Germaphobic

[SimonSays]

We have a new tenant in the house. He seems like a typical bloke. He's not as bad as some, but he's not up to our resident Germaphobic’s requirements. She lives next door to us, and needs things particularly clean. She will leave notes on the bathroom door, telling someone what she needs to happen, attempting to train the errant miscreant: please clean the floor after you shower. Please clean the sink as I keep finding hairs, etc.

Not everybody cleans so well after them. She's far from perfect too. I found a few very curly black hair’s in the sink the other day, which can only come from her, but I don't make an issue out of it. Instead of allowing things to be, she has to have things changed to feel comfortable. She left a note for a previous tenant who would sometimes leave his empty shampoo bottle on the ledge without putting it in the bin straightaway, and asked him to do so. He refused and left them all there indefinitely after that.

I don't like seeing notes on the bathroom door… I don't want to see her thoughts every time I go to use it, but I don't expect her to take it down so that I feel better about it, and she's not talking to me anyway. Hopefully for her, he gets the message, and eventually she'll take the note down once she's satisfied.

I can only imagine how much these things bother her, because she can't stop thinking about them and feeling anxiety over them. To me it feels like quite a judgemental state, and that creates suffering. It's a neurotic OCD and challenging to live around.

While I'm not unsympathetic, and am willing to make an effort, she doesn't seem to understand that other people aren't like she is. She will make a big deal about what other people do or don't do, and then leave her unwashed dishes and frying pan on the counter, for a day, before washing them up.

I don't like being confrontational, not unless it's absolutely essential. It's not absolutely essential I point out the hypocrisy in expecting others to be cleaner than they are, while she leaves unwashed dishes lying around. It feels like all her life she's had people adjust their actions to suit her and has acquired a sense of entitlement (she's a university student).

I always clean up and put everything away when I use the kitchen. I leave the bathroom as I found it, or cleaner. When she asked me unexpectedly the other day if I'd used her toaster (she doesn't like anybody touching her things and I never have) and I told her I didn’t, she was so sure it must have been me she had to ask twice. “So you didn't heat up your (whatever the food item she said was) on it?” “No.” I replied again. The fact that she asked the question twice suggested she didn't believe me. It's not nice to be thought to have done something that you haven't, and in court you are innocent until proven guilty. I think I've been guilty in her mental court a few times since she arrived.

The thing I don't do any more, even though sometimes I still feel like I want to, is want everything around me how I prefer it. I used to be able to do that. And my first wife was more than willing to accommodate me. But this was not good for my ego, and a sense of expectation and entitlement ensued over the years, contributing to the issues we had. Once you get used to having your way it's very difficult to let go of that. I still feel it within me sometimes.

 

[Gerald Wilgus]

A friend that I tolerate by not letting it bother me is OCD. She perseverates about the oddest things. The day after i get home another friend is celebrating his birthday and we are getting together at his favorite restaurant. The OCD one started complaining that it will interfere with an optional zoom meeting that she has a tendency to filibuster on and besides there may be a HS concert at the same time. Nobody is accommodating that. The other aspect of the OCD is the inability to tolerate making a mistake. Once on a canoe day trip she broke down sobbing because lunch was left at home, and despite stores nearby where provisions can be purchased.

 

[Atrapa Almas]

I don't like being confrontational, not unless it's absolutely essential.

Is having a non confrontational conversation a choice?

It's not absolutely essential I point out the hypocrisy in expecting others to be cleaner than they are, while she leaves unwashed dishes lying around.

May she have a diferent cleaning category for bathroom and kitchen stuff?

Offtopic: I will no longer consider renting a passive income.

 

[SimonSays]

Maybe she has a diferent cleaning category for bathroom and kitchen stuff?

Yes, I would imagine that is probably so.

I don't have a conversation with her because she is quite young, a lot younger than my own daughter.

I have spoken to her before, when she first came here, but I don't like to. If I were to open that door, I fear I will open the door to more of her issues coming in. It's why I say something on here instead.

 

[Judge]

Sad. It sounds like the woman may in fact have OCPD rather than merely OCD. Having OCPD is where one may be intolerant of conditions and situations beyond their actual control, yet they are compelled to act on them anyways. I'm always reminded of the tv series "Monk", where Tony Shaloub is in a doctors office waiting room having to rearrange the chairs that vex him. In the real world, such behavior can get one into trouble sooner or later.

Indicative of how I recognize that my own OCD does not extend to this extent. That I can contain such compulsions exclusively to my own environment for which I have care, custody and control over. Sure it makes me quietly cringe how my relatives choose to live. But that's for them to deal with- not me.

However for those with OCPD, they have no such control, no matter how many times you may emphasize domains of private property. I'm inclined to think that one is wasting their time attempting to regulate such a person's traits and behaviors that are pathologically a compulsion- not a choice. That you cannot reason with them. That you just learn to ignore them, as cruel as it may sound.

As someone with OCD, I try very hard to keep it all to myself. So much so, people are more apt to consider me to be "eccentric" without figuring it out. But then I'm not a germophobe either. My brand of OCD involves other issues, thank goodness. Put to a real test many years ago in frequently taking care of my girlfriend's daughter ages 4 to 7. -But I survived.

Trying to reason with such a person is just as pointless as it would be for everyone to submit to her standards of hygiene.

Neither is ever going to happen. That in the end it is her who loses in such a standoff. Where it should be her life's mission regardless of the obstacles to seek living conditions for which she doesn't have to share any space with any person.

 

[SimonSays]

Trying to reason with such a person is just as pointless as it would be for everyone to submit to her standards of hygiene.

Exactly. I didn't consider OCPD but it does make sense, and maybe explains why I don't want to say something. On some level I knew there's no point. It's not something she can do much about. I don't want to make things an issue.

 

[Judge]

It not something she can do much about. I don't want to make things an issue.

Ultimately it must be she who seeks real help, with no guarantees that such behavior can be altered or improved.

 

[Atrapa Almas]

Yes, I would imagine that is probably so.

I don't have a conversation with her because she is quite young, a lot younger than my own daughter.

I have spoken to her before, when she first came here, but I don't like to. If I were to open that door, I fear I will open the door to more of her issues coming in. It's why I say something on here instead.

Its important to have fears into consideration.

Im glad that you have this forum to vent.

 

[Tom]

As long as she wasn't messing with me much I would probably see it as a potentially beneficial (and possibly humorous) situation. Since she is an agressive enforcer of sanitation in a shared bathroom I wouldn't have to worry about it. I don't like germs much either. Unless it backfires and people pushback by being purposely gross. The last thing you want is a mad pooper.

 

[SimonSays]

Since she is an agressive enforcer of sanitation in a shared bathroom I wouldn't have to worry about it

Yes. There are some perks to it as she cleans it a lot.

Unless it backfires and people pushback by being purposely gross. The last thing you want is a mad pooper.

Lol. She would've hated the man who was in her room before her. He would leave the bathroom in a right state, and whatever came out of his rear end, would emerge with such force it would leave splash back residue on the underside of the seat and he wouldn't clean it!!

 

[Judge]

He would leave the bathroom in a right state, and whatever came out of his rear end, would emerge with such force it would leave splash back residue on the underside of the seat and he wouldn't clean it!!

That's ok. The reality being that she would be compelled to clean it all on her own. Each and every time. No matter how many times she complains and no one does a thing, she'll be there to methodically clean it herself.

Over and over and over again. She can't stop...whether it bothers her or not.

No differently than how many times I have to check a lock that has been already locked. Or to make sure my corner chair in the living room is turned precisely 45 degrees facing my reclining sofa. It's no fun having such irrational compulsions.

 

[SimonSays]

It's no fun having such irrational compulsions.

It doesn't sound it.

May I ask you about your experience?

For instance...when you are checking a lock you have already locked and checked, you also know you have already checked it and it was locked, yet still feel compelled to check it again, just to be sure again. And for a moment there is relief? And then at some point that compulsive feeling returns, and you check again to feel relieved again, and yet you always know it is locked, just as it was the last time you checked, and yet you still check. Is this what you go through?

 

[Judge]

It doesn't sound it.

May I ask you about your experience?

For instance...when you are checking a lock you have already locked and checked, you also know you have already checked it and it was locked, yet still feel compelled to check it again, just to be sure again. And for a moment there is relief? And then at some point that compulsive feeling returns, and you check again to feel relieved again, and yet you always know it is locked, just as it was the last time you checked, and yet you still check. Is this what you go through?

Pretty much as you posted. Relief only seems to come only after a fourth check of my front door.

Just don't try to rationalize any of it.

 

[SimonSays]

Pretty much as you posted. Relief only seems to come only after a fourth check of my front door.

Just don't try to rationalize any of it.

I understand. My non OCD mind wants to say...but surely your experience of knowing the lock is locked would help you not need to recheck it, but that would be rationalising it.

What would happen if you deliberately left the door unlocked? You wouldn't need to check it as you'd know it isn't locked.

I don't lock my door. When I go out I always leave it unlocked. I have no anxiety about it and really like not having to carry a key, but I used to have huge anxiety when I first lived in my van. I literally could not walk away from it 30 yards...the need to return to it was overwhelming.

People have things stolen from their home sometimes; one can come home and find missing things, but never a missing house! My van was my home but it could literally be taken away. It took me a few months to be able to walk away, go to the library for a few hours, and not worry about it. Eventually I was able to walk away leaving everything open. I realised I needed to let go of any fear I had about losing it. I had to test my faith about how life only gives me the experiences I need. But that's another thread

 

[Atrapa Almas]

Pretty much as you posted. Relief only seems to come only after a fourth check of my front door.

Just don't try to rationalize any of it.

If you could visually see from 5 meters away if the door is locked or not, would you still feel the urge to go and check or visually check from 5 meters would work?

 

[Judge]

If you could visually see from 5 meters away if the door is locked or not, would you still feel the urge to go and check or visually check from 5 meters would work?

Of course. The compulsion overrides anything your mind can conjure up. I see it, I know it's locked but I cannot resist double-triple- or quadruple checking it. Though the fourth time seems more often than not to be the charm.

Like I said, don't look for rationale here. You won't find it. Ok...maybe a smidgen of rationale. The knob on my front door has a lot of play in it. It can look locked, but may not be locked. Though 99% of the time it's locked no matter how many times I check.

 

[Atrapa Almas]

Of course. The compulsion overrides anything your mind can conjure up. I see it, I know it's locked but I cannot resist double-triple- or quadruple checking it. Though the fourth time seems more often than not to be the charm.

Like I said, don't look for rationale here. You won't find it. Ok...maybe a smidgen of rationale. The knob on my front door has a lot of play in it. It can look locked, but may not be locked. Though 99% of the time it's locked no matter how many times I check.

I was wondering if installing a web cam focusing to that lock part could let you check the lock remotely (from the cellphone) and save you some of the time and efford.

Its probably way more complex and if that worked you could have figure it yourself.

Thanks for answering.

 

[Judge]

I was wondering if installing a web cam focusing to that lock part could let you check the lock remotely (from the cellphone) and save you some of the time and efford.

Its probably way more complex and if that worked you could have figure it yourself.

Thanks for answering.

No. In terms of my OCD what I see isn't so important as when I actually feel the knob to see whether or not it will rotate any further counter-clockwise. I'm compelled to physically check it. No surprise to me, especially given that on another OCD issue CBT did not work for me.

 

[Aspychata]

I kinda of wish l was a tab more obsessive like with cleaning.

 

[Judge]

I kinda of wish l was a tad more obsessive like with cleaning.

Guilty as charged. Now that's definitely part of my OCD. My personal environment must remain orderly.