intense bullying?

[Jumpinbare]

Plus, so many here have been hurt, including me, that I aspire to be a small bit of kindness in this world.

In my teens I read somewhere something to the effect "because I thirsted in the desert, I dug a well for those that would follow". I have always tried to be kind, or if just too exhausted for that level of interaction, to at least do no harm. It has been sort of my anti-bully mantra throughout life.

 

[Atrapa Almas]

"because I thirsted in the desert, I dug a well for those that would follow".

It seems that most people who help bullied are those who already suffered it somehow.

People who managed to not being bullied are mostly the ones that will ignore bullying.

Thats how it works. So sad.

 

[Southern_Gentleman]

I've never been able to block out such memories, and I'm 67 years old.

Yes, you are not alone. Sadly the only successful way for me to deal with bullying was to step down and deal with them on their own terms. And at the age of 16 such bullying stopped.

When "the danger" passed, largely because I became "the danger" myself. Not as a bully, but one prepared to periodically beat the bullies up on their own terms.

Same here and I would love five minutes in a locked room with some of them. Bullies never remember their victims but the victims never forget the bullies. To this day, I still recall every face and name.

When I came home from the Army, I ran into some of my former bullies. They became quite respectful. Now that I'm in my mid 60's, people don't bully me because they know that 1) beating up an old man makes them look bad, 2) they could get beat by an old man, 3) the old man will probably just shoot them because at my age life in prison isn't much of a threat.

 

[Metalhead]

I was bullied nonstop when I was in middle and high school. I was the official school punching bag. The staff allowed the other kids to physically assault me and then they punished me whenever I reacted to it.

Yeah, I am bitter about this.

 

[Boogs]

I was exceptionally lucky at school, and mostly was just ignored rather than bullied. I was lucky my school wasn't too bad for stopping overt bullying, the outright physically violent type, I was lucky to be large, 6 ft+ and at the time fairly heavy (especially mid teens on); and I think the bullies never quite could decide if I was an easy enough victim, so made the simple choice of picking on the more vulnerable looking one's.

Bullying can invoke such awful feelings, and not just the physical, but mental bullying, cyber bullying (as mentioned) and pretty much any sort of one-sided attack of that nature. It's the unfeeling cruelty and sadism of it. But now I believe it's as much a part of most people as many other social aspects of human culture. We are just beasts, in the sense that in many ways we differ much less than we like to think from our genetic cousins in the animal kingdom. Look at anthropologic style studies of ape communities in the wild, how they interact and develop social standing and position. They too use so many of the same behavioural traits we can see in our own communities. same with other species, though apes are easier to interpret and relate to.

In the uk there was a recent piece of research published on the back of a study of a year of school children, following them through their lives, to gain data not available before as the study ran for many decades (from the 60's or 70's), is still going I think. The point though was this team looked at the people who built up records of bullying at school and related matters (minor police involvement etc), and the results, as I suspect most here would guess, was that those who were the biggest bullies went on to become the most successful in adult life, gained the highest positions, acquired the most wealth, generally were what most people would describe as having done better than most. Their success had little to do with their intelligence or academic ability, but rather their ability to bully their way up the ladder.

Why are the more senior people the most likely to enable bullying? Why do they so often allow it to happened, even participate themselves? Those with the most, picking on those with the least.
I think it's in part a blind mechanism many people run to without knowing why or how, or even that they do it. And this may be expected when considering evolution is not a kind mistress, and fair is an abstract concept, not some law of nature, quite the opposite in fact.

For our 'sins' (an expression only!), we are cursed to be able to see this, we can peek through the veiled view that others are unaware of, and we can see the injustice where they see only social position and order without conscious thought of their part in it.
So, who in the end is the weaker? Those who blindly act and lash out for only their own appeasement and benefit, or us who can see them for what they are, little more than any other animal sightlessly fighting to stay off the bottom of the heap? But never knowing the trap they are in themselves? For the harder they fight and bully their way up the ladder, the more they surround themselves with others waiting to do the same to them.

And these are the people who have done the most to make of our world the worst. Maybe we are the more evolved? What a nice thought that could be! Even if it means little in the face of things.

I for one, while I too can be trite and envious of material gain and perceived popularity of others, I know in my heart I'd never be happy in that position, never feel successful or proud of myself, in fact, I suspect I'd hate it more than anything. So my big FU to them all is to say "I'm still here, and you ain't getting rid of me THAT easy!" (but I have to admit, I may whisper it sometimes, to avoid a metaphorical thump! ).

 

[stevens]

Oh, I tried all the reasoning, negotiation, and kindness that many people try to use to "logically" deflect bullies. It wasn't until one of them came up to me when I was working on a car in the street, and I hit him over the head with a socket wrench, that I got the reputaiton of being crazy and they left me alone. I do wish someone would have explained this to me several years before. I'm sad to report that some people only respond to aversive conditioning. Those usually are on a power trip, with no one to restrain their deviant impulses.

 

[Boogs]

Yeah, but how ruddy awful to be reduced to having to do that.
Not to mention the risks of killing or permanently damaging someone that way unintentionally.
Glad it worked out for you in that way at least.

Those usually are on a power trip, with no one to restrain their deviant impulses.

Or have nothing in them beyond being physically stronger and more brutal and cruel to others, to get what they want. Just empty shells inside, in terms of personality and imagination.

 

[Misty Avich]

I first started getting bullied at age 11 when I started high school, when walking home from school. Kids from my school whom I didn't know, would target me because I had no friends to walk home with and kids just liked to pick on others who were on their own.

Also there was a girl in my class who hated me because she was told I had AS and she hated me because of it. She was wimpy and socially awkward like me but hid it by picking on me. The other girls in the class seemed scared of her, although she was nothing to be scared of. Even I wasn't scared of her, as she wasn't threatening or anything. She just hated me and made sure I was always left out and excluded. She even said to me that she believed I had no feelings and that I was worthless and stupid.

I also got bullied by my sister's friends at high school. They made fun of me because I was so weak and pathetic, and my sister sort of let them do it although not intentionally, she just didn't know how to stop them. They'd often make me cry.

Then these two random boys, much older than me, kept saying "hi, Japanese!" every time they saw me in the hallways or even in the street. I had no idea why they kept calling me Japanese because I looked nothing like a Japanese girl at all. It wasn't even the way I dressed, because I wore the required uniform so I looked just like everyone else.

Then in my LAST year of high school I got sexually harassed on my way home from school, by boys that were TWO years younger than me. Then it started turning aggressive, and one day they tripped me up and almost pushed me into the road. It's horrible being bullied on your way to or from school because there's not a lot anyone can do about it. The teachers can't police the streets.

Then when I was 19 I got bullied by my so-called friends I had met at college. But they were just angry, unstable girls who seemed jealous of me, and one day they were bored so just decided to harass me over the phone and text, first starting off aggressive then turning into juvenile tormenting. I had to get my mobile phone number changed because they just wouldn't stop phoning and sending awful texts (this was back in the days where it wasn't simple to just block a phone number).

I suffered no bullying in my 20s, but unfortunately I'm suffering cyberbullying in my 30s. It's the first time I've ever been cyberbullied and it seems to have damaged me emotionally more than any other bullying I've ever faced. I do wish I could swear on this forum because any family-friendly words to call them would be a complete understatement.

 

[stevens]

I suffered no bullying in my 20s, but unfortunately I'm suffering cyberbullying in my 30s. It's the first time I've ever been cyberbullied and it seems to have damaged me emotionally more than any other bullying I've ever faced.

I'm sorry this has happened to you. I know just how long, how many decades, the after effects of this can last.

Here's an idea that might help in the worst times. Whenever I see an injustice, if I can't do something to directly counteract it, I remind myself to find someone, somewhere, who needs support and then do something for them in that moment. This can be rather mundane, but it really does help, to pay the understanding we've gained forward to the benefit of someone else, especially someone who doesn't have support or who doesn't have the courage to ask for it.

Even dead people can be bullied. I know a professional colleague who has a longstanding bad habit of getting other people to do his work for him, thereafter taking too much credit for it. He's a social genius, in a sea of nerds who are powerless to harvest the same benefits he does while having expertise and abilities that he does not.

One day, he mentioned to me that he had many years before provided professional support to a colleague, since deceased, that I knew he had not provided. I checked out my hunch with the deceased man's spouse. It turned out that I was right. I decided to donate $1,000 to the deceased engineer's scholarship fund, which he had established at a regional university. By then it was mostly dormant. That contribution had the effect of re-booting the thing, so it did attract a few more contributions. While this might seem passive and indirect, it was something I could do to help prevent some moron from stealing from a dead person. This too is a form of bullying.

It's interesting that autistic people--even under our social disabilities--are much better at seeing through disinformation than many people with far better social acuity. We could put that to work, not only feeling better about ourselves but lifting other people up who have a lesser voice.

 

[Boogs]

Here's an idea that might help in the worst times.

Oh! I do like that! Because it fits so well our large and complex societies where depersonalisation is a part and parcel of life. To not challenge where challenge so often returns more abuse, sometimes to the victim (maybe later on) you're trying to help at the time. So the idea of injecting a little fairness and compassion elsewhere where it can flow, not be blocked or diverted, seems a nice simple neat solution!

It's interesting that autistic people--even under our social disabilities--are much better at seeing through disinformation than many people

I have wondered about this, with my little 'lie detector' so often ringing it's little bells as people interact, but sadly, people don't generally seem to want to hear the truth, and in fact will bully the messanger just to be in denial of that truth. Maybe I just have too poor a sensitivity for the truths that hurt too much, and fail to express them softly enough.

 

[FayetheAspie]

Being intelligent was half the cause of my bullying. Being physically uncoordinated was the other half.

Being intelligent, literal interpretation of words,and not following popular trends if I do not personally find them interesting are some of the main reasons that I have been bullied and/or shunned before. The amusing part was when I would be called "Einstein " in a derogatory tone instead of my real name. I am not sure how that comparison is supposed to be an insult. Albert Einstein was actually one of my heroes as a child along with several other famous scientists from the past. I was thrilled when I learned that he was probably autistic too.

 

[Misty Avich]

Being thick was most the cause of me being bullied. Although I wasn't intellectually delayed, I was still known as the thickest kid in the class because of being statemented and having a support worker with me in the classroom. So I was always known by "the retarded kid" of the class. That made me very unpopular. God I wish I'd never behaved so out of character on my first day of school, then none of this statementing and early diagnosing would have happened. If I could see my 4-year-old self now I think I'd love to give her a big whack around the ear for mapping out my future like that.

 

[Boogs]

I get the impression you've take on the worse criticisms levelled at you and adopted them as yours, when they were the prejudices of children more ignorant than you at that time.

You seem aware of this and yet own those criticisms when they weren't what you were? How could a 4 year old have any conception of what it means to be ND, just being told that by an adult doesn't put across what it means and doesn't protect from the injustice of others on it's own.

Being singled out in class by almost any means or cause, whether NT or ND will invariably result in bullying of some degree, and if managed badly by school/teachers this can be crippling for many kids, and for ND's can exacerbate their condition quite significantly. You don't need to be ND to be excluded and bullied by any means, you're just more likely to be, not because of a real difference as such, but just not being able to join a social group for protection.

I'm no doc or therapist or psychologist (so excuse me if I seem to acting as such) but I think you may need to soften your approach to yourself, especially that confused and bullied 4 year old who you blame for mapping out your future, when it was others responsible for that, not you! You are allowed to have a childhood free of those responsibilities just like everyone else! You didn't make the situation you're in, you were let down by others. maybe not their direct fault, but it was adults who had the choices and responsibilities that directed your life, not you.

 

[Misty Avich]

I wasn't bullied when I was 4. Bullying didn't start until I was 11.

 

[Rodafina]

If I could see my 4-year-old self now I think I'd love to give her a big whack around the ear for mapping out my future like that.

I think 4 year old you would benefit more from a warm hug and a strong message that everyone is different, she is a worthy child exactly as she is, and that it's okay to need a bit of help through life.

It's the adult version of you that can change the trajectory of your life if you don't like how it's gone so far. I think you may benefit from being more like the 4 year old you - authentic, unafraid to be yourself, and not so worried about what the world thinks of you.

 

[Misty Avich]

Most female Aspies start school being good and quiet like all the other children. Not me. You don't know about how my temporarily regressed behaviour made social services think it was from child abuse at home. My parents nearly got us taken away from them. We had to go to lots of appointments to prove that they were not abusing me. It was very distressing for me having to have a medical person examining me between the legs to see if I had been sexually abused or not. It was humiliating. And then the social services decided that if my parents didn't go through with getting me diagnosed with something, they'd be labelled as bad parents. So, feeling under horrible pressure, we HAD to get me assessed further to receive a label. All I wanted was to be left alone. I was settled down fine at school by then, why couldn't they just leave me alone?

It was an awful time. Ruined my childhood, my innocence, and my dignity. And none of that would never of happened if I hadn't behaved like a brat on my first day of school.

 

[Rodafina]

Most female Aspies start school being good and quiet like all the other children. Not me. You don't know about how my temporarily regressed behaviour made social services think it was from child abuse at home. My parents nearly got us taken away from them. We had to go to lots of appointments to prove that they were not abusing me. It was very distressing for me having to have a medical person examining me between the legs to see if I had been sexually abused or not. It was humiliating. And then they decided that if they didn't go through with getting me diagnosed with something, they'd be labelled as bad parents. So, feeling under horrible pressure, we HAD to get me assessed further to receive a label. All I wanted was to be left alone. I was settled down fine at school by then, why couldn't they just leave me alone?

It was an awful time. Ruined my childhood, my innocence, and my dignity. And none of that would never of happened if I hadn't behaved like a brat on my first day of school.

I do know all of that as you have shared it multiple times. Blaming your four year-old self for how she acted on one day of her life for all of the troubles that you had in your youth and beyond is not a reasonable way to make sense of the very serious hardship you faced as a child. Fantasizing about whacking some sense into that child shows that you have little compassion or understanding for who you were as a child.

If you have any inclination to actually heal from your painful past and live a more content life now, I would recommend forgiving that child version of yourself and really working hard to find compassion for yourself and not drown yourself in self hatred like you do.

I think maybe you are not interested in a solutions-focused conversation. So, I accept that I am not a good person to try to help you.

 

[Misty Avich]

You're right, I have no understanding of why the hell I behaved like that on my first day of school. But it's haunted me ever since. Maybe a member of staff at the school secretly abused me and I don't remember? Maybe something else similar happened to trigger such behaviour?
But if I was so frightened, why didn't I just behave frightened, instead of being disruptive and abusive to my teacher? Why couldn't I have just cried or even screamed for my mum? That would have made a lot more sense. Expressing my feelings wasn't beyond my capabilities, as I could easily express my feelings appropriately BEFORE then. I remember when I was 3 and started preschool I had separation anxiety and I felt afraid of being in a strange new place without my mum. I remember feeling very anxious and I went up to one of the members of staff and cried "I want Mummy!" Just like a normal child. I didn't act up, tip chairs over, pull the teacher's hair, kick the other children, or lots of other destructive and disruptive behaviour like I did on my first day of school. The teacher was CRYING by the end of the day. I had made a grown woman cry and I have felt bad ever since. I felt I had let my parents down. It's always an emotional time for parents when their little one starts school but also a very proud time. To learn that I had been disruptive and naughty in the classroom must have really disappointed and worried my parents to the core. Yet as soon as I came out of school all my anxiety disappeared. I skipped home and was just hyperactive when I got home, and my parents couldn't get through to me as to why I was behaving so out of character in school. Usually I was a very engaging child, I was articulate and had no speech delays, and I could answer questions and express my feelings as I mentioned before. So I have no idea why I suddenly couldn't rationalise what I was doing at school. My mum said that whenever she asked me why I was behaving like that in school I'd just shrug.

 

[Boogs]

You seem to be taking on the responsibility of those in charge of looking after you. Some of what you describe sounds more like abuse to me.
Also, bear in mind memories are very malleable and we alter them through our lives for all sorts of reasons. This is how brains work. In fact every time you recall a memory it's altered in some way, and you have almost no way of know that's happened.
This occurs for good reason, but we tend to think our memories are inviolate which is absolutely not the case. Don't make too much of what your childhood memories tell you, as you'll quite possibly have altered them unknowingly (and subconsciously) to fit your later understanding of what happened, regardless of the accuracy of that.

Regardless of all that anyway, beating yourself up for simply being a child in bad circumstances isn't likely to help you move forward now. Put it this way, would you blame a random school child for the same behaviour as you blame your younger self for?

 

[Misty Avich]

You seem to be taking on the responsibility of those in charge of looking after you. Some of what you describe sounds more like abuse to me.
Also, bear in mind memories are very malleable and we alter them through our lives for all sorts of reasons. This is how brains work. In fact every time you recall a memory it's altered in some way, and you have almost no way of know that's happened.
This occurs for good reason, but we tend to think our memories are inviolate which is absolutely not the case. Don't make too much of what your childhood memories tell you, as you'll quite possibly have altered them unknowingly (and subconsciously) to fit your later understanding of what happened, regardless of the accuracy of that.

Not the case for me. My memory is pretty accurate. I write memoirs of my life and when my aunts read them they remember the memories exactly the same as I do. My long-term memory is the only quality my brain has to offer, please don't doubt me on that (even though you weren't doing it intentionally, I'm just speaking in general).

Regardless of all that anyway, beating yourself up for simply being a child in bad circumstances isn't likely to help you move forward now. Put it this way, would you blame a random school child for the same behaviour as you blame your younger self for?

No, but I just can't feel the same compassion towards myself as I can towards others. It's the butterfly effect. If I hadn't have acted like I did then I would have been like everyone else here and not gotten diagnosed until adulthood.