Biology and psychology: Testosterone and aggressive behavior in man

[Au Naturel]

From a hormonal perspective I think of a parallel with women who are pregnant. I think it's safe to say that most biological females like being women. Also, many of them who experience pregnancy enjoy the overall process. My wife is one of them. She loved being pregnant (overall). However, it was a period of time when her hormones were "off the charts" and extremely high. This resulted in a hormonally driven aspect of pregnancy that she didn't like; how it affected her mood and her emotions. She would cry so easily and without being able to stop that she'd start laughing while crying because the experience was ridiculously overwhelming. Intense level of hormones.

Now let's talk about high T for the parallel. Having extremely high natural T such as is typical in late adolescence to mid-twenties at least, is great if you have a willing sexual partner or partners because during that period you're basically a machine. If you don't have a sexual partner, high T can be extremely difficult and unpleasant. It's funny though how often men's experiences in this regard are waved off, but no one tells a pregnant woman overwhelmed with hormonal emotional activity to "just deal with it", etc.

There's a comedian named Larry Miller that was popular some decades prior. He had a joke he'd often tell that men everywhere could identify with. The premise being: "Women...you have no idea (about how sexually motivated and during that peak period, how all-consuming the sexual drive is for men). You think you know...but you have no idea."

It's just amazing how strong hormones can be at certain periods in our lives.

It is that way because if it wasn't, you didn't reproduce. You'd be shoved aside by those more driven. This dates back probably as long as sexual reproduction has existed.

Yeah. I remember being a teenager. I had a sex drive that wouldn't quit - started around age 10.

Intrusive fantasies, erections at all the wrong times, masturbating multiple times a day. It was so strong I thought I must be some perverse sexual deviant. I couldn't read the minds of the other guys, but I felt it was obvious they had a better handle on it than I did. (One boy did tell me the only reason he was in sports was to sublimate his sex drive.) I had to keep a lid on it if I was to exist in society without continual shaming or ridicule. When you do that with autism, it's called masking. (I did that too.)

Things calmed down in my later teens. It was still powerful, always in the background, looking for an opportunity. Stayed that way until my 30s. I came to see it as an internal demon.

The only thing to do for a demon is to accept it nonjudgmentally. I yam what I yam, and that is neither good nor bad other than what I make of it. I've never yet met a demon that would go away from sheer willpower. You must find ways to cope. (Some especially destructive demons have twelve-step programs built around them.) Hating yourself for it is not a way to cope; neither is hating other people for not understanding.

If you are lucky, it is something that you can build a sandbox for and let it come out to play when it's safe. Brownie points if you can make friends with it. Once you've done that, maybe you can put it to work. Demons are powerful engines, and you can harness that energy to do amazing things.

 

[Jonn]

Elevated testosterone is associated with the impulsive behavior of adolescence.

This is what I was trying to explain to some of the ppl on the other site.

Testosterone doesn't "make" you violent but instead reduces inhibitory control of violent urges.

I was researching the CONNECTION between testosterone and aggression.
There definitely is one.

Lots of reasons one might be violent other than testosterone.

CAFFEINE affects the entire emotional spectrum, including frustration levels.

Increasing testosterone above normal levels (whatever they may be) can leave you more easily sexually aroused. This applies to females too. Being aroused generally also increases testosterone levels. Nice little feedback loop there. ☺

I heard some time ago that testosterone levels drop for men after about age 30 on a "yearly" basis.
I.E., A further reduction every year.
Apparently, that was "scoff-worthy" on the other site as well. lol
I intend to look into this.

I don't think it is a fixed relationship. Every body has a different level that is normal for it and has minor fluctuations over time.

The testosterone levels aren't constant.
It is often dependent on the situation at hand.

The primary source of estrogen in men is testosterone, which is converted by the enzyme aromatase. This is why bodybuilders on steroids often develop breasts that require cosmetic surgery to reduce. Artificially boosted testosterone is also linked to an enlarged prostate later in middle age.

Interesting.

 

[Jonn]

She would cry so easily and without being able to stop that she'd start laughing while crying because the experience was ridiculously overwhelming.

I can be the same if I have too much caffeine.
True...
Or perhaps I had a phantom pregnancy and didn't realise it.

Now let's talk about high T for the parallel. Having extremely high natural T such as is typical in late adolescence to mid-twenties at least, is great if you have a willing sexual partner or partners because during that period you're basically a machine. If you don't have a sexual partner, high T can be extremely difficult and unpleasant.

Some people prefer to ignore "the science" in preference to a narrative.

It's funny though how often men's experiences in this regard are waved off, but no one tells a pregnant woman overwhelmed with hormonal emotional activity to "just deal with it", nor are they generally shamed for it or made to feel guilty because of it.

The Truth is not necessarily politically incorrect.
Some need to be educated about that.

There's a comedian named Larry Miller that was popular some decades prior. He had a joke he'd often tell that men everywhere could identify with. The premise being: "Women...you have no idea (about how sexually motivated and during that peak period, how all-consuming the sexual drive is for men). You think you know...but you have no idea."

Such is life.
Men should not speak for women...
But women should not speak for men, either.

It's just amazing how strong hormones can be at certain periods in our lives.

Some younger ppl have difficulty understanding this.
Being an older a more mature male, I have been through natural changes in life.
Unfortunately, all too often, "the arrogance of youth prevails" over reason and respect for life experience.

 

[Jonn]

Yeah. I remember being a teenager. I had a sex drive that wouldn't quit - started around age 10.

Testosterone levels peak at around age 20, so I have read.

Intrusive fantasies, erections at all the wrong times, masturbating multiple times a day. It was so strong I thought I must be some perverse sexual deviant.

My personal best was 5 in half a day. <proud>

The only thing to do for a demon is to accept it nonjudgmentally. I yam what I yam, and that is neither good nor bad other than what I make of it. I've never yet met a demon that would go away from sheer willpower. You must find ways to cope. (Some especially destructive demons have twelve-step programs built around them.) Hating yourself for it is not a way to cope; neither is hating other people for not understanding.

Evolution has made us the way we are.
We did NOT choose to be this.
Some seem to have a problem with this simple concept.

 

[Au Naturel]

This is what I was trying to explain to some of the ppl on the other site.

I was researching the CONNECTION between testosterone and aggression.
There definitely is one.

CAFFEINE affects the entire emotional spectrum, including frustration levels.

I heard some time ago that testosterone levels drop for men after about age 30 on a "yearly" basis.
I.E., A further reduction every year.
Apparently, that was "scoff-worthy" on the other site as well. lol
I intend to look into this.

The testosterone levels aren't constant.
It is often dependent on the situation at hand.

Interesting.

There's a big drop in testosterone when puberty tapers off. The drop after 30 is much more gradual.

I think the high testosterone level of puberty has to be coupled with some other factor to produce violence. Strong stimulants could do it. A significant lack of empathy has to be in place, or perhaps violence in the home. Testosterone and empathy are not mutually exclusive.

Quacks who want to sell androstenone will blame impotence on lowered testosterone levels. In older men, the main causes of impotence are high blood pressure, clogged arteries, loss of arterial valve function, and medications. In particular, the drugs used for treating an enlarged prostate cause ED.

 

[Jonn]

There's a big drop in testosterone when puberty tapers off. The drop after 30 is much more gradual.

Testosterone levels generally peak during adolescence and early adulthood. As you age, your testosterone level gradually declines — typically about 1% a year after age 30 or 40.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-...th/in-depth/testosterone-therapy/art-20045728

 

[Kayla55]

Survival mode is No. 1

There was findings that in nature when shortage of males, females will compete firstly for food, then to reproduce. In these events oestrogen can make females highly competitive and even agressive.

Another interesting idea is that when female doesn't have her needs met, she will go hunting to replace men. (Survival mode) when males also more interested in no strings attached young girls tend to also learn fighting techniques, and defend themselves just like female species in the wild. Given that most males receive training from others there isn't an indication that testosterone makes more aggressive, it's if one animal can overpower another they will, there are females who behave like this amongst each other, when trained to actually fight then we observe aggression.
So yip, hormones are for procreation.

That's a fact. "'Roid rage" is caused by artificially elevating testosterone levels beyond anything natural. Elevated testosterone is associated with the impulsive behavior of adolescence. Testosterone doesn't "make" you violent but instead reduces inhibitory control of violent urges. (Lots of reasons one might be violent other than testosterone.)

Increasing testosterone above normal levels (whatever they may be) can leave you more easily sexually aroused. This applies to females too. Being aroused generally also increases testosterone levels. Nice little feedback loop there. ☺

I don't think it is a fixed relationship. Every body has a different level that is normal for it and has minor fluctuations over time. (Guys have the most in the morning.) Your body "knows" what's normal for you. When testosterone floods your system, things get out of whack.

The primary source of estrogen in men is testosterone, which is converted by the enzyme aromatase. This is why bodybuilders on steroids often develop breasts that require cosmetic surgery to reduce. Artificially boosted testosterone is also linked to an enlarged prostate later in middle age.

Survival mode is No. 1

There was findings that in nature when shortage of males, females will compete firstly for food, then to reproduce. In these events oestrogen can make females highly competitive and even agressive.

Another interesting idea is that when female doesn't have her needs met, she will go hunting to replace men. (Survival mode) when males also more interested in no strings attached young girls tend to also learn fighting techniques, and defend themselves just like female species in the wild. Given that most males receive training from others there isn't an indication that testosterone makes more aggressive, it's if one animal can overpower another they will, there are females who behave like this amongst each other, when trained to actually fight then we observe aggression.
So yip, hormones are for procreation.

 

[Kayla55]

Prime example is also rats in captivity, if male has too much sex his testacles swell, and that's why rats look like that!! Must have a gene pool as well. So if there isn't a few other dominant males in captivity it's a problem. Also a sperm drop. So concept of one alpha male doesn't exist as there always few top males.
That's in animal kingdom.

 

[vergil96]

When I started to take a certain hormonal medication, it caused several things in my brain for the first 2-3 months of use. It made me blow up easily, I could go from calm mood to rage in a finger snap. It also caused increased drive and withdrawal felt like I bacame a flat tire. It all regulated itself without effort on my part after said 2-3 months, all that is left now is that I have more stable drive and no hormonal mood lows like I used to. So idk, just my three cents about the ability of the brain to adapt to neurotransmitter levels. Impulsive displays of emotion are caused by changes in hormone levels, not by the level of hormones themselves. This is why teenagers have mood swings - their brains haven't adapted yet and haven't balanced themselves yet. "Roid rage" in bodybuilders results, at least in my opinion, from the fact that they do so called "cycles" in which their hormones fluctuate a lot. Also, they use doses above the physiological levels of male hormones, their blood test results can be a few times above the upper limit of the norm, so hell knows what kind of impact it can have, the human body isn't made to deal with that. So to sum up, hormones by themselves promote certain personality traits and drive, and rapid changes in them cause outbursts of all kinds of feelings.

 

[Dagan]

Truly, some of the testosterone supplements may as well be called, "come at me, bro."

 

[Jonn]

This is why teenagers have mood swings - their brains haven't adapted yet and haven't balanced themselves yet.

Agreed.
Another aspect is that these feelings are new, and a learning process is involved.

So to sum up, hormones by themselves promote certain personality traits and drive, and rapid changes in them cause outbursts of all kinds of feelings.

Sounds reasonable.