelligent -a quality I highly value- so I decided to go out with him after a few times of seeing each other at that bar and other events from the Meetup community in my city.
We went out on a -kind of- date and that's when I realized he did not know how to interact with people that well. But he was still interesting to talk to and for some reason I felt quite drawn to him. Towards the end we were both quite drunk and he said a couple of statements that I found troubling: 'people are inherently bad and to be avoided' and 'I have the urge to kill somebody, either to kill somebody else or myself'. I tend to stomach pretty much anything people tell me and react in a logical way so I just asked him if he had harmed or killed somebody so far. To which he responded that no, but that there was a person who bullied him for many years at school and that he wanted him dead. And that he'd thought about suicide.
Surprisingly, I still went out with him a few times thinking he just had a mental health issue that he had to work through. At that point I became convinced he was a psychopath (I later found out he wasn't and he's not violent at all). He had a lot of issues with empathy. He seemed to be very callous, arrogant, hated people and thought most humans are stupid. He'd never had a close friend, just acquaintances, and wasn't that interested in friendships either. He also said he didn't care about love or affection, just in dating somebody intelligent. He couldn't be bothered with keeping in touch with his family either. He admitted himself he rarely experienced emotions or feelings, and when he did he struggled to control them.
I told him I thought he was a psychopath for the reasons above. He said it seemed to fit his behavior and went along with it, so I became even more convinced. He has outstanding analytical skills and strategic thinking, and I am good at understanding people, so we set a kind of information exchange.
But then things weren't adding up, especially after he became my summer fling. He told me he had been scared of talking to people for a very long time and he hadn't really dated anybody before. It was only a year and a half ago (a bit after moving to my city, which has a much better climate than where he comes from) that he started going out to bars to get over his fear of talking to people and try to get better at conversations. He also said he liked me and had been missing me when we were not together. On a couple of instances when I said I could not see him any longer, he got quite emotional and said he didn't want me to go. He cried his eyes out both times. I was so convinced he was a psychopath I brushed it off and thought he was just lying and trying to trick me. Indeed he tried to assure me he had no intention to manipulate or lie to me with very logical arguments.
But again he's always been quite kind in his own way, wants to genuinely do things right and does not seem to attempt to manipulate me. I'm not sure how I once thought he was lying if he in fact tends to be honest to the point of shooting himself in the foot. I later apologized for attributing everything he did to lying and manipulation. I'm surprised he put up with the nasty things I told him when I still thought he was a psychopath.
He always tries to incorporate the things I like to the dynamic of the 'relationship' (even if it's not very serious yet). When I point something he's done that I didn't like or his emotional distance, he always tries to see where he went wrong and makes sure he doesn't do it again. Surprisingly, he makes room for me and my needs more than the average person would (if I do tell them what my needs are, since they are not always evident to him apparently). If I tell him I need help with something, he will help to the best of his capabilities.
Since he's a natural problem-solver and always thinks like the engineer he is, he also started going to therapy after my complaints about his lack of empathy and affection. He's not so interested in a diagnosis, but rather in a way to address symptoms. Not sure if this is common.
Not long after we started seeing each other more often it became apparent to me that the issue was more about lack of understanding than lack of care (weak theory of mind maybe?). Things that are very straightforward for me seem difficult for him to understand. Putting himself in somebody else's shoes is also challenging for him. In general, I don't think he understands the magnitude of his issues, although it's slowly starting to sink in.
I think he does care, but he feels and expresses care in a different way I do. In fact, once we discussed the issues he has with his family, he seemed to understand the way they act much better and willing to resume contact with them, and started to realize some things he says can come across as cruel.
Since we started seeing each other, he certainly seems to be less callous and hateful towards people. I think now that I helped him understand people a little better he hates them less. I think he was also tired of so much rejection. Can you guys help me figure out if this may be the case?
One issue that I cannot quite resolve is his flat affect. He struggles to identify and express emotions, and he's also been trying to shut them out for a long time. He often says he has PTSD from the bullying he experienced. But again if I strike a nerve he can cry even if we are in a bar or a restaurant. I read about a condition called alexythimia which is often co-morbid with autism, not sure if it may be that. What do you guys think? Can that improve?
Anyway it seems like I'll continue seeing him for now and see what happens. He is be committed to addressing his issues and following therapy.
I am also in therapy since I have a diagnosed anxiety disorder possibly co-morbid with another disorder that is still unclear, perhaps emotional attachment disorder or some borderline features. We both share having felt different and like we didn't fit in for most of our lives. While I am neurotypical (as far as I know), I struggle to connect and find common ground with people, especially if they are my age. I also like he doesn't beat around the bush and says things as they are, I've never been fond of the silly social games many people like to play.
I also think we make a good team since each of us is strong in different areas
Hope you enjoyed the read and that you can give me some useful feedback to make sure things go smoothly.
Many thanks!
First post on the forum
Great to meet you all. I hope I have not offended anybody with the title of this post. A few months ago I met a person who I initially thought to be an Aspie. However, shortly after I became convinced he was a psychopath. After a while I have realized -and so has confirmed his therapist- that it's not psychopathy and most likely high-functioning autism. Here's the story.
I've had a couple of Aspie friends and even though they are all very different to each other I identified some common signs in him. He was not shy but certainly did not know how to interact with people very well (he's 29, I'm 26). He came across as socially awkward and very blunt. He also had a dark and unusual sense of humor that I found quite amusing. I thought he was endearing, different and very intelligent -a quality I highly value- so I decided to go out with him after a few times of seeing each other at that bar and other events from the Meetup community in my city.
We went out on a -kind of- date and that's when I realized he did not know how to interact with people that well. But he was still interesting to talk to and for some reason I felt quite drawn to him. Towards the end we were both quite drunk and he said a couple of statements that I found troubling: 'people are inherently bad and to be avoided' and 'I have the urge to kill somebody, either to kill somebody else or myself'. I tend to stomach pretty much anything people tell me and react in a logical way so I just asked him if he had harmed or killed somebody so far. To which he responded that no, but that there was a person who bullied him for many years at school and that he wanted him dead. And that he'd thought about suicide.
Surprisingly, I still went out with him a few times thinking he just had a mental health issue that he had to work through. At that point I became convinced he was a psychopath (I later found out he wasn't and he's not violent at all). He had a lot of issues with empathy. He seemed to be very callous, arrogant, hated people and thought most humans are stupid. He'd never had a close friend, just acquaintances, and wasn't that interested in friendships either. He also said he didn't care about love or affection, just in dating somebody intelligent. He couldn't be bothered with keeping in touch with his family either. He admitted himself he rarely experienced emotions or feelings, and when he did he struggled to control them.
I told him I thought he was a psychopath for the reasons above. He said it seemed to fit his behavior and went along with it, so I became even more convinced. He has outstanding analytical skills and strategic thinking, and I am good at understanding people, so we set a kind of information exchange.
But then things weren't adding up, especially after he became my summer fling. He told me he had been scared of talking to people for a very long time and he hadn't really dated anybody before. It was only a year and a half ago (a bit after moving to my city, which has a much better climate than where he comes from) that he started going out to bars to get over his fear of talking to people and try to get better at conversations. He also said he liked me and had been missing me when we were not together. On a couple of instances when I said I could not see him any longer, he got quite emotional and said he didn't want me to go. He cried his eyes out both times. I was so convinced he was a psychopath I brushed it off and thought he was just lying and trying to trick me. Indeed he tried to assure me he had no intention to manipulate or lie to me with very logical arguments.
But again he's always been quite kind in his own way, wants to genuinely do things right and does not seem to attempt to manipulate me. I'm not sure how I once thought he was lying if he in fact tends to be honest to the point of shooting himself in the foot. I later apologized for attributing everything he did to lying and manipulation. I'm surprised he put up with the nasty things I told him when I still thought he was a psychopath.
He always tries to incorporate the things I like to the dynamic of the 'relationship' (even if it's not very serious yet). When I point something he's done that I didn't like or his emotional distance, he always tries to see where he went wrong and makes sure he doesn't do it again. Surprisingly, he makes room for me and my needs more than the average person would (if I do tell them what my needs are, since they are not always evident to him apparently). If I tell him I need help with something, he will help to the best of his capabilities.
Since he's a natural problem-solver and always thinks like the engineer he is, he also started going to therapy after my complaints about his lack of empathy and affection. He's not so interested in a diagnosis, but rather in a way to address symptoms. Not sure if this is common.
Not long after we started seeing each other more often it became apparent to me that the issue was more about lack of understanding than lack of care (weak theory of mind maybe?). Things that are very straightforward for me seem difficult for him to understand. Putting himself in somebody else's shoes is also challenging for him. In general, I don't think he understands the magnitude of his issues, although it's slowly starting to sink in.
I think he does care, but he feels and expresses care in a different way I do. In fact, once we discussed the issues he has with his family, he seemed to understand the way they act much better and willing to resume contact with them, and started to realize some things he says can come across as cruel.
Since we started seeing each other, he certainly seems to be less callous and hateful towards people. I think now that I helped him understand people a little better he hates them less. I think he was also tired of so much rejection. Can you guys help me figure out if this may be the case?
One issue that I cannot quite resolve is his flat affect. He struggles to identify and express emotions, and he's also been trying to shut them out for a long time. He often says he has PTSD from the bullying he experienced. But again if I strike a nerve he can cry even if we are in a bar or a restaurant. I read about a condition called alexythimia which is often co-morbid with autism, not sure if it may be that. What do you guys think? Can that improve?
Anyway it seems like I'll continue seeing him for now and see what happens. He is be committed to addressing his issues and following therapy.
I am also in therapy since I have a diagnosed anxiety disorder possibly co-morbid with another disorder that is still unclear, perhaps emotional attachment disorder or some borderline features. We both share having felt different and like we didn't fit in for most of our lives. While I am neurotypical (as far as I know), I struggle to connect and find common ground with people, especially if they are my age. I also like he doesn't beat around the bush and says things as they are, I've never been fond of the silly social games many people like to play.
I also think we make a good team since each of us is strong in different areas
Hope you enjoyed the read and that you can give me some useful feedback to make sure things go smoothly.
Many thanks!
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