Underemployment

[The Midge]

It’s Friday. I’m sitting down with my morning cuppa on a day off. When the grass is dry I’m going to start some work on the garden and do a bit of landscaping. Sounds idyllic doesn’t it?

I would rather be at work earning enough to live on comfortably, getting a pension and that kind of thing. However, I’m underemployed. I only have 3 days paid work per week and that is about to go down to 2. I’m also working at way below my capacity. I’m doing an entry level job when I have as Masters Degree and decades of experience in my field.

One thing I have learned about being on the spectrum (diagnosed or undiagnosed) is that it seriously harms one’s employment prospects.

I know there are horrifying stats about the number of Auties who don’t work. 85% was a figure I have seen around a lot- but I think that sounds suspiciously high. I suspect that many HFA/ Aspies do work and many Undiagnosed are struggling through work. Any indication of the reliability of those statistics would and info about where they came from would be most welcome.

I suspect very many are under employed too. (that is working below their qualification and/ or less hours than they want to or could.) Any reliable statistic on this would be most welcome too!

I have been lucky to have worked full time and in a few good jobs too. However my career has lacked continuity and there have been some long gaps when I didn’t work. I have lost jobs on more than one occasion. I don’t think I have ever been offered promotion or progression without changing employer.

I’m going to have to start posting my CV on line hoping someone is looking for someone within my specialism. I’ve considered the gigging economy to get a second income but that sounds like it could be full of problems because of the unpredictability and the dependence on ratings/ networking skills and then there is all the stuff which comes with being effectively self-employed. Self-employment doesn’t work for me as I get overwhelmed with the multitasking and the thought of trying t manage employees that I would need to reach the turnover I would need to sustain a business in my sector is not realistic.

How may here are underemployed and how do you cope?

 

[pax]

I have a understanding husband, who though a lot less qualified, makes a lot more money.

 

[Katleya]

I just went from underemployed to unemployed again, so I can't really share things that help me cope, because honestly I'm still looking for those.

 

[Maiki]

Hello friends-- this gives me "all sorts of feels" when I read those posts. Discouraged is one. I do believe there is a large pool of untapped (or undertapped) skills out there in our HF-ASD population. I have been moving from temporary position to temp position within a large organization. I am working part time intentionally, and out of necessity. I may be an invisible Aspie, but the toll it takes on me to function 'normally' at my job is enormous. I've learned that I can't manage to be healthy and happy and work full time. I've got 3 school age kids. My husband works full time. We experimented with both of us working full time, but I was exhausted and unhappy. I earn substantially more money than hubby does, but his workplace does not employ any part time workers. So-- there it is. I guess I am underemployed. I am also not sure just how I will navigate my performance appraisal this week. I knowingly pulled myself out of the management stream when I went part time. Now discussions about my performance, goals and career plan are riddled with hazards.

 

[The Midge]

I just went from underemployed to unemployed again, so I can't really share things that help me cope, because honestly I'm still looking for those.

Well done on managing to do that. I think it is quiet an achievement.

 

[Mr Allen]

I just had an interview for part time sales/event management job, the company don't seem to be very organised IMO, I just had an email from Claudia asking why I "missed" the appointment? Eh? I arrived early and was in and out in 20 minutes.

Meh, I'll see if I get a message to see if I was successful, I have a lunch time meeting at the Flat tomorrow.

 

[IamYam]

I am 31.

After I finished university (22), I couldn't find work for about 2 years (24). I eventually got work in a role where I didn't need any qualifications. I did 'casual work' (employed and paid as needed) in events. About 3 years later (27).

I then went to a disability positive agency who helped me get into a pool of temps who get asked to work on a casual basis (for a media organisation). I was then asked to do a long term assignment after 2 years of this kind of work (29). This then turned into a one year contract (30) which only recently (sept 2017) turned into a full time staff position.

I think starting anywhere is key. Our kind aren't so good at interviews, people talk in interviews and don't 'do'. When I got into the media organisation where I work now, I got offered a position on the basis of what I 'do' and not how I speak.

I felt like rubbish for many years because I didn't have stable work The disability agency asked me to provide my story for other younger people who are getting help from that agency as a way of telling them how someone can make it.

Perseverance is key, and being the kind of person who doesnt say no to more work. One thing I also do at work is that I try to be as friendly and impartial as possible. I also like to be supportive of my colleagues and I look out for them with their issues, even though I don't get as much support for mine.

 

[Gracey]

Yes I suspect I have been and perhaps always will be.


I don't know what it is I would like to get out of bed and do (and be really good at it)

I seem to pick up work where I can. Any and most types of work.
Me adapting to fit into the role.
Not because it's an interest or something I was born to do but because I'm skint and need to earn some money and know I am capable of doing the job.

I don't know if I'm underemployed but I do know I can get bored and restless quite quickly.

 

[Mattymatt]

It’s Friday. I’m sitting down with my morning cuppa on a day off. When the grass is dry I’m going to start some work on the garden and do a bit of landscaping. Sounds idyllic doesn’t it?

I would rather be at work earning enough to live on comfortably, getting a pension and that kind of thing. However, I’m underemployed. I only have 3 days paid work per week and that is about to go down to 2. I’m also working at way below my capacity. I’m doing an entry level job when I have as Masters Degree and decades of experience in my field.

One thing I have learned about being on the spectrum (diagnosed or undiagnosed) is that it seriously harms one’s employment prospects.

I know there are horrifying stats about the number of Auties who don’t work. 85% was a figure I have seen around a lot- but I think that sounds suspiciously high. I suspect that many HFA/ Aspies do work and many Undiagnosed are struggling through work. Any indication of the reliability of those statistics would and info about where they came from would be most welcome.

I suspect very many are under employed too. (that is working below their qualification and/ or less hours than they want to or could.) Any reliable statistic on this would be most welcome too!

I have been lucky to have worked full time and in a few good jobs too. However my career has lacked continuity and there have been some long gaps when I didn’t work. I have lost jobs on more than one occasion. I don’t think I have ever been offered promotion or progression without changing employer.

I’m going to have to start posting my CV on line hoping someone is looking for someone within my specialism. I’ve considered the gigging economy to get a second income but that sounds like it could be full of problems because of the unpredictability and the dependence on ratings/ networking skills and then there is all the stuff which comes with being effectively self-employed. Self-employment doesn’t work for me as I get overwhelmed with the multitasking and the thought of trying t manage employees that I would need to reach the turnover I would need to sustain a business in my sector is not realistic.

How may here are underemployed and how do you cope?

If it helps, I am really sympathetic because I am underemployed as well. I tried going the route of running my own business and experienced similar similar difficulties. Despite being half way to a masters in Information Systems, I am about to embark on a career as an Armed Security Officer. Voc Rehab magically came through with the funds to do the training based on there being a real need for security beyond the basic guard.

I worked as an unarmed security officer in college. I was young then and restless to do something better. I drove a truck for a while but health issues forced me to give it up. Diabetes and tractor-trailers do not mix. Thankfully the medical requirements for my state's armed security license is only hearing and vision. Now that I am 40, I just want to settle into something that I can do easily and without too much anxiety or stress. My therapist tells me over and over that it is better to seek a life of peace versus a life of happiness. Happiness happens in fleeting moments but peace can be attained for life. I am still trying to adopt this phrase because society's message of continuous self-improvement is everywhere.

 

[Cocoa Beach]

I'm so sorry any of us had to go through this. I deal with employment challenges all the time. Now I have my own business and I struggle to find and keep help. Also, it's difficult to do business with other companies because I make the wrong impression. I work hard to do everything I'm supposed to do while they clown around.They don't do what they're supposed to do, they miss deadlines, they refuse to respond to messages, they lie all the time, they insult me, etc. Then they walk away saying I'm the difficult one. The disrespect is almost unbearable sometimes.

I'm not saying I'm perfect. Certainly, these things cause me to get angry sometimes. But even when I put every ounce of energy into sustaining a business relationship no matter what the other person does, it falls apart disastrously.

The stress of not being able to bring in help as needed is a daily burden.

 

[Aeolienne]

I’m going to have to start posting my CV on line hoping someone is looking for someone within my specialism. I’ve considered the gigging economy to get a second income but that sounds like it could be full of problems because of the unpredictability and the dependence on ratings/ networking skills and then there is all the stuff which comes with being effectively self-employed.

This radio documentary may be of interest:

Zero Hour Hero?

Jonathan's app could be a lifeline for job seekers in the gig economy. Grace Dent follows the Southend-on-Sea entrepreneur as he tries to get his app off the ground before funding runs out.

Listen or download the podcast here

 

[Mr Allen]

I am 31.

After I finished university (22), I couldn't find work for about 2 years (24). I eventually got work in a role where I didn't need any qualifications. I did 'casual work' (employed and paid as needed) in events. About 3 years later (27).

I then went to a disability positive agency who helped me get into a pool of temps who get asked to work on a casual basis (for a media organisation). I was then asked to do a long term assignment after 2 years of this kind of work (29). This then turned into a one year contract (30) which only recently (sept 2017) turned into a full time staff position.

I think starting anywhere is key. Our kind aren't so good at interviews, people talk in interviews and don't 'do'. When I got into the media organisation where I work now, I got offered a position on the basis of what I 'do' and not how I speak.

I felt like rubbish for many years because I didn't have stable work The disability agency asked me to provide my story for other younger people who are getting help from that agency as a way of telling them how someone can make it.

Perseverance is key, and being the kind of person who doesnt say no to more work. One thing I also do at work is that I try to be as friendly and impartial as possible. I also like to be supportive of my colleagues and I look out for them with their issues, even though I don't get as much support for mine.

About 3 or 4 years ago I was assigned to Remploy by the Job Centre, and they weren't that helpful IMO, I especially didn't like the bit where they said NOT to declare my disability on any job applications, I mean yeah OK in a way it makes sense, as most people on here know I've been saying for years that the UK equality laws aren't worth the paper they're printed on because the government doesn't enforce them, but that's beside the point, the likes of Remploy are supposed to be POSITIVE about disability issues.

Also, they were sending me to apply for jobs that weren't suitable, such as sorting Parcels down at the Post Office, humping heavy Parcel sacks with my back problems? How about no? Even though I've done the safe manual lifting course, all about bending your kneed and keeping the back straight, and only lifting what you know you can manage without hurting yourself.

 

[DuckRabbit]

From the Association of Graduate Careers Advisory Services (AGCAS) (2018). What Happens Next? A report on the first destinations of 2018 disabled graduates. Available at: http://www.agcas.org.uk/Latest/what-happens-next-2018Â (accessed 4 January 2019)

• Of all the disability groups, those with a social/ASD condition were least likely to be in full-time employment and most likely to be unemployed. Indeed, for this group of graduates, unemployment figures actually increased with increasing qualification level.
• Graduates (at all qualification levels) with a social/ASD condition who had obtained employment were less likely to have secured this on a permanent basis than any other disability group; this group also had the higher proportions employed on a voluntary basis.
• Compared to non-disabled graduates, at all qualification levels those disclosing a disability were less likely to be in full-time employment, more likely to be in part-time employment and more likely to pursue further study.
• At first degree and postgraduate (taught) levels, graduates with a social/ASD condition were least likely to have obtained their current employment before or during their studies

 

[LadyBird84]

How may here are underemployed and how do you cope?

*Raises hand.* Me. Or I'm about to be..
(I made a thread about it here.)
Basically decided to start working fewer hours.
How do I cope? Not very well.
I'm not sure what to do now as it turns out the field I studied in is not very suitable for me (I wasn't diagnosed at the time).
I think I could work more in a more appropriate field but since I have no experience with anything else and am older, I'm not sure who would hire me? I wouldn't even know what kind of job that would be.

 

[dhl02]

Join the club. I drive Uber Eats for money right now, but it is mostly to supplement my disability check. No way in hell I could support myself on the amount of money I get between the two. It is what it is. Life sucks, it isn't fair, and I dread what will happen to me when I lose my support network. Some people can work in positions specifically designed for people on the spectrum, but outside of those it is pretty slim pickings. Even those jobs aren't for everyone, as I have found out.

 

[Aeolienne]

From the Association of Graduate Careers Advisory Services (AGCAS) (2018). What Happens Next? A report on the first destinations of 2018 disabled graduates. Available at: http://www.agcas.org.uk/Latest/what-happens-next-2018Â (accessed 4 January 2019)

• Of all the disability groups, those with a social/ASD condition were least likely to be in full-time employment and most likely to be unemployed. Indeed, for this group of graduates, unemployment figures actually increased with increasing qualification level.
• Graduates (at all qualification levels) with a social/ASD condition who had obtained employment were less likely to have secured this on a permanent basis than any other disability group; this group also had the higher proportions employed on a voluntary basis.
• Compared to non-disabled graduates, at all qualification levels those disclosing a disability were less likely to be in full-time employment, more likely to be in part-time employment and more likely to pursue further study.
• At first degree and postgraduate (taught) levels, graduates with a social/ASD condition were least likely to have obtained their current employment before or during their studies

The link to the AGCAS report is broken. Try this.

 

[china autie]

Yes, underemployed here too.

Why not keep your job and also take on a few gigs?

The way people get around the rating system is to have their friends pretend to hire them and then rate them highly.

I don't know if I could live with that, but some people do because they have to make a living.

Or, can you write? If yes, maybe write articles or technical articles about your expertise?
Just a random thought.

 

[Judge]

Me too. At least I learned why I so tenaciously would hold onto the few jobs I've had in my life, even when they proved to be utterly toxic to me. Where in one case it took me years to bail.

For me, doing even the most complex jobs didn't seem nearly as daunting as applying for them.

Sad, but for me it is what it is. My life as an Aspie.

 

[DuckRabbit]

Society is gradually acquiring a more accurate understanding of ASC (withdrawing their projections would be the next step): We’re wasting the talents of autistic people
'We’re wasting the talents of autistic people' by Martha Gill
'Businesses weed out potential employees who have similar qualities to teenage climate activist'

"It is odd that little has been done to help autistic people into work, particularly when you consider how much this would improve those workplaces. Doing away with interviews, for example. These are barriers to talented autistic people but they are often also barriers to finding talented people in general. Studies have shown that free-form chats are useless as a hiring technique because people tend to vastly overestimate their ability to “work someone out” over a ten-minute coffee. For the kinds of technical jobs autistic people excel at, such as coding, interviews are particularly irrelevant; it’s rather like appointing the Royal Ballet’s principal on the basis of who can down a pint the fastest."

Some comments I liked:
----------------------------
Everyone has their talents and limitations. Placing people in jobs that’s require empathy who are incapable of feeling empathy is a bad idea. But placing people in jobs that require attention to detail and order who have an extraordinary focus for these things is a good idea. Horses for courses.

RESPONSE:
This is actually a common myth. Autistic people do feel empathy (as a rule). Where some of us struggle more than the population at large is in the cognitive aspect - that is in the understanding and anticipation of how others feel. Once we do understand though we have as strong an empathetic response as anyone else, sometimes stronger.

Greta Thunberg is actually a really good example of an autistic person driven to do something out of emotional concern and compassion for others. I obviously don't know enough about her to know how able she is to sense how others around her are feeling in social situations etc, but many autistic people can, even if a bit differently.

----------------------------
Judging a fish by how well it can climb a tree has been a long time problem.

 

[tlc]

I've worked at this job as an engineer for 20 years. But after long periods of dissatisfaction, I've looked around and had interviews, and learned that starting over in today's world with my conditions seems next to impossible. At my current job they know me and my strengths and weaknesses. For those reasons I have stayed.

And even at that, it's been tough to support myself comfortably. I can support myself if I strip my life down to basics, doing everything myself, fixing everything myself, driving 30 year old cars, burning wood for heat. If I wanted to drive a late model used car, pay a mechanic to fix it, pay for a repairman or contractor to fix things at home when they break, heat the house with a gas or oil furnace so I don't have to worry, have a broadband/cable TV plan with a smartphone... things I would consider a comfortable normal life, no way. I don't know how others do it, unless they're up to their necks in credit card debt.