"You're hurting me"

[krisi]

I've noticed when some people (EDITED--used to say NT's, but it can go for others as well, and also, I don't want this to be an NT bashing thread--someone made a very good point) are hurt, they tend to act out, act immaturely, and make snide, rude remarks, or give the person "the silent treatment" instead of telling the person what they are doing that is causing problems.

Knowing that I hate when people do that, I try to be direct with people and simply take them aside privately and tell them how they're making me feel. It's the easiest, simplest way to communicate something that is difficult to talk about.

Still, now I have a friend who is angry because I have told her on a couple of accounts that something she is doing is hurting me. She always insists that it is unintentional, and while I always tell her that I'm not angry (I'm really not--just hurt. And once I can communicate that, that goes away too), I also tell her that even if she doesn't intend to be hurtful, it still hurts.

When I am unable to let someone know that they're hurting me, by either telling them or acting as described in the beginning of this post, I tend to start turning that frustration towards myself in some mild physical ways, (self scratching, biting...I know it's odd, and probably abnormal even for an aspie).

How can I effectively tell someone "What you're doing is hurting me," without being snarky, yet without making them angry for being too direct?

 

[Ana54]

Just tell them you felt hurt by such and such and why. Word it diplomatically but be direct and honest.

 

[krisi]

Just tell them you felt hurt by such and such and why. Word it diplomatically but be direct and honest.

What's a diplomatic way to word things like that? I think that's where my breakdown is happening, because what has made my friend mad is me doing exactly what the first sentence says....I tell them how I felt and what made me feel that way...I really struggle with how to word things so that people don't get offended.

Edit: I try to use metaphors that they have used that both of us understand, because that creates a common ground for us to work with. But she is still gettting offended. This particular friend uses the metaphor of having "an emotional bank account" with everyone you know, and positive interactions add to the account, and negative interactions withdraw from the account. What was most recently said that made her angry was basically, "I feel like recently you've been making a lot of withdrawls from our emotional bank account, though it has been somewhat indirectly, like withdrawing from an ATM at another bank." (the specific behaviors I was referring to were consistently negative attitudes and remarks during meetings of a group we both participate in, and blowing me off when I told her I needed to talk to her--being forgotten, especially by a close friend when something is wrong, really hurts).

 

[Ana54]

You need new friends.

 

[142857]

If someone acts like that,even if I consider them a close personal friend, I have no problem with simply terminating the friendship. And from that point there is almost invariably no going back. I suspect that a lot of aspies are like this and that is perhaps why we don't have all that many friends.

Showing that you are hurt and that someone's behaviour and/or words towards you are unacceptable is something I struggle with as well. A bit like how I am terrified of dentists but all dentists think I am the best patient ever because I don't/can't outwardly show fear or nervousness.

 

[Kit]

Not another NT bashing thread because this isn't a NT thing. I do this too. I have every right to vent and let it out when I talk to my online friends. Besides why talk to people if they are going to hurt you again if they find out they actually got to you? You can't trust jerks.

Also lot of people don't like confrontations and it's hard for them to go to the person whom hurt them. I am the same way because I am afraid they won't care about me and do it more. However if they were my friends or family, then it's easier to tell them because I know what kind of people they are and I can trust them. I can trust my husband too. He would never hurt me on purpose and he always says his "sorry."

 

[gamers1700]

Sometimes if the person doesn't accept what you have to say or continues despite you telling them, it may be a good idea to just return the favor or just not be around them for a while. Most NT friends will notice when you do this, and if they care enough about the friendship they will usually ask you about it. This is just like the silent treatment, but not as rude.

 

[Kit]

I know silent treatment is a forum of bullying but I tend to do this a lot. When someone upsets me, I don't want to have anything to do with them until they admit they were wrong. After all you are supposed to ignore people if they upset you. If it bugs them so much, try and resolve the issue with me and understand my point of view and listen to me, don't play the victim and apologize and bam I am over it. I can't stand people who play the victim when they find out their victim has been talking about their issue they had with them and they instead get upset and play the victim by getting upset and saying the person talked about about them. What do they expect?

If that happened with me, I would go to that person and tell them my side of the story if their side was wrong and correct them. Sometimes misunderstandings happen and both people need to listen to each other and not play the fricken victim. Sometimes neither of them were the bad guys and they were both victims so they both owe each other an apology. Why can't people do this? I am willing to.

 

[Ana54]

It takes a long time for my bf to explain himself and sometimes I feel like he doesn't care but it's alright because it's just because he shuts down. Even if I have to wait months or a year, I can always bring it up again and then he'll realize where he went wrong, apologize and be over it. I'm starting to see that he doesn't do dirty tricks like refuse to answer my questions and then later say "It's too late now; you should have brought it up with me before." He just shuts down when he is stressed and doesn't answer me or changes the subject or just stops talking to me. He knows when he didn't listen before and now I realize that he expects me to have taken the social nuance from him that he wasn't that way anymore and so that is why I should just get over it. So I think I have unresolved issues with him when I don't. I need to pay better attention. But it really sucks sometimes. I would listen if he told me he suspected something about me, like that I did or said or thought or felt that, and I would try to explain myself.

 

[Dani Evar]

I can easily go utterly silent with people like that, just giving them the tremendous intensity of my solitude. Then, they can either be infinitely veiled or be drawn near, and nearer still, looking into that wordless mirror.

I hate the idea of hurting someone/a living being. I truly, very consciously hate it. But this doesn't mean that there are no secondary manifestations of this principle. Like, I hate war, but when, after several insults and stampedes, I have to defend the soul of my own existence, as my own child, I won't mind taking up arms just to display the living DIFFERENCE between me and the rest.

If, after mistreating me, someone pesteringly forces me to break my silence, I can sound very very rude (to typical NTs), but I'm not sorry about it, just as the thunderous storm of Nature isn't sorry about anything (this doesn't mean that Nature is intrinsically mean: it's just a singular, often brief, happening). At the same time, I usually leave no anger/grudge in me once certain ravishing anger is revealed/let loose, like a storm. After the storm of such magnitude passes, there comes an equally unique sense of serenity.

When it comes to severing ties, I can do it very spontaneously because I really have no need of the existence of supercilious others, let alone the whole world (I really mean it). At the same time, it doesn't banish true love from my heart, only certain objects/subjects are transformed away. When someone apologizes to me, I can usually be present again for him/her.

But then, again, it depends on how deep you're connected with someone. People are related to us differently, and the same can even be a lot truer among close friends. Clearly, not everyone is equivalent/uniquely satisfactory to us in the deepest archetypal domains.

I can call someone a 'friend' and welcome him/her to my silent, autistic universe (with its own secrets and pearls), if he/she is connected to me spontaneously through genuine compassion, unique awareness, and superior intelligence (or simply, at least the first two), without societal pressure and extraneous interference. Because all there is about me is found in my solitude.

Friends like that usually never ever hurt you; instead, when it gets so difficult and awkward, they will gladly give you space for both themselves and you.

Don't worry. Besides, NTs can easily 'forget' mistreatment by simply moving on, Krisi. This is in contrast to those with severe autistic fixation. When 'normal people' are hurt, they are not hurt the way we are hurt---this you should know. And when they are happy, it's also a different level of joy compared to that which an Aspie is capable of.

After all, NTs are never really 'alone' (other than just having the general idea of loneliness as painful and unacceptable), as others very easily come and go in their lives. That is, their occasional loneliness is relatively easy to overcome. They are none other than the society itself: when is the self-securing, self-befriending society ever destroyed by collective loneliness? Never, simply because it is a maximum comfortable amalgamation of like-minded mediocrities. The society is never alone, with all the collected norms, rules, and 'wisdom' they (the people) hold on to.

NTs exist that way: they always see the society first and only then a particular individual, and so the threads of relationship are logically housed and normed not by the individual's uniqueness, nor their own, but the society's established ideals. They can NOT truly, unconditionally love (accept) you the way you are in yourself. (Don McLean: "And I could have told you Vincent, the world was never meant for one as beautiful as you.")

By contrast, unique Aspies (I realize not all Aspies are 'unique' (profoundly, multi-dimensionally self-distinct), being just in the mean, non-reciprocal, prevalent range of the spectrum) always see individual, profoundly subjective and free worlds first (instead of the collective, self-stagnant society), when they connect to each other. This type of authentic connection is of course both very deeply rewarding and a lot more fragile. But where else do we find all the beauty of life quivering upon a single moment and string, other than in a single fragile, sensitive existence---such as the dew drop on a frail petal, witnessed and infused only by the morning light?

Or maybe, just welcome new, more unique friends (when and if they come). May they quietly come along soon .

 

[Ruby_Aspergic]

You just literally say, "when you do X, it makes me feel Y." No need to make it any more complicated than that.