Trouble with past friendships and being in the same hobby

[Arashi222]

So I have a question for people. I have an ex-friend who got me into my doll collecting she also works with me (yah I know its a pain in the butt). We are also on the same doll forum on the Internets called DOA (den of angels). I always feel like I can't go to things because of her and her other friend who also used to be my friend. Every year she has a BJD mini doll meet for Halloween. Now Last year when she uninvited me because she didn't want me to be there because she didn't want to be friends with me anymore was hurtful but understandable. This year, she posts to several people where I can see it that she is still having her wonderful party and and reminding people to come all the while it feels like a big giant poke in the gut saying you're not invited to the party...I don't know what to do. Plus she already had said she was going to the doll meet in November. I can barely deal with her at work. It is giving me anxiety just thinking about her being there with them standing their like they are the queens of dolls and everyone else is beneath them.

I have always been made to feel too that my dolls are inferior to theirs. I am having real trouble with how to move forward and still enjoy the hobby that I love even though they got me into it. I needs help.

 

[King_Oni]

This party... is it HER party? If not... why does she tell who is invited? Also; Clearly it says something about the people attending the party if they all swarm over her and her dolls and don't care about other people being there as well.

I wouldn't put up with that kind of elitist behaviour to start with. But... I do know that the BJD community isn't really big, so not being part of such parties is missing out on meetings I guess.

Perhaps; you're better off steering clear from this meeting (unless you barely have any other meetings going on in your area) and let them be. You're better than this and shouldn't have to put up with exclusion for whatever superficial reason they conjure up.

I don't know if this is any help or advice, probably more a way to put it in perspective.

A word of advice though; Never quit a hobby because other people give you crap for it. Enjoy it for yourself, not for others.

 

[Arashi222]

This party... is it HER party? If not... why does she tell who is invited? Also; Clearly it says something about the people attending the party if they all swarm over her and her dolls and don't care about other people being there as well.

I wouldn't put up with that kind of elitist behaviour to start with. But... I do know that the BJD community isn't really big, so not being part of such parties is missing out on meetings I guess.

Perhaps; you're better off steering clear from this meeting (unless you barely have any other meetings going on in your area) and let them be. You're better than this and shouldn't have to put up with exclusion for whatever superficial reason they conjure up.

I don't know if this is any help or advice, probably more a way to put it in perspective.

A word of advice though; Never quit a hobby because other people give you crap for it. Enjoy it for yourself, not for others.

It is at her house. So in essence yes it is. But she has it open invite except to me. The one in November is bigger and more people will probably be there. People like her dolls. I like her dolls. But I love my own. I was always made to feel by her and her friends that I was inferior. But it was not just the dolls. I was always considered to be the third wheel even though they denied it many many times.

It is missing out. I don't go out much. Its one of the few times I get together and people don't think its weird to go on and on about dolls and companies and sculpts, face-ups and dollie clothing. Because they care too. I guess I really just need a pep talk. As its coming up to the one year anniversary of her not being friends with me. I just her lies bother me. Its the whole you need counseling nothing is wrong with me BS that upsets me. I had written her a letter back not long after I had joined this site. Telling her about my AS and why what she felt was being emotionally abusive and manipulating was a lot of my AS symptoms. She told me that to be friends with me again I had to get counseling nevermind her issues.


Thanks for the perspective. I kinda need it sometimes. Its so hard for me. I feel like I am being pushed out and pulled in at the same time. They are trying to push me out of the hobby. My new friends that I went to Renfeast with have been nothing but nice and understanding, and have gone out of their way to keep me in the hobby.

I want to go to the Nov. meet. But the last meet that they were there was awkward. I felt like I couldn't move from the other side of the room and started to cry half way through. I am genuinely looking for as many perspectives as possible. I value all of them. I just feel so torn. I feel hurt. I think its an AS thing that I remember anniversaries of not being friends with people.

I am a wiccan and we used to do rituals together after the party for Samhain. Its a holiday for us. I now don't get to celebrate how I used to. It is upsetting. My mom was nice last year and took me out to make me feel better but it was not the same. I just am unsure how to deal with being in a hobby that I feel I am being excluded from on some levels.

 

[Spinning Compass]

These are middle or high school kids, right? Unfortunately you are right in the middle of typical middle/high school girl behavior. It stinks, it hurts, it sucks. But if they are doing it to you they are doing it to others and eventually will turn on each other. You know what? Life's too short to stress out with that group.

Are there other people you trust who are also into dolls but are NOT part of that clique? Maybe you can start your own group with only one or two like-minded people that you trust. As for the others, you already know what they are.

This isn't about dolls. This is about power and exclusion. Today you are the excluded one. Tomorrow it will be someone else. I agree on one hand with King Oni that you shouldn't quit a hobby you enjoy just because others crap on you about it, but in this case I think you ought to bow out of this group. Because they thrive on making someone miserable. But if YOU turn YOUR back on THEM and act like it doesn't bother you in the least that they are excluding you, if you go on to develop your own life WITHOUT them, then they have no more power over you and guess what? They may be coming back to you because if there is one thing these power queens cannot stand it is to be ignored. When you are giving into them they love it. They want to see you cry and grovel and be weak. But it drives them nuts to see a strong woman who can walk on her own.

I know Wiccans have gotten a lot of bad press, but I've read some of their writings and they seem to be a pretty good bunch if a little strange to my way of thinking (I'm too rational and science oriented for them). Maybe you can find some good solid friendships there, also with these Renaissance fairs and groups. What you want to be around is people who are a little older and more mature and aren't interested in playing high school power games.

 

[Spinning Compass]

I had a similar situation with a group of my neighbors. All of a sudden they turned cold on me. So I went my own way and started getting involved in theater and other things and guess what? One of them wants to resume the friendship. Except that there is one guy there in that group who doesn't like me so I can only be around when he isn't. Well guess what, if you're not strong enough to stand up for me--if the only way we can be friends is for me to sneak around--then screw it. So I have been there and done that.

Don't waste your time hanging around petty people. I mean it. You are so much better than them.

 

[Arashi222]

I wish they were high school middle school. No they are my age one is older than me actually. I'm 30yrs old. I have been trying to turn my back. I love my hobby. I love my dolls and I didn't get into it to be popular or anything in fact a lot of people think they are creepy. But I know they are playing this power thing but I don't understand it. I don't get how to just let it go when its there every day at work for the one girl and every time I go to the bigger meets they are there and in this case I have been purposely told I am not invited to her party this year again. I mean am I the only one that remembers anniversaries like this of ex-friendships? we are both Wiccans, that is something I don't understand, she is very mean to people, and I have always tried to be nice to her or not talk to her after this whole thing started last year. Me new friends in the hobby have jokingly said they have to retrain me for good friendships. I am always thinking I am doing something wrong. I really am unsure. How Spinning Compass? How did you move forward in your own life and not let them bother you like that? I mean I have to work with one of them. I have to see her almost every day and be nice to her when she tries to get me all upset on purpose. She's close to my age like 27yrs old something like that.

 

[Spinning Compass]

It is so sad to see women that age acting like that. It sounds like they do not have very much going on in their lives and this is the only way they can feel validated.

How did I move on? I found different interests. I don't know what your situation is as far as location, opportunities and transportation. In my case I live in a small town (and this sort of behavior you describe is very common in small towns) but I have a car and I live near a city where there are lots of things going on. I realize not everyone has these options and rising gas prices have impacted my ability to do a lot of things I'd like to do but no longer can.

Good places to find information on things that are happening locally that you might be interested in are public library bulletin boards, in fact bulletin boards of any kind whether it is at the supermarket or laundromat or other businesses. I learn a lot about what is going on that way. And when you start going to different events you end up learning more about other events. For example I am in a local historical society. They were invited to take part in the dedication of a new nature preserve in the area. So I went to that. Now there are two things I can be involved in, the nature society and the historical society. The big thing is to widen your interests. Most people of the type you describe have no interests or only very narrow interests. In other words I don't think they are into dolls for the sake of dolls--they aren't really interested in dolls. Dolls are just an avenue for playing power games.

So I would put as much space as practical between you and them, which I realize is not easy to do on the job. When you have to relate to your nasty co-worker do it in a professional way and keep the conversation to work-related topics only. Do not discuss any other issues.

Also, I don't know what kind of job you do, but I am active in an administrative assistants organization even though I am not strictly an administrative assistant. Organizations like that can give you lots of advice on how to deal with people and situations like that on the job.

 

[Geordie]

It's hard to move on, when that person is someone Arashi is working with, and that she also loves dolls. Much as the lady was petty, she's simply unreasonable and is a pain in the butt.

I'm sure Arashi's dolls are pretty in their own kind of way.

 

[Arashi222]

Yah its just so hard. The problem is hard when i work with her and her mom. I love my dolls, I love the hobby. Its just a small community of people and its hard to just move forward when every day you subjected to the stress of whether or not they are going to be there that day or not. Its stressful. I feel like I have always been inferior to their dolls. Its terrible. I just want to have fun and go to the meets and not worry about whether or not I'm gonna be in the same room. I mean this is girl who would get upset with me when I would sit under the table at meet ups because it was too much for me at times.

I just want to say thanks to everyone who keeps responding to me and giving me ideas on how to move forward...its just so hard when I work with one of them and the same person is someone that is in the same small community of hobbyists.

 

[Kelly]

This isn't about dolls. This is about power and exclusion. Today you are the excluded one. Tomorrow it will be someone else.

Because they thrive on making someone miserable. But if YOU turn YOUR back on THEM and act like it doesn't bother you in the least that they are excluding you, if you go on to develop your own life WITHOUT them, then they have no more power over you and guess what? They may be coming back to you because if there is one thing these power queens cannot stand it is to be ignored. When you are giving into them they love it. They want to see you cry and grovel and be weak. But it drives them nuts to see a strong woman who can walk on her own.

Exactly this^

They have so little in their lives that the only way they have power and feel they have purpose is to scrutinise and mock the people they consider inferior in their chosen community.

Don't go to your ex-friend's party if it will be too much for you but DO go to the other meet. Your new friend's are really understanding right? So have a little plan in place, if you feel like it's too much and your going to cry etc then have some kind of code in place to make them aware that your not dealing and can you all leave together under the guise of having better things to do/running late for something oh so important. Or just step outside / in a separate room/the bathroom/wherever so you can take a break to calm down and try to leave/come back in smiling (even if it's a totally fake one).

Don't look at your ex-friend's, speak to them acknowledge them in any way, if a mutual friend mentions them for example they say "oh have you seen X's new doll, isn't it lovely?" you will have to try your best to be as unemotional and just respond flatly with "Oh is she here, I didn't notice, I'll have a look in a little bit, so anyway...*talk about dolly stuff*"

It could be your ex-friend has moved on and is posting about her meet the way she normally would and it just seems like she's having a poke at you. If you really want to go to her meet/party you could always challenge her behaviour head on (and publicly), basically make a post on that forum or respond to one of her threads about the meet at her house. What you need to do is ask (in a really sweet/happy/I don't give an F what you think way) if it's okay if you pop along with a couple of friends, that you know you two aren't really friends anymore but she has said it's an open invite so you thought you'd just clarify. Then she will have to publicly state yes or no and give a reason for her answer, either way she is screwed, if she says yes not a problem then you get a free pass to go to the meet at her house if she says no she will be obliged to give a reason why and what possible reason could she have that will not make her look like the ***** she is?

Oh and by the way your doll's are awesome and if anything she is just jealous because you really care about yours, make in-depth stories about them etc, she probably hasn't got the imagination or heart to be as passionate about them as you do. You are a wonderful person Arashi and she is a bitter nasty person and that means that no matter what your always the better,lovelier person

 

[Arashi222]

Wow, I never really thought about it like that. My new friends are very understanding and have been trying to help as my one friend put it retrain me with good friends. I am super apprecaiive Kelly. Thank for saying what you said about my dolls. I have been made to feel so badly about them. My new friends don't want to go to the dollie meet at her house they went the previous year when i was there too and they said they didn't even notice me hiding against the dolls and not saying a word. I want to go to the one in November but I am truly afraid to. I really have this fear about going now. I don't want to melt down while there. That is another big thing too.
As to her mini meet at her house...she hasn't posted her mini meet on the forum yet. I looked. But she did remind one of the other members who was scheduling the big meet about it and kinda pointing out that I wasn't invited. It was mean. But I can't do anything. I feel like it is soo petty. I feel so lost. I love my dolls. I care about them. To me they are real and yet I feel like I have had them all taken away from me or locked away sometimes. I feel like I cannot share them the way i used to because she made it impossible and made me feel like I'm a sick freak with screwy characters.
Kelly is right though...and Spinning compass to. I need to figure out away to not let them bug me so much...its just so hard almost 3yrs of friendship down the drain and almost 1yr of not being friends now...its sooo hard.

 

[Soup]

Hi Arashi. I read through all the comments & everyone has come through with excellent advice. The immature & high school 'mean girl' attitude of these supposedly grown women ought to be embarrassing to them. Their motives & intentions are harmful & I wholeheartedly agree with everything Kelly said about how you should conduct yourself in response to them.

As for your dolls being inferior, that is absurd. I could buy any one of these dolls I desire, Arashi. I've combed the internet & have seen some collections in person when they were at the Mc.Cord Museum. Your doll Ally remains one of my very favourites. She isn't overly painted, she isn't overwhelmed by a ridiculous $2,000 costume, she doesn't look like an over-blown fantasy character that lacks depth. She isn't wearing some stupid wig that's too thick & down to her ankles like a 1980s Barbie from a Walmart. Her face isn't so distorted that she looks like either an alien or someone with a terrible birth defect. She is soulful & unique. She reminds me of children I've known in the past & is familiar yet deep in her own thoughts & is exactly the type of doll I'd love to have.

I'd bet that many of these women's dolls are more like status symbols & show-pieces. That's fine IF that's what they're into. As for me, I like what compels me: not merely what looks flashy & expensive. Please continue with your hobby so long at your passion for it persists & never allow them the satisfaction of driving you out with their petty behaviour.

 

[Arashi222]

Thanks Soup!

Its just hard. While I collected other types of dolls before the BJD hobby. They are the ones that got me into the hobby. While I am having issues with just trying to undo the damage that was done to my characters, my dolls (though not physically). What I cannot understand is how the person who did all this damage to me would spend hours some nights telling me about how she never wanted to treat anyone the way that she treated my characters. She left me disconnected from several of my characters. I feel like I am having to work so hard and Its like with this friendship that is no more my dolls and parts of myself were connected in ways I have yet to even understand and its damaged connections i have to myself too.

I know they care about their dolls. I had pictures up here of their dolls. I can show them...I have pictures of my dolls with their dolls and they too have stories and characters but I was made to feel like my choices were always inferior that whenever I bought a doll it was oh that won't work with your collection then they would always sorta concede that I did know what I was doing. I just am having a hard time trying to not feel pushed out of something that I love. I am hoping that my new big doll when i pay her off helps.

Thank you for the compliment about Ally. A lot of people really really like her. I love them all but she does have a special place in my heart. I just need to find away to build my confidence back up and try to move forward. Its not in my nature to be head on mean to someone. Its just not, the only time I can even appear slightly mean is when I am so frustrated that I say things without thinking. But its silly I know to still want to be friends with them. I just do...maybe because I spent three years with them telling them things I never told to anyone else.

 

[Soup]

That's because you're a kind, supportive & sensitive caring person lacking in any duplicity. the lack of duplicity is one of the more endearing qualities many Aspies share with people with Down's Syndrome & William Syndrome. I consider it to be a gift. The problems occur when we encounter others who are not quite so sincere & have an ulterior motive. We can wind up being deceived, taken advantage of & hurt IF we are also sensitive & trusting.

There's nothing whatsoever wrong with your dolls, Arashi. there poeple would behave the same way whether it was dolls, yachts, Transformers or Pokemon cards: they have a character flaw. I hope they do wake up & realize that they're harming you needlessly, feel some regret over their mean behaviour & work to make amends. That is what sane people do. If they do become friends with you again, be wary of overly confiding in them: they cannot be trusted 100% with your private thoughts & feelings. Confide them to a journal or to one of your dolls.

 

[Arashi222]

My main issue is that they have told me many times during this whole process that I am a manipulative emotionally abusive person who does what she does because she abusive to get what I want when in reality I am just trying to understand what is going on and get mad and frustrated when they cannot explain. do not want to explain, or even tell me I am not feeling in said emotion. I want so badly to be their friends again. I know its silly but i invested so much time into them you know? I hope I am not the only one that has invested so much time into a friendship only to find out that they are hurting you badly because they cannot and will not understand you. I learned a lot from their friendship. Tell people first about the AS. I never thought of it as a problem in that realm for me it was always you like me because of me or not at all and leave me alone. But they at first seemed to like me. So now I left confused.

I have a protector character named Juilian he is a shadow elf (Dream of doll elf Sha, every rare). That they actually had gotten him to relax and leave me for periods of time to do other things now he won't ever leave again. He doesn't trust anyone and I feel like because of all of this I am no longer as trusting as I had worked to get when I was in therapy in high school. One of the reasons I went to therapy in high school was to work on learning how to be friends. You know those social skills that most people just automatically understand. I have had to work hard.

Thank you again for your compliments on my dolls. I just I know feel so inferior. I love my hobby but I feel like your right I need to start to let go and every time I feel I am starting to a little bit something happens and I can't. I am almost terrified of getting my new doll now in December when i pay her off as b-day present to my self. I don't want them to see her, I feel almost panicked about it. Even though they would never say anything to me anymore except the one at work that I try to avoid at all costs. But I try to write down my feelings. I try to work them out but they are so jumbled. See I told this friend something I had never told anyone not soul until her its something that I regret ever allowing my self to tell her. I feel disconnected from my characters my world basically feels like it was yanked away from me. Like she is holding some of my people hostage and I can't get them back until I find some way to lock the door on that past and move forward.

I am so glad I have you guys here helping me talk through this. It is helping a lot. I feel loads better now just writing out what i feel and getting feedback on it then from before. Oh here is my boy that is my protector just so you know what he looks like he is a bit of a shadow and can be intimidating:

 

[Spinning Compass]

I know exactly what it is like to invest a lot of time in a friendship and find out that it never was what you thought it was. It sounds like these people are projecting their thoughts and feelings onto you and then blaming you for it. Kind of like a guy who blames a girl for leading him on sexually when all she was doing was minding her own business. He's projecting onto her.

You aren't going to change these people. I wouldn't even waste my time trying. There is a saying in the New Testament about don't throw pearls before swine or give what is holy to dogs as they will just turn and trample you after trashing what you gave them. I believe that is so true. Be very guarded about what is important to you. Especially around that bunch.

 

[Arashi222]

I guess I just don't know how to stop hoping. Like you said. I invested a lot into this past friendship. Its hard to come up on the 1yr anniversary in October and still not be friends with them anymore. I just feel like I try so hard to do what she wanted but it wasn't enough. Nothing was ever enough. I tried to do what they wanted me to be able to do. I tried so many times to be more flexible but I couldn't. I was told that I was a terrible friend because I didn't understand what it was to be real friends with people. But I still on some stupid level want to be friends with her. I miss her. I miss the good times. The good stuff. I miss roleplaying with her, going to doll meet with her. I just am stuck. I hate being so stuck (I know part of it is that I work with her). the other part is she was teh first real friend I had since the death of my best friend in 2007. I hadn't had a close friend until that point I hadn't bothered to try to get closer to anyone.

I need to find someone else to role-play with, I need to find someone whom I trust again in the same way. Because I know there are good people out there. I know it. I just have to find them. Besides its hard to be told you are a freak and that you're crazy when they are the ones that cannot seem to understand a three page typed letter that explains AS and what the symptoms are and cannot understand why someone would not want to tell them right away. I am just so confused and lost. I think part of it is that I miss my best friend, and she had sorta replaced her...poor replacement...(shakes head at self). I really appreciate all the encouragement. I am still gonna keep trying.

 

[ravendragonwing]

Big hugs to you
this really sucks that you are going through this hun. I feel your anguish.
Being of the witchy side of religion too, I only have one thing: whatever you throw out there comes back 3 fold. You may never see it, but it will. I made up a little spell for people like this: I imagine myself being covered my a mirror and when someone sends negative energy my way, it bounces off that mirror and goes back to them, I chant "I rubber, your glue, whatever you throw at me, bounces off and sticks on you" Campy I know, but it helps.
At 38 I still haven't learned how to deal with people like that, and it takes very special people to be my friend, to really be my friend, rare and difficult, they are out there. Don't give up hope.

 

[Arashi222]

Big hugs to you
this really sucks that you are going through this hun. I feel your anguish.
Being of the witchy side of religion too, I only have one thing: whatever you throw out there comes back 3 fold. You may never see it, but it will. I made up a little spell for people like this: I imagine myself being covered my a mirror and when someone sends negative energy my way, it bounces off that mirror and goes back to them, I chant "I rubber, your glue, whatever you throw at me, bounces off and sticks on you" Campy I know, but it helps.
At 38 I still haven't learned how to deal with people like that, and it takes very special people to be my friend, to really be my friend, rare and difficult, they are out there. Don't give up hope.

Yes thank you. It is so hard. I am always concerned about whatever i do coming back to me 3fold. Hence me feeling so confused and unsure what I can do about it. It is a good idea. I have thought about working the elements. See you're not that much older than me and you still struggle with it too. I have some newer friends that are what they call trying to help retrain me (we joke about it) but in all seriousness they really are. They have seen the lack of confidence and fear I exhibit every time I stim, or say something or go on and on about my chosen topic or go on and on about my characters (lucky they are into the hobby too). I like your little spell for negative energy. I have one too but i work better with fire magick. I am glad that I have so many people here that are trying to help and being supportive about this. Moving forward is so hard when you see them all the time. When those that used to hang out with you at doll meets don't because they don't want to be seen with you. Seen with you because you are considered the freak. I know I have to remember that Samhain is coming up and that I can do a ritual and try to release some of this negative energy that is just killing me...I just want everyone to be happy. It takes a lot to be my friend these days too. I don't trust the way I had. I have gone back into my shell. Though being here has helped a lot of that. Hugs...Thanks you. I just am so confused as to what to do. Its so complicated that even I don't understand it all.

 

[Arashi222]

Update...Well as October has begun. I am feeling a bit sad about the not having a doll meet i can attend this month. I am not allowed to go to the one this month as it is in my ex-friends house. So I don't get to do any dollie related anything until November, plus she already said she was going to that meet. WHile the bigger meets are easier to stay away from them. It is hard on me. I go for the fun of talking none stop about my dolls and showing them off. I am proud of my dolsl even though I still have big bouts of self esteem issues when it comes to my dolls. I miss being able to go to the party. I still stupid as it is want to be her friend. I know I know that is the dumbest idea.

I am at a loss as to how to not focus or come up with something different to do for meets. I might suggest to the girl that has been planning the bigger meets if she could plan something for October. But then would that be seen as catty and bitchy? I don't know. I just want a place I can go to too. I could never have them at my house or anything my mom doesn't like my dolls and for two doesn't know how many I have currently either though I think she suspects. I am also wondering if it would be bad to suggest to the person doing most of the scheduling of meets to maybe try to do more than one meet in a month that way more people can go? I am just unsure what I can do here.