Fed up with other thinking they have aspergers

[2Fragile2TakeCriticism]

No autistic person is the same so i try not to judge people. For example if someone who does not know my past was to see me now they would not believe i am autistic.

You don't know the amount of work someone has put in to "seem normal" you dont know that person, just what that person shows you, so it is best not to judge.

I see a lot of autistic people running their own business, have families etc. And they seem super normal and adult like compared to me. But obviously i dont know them so i cant make a judgement on them. In fact if they are not a psychiatrist, no one can.

I definitely agree. Simply undermining self-diagnosis does many a huge disservice and is especially dismissive to women and people of color as their struggles of autism and other disabilities are different compared to white men.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

Keep in mind nobody admits to having a two-digit IQ. even through by definition half of us do .

 

[Atrapa Almas]

Have you heard of Munchausen Syndrome? It’s often dismissed but very real.

Now I have. I didnt know it was named that way.

I wonder if someone would fake a condition to be bullied rather than been taken care. Who knows, people do all sort of things.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

They fake it as they see the gifts some of us were given and wish to emulate. I was never bullied my personality is like a honey badger do not screw with me.

 

[Ken]

As soon as I say something, like: I need to have a routine with food etc, the one I am talking to, interrupts me and says: wow, I am like that too; I think I have aspergers. Yet, clearly that person does not have it!

I struggled for years to receive my official diagnosis and it really frustrates me when others hit out randomly with: ah, I have that as well.

I would love to meet someone who has the same condition, since being around neurotypicals, is hard work, but I get so aggitated, when those who do not have aspergers, try to push that they do, only because of one trait.

Many neurotypical portray similar traits, but that does not mean they have aspergers, as it is like a fine tuning.

I was in a rare chat with two spiritual sisters yesterday and found it fascinating listening to them, as they really do speak a different type of language to me. Whereas, a lady I am helping to understand the Bible, she truly does get me and I feel astonishingly comfortable around her. She does not have aspergers, but sure does exhibit many traits and her daugher has ADHD. I said I felt jealous of her daughter, having a fantastic mum!

Yea, I get that a lot. I have always interpreted that as a "wave of the hand" dismissal. I find it insulting.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

Even my wife jokes with me that she has some Aspie traits and she does, but an aspie that does not make.

 

[LadyS]

I know individuals as @Suzanne has described. Also have a couple of friends are similar to the term "perpetual victim". One of them constantly has to one-up everyone (especially me) on "who has/had it worse". Another actively uses her "victimhood" for attention, and has now lost half of her friendships because of it.

I've known these two nearly my whole life - know their families and they've openly shared all their issues, so it isn't a matter of judgment. They've both openly admitted to being insecure, worried about what others think, and emotionally needy.
Contrary to what others here have said, there are people out there who try to connect to others through less than genuine ways because of their insecurities. Unfortunately it does minimize those who actually have to work through their stuff just to function day-to-day.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

I spend most of my time thinking how does the universe work and considerably less time on how other people work I suspect many here share similar attributes.

 

[2Fragile2TakeCriticism]

Yea, I get that a lot. I have always interpreted that as a "wave of the hand" dismissal. I find it insulting.

How is it an insult/dismissal when someone who is masking their behavior trying to relate with your problems? If there’s any dismissal it’s actually the people who claim “you don’t look autistic” but get insulted when they’re told similar.

 

[MNAus]

Personally I wouldn't ever judge an individual, but that doesn't mean I disregard this phenomenon. In a rather poor analogy you'd never accuse an individual, a priori, of being a criminal, but crime does exist. And it has consequences. Trying to get a speech path, OT or psychologist for the kids is near impossible. So another year goes by as they miss keys parts of their childhood while we wait for the thousands of kids who actually aren't ASD but are displaying all the hallmarks of crappy parenting. I don't want to say what their actual problems are, because my kids deserve privacy, but their lives are materially affected. When we get to see a specialist they are clear "we turn no-one away, but half the kids here don't need to be here"

 

[ra49]

Agree.

1. These sorts of comments are minimizing.
2. I think the intent, though, is more altruistic. They just want to connect with you in some way. They don't have the perspective that we have, so at the very least, it's an innocent social faux pas. Many just don't know that what they said is going to be taken as an insult.
3. There are ways to explain a "condition" (ASD-1/Asperger's in this case) to a person like this. I will often explain that many people, from time-to-time, may exhibit isolated "autistic-like" traits and behaviors. This is normal. What isn't normal, and qualifies as a diagnosable condition, is the persistence of a group of traits and behaviors.
4. Yes, there are a few people out there that disregard any sort of neurological condition as if we have full control over our behavior, and that autism, ADHD, PTSD is simply a label for "weak", undisciplined individuals who just want attention or an excuse for their lack of self-control, or worse, want to "sponge off of tax payers" like a parasite. These people do not believe in "disabilities", nor do they have any interest in understanding. Their attitude is "Quit your whining and get to work, because I'm not paying your way." Obviously, I've heard these sorts of statements before.

Dx also requiring many more than 1 or 2 indicators, and not just persistence over years but continuously negative (as compared to "normal") impact or effect in our lives

 

[Aspychata]

Everybody hates that word in my family.

 

[The Pandector]

I’m self-diagnosed. Don’t know the group perception, but I see myself nailed when the DSM says ‘severe and pervasive.’ We can reflect endlessly about sociability, IQ, verbalization, but every autist agrees that every autist is different. Further, (though I missed its mention here) age is a factor.

We’re all different. What’s the same? I dunno, but I know that whatever it is is severe, and it’s pervasive. It seems that, truly, every waking hour as long as I can remember, I asked myself at least once, why am I so different, so isolated? My observations, values, judgements are all at odds. What secret have I missed that would end this aloneness? I found the answer at 68, but still no solutions.

I was thrilled to find an online community of people like me, where I could be understood, even if a lifetime later. What a heartbreak to find so few anything at all like me. A return to desolation. Does that sound dramatic? If anything, it’s understated.

My severe isolation is the single thing that I most identify with autism. I cannot imagine a gregarious autistic person; in my world, those descriptors are mutually exclusive. Period. Yet, I’ve read a number of comments from autists who feel they are socially adept. I find a high IQ useless in constructing relationships, but to some autists it comes naturally.

I had somehow expected people like me. Which, in my world, passes for comical irony, because it’s also my conclusion that autistic people suffer because the NT’s of the world expect people like them.

 

[Porky]

Yea, I get that a lot. I have always interpreted that as a "wave of the hand" dismissal. I find it insulating

Same, but not sure the intent is always to insult. If folks knew the depth of a particular struggle, I'm sure they wouldn't be so quick to dismiss, trouble is only aspies really know and even on this forum I get a sense many people don't want to see themselves as disabled, yet regardless of our 'gifts" and "differences" our brains are very vulnerable if left to fend for ourselves in the NT jungle. If you don't know you don't know, then how can you know you don't know? Eventually someone has to take you by the hand. Friends are so important aspie and NT. Be kind and maybe don't miss the chance to connect just a little bit everyday - neuroplasticity is a thing.

 

[kenaij]

There comes a point where I have to disagree with a few things.

First of all, self-diagnosis IS equally valid as official diagnoses, because everyone has a struggle. Of course, of the entire population diagnosed with autism, no experience is the exact same. And misdiagnoses may also exist because even if the diagnosis is incorrect, it can also mean that an individual is possibly struggling with another disability that’s brushed under the rug.

Second, to undermine self-diagnosis and deem it as “not truly a diagnosis” is to dismiss the experiences of working class individuals and women and gender non-binaries who may also have possibility of having the disability. Some people simply cannot afford enough money for medical treatment, while women’s symptoms of autism are much different from men’s because they’re expected to mask their behavior in order to fit in to the nt society. It should also be noted that if not, women, especially women of color who freely express themselves are unfairly judged as hysterical and moody (i.e. the angry black woman stereotype). This stigma is the main reason why economically privileged cisgender white men are more likely to receive an official diagnosis, while outsiders are either shut out or have to work much harder to achieve one.

Third, judging someone for self-diagnosing is unfair in itself. While I do agree that the phrase “we’re all a little autistic” is inaccurate, it should also be noted that viewing a person as not struggling at all for appearing to be “normal” is also wrong. No struggle is the same. No version of “normal” is the same. I’m guilty of scoffing at people for supposedly making a big deal out of something I lack the understanding of, but a lot of times to them, their struggles are valid regardless.

So in summary, to assume that self-diagnosis is not valid but selfish and trendy is to engage in negative generalizations, prejudice, and isolation.

I hope I haven’t offended you or anything, as this is only my opinion.

I never stated self diagnosis is either selfish or trendy. There are simply too many factors to consider which I have not studied to claim I`m autistic based on my feelings and things I recognise. I feel very close to the general experience autistic people seem to have. So I assume I`m autistic. But I cannot claim I`m autistic because I was not diagnosed with being autistic.

Let's try an example. I might have certain signs of being physically sick. I might put the symptoms in a google search bar and find it are general signs of colon cancer. I might view a couple of youtube videos where I can relate my symptoms for 90% with that of colon cancer. However. In reality for it to be colon cancer 2 more factors need to be met. So there is still something wrong with me, I`m still sick which causes me to have symptoms. But I do not have cancer. Which only a medical proffesional could tell me with certainty.
In short. I`m not saying someone that is self diagnosed is not struggling, nor am I claiming they are fully Neurotypical. All I`m saying is you cannot claim to be autistic for yourself. Because your knowledge of autism simply is not good enough. Not like someone who has actually studied autism.

For me. A lot of the things that seem to help autistic people seem to help me. But since I do not have an official diagnosis (which I understand could be a wrong diagnosis) I cannot call myself autistic.

I understand you think I`m very privileged as a white male. And in a medical sense that might very well be true. It does not however have anything to do with my point. If the aspects of autism in other subgroups are so different. It actually makes them very much less likely to correctly self diagnose. One would assume specialised medical proffesionals have the same, of not better, information about autism than the general public does. Again. I do not claim people in this subgroup do not struggle. But the only way to claim your autistic is to get a diagnosis by someone who knows what they are talking about.

 

[2Fragile2TakeCriticism]

Personally I wouldn't ever judge an individual, but that doesn't mean I disregard this phenomenon. In a rather poor analogy you'd never accuse an individual, a priori, of being a criminal, but crime does exist. And it has consequences. Trying to get a speech path, OT or psychologist for the kids is near impossible. So another year goes by as they miss keys parts of their childhood while we wait for the thousands of kids who actually aren't ASD but are displaying all the hallmarks of crappy parenting. I don't want to say what their actual problems are, because my kids deserve privacy, but their lives are materially affected. When we get to see a specialist they are clear "we turn no-one away, but half the kids here don't need to be here"

I don’t want to argue about this view but I feel the need to disagree on a few things. Just because there are thousands of other kids that don’t have ASD doesn’t mean they’re completely fine. They may have symptoms of perhaps other disabilities deeply affected by bad parenting (PTSD, anxiety, depression, etc.).

There are even many parents who drag their kids to therapists and believe something’s wrong with them and assume they know what exactly it is. It’s worse knowing many of these young kids don’t choose to come there in the first place, just some snotty parents who act like they need to justify their actions toward their “problem children”. And it’s sad knowing these kids are too young to make decisions on their own because their parents are brainwashing them to believing they’re crazy. One should NEVER dismiss these kids’ problems, it is all a misdiagnosis, and they deserve to be addressed.

I need to point out as a person with autism, my behavior is much different as a woman, because I tend to mask my traits in public. So to claim “you are not truly autistic, you do not need to be here” is dismissive towards women in the spectrum. These kids deserve this kind of attention, one simply cannot dismiss such a case when acknowledging thousands upon THOUSANDS of other kids whom you don’t know the personal lives of. Some of these kids might in fact be masking their behavior and be struggling with another disability.

Honestly, the so-called fake diagnosis is just a way to hurt children and guilt them into believing they’re the problem.

I had several symptoms of depression and hearing the controversy on self-diagnosis makes me constantly question myself whether I am just being selfish and attention-seeking. It gives me the notion that I will never belong because of the community’s hypocrisy and lack of awareness of recognizing disabilities in minorities. It’s sad and disgusting.

 

[2Fragile2TakeCriticism]

Same, but not sure the intent is always to insult. If folks knew the depth of a particular struggle, I'm sure they wouldn't be so quick to dismiss, trouble is only aspies really know and even on this forum I get a sense many people don't want to see themselves as disabled, yet regardless of our 'gifts" and "differences" our brains are very vulnerable if left to fend for ourselves in the NT jungle. If you don't know you don't know, then how can you know you don't know? Eventually someone has to take you by the hand. Friends are so important aspie and NT. Be kind and maybe don't miss the chance to connect just a little bit everyday - neuroplasticity is a thing.

It should be noted that no struggles of autism (and any other disability) are the same. One simply cannot assume that they’re not “truly autistic” if they don’t mark specific traits. Because disabilities are not a one-way-only condition.

Claiming self-diagnosis and relating to other disorders is an insult/dismissal to relate to others with the same disability that are far different symptoms based on identity is ITSELF an insult, because it ostracized women and racial minorities from participating in discussions on their own experiences with autism and whatnot. It’s especially insulting since a lot of these so-called fakers, especially on social media, are women and racial minorities. And when white patriarchy views those groups as inferior human beings because they don’t “belong” in communities where white men are dominant.

This is pretty much what’s going on. Many times the resentment towards self-diagnosis and “faking mental disorders” is literally just a facade to disguise misogyny and racism, especially when those groups are often overlooked and even marginalized by health professionals themselves. And that’s what I believe to be truly scary.

 

[MNAus]

I don’t want to argue about this view but I feel the need to disagree on a few things. Just because there are thousands of other kids that don’t have ASD doesn’t mean they’re completely fine. They may have symptoms of perhaps other disabilities deeply affected by bad parenting (PTSD, anxiety, depression, etc.).

At no point do I blame these kids

There are even many parents who drag their kids to therapists and believe something’s wrong with them and assume they know what exactly it is. It’s worse knowing many of these young kids don’t choose to come there in the first place, just some snotty parents who act like they need to justify their actions toward their “problem children”. And it’s sad knowing these kids are too young to make decisions on their own because their parents are brainwashing them to believing they’re crazy. One should NEVER dismiss these kids’ problems, it is all a misdiagnosis, and they deserve to be addressed.

Yes, yes they do need to be addressed, and they're not. At no point do I dismiss their problem, but what I can't ignore that this system and zeitgeist is enabling this. Yes, they need help, and the willingness of society to allow them to be informally misdiagnosed by their family does the opposite.

I need to point out as a person with autism, my behavior is much different as a woman, because I tend to mask my traits in public. So to claim “you are not truly autistic, you do not need to be here” is dismissive towards women in the spectrum.

I don't really understand why you'd take this tack to be honest. I'm autistic, my son is autistic. But so is my daughter, my aunt, my sister, two nephews and two nieces... plus a bunch of cousins. I'm certainly not dismissive of women, and I find it a bit tawdry that you'd level that at someone. We're all better than that here, please don't do that. Let's leave this at this point, I'm not prepared to have a conversation with this kind of shaming being levelled at me. IF you even had the first idea of how hard I fight for my girl you'd not be so rude.

It’s sad and disgusting.

I've spent too much of my life being told I should be ashamed. Time to stand up to it.

Not going to be shamed. Sorry.

 

[vergil96]

Hm, I haven't had these conversations with people yet. It looks like they're trying to be supportive and show understanding, and what they say doesn't sit well with the OP. As for people claiming to have autism... I haven't actually been in these conversations. At least IRL. On the internet, it seems like people think they have autism, while they're socially awkward, but it can have lots of different reasons. Socialisation is learnt, not inborn, so under bad circumstances, someone might not learn it. Or if they have ADHD they might also have some similar symptoms and may appear awkward. Idk, just thoughts.

I believe it might have been just an overgeneralization and bad wording, but I don't think someone should be dismissed as not autistic just because you can't see it. It takes in-depth diagnosis or lots of self-reflection to actually know you're autistic if you don't appear so at first sight for whatever reason, be it masking or just not having symptoms obvious at first sight. It doesn't mean autism doesn't affect someone in ways that aren't immediately visible.

 

[2Fragile2TakeCriticism]

At no point do I blame these kids


Yes, yes they do need to be addressed, and they're not. At no point do I dismiss their problem, but what I can't ignore that this system and zeitgeist is enabling this. Yes, they need help, and the willingness of society to allow them to be informally misdiagnosed by their family does the opposite.


I don't really understand why you'd take this tack to be honest. I'm autistic, my son is autistic. But so is my daughter, my aunt, my sister, two nephews and two nieces... plus a bunch of cousins. I'm certainly not dismissive of women, and I find it a bit tawdry that you'd level that at someone. We're all better than that here, please don't do that. Let's leave this at this point, I'm not prepared to have a conversation with this kind of shaming being levelled at me. IF you even had the first f***** idea of how hard I fight for my girl you'd not be so rude.


I've spent too much of my life being told I should be ashamed. Time to stand up to it.

Not going to be shamed. Sorry.

Dear god, you assume I’m being rude all because I’m calling out the societal stigma of mental health issues against minorities.

To be specific, I’m not being “tawdry” as you call it, I’m actually referring these problems about women in families of color and of working classes. I should’ve probably been more specific, my bad.

That doesn’t mean I’m being dismissive towards you and your kids. Your struggles as well as your kids are especially valid. What I’m actually trying to say is that when misdiagnoses are occurring, they’re usually dismissed upon due to race, sex, and class.

I am also well aware that you are not dismissive of such people as well, but it’s be best if you acknowledge the harmful impacts of racism and other forms of oppression when it comes to medical care being ignorant of individuals who are masking their traits and don’t recognize they’re actually struggling.

I hope this clears some misunderstanding.