"Me, my autism and cults" - Heart & Soul podcast from the BBC World Service

[Aeolienne]

(Not written by me)

By the time Richard Turner was in his mid-30s, he’d given away nearly all of his money to a church. Everything he held dear had been stripped bare by a religious community in the UK which claimed to have his best interests at heart. It took him years to piece together how this could have happened. It was only in recovery that he was diagnosed with autism, which he believes made him more susceptible to coercive control by a group he now regards as a cult.

For Heart and Soul, Richard takes us on his journey of self-discovery, sharing his faith experiences with other ‘cult survivors’, including one US man with Asperger’s Syndrome who has spent most of his adult life ‘cult-hopping’. How common are these extraordinary stories across the world? With very little academic research available, Richard is part of a growing movement working to understand the link between neurodivergence and cults.

Listen here

 

[Neonatal RRT]

Although not well-studied, within the context of Asperger's condition and other forms of autism, there appears to be some degree of social naivety, perhaps gullibility, when it comes to interactions with certain individuals who may be "social predators", criminals, even sales people. There is a few articles on this topic, but not enough to really explore the phenomenon.

I know I sense this within myself, and avoid answering my front door to people who are solicitors. I spend way too much time listening to their story, their sales pitch, and then feel some sense of guilt for saying "No". My wife, whom I usually send to the door, despite her protests, is like "Not interested" right up front and sends them on their way.

I know that if I ever run into a sociopath, a psychopath, criminal, or even a savvy salesperson, I am going to be a victim.

 

[Outdated]

I know that if I ever run into a sociopath, a psychopath, criminal, or even a savvy salesperson, I am going to be a victim.

I have this problem in social situations and can be very easily led but I have no trouble when it's strangers knocking on my door. Hawkers are banned in my state but I still get the occasional religious nutjobs. They get short shrift.

 

[Forest Cat]

When I was a teenager and in my early 20s I think I was perfect cult material. If I had met the wrong smooth talking cult leader, I would probably had still been a member now and lived on a compund somewhere with the other victims. I was so gullable and easily led and the biggest problem of all; I trusted people. I had a weird, blind trust in people.

 

[Angular Chap]

Thanks for posting this, another addition to the archive to warn people about.

Sadly, I fear this will become more and more common in future. With Autism becoming more and more talked about and in the spotlight, certain individuals and organisations will be trying to exploit us. It's already happening as we speak.

I'll have a lot more to say on this in future, but part of my job involves fraud prevention and I see the same patterns starting to emerge with Autism as I do with other fraud victims.

Now I don't want to downplay the seriousness of cults and the harm they do, but in the podcast, one of the interviewees says there is no real clear definition of what a cult is (in the UK at least), so for now I'll avoid using the term cult and just call them what I know: con artists. And in this case, con artists hiding behind religion.

Stay safe everyone.

 

[Outdated]

With Autism becoming more and more talked about and in the spotlight, certain individuals and organisations will be trying to exploit us. It's already happening as we speak.

Thankfully the mods here are on the ball and manage to delete a lot of stuff before too many people see it. I saw one just a little while ago, just before it got deleted.

Complete with a fake forum and fake discussions about how wonderful it is, someone selling a cure for autism.

 

[NB79]

i trust people too much too, and it cost me to say no, but at the same time i use my intelligence to detect danger and i am aware people can be tricky.

 

[Aneka]

I'm glad for the bad experiences I've made with people. They taught me to consider bad intentions.

 

[Angular Chap]

Complete with a fake forum and fake discussions about how wonderful it is, someone selling a cure for autism.

Have to give them credit, some real professionals out there, running some really slick operations.

 

[Aspychata]

Think l realized that people can be completely full of poop. So l now take that approach with everyone. I recently thought someone was okay, but they turned out to be a liar. She was a life traveler, however some are okay, some aren't. I think it was a good lesson for me. I am more cautious. I think l look for the bad now in people instead of finding the good. Not the best way to go but it gets the job done.

 

[Swansong]

Curious.

For me one of the few benefits of my nature has been that it has made an extremely aware and critical individual and has freed me from the desire to fit in and the power that peer pressure has over others.

After all, since basically every other human being seems so utterly alien to me (often in very negative ways), why would I ever have any desire to belong to any shared social structure?

Of course, each person is different and "autism" itself is little more than an umbrella term.

 

[Magna]

I know I sense this within myself, and avoid answering my front door to people who are solicitors. I spend way too much time listening to their story, their sales pitch, and then feel some sense of guilt for saying "No". My wife, whom I usually send to the door, despite her protests, is like "Not interested" right up front and sends them on their way.

I know that if I ever run into a sociopath, a psychopath, criminal, or even a savvy salesperson, I am going to be a victim.

^ This is me as well.

I'm glad this is being talked about. Religion can be a positive influence in a person's life provided it's balanced. Unbalanced, and it can be seriously damaging not only to the person themselves but to those around them. I spent my childhood, my formative years in a family where my parents bounced from one small cult-like religious group to another.

I know now that my own autism and more specifically black and white and literal thinking left me prone to experiencing serious psychological damage in the form of religious trauma. In relation to my life as a whole nothing else even comes close to the level of damage sustained. A primary reason I underwent trauma therapy was due to my damaging experiences from religion and I still participate in a group of religious trauma survivors. I'm convinced that taking things literally and being very rule based as a result of my autism meant that I viewed religion, God, sin, guilt, self-loathing, etc much differently than NT people around me did who were practicing the same religion.

 

[Luca]

In the situation I came from, I learned pretty early on not to trust people and to watch out for myself. Even so, I have also been manipulated and conned. :/

 

[VictorR]

Along with a tendency to trust by default, something that also hurts many of us is a lack of social connection and/or feeling not heard due to our different ways of seeing things.

Extremist groups (which I suppose can be a form of cult) are another area where autistic individuals are at heightened risk of being drawn into.

Extremism is a global phenomenon, with an increasing domestic and international presence. Extremists recruit persons to their causes through online forums that spread hate-filled narratives and promote violence. Individuals with autism spectrum disorder may be vulnerable to recruitment through these online forums, and clinicians who work with autistic adolescents, young adults, and their families should familiarize themselves with the risk and identify strategies based on a multidisciplinary approach in the early identification, holistic prevention, and care-based intervention strategies of at-risk adolescents. This special article, representing an international collaboration between developmental-behavioral pediatrics, law enforcement, and psychology, hopes to shed light on the issue for clinicians.

Autism Spectrum Disorder, Extremism, and the Role of Developmental-Behavioral Pediatric Clinicians

 

[Aspychata]

Along with a tendency to trust by default, something that also hurts many of us is a lack of social connection and/or feeling not heard due to our different ways of seeing things.

Extremist groups (which I suppose can be a form of cult) are another area where autistic individuals are at heightened risk of being drawn into.



Autism Spectrum Disorder, Extremism, and the Role of Developmental-Behavioral Pediatric Clinicians

Excellent point. Any type of extreme thinking or doctrines found in cult like groups, we need to examine whether it's our thinking or a group trying to snare gullible individuals which can really be anybody dealing with complications of any kind, etc: financial, thought process, addictions. This all ties into making poor choices that affect us for the rest of our life.

My childhood led me to poor decisions with men which has haunted me, and prevented me from seeking boyfriends at all. Like that song says, looking for answers in all the wrong places. I finally worked on myself and my thinking, but it's a long hard road.

I understand now that no relationship is perfect, and that reflection on our own thought process can provide insightful crystal ball to how others view us, and how to upgrade our responses reducing our stress, becoming more proactive and less reactive. Thanks if anybody read this far. Lol

 

[Rodafina]

For me one of the few benefits of my nature has been that it has made an extremely aware and critical individual and has freed me from the desire to fit in and the power that peer pressure has over others.

After all, since basically every other human being seems so utterly alien to me (often in very negative ways), why would I ever have any desire to belong to any shared social structure?

Thanks for writing this. I was trying to figure out where I fit in as I am trusting in some ways, but extremely guarded most of the time. I have had the desire to fit in, but absolutely zero success with it, and other than that, what you wrote describes my experience in the world perfectly.

 

[Outdated]

Thanks for writing this. I was trying to figure out where I fit in as I am trusting in some ways, but extremely guarded most of the time.

I think many of us learn a healthy cynicism by either being born on the wrong side of the tracks as I was, or by having to deal with the rougher end of the community later in life. I think people that have lived very sheltered lives are much more vulnerable, yet I envy them.

 

[Stuttermabolur]

I think many of us learn a healthy cynicism by either being born on the wrong side of the tracks as I was, or by having to deal with the rougher end of the community later in life. I think people that have lived very sheltered lives are much more vulnerable, yet I envy them.

That absolutely goes for me. I have tried to keep some of my naiveté alive as it's in short supply now that cynicism is thriving but I know I've only been able to do so because I've been very lucky. I'm also very trusting of people which makes me an easy "mark". I have huge respect for people who have gone through serious difficulties and/or trauma yet managed to retain their sense of self, though I also feel for them for having to go through that.

 

[Angular Chap]

In the situation I came from, I learned pretty early on not to trust people and to watch out for myself. Even so, I have also been manipulated and conned. :/

Literally anyone can be conned, all it takes is the right scam. Respect to you and anyone else who admits to being conned, most people don't want to admit it happened to them.

To quote my fellow Scotsman and industry peer, R. Paul Wilson:

"If you think you can't be conned, then you are exactly the type of person a con artist wants to meet."

Some more reading on the subject:

R. Paul Wilson On: The Psychology Of Being Conned

 

[Aeolienne]

To quote my fellow Scotsman and industry peer, R. Paul Wilson:

"If you think you can't be conned, then you are exactly the type of person a con artist wants to meet."

I wonder if Greta Thunberg is still convinced she's immune?
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