Aspergers and Religion

[King_Oni]

The use of the word lunatic doesn't do you any favors, regardless of context.

And that's all I'll say about this in this thread.

 

[Tarragon]

I didn't refer to believers as lunatics, but I actually called them sane and rational people.

They believe what has been written down. Beliefs thought up by either lunatics, those trying to sell books, or establish political goals.

Ah me...

Ok, here's my tuppence worth - forget the whole discussion! It is no good trying to talk like this here.

I'm what they label "atheists". But I have learnt to let it be with this topic. Everyone needs to cling to their version of reality. Of course, there is only one reality but arguing about it isn't going to work

I don't think it's an aspie/nt thing as it applies across the board. Admittedly, I am surprised at just how many "rational" aspies (and nt's) have religious views, but I put this down to the immense power of peer and group pressure in this area, even if aspies are less prone to social stuff. Religions have perfected their techniques over hundreds of years, and even though they all disagree with each other about a couple of topics (usually as to which religion is right), they are all masters when it comes to appealing to people using their own strengths (and weaknesses).

Personally, I take the long term view. I get great comfort from knowing just how utterly insignificant the fate of mankind is in the grand scheme of things, and nothing really matters (cosmically speaking).

I do find it disturbing to see the way people defend their own decisions (as in what to choose to believe in). This applies equally to both religious minds and non-religious minds. Personally, I'd be fine if one day the skies open and a big dude with a beard comes along and says "ha, only fooling - I'm here all along!" (though I might reserve my admiration for this entity after seeing the suffering people inflict on each other).

So, basically, it doesn't matter what people do, say, think, believe, fight for, die for. It doesn't change anything in the universe and that's where I play my trump card and stay out of the way of people who believe (or not believe) anything. I don't want to change them, or argue. Waste of my time.

People are illogical, irrational, full of their own self importance. I ignore NT's and ASD's inflicted with this curse. This goes for non religious people too. It just doesn't matter. My absolute favourite quote summing up existence comes at the end of the rocky horror picture show. It nails it precisely. It contains all the answers, and lets you just get on with the rest of your life.

I won't post or quote it directly, as (a) many religious people won't want to watch such a "degenerate and perverted show" (I quote this from a very religious person I know who described it in those exact words!!) and (b) if you haven't seen the film, then I would have to spoil the climax.


I wonder if I've managed to avoid offending anyone? Hope so. If not, them hopefully I've offended EVERYONE so I can be said to be at least inclusive!!

People seem to want to share their stuff here, which is great. Isn't it interesting to see how many different views religions have? Gosh, could it be that they can't quite make up their mind what the truth actually is??

Don't worry, I find bashing religion based on an atheist points of view equally dull and silly. All you will do is get banned or the thread closed.

I do view religions as more a sort of "social club" for people, which does actually make me puzzled when I see Aspies being part of it. But, I suppose if there was such a thing as a church for an atheist, we'd see people flock together to go to that too.

Btw, lunatics derives from the practise of worshiping the moon. Not a bad idea I suppose. Makes as much sense as anything else I've seen!

 

[ShatteredUniverse]

Ah me...

Btw, lunatics derives from the practise of worshiping the moon. Not a bad idea I suppose. Makes as much sense as anything else I've seen!

No wonder the Saiyans are "lunatics".

 

[wyverary]

This thread had better get back on topic real quick. I feel sorry for the original poster, who simply wanted to gather a little information. Links to our policy on this topic have already been posted more than once; I would hate to close a thread that can otherwise prove informative and productive.

 

[Tarragon]

I have a question for you all! Since I have known only a handful of lovely ASD people, I am curious as to how ASD people deal with the issue of religion (Christianity or not; I am a Christian UMC pastor, but I'm not trying to evangelize here, simply interested since it's one of my biggest interests, obviously!).

Did you grow up in a religious household?

No. Religion was used in the generation before my parents to evade personal responsibility for people's actions, including murder, domestic violence and possibly worse things.

What role does religion play in your life?

None at all.

Do you regularly participate in religious life, and do you do so in community with other people or in a more solitary fashion?

Not applicable. I have been to a church service several times accompanying my religious girlfriend, but found the whole experience tedious and not relevant to my life in any form whatsoever.


Have you been accepted by people of your faith, or largely rejected, or do they just find you "querky"?

I am accepted within the descriptor of being an atheist. I am not accepted by people who classify themselves as religious. I have been found "query" by all walks of life, irrespective of their religion or lack of.


What do you think of NTs and religion versus ASDs and religion?

I think the concept is rife between both types of brain structure. It seems this mindset occurs outside the scope of a nt vs ASD brain discussion.


Do you have any unconventional views--like maybe Jesus was an Aspie?!

From a religious point of view, my views are heresy. As you have asked me about my views, here they are:-

There is no link to any physical truth of the universe contained within any human religion. Religion is born out of the murky consciousness of humanity as it tries to find its way on this planet.
It is born out of fear of death, and is used to attempt to comfort people as they experience life.
... It is also used to justify actions of people, and tends to promote narrow thinking and non-logical thought.

Any insights, ideas, observations, experiences or opinions are greatly appreciated!!!!

Note to mods:- There is no exclusion from a non-religious person to answer this question. i agree that arguing is stupid and non-productive. So, I have answered the original questions as is my entitlement to do so.

 

[reveric15]

Well I apologize for starting a major debate here on AspiesCentral. I very much did not intend for this to go so far. As I had stated earlier, I am a UMC pastor (Christian Protestant) and obviously this is my interest and one of my obsessions. I am very grateful for the openness of everyone to discussing this issue, and I hope that no one has been too greatly offended by any posts made. I personally am not offended, as a former atheist who was judgmental towards those with religious beliefs. I pray we all can forgive and forget any wrongdoings that may have arisen from this thread.

What is interesting from this thread is that, although this is a cursory survey, it appears that religion does not play much greater or smaller of a role in the lives of us ASD people than for NTs. We have seen people of the whole spectrum of religious conviction, up to and including highly vocal opposition. This appears to be very similar with what we would have found given a sampling of any other segment of society.

Furthermore, the language that we have developed around our experiences with faith, be it Christian, non-Christian or non-religious, is no different from NT society. The reasons that all have cited for a life with or without faith are no different from those discussed by the NT community. In fact, we had no one who gave much thought to the idea that Jesus could be an Aspie! I would have guessed that someone would have loved that possibility!!

This was really interesting and I appreciate everyone's comments. It appears that those of us who are ASD are no more or less involved in faith matters than anyone else, that we are part of the world of faith as much as anyone else. And of course, each of us is different, so there is a world of difference between us--but it appears that wherever we fall on the faith spectrum, we will find other ASDs and NTs there with us.

 

[wyverary]

On that note, I'm going to go ahead and close this thread. Thanks to everyone who contributed and kept this civil.

 

[Brent]

Thanks wyverary for keeping this from spiraling out of control. We have a new system in place where we will ban you from a thread if you can not keep it on track. This thread ban may also be followed with warning points. Please keep this on topic and friendly.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

Thanks wyverary for keeping this from spiraling out of control. We have a new system in place where we will ban you from a thread if you can not keep it on track. This thread ban may also be followed with warning points. Please keep this on topic and friendly.

Woo hoo!!! I'm so glad threads will be able to be kept open!!!

 

[Meistersinger]

Did you grow up in a religious household? Not really. Sure, Mom and Dad took me and my brothers to the church Dad grew up in, but we were never really welcomed there. The problem stemmed from the fact that Mom was the daughter of the town drunk. Since I was almost born out of wedlock, it ended up being a shotgun marriage. Given that, we were treated as second class citizens, since Dad's extended family viewed Mom as beneath them.

What role does religion play in your life? Right now, I am struggling with some of the policies that the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America have put into place that are totally against Scripture, namely, the ordination of openly gay clergy, the sanctification of same sex marriage, and the demasculinization of the liturgy and hymnody in the church. I'm to the point of leaving the congregation I've been a member of since 1991, and have been attending and singing in their choir since 1977, as I no longer feel like they a member of the body of Christ, and have become just a social club.

Do you regularly participate in religious life, and do you do so in community with other people or in a more solitary fashion?
Not as much as I used to.

Have you been accepted by people of your faith, or largely rejected, or do they just find you "quirky"? With the older members of the congregation (those of us that are still confessional traditional orthodox Lutherans), I'm accepted.

What do you think of NTs and religion versus ASDs and religion? Personally, I think the NT theologians of the mainline denominations of today have "screwed the pooch." If orthodox, confessional denominations are to survive, it's up to those of us on the spectrum to save it.

Do you have any unconventional views--like maybe Jesus was an Aspie? My views tend to be more Orthodox mixture of Calvinist and Arminian thought, without the excesses of those, and dispensationalist, theology.



Never teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time, and annoys the pig.

 

[anja]

I was raised Roman Catholic and I feel that it plays a huge part in my life. I talk to myself a lot! But I see it more as talking to God because I feel he can understand my thoughts and so I feel happier because he understand the true me, the me i cannot verbally express to others. I love religion and the sense of belonging it brings to me. It explains so much to me and I love science too but in no way do I think it undermines God. Just my own opinion though.

 

[zurb]

Do you have any unconventional views--like maybe Jesus was an Aspie?!

A late addition:
People used to often ask "What is your favourite book of the Bible?" I very quickly learnt that "Hebrews" was the "wrong" answer, and "Psalms" is the "correct" answer. Now that I know I'm an aspie (and don't have to think the same), I'm happy to say Hebrews is back as my official favourite

 

[Structrix]

Did you grow up in a religious household? No, my family was an Anglican Easter Christian family and we went a couple of Sundays throughout the rest of the year.
What role does religion play in your life? It's very important to me and a bit of an obsession.
Do you regularly participate in religious life, and do you do so in community with other people or in a more solitary fashion? I try to go mass every Sunday (Im Roman Catholic and a convert) and extra masses if possible.
Have you been accepted by people of your faith, or largely rejected, or do they just find you "querky"? I feel rejected mostly because the church I go to is in an ethnically Cuban area of the city and so most of the congregation is Cuban or spanish speaking even though I go to an english mass.
What do you think of NTs and religion versus ASDs and religion? I haven't given it much thought. I suppose it would be the same for both groups.
Do you have any unconventional views--like maybe Jesus was an Aspie?! No, I don't. My views are pretty orthodox and I like it like that. I think that appeals to my aspie side with everything being structured, well-ordered and rules based. Mass is very much a routine and done the same way for the most part every day of the year. It lasts a specific amount of time and there are seasonal themes. I like that a lot!

 

[gouldgrl]

A late addition:
People used to often ask "What is your favourite book of the Bible?" I very quickly learnt that "Hebrews" was the "wrong" answer, and "Psalms" is the "correct" answer. Now that I know I'm an aspie (and don't have to think the same), I'm happy to say Hebrews is back as my official favourite

Okay, but I am interested to know why Hebrews is your favorite.

 

[Ericho]

A late addition:
People used to often ask "What is your favourite book of the Bible?" I very quickly learnt that "Hebrews" was the "wrong" answer, and "Psalms" is the "correct" answer. Now that I know I'm an aspie (and don't have to think the same), I'm happy to say Hebrews is back as my official favourite

It's the longest chapter in the Bible, BTW.

 

[zurb]

Okay, but I am interested to know why Hebrews is your favorite.

First, let me say that for the last couple of years my wife & I have been puzzling over whether an aspie can have the same relationship with God as an NT does. I recently realized that God often uses marriage as a metaphor for our relationship with Him. And my wife and I certainly have a relationship, and a good one, though it may be very different from two NTs. So yes, aspies also can have a relationship with God, but it may look a bit different than an NT one. I don't think God minds.

As far as Psalms is concerned, I believe NTs (maybe some aspies too?) appreciate the emotions and can relate to them. For me, as with most poetry, I can study them academically, but they don't 'do anything for me'. I'm more likely to empathize with King David from the narratives than his poetry.

Hebrews on the other hand appeals to my logic and academic side. And it helps tie the old and new testaments together. I would love to know what Jesus actually said on the road to Emmaus. I'm sure Hebrews isn't it, but it may have some similarities.

Better stop here, I think I'm still on topic, but don't want to stray too far

 

[Grumpy Cat]

I read how all of you Aspies have read the Bible and I (NT girl) totally believe in God and would like to read the Bible, but I've only read small parts. I have good intentions (my Bible is out right now with a book about Revelations written by Jack Van Impe to help me make sense of things), but no matter what I do I always find something else I'd rather be doing - like reading a murder mystery, knitting, exercising and even LAUNDRY. Any ideas of how I can get myself to buckle down and enjoy reading the Bible instead of thinking of it like a homework assignment? (I hate parables.)

 

[Atay]

Try asking yourself why you want to read it, and develop at least half a dozen reasons. They can't have to do with responsibility or it won't work (for most people). Then, identify your obstacles, and practice self-compassion for these obstacles. Then, process the sadness of the concept of not being able to meet that want. Lastly, set yourself an achievable goal. Don't try to read the whole thing. Just choose a particularly interesting part to start with. Good luck!

 

[Harrison]

Did you grow up in a religious household? No. My father was a Bon Buddhist and my mother was a catholic, although of Jewish descent. As a child I was allowed to study whatever religions/faiths I encountered with the view of making up my own mind. I ended up as a Taoist with pagan roots.
What role does religion play in your life? Taoism is more a way of living, it suits my aspie nature. The word 'tao' simply means the 'way or path' and its fluidity is what I appreciate.
Do you regularly participate in religious life, and do you do so in community with other people or in a more solitary fashion? I prefer my solitary practise.
Have you been accepted by people of your faith, or largely rejected, or do they just find you "querky"? I have no idea if I am accepted, as I do not seek acceptance. People in general find me quirky so I doubt it is because of my faith.
What do you think of NTs and religion versus ASDs and religion? I have no problem with any religion or faith as long as its followers harm no-one in the name of their belief.
Do you have any unconventional views--like maybe Jesus was an Aspie?! I believe we are spirit that chooses to experience being human. So my life is not one of spiritual pursuit but of human understanding.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

Try asking yourself why you want to read it, and develop at least half a dozen reasons. They can't have to do with responsibility or it won't work (for most people). Then, identify your obstacles, and practice self-compassion for these obstacles. Then, process the sadness of the concept of not being able to meet that want. Lastly, set yourself an achievable goal. Don't try to read the whole thing. Just choose a particularly interesting part to start with. Good luck!

Thank you! I'll give that a whirl - today actually. I hope God doesn't expect a lot in the beginning (I have to catch up on "Big Brother"!).