A relation between ASD and schizotypal or schizoid personality disorder?

[risootser]

I used to be extremely introverted when I was on the lower end of the autism spectrum to the point where I didn't have any interest in other people or want to talk to anyone. Now I'm an extrovert who prefers to be around people all the time. I'm also much more open now that autistic anxiety isn't holding me back.

Something tells me that your inner thoughts and previous experiences were controlling you aka being neurotic and not being able to be yourself. Yes, CBT will help to discover true self. Getting to know someone is hard because of the persona. People can be withdrawn and anxious extroverts and that is their own adaptation to the world. Similarly an introvert can be attached to the social settings because it creates sense of safety etc. One can examine true extroversion based on energy and not based on activity.

 

[Matthias]

Something tells me that your inner thoughts and previous experiences were controlling you aka being neurotic and not being able to be yourself. Yes, CBT will help to discover true self. Getting to know someone is hard because of the persona. People can be withdrawn and anxious extroverts and that is their own adaptation to the world. Similarly an introvert can be attached to the social settings because it creates sense of safety etc. One can examine true extroversion based on energy and not based on activity.

I never heard of a withdrawn and anxious extrovert. I was introverted because I was depressed and had anxiety. I remember a personality test I took when I was younger said I was introverted.

CBT will help to discover true self.

Glad you agree. That's the main point I want to get across to people on this forum. Suffering from autism symptoms caused by anxiety that results from cognitive distortions isn't being ones true self. It's avoiding one's problems. It's so free and liberating to finally be able to be myself and I wish other people could experience how it feels.

 

[risootser]

I never heard of a withdrawn and anxious extrovert. I was introverted because I was depressed and had anxiety. I remember a personality test I took when I was younger said I was introverted.

I don't think adaptation is true personality it aligns more with persona you project.

However Carl Jung warns about using personas too much fearing that one might lose their own individuality to their persona. A study has shown that this can be true to an extent, when taking a private self-rating test there is a high correlation between how a person rates themselves and how they present themselves in public, but it is hard to tell if people are accurately filling out the test or answering what they find desirable.

Persona - Wikipedia

If a person is born with extroverted characteristics but avoids social situations it is certainly more desirable in many cases to label themselves as an introvert. It makes you feel safe in your own skin via accumulated experiences. Similarly demands of high conscientiousness in work makes you want to score more highly in this trait while it does not truly align with you but you internally fight against your own disposition given that you are low in it.

Look at photos from childhood and especially when you were a baby. Did your facial expressions communicate extroversion like wide smile? Mine certainly did. I had a huge open smile. Very expressive indeed. Much more than more socially adjusted introverts I know. I have a cousin of same age as me and we were together a lot. There are lots of photos us together and she is an introvert with less expression and withdrawn from the external stimulus but she is also very good socially. My face and demeanor is very expressive after depression. During depression I looked like a zombie - a living dead.

 

[risootser]

Glad you agree. That's the main point I want to get across to people on this forum. Suffering from autism symptoms caused by anxiety that results from cognitive distortions isn't being ones true self. It's avoiding one's problems. It's so free and liberating to finally be able to be myself and I wish other people could experience how it feels.

Since you made a point about recovery it made me to speculate about the possibility of existence of autistic personality disorder in contrast to autism.

It is like there is autistic like personality like there is OCD like personality.

People with Obsessive Compulsive Personality Disorder have egosyntonic mindset towards obsessions and are OK with it whereas people with OCD suffer from their compulsions making it edosyntonic.
Likewise if there was an Autistic Personality Disorder in contrast to Autism where Autistics live in sensory overloaded world and cannot comprehend social interaction with people condition being edosyntonic - people with Autistic Personality Disorder can cope with sensory input but have egosyntonic preferences and do not care about investing their minds into social rules. I think if there was an autistic personality disorder I could have ticked few boxes. I must admit that most of my crookedness is very egosyntonic because I do not like being controlled.

 

[Matthias]

I don't think adaptation is true personality it aligns more with persona you project.

Persona - Wikipedia

If a person is born with extroverted characteristics but avoids social situations it is certainly more desirable in many cases to label themselves as an introvert. It makes you feel safe in your own skin via accumulated experiences. Similarly demands of high conscientiousness in work makes you want to score more highly in this trait while it does not truly align with you but you internally fight against your own disposition given that you are low in it.

Look at photos from childhood and especially when you were a baby. Did your facial expressions communicate extroversion like wide smile? Mine certainly did. I had a huge open smile. Very expressive indeed. Much more than more socially adjusted introverts I know. I have a cousin of same age as me and we were together a lot. There are lots of photos us together and she is an introvert with less expression and withdrawn from the external stimulus but she is also very good socially. My face and demeanor is very expressive after depression. During depression I looked like a zombie - a living dead.

I never smiled. I think I became depressed when I was only a few months old. The same patterns occurs in neglected babies or babies raised in orphanages. They'll be very introverted during the beginning of their life but may become extroverted later in life if they overcome their depression.

 

[Matthias]

Since you made a point about recovery it made me to speculate about the possibility of existence of autistic personality disorder in contrast to autism.

It is like there is autistic like personality like there is OCD like personality.

People with Obsessive Compulsive Personality Disorder have egosyntonic mindset towards obsessions and are OK with it whereas people with OCD suffer from their compulsions making it edosyntonic.
Likewise if there was an Autistic Personality Disorder in contrast to Autism where Autistics live in sensory overloaded world and cannot comprehend social interaction with people condition being edosyntonic - people with Autistic Personality Disorder can cope with sensory input but have egosyntonic preferences and do not care about investing their minds into social rules. I think if there was an autistic personality disorder I could have ticked few boxes. I must admit that most of my crookedness is very egosyntonic because I do not like being controlled.

I found out after overcoming most of my problems that I was born with a mast cell disorder. What happens is certain triggers such as stress, pollen, high histamine foods, and milk affect the mast cells which cause mild brain inflammation which results in cognitive dysfunction and "brain fog." That would have altered how I perceived the world and the cognitive distortions I formed caused me to become depressed, anxious, and misunderstand people as well as created more stress that further impaired my brain function.

Once my stress that continually affected my mast cells went away, my autistic traits started to vary which makes it easy to tell which symptoms are caused by the mast cells. Because of that, I know the mast cells cause my nonverbal impairments, slow processing speed, sensitivity to sound, and preference for sameness and routine (to cope with the "brain fog").

My severest symptoms of autism (failure to initiate or respond to social interactions, a total lack of facial expressions and nonverbal communication, absence of interest in peers) were caused by depression. Later, when I was less depressed, cognitive distortions caused much of my anxiety, social awkwardness, and trouble understanding people (although the "brain fog" certainly contributes to it).

My point is that a mast cell disorder + cognitive distortions (which caused depression, anxiety, stress, and trouble understanding people) resulted in me meeting the criteria for autism and correcting my thinking caused me to no longer meet the criteria. Regardless of whether you think I had autism, I met the criteria, which means other people who currently meet the criteria may be able to recover like I did.

As far as personality, when I became less depressed, I started to be interested in people and wanted friends but I wasn't able to comprehend social interaction. I also had and still have sensory overload when something triggers my mast cells.

Another thing is research is indicating that maybe 1 in 10 people suffer from mast cell activation syndrome and a study found that 1 in 10 people with a mast cell disorder are autistic. That means 1 in 100, or 50% of people with autism, may have become autistic for the same reason I did.

 

[risootser]

I found out after overcoming most of my problems that I was born with a mast cell disorder. What happens is certain triggers such as stress, pollen, high histamine foods, and milk affect the mast cells which cause mild brain inflammation which results in cognitive dysfunction and "brain fog." That would have altered how I perceived the world and the cognitive distortions I formed caused me to become depressed, anxious, and misunderstand people as well as created more stress that further impaired my brain function.

Once my stress that continually affected my mast cells went away, my autistic traits started to vary which makes it easy to tell which symptoms are caused by the mast cells. Because of that, I know the mast cells cause my nonverbal impairments, slow processing speed, sensitivity to sound, and preference for sameness and routine (to cope with the "brain fog").

My severest symptoms of autism (failure to initiate or respond to social interactions, a total lack of facial expressions and nonverbal communication, absence of interest in peers) were caused by depression. Later, when I was less depressed, cognitive distortions caused much of my anxiety, social awkwardness, and trouble understanding people (although the "brain fog" certainly contributes to it).

My point is that a mast cell disorder + cognitive distortions (which caused depression, anxiety, stress, and trouble understanding people) resulted in me meeting the criteria for autism and correcting my thinking caused me to no longer meet the criteria. Regardless of whether you think I had autism, I met the criteria, which means other people who currently meet the criteria may be able to recover like I did.

As far as personality, when I became less depressed, I started to be interested in people and wanted friends but I wasn't able to comprehend social interaction. I also had and still have sensory overload when something triggers my mast cells.

Another thing is research is indicating that maybe 1 in 10 people suffer from mast cell activation syndrome and a study found that 1 in 10 people with a mast cell disorder are autistic. That means 1 in 100, or 50% of people with autism, may have become autistic for the same reason I did.

Most of my issues with social interaction is connected to my eye/vision processing. I can not interact properly because I can not even follow intricate details such as eyes. I can not spot details at all. I do not notice if something is changed in my environment. I do much better with concerta. Whole world around me is a mist.

 

[risootser]

As far as personality, when I became less depressed, I started to be interested in people and wanted friends but I wasn't able to comprehend social interaction.

Just bear in mind that socialization is not same as extroversion and need for intimate friends is an introverted trait. Nothing wrong with it. Of course it is OK to raise some traits but introversion is not an illness neither is an extroversion. Both can be detrimental when gone wrong.