Anti-fragility

[Au Naturel]

From what you wrote earlier in this thread, I am very glad you were able to successfully heal your PTSD. I applaud your hard work to overcome that and I am glad you had the right resources to help. Please just remember that not everyone's brain works the same nor is everyone's trauma or experience the same.

To me, it is not about comparing the severity of one another's trauma or autism difficulties nor making judgments on expected outcomes (Especially without having walked in the other person's shoes), but helping to get more support and compassion out there for the huge traumatic hurdles many on the autism spectrum face without the needed support, guidance, finances and expertise. IMO we need more experts better trained about autism and CPTSD along with better, affordable resources for ASD adults so a higher percentage can heal from trauma as well.

It's like I said. It was a lifetime of work, and it is still a work in progress and will probably be so until the day I die. Not everyone can go that way.

I did see a therapist briefly in my early 20s. There was a bit of the absurd where she had me beating the sofa with a bataka to get my anger out. That was fun, but anger at my parents wasn't the issue. I felt worthless. I'd spent my entire childhood being told how stupid I was and how worthless by parents, teachers, and peers. (Never mind the beatings or the emotional abuse by Mom.) I didn't see any way I could ever be of any value as a person. I'd learned the lessons well.

She encouraged me to embrace my inner child (How corny that sounds!) and to accept myself for simply existing without placing value judgments on the state of that existence. It seems that believing you are worthless prevents one from making progress. You can achieve incredible success but still feel worthless inside.

And then my freebie visits ran out, and that was that. One reason I always encourage philosophy is that I could never afford therapy. You can't pull yourself up by your own bootstraps. It is an absurd concept. You do need to grab something, though. Philosophy is a flimsy rope but it is still something outside of you to grab.

 

[Atrapa Almas]

@Au Naturel i am not looking for a figth. I am trying you not to trigger or hurt people.

On one hand you talk about therapy, which is true that helps with a good professional.

And on the other hand you talk about attitude, about chosing to let things in the past... Like it could be done consciously. As it was a matter of choice. Triggers are by definition unconscious stuff. Blocked memories are by definition unconscious stuff. Frozen, unprocessed memories are unconscious stuff.

Please, stop saying that people who suffer trauma should just change their attitude and let the past in the past. They do not suffer by their own choice.

It happens the same with clinical depression or anxiety. They can not choose to just stop feeling like that.

And a person with trauma cant just let the past in the past. Yes, they can look for help, of course. And they should.

Yes they can try to recover and work their way out, of course. With a good therapy. I agree.

But you are not just saying that.

How usefull is for a Traumatized war Veteran who wakes up in the night with terrible nightmares and axiety to read from you:

Hey! Just change your attitude and let past in the past!

Its and insult for that person. Its like spiting in their face and making them responsible of their own suffering.

Hey! Just go to therapy, solve your **** and shut up!

Do you have any idea of how much efforf, time and money takes to get out of those traumas? Do you think they have a 100% rate of success?

No they dont. And its not just a matter of attitude. People who have been broken never ever can be healed like "nothing happened" and like "past is in the past". They can at best achieve functionality, but those scars will be always with them.

I dont want to figth. I want you to stop insulting people with trauma with simplified rainbow "just change your attitude" sentences.

And I would like you to get educated by reading some of the sugested books. If you want to help others, educate yourself first.

 

[Gerald Wilgus]

Telling someone who is severely traumatized to permanently "think positive" without offering them resources that can actually help, is like telling someone with a permanent leg injury to go run a marathon without any training.

Exactly, @Luca . In reprogramming myself, I did not "think positive". Rather I was able to recognize just how I transcended constraints that others convinced me of. Being able to celebrate who I am and what I have been able to accomplish allows me the space to dispassionately recognize my life's difficulties as things that brought me to the present.

 

[Au Naturel]

Triggers are Pavlovian reflexes. A bell rings and you salivate. No thought was involved. Completely unconscious. They are still learned. They can be unlearned.

Something happens, and you flash back to a past trauma. You can learn not to flash back to that trauma. We're pretty successful at resolving PTSD among returning service people if we can get them into therapy. There are ways to get that trigger to go extinct.

Emotional debilitation from chronic abuse and the unwelcome emergence of memories is a more difficult matter. The objective of therapy is to get to a point where a person can honestly say, "I remember that bad thing happened but it no longer controls my feelings, my actions, or my life. Water under the bridge." That's the destination, not how you get there.

The methodology for doing that varies. CBT and its variants (CPT, REBT, ect.) have scientific data supporting their effectiveness. Most other psychotherapies do not. I would always rather ride the horse that has a lot of wins in a race. They all share the underlying principle that thoughts ultimately drive emotions and not vice versa.

Here's a good book on the subject of recovering from trauma.

Surviving Survival: The Art and Science of Resilience​

 

[Au Naturel]

Hey! Just change your attitude and let past in the past!

Hey! Just go to therapy, solve your **** and shut up!

Why are you trying to put words in my post I never typed? Claiming intent that I obviously did not have?

I must have stepped on a landmine.

 

[Atrapa Almas]

Why are you trying to put words in my post I never typed?

Ok, I will quote yours.

Claiming intent that I obviously did not have?

The road to hell is paved with good intents. I am sure you dont intent hurting others, but you are doing it. Thats why I have come to tell that to you.

But you seem unable to listen. YOU ARE HURTING OTHERS.

I must have stepped on a landmine.

Yeah, poor you. If it hurts, just let it in the past and have a good attitude.

Now with your quotes:

My takeaway is that the past doesn't exist anywhere but in your brain.

False. All society may be a problem for people with trauma. A raped girl sharing school with her abuser: Hey! Your past doesnt exist anywehere but in your brain.

How usefull is that sentence for her? IT IS NOT

Accept them and decide they don't matter.

How usefull is that sentence? IT IS NOT

Yup. That happened. Oh well, just water under the bridge.

How usefull is that sentence? IT IS NOT

If that airline flight is canceled or you don't get the job, getting upset over it will not uncancel. Getting upset over it is what hurts.

Hey! Were you rapes by your dad? Dont get upset over it. Getting upset over is what hurts.

How usefull is that sentence for the victim? IT IS NOT.

Instead of getting angry or depressed or fearful, look for ways to improve the situation.

Hey! Does your drunk dad hit you everyday? Hey! Just look for ways to improve the situation.

How usefull is that sentence? IT IS NOT

If there is something to be done, do it. If there is nothing to be done, keep calm and carry on.

Is your soon about to die from drugs? Hey! Just keep calm and carry on.

How helpfull is that sentence? IT IS NOT

Most of life's problems are unfixable. Accept them and move on - or don't and feel miserable.

Do you feel depresed? Feel not depressed.

Do you feel angry? Feel not.

Do you feel anxious? Feel not.

How usefull is that sentence? IT IS NOT.


You are not helping. You are hurting.

YOU ARE HURTING OTHERS.

PLEASE STOP IT.

JUST STOP HURTING OTHERS.

YOU ARE NOT A THERAPYST. STOP.

STOP.

 

[1ofakind]

It's like I said. It was a lifetime of work, and it is still a work in progress and will probably be so until the day I die. Not everyone can go that way.

I did see a therapist briefly in my early 20s. There was a bit of the absurd where she had me beating the sofa with a bataka to get my anger out. That was fun, but anger at my parents wasn't the issue. I felt worthless. I'd spent my entire childhood being told how stupid I was and how worthless by parents, teachers, and peers. (Never mind the beatings or the emotional abuse by Mom.) I didn't see any way I could ever be of any value as a person. I'd learned the lessons well.

She encouraged me to embrace my inner child (How corny that sounds!) and to accept myself for simply existing without placing value judgments on the state of that existence. It seems that believing you are worthless prevents one from making progress. You can achieve incredible success but still feel worthless inside.

And then my freebie visits ran out, and that was that. One reason I always encourage philosophy is that I could never afford therapy. You can't pull yourself up by your own bootstraps. It is an absurd concept. You do need to grab something, though. Philosophy is a flimsy rope but it is still something outside of you to grab.

From my experience, it is sad and concerning how most therapists and professionals lack understanding about the autism spectrum - even many who think they get it, don't. So, I can understand why you grabbed onto philosophy.

One of the dynamics that fuels lack of understanding is how neurotypicals project their own reasons for behavior and thoughts onto individuals on the autism spectrum. This is done because they have no 'frame of reference' for the autistic experience and don't understand the brain/processing differences. I always say that it is like trying to teach a blind person about color...there is no frame of reference to grasp the concept. This is important regarding dealing with trauma & life's hurdles as well.

What concerns me about the philosophy you grabbed onto is that it can be damaging to people on the spectrum who are truly doing all they can but it isn't enough to overcome the hurdles. Also, because this forum is easily accessed publicly, it sends the message to others that people on the spectrum just need to try harder and want to be healed.

I have seen how those traumatized by domestic violence are left in fear without needed support and safety because people minimized and/or dismissed their trauma until they are killed. I have seen the system fail people on the autism spectrum trying to get the support needed (And legally obligated) to function because it didn't seem important to them. I want to promote education and understanding so these things can be changed and more can succeed. I want people to understand that there are many traumatized people on the autism spectrum who have been trying 100% and lack the needed support because current resources are greatly lacking especially for ASD1 adults.

 

[WhitewaterWoman]

I am in agreement that there are many autists who lack the capacity, the agency, the resources to move beyond the horrible experiences of childhood. I’m reasonably sure everyone on this forum is supportive of others who have experienced abuse and neglect.

At the same time, some people have found a way to move beyond the pain of the past.

I would think we would want to provide support to those who are in pain and cheer on those who have moved past it.

And maybe, at some future point in time, something will move through you, a door may open, and someone‘s pain might be lessened through the example of others. Let’s not tamp down the success stories.