My partner (ASD) and I (NT) have relationship problems. Looking for advice/different perspectives!

[leoxsi]

Hi everyone,

This is my first time being on this forum and I'm looking for some perspective on my relationship problems with my partner. Hope to find some fresh insights here .

My partner (officially diagnosed with PDD-NOS as a kid) and I (NT) have been together for almost 3 years. We're both in our early twenties and still living with our parents for unrelated reasons. We've never had sexual intercourse and he is sexually very reserved (doesn't often undress me or carress me and doesn't like to be touched). For a long time I believed that this was due to his inexperience and high sensitivity, so I decided to let the topic rest (I didn't want to pressure him into something he would be uncomfortable with). However, recently I brought up the topic again (because it does bother me in different ways) and he told me he may have been hesitant, because he felt like our relationship was too unstable. I admit we've had our struggles from time to time like any relationship, but he had never mentioned it as such an issue. I asked him if he sees a future with me and he kept quiet. After a long uncomfortable silence he admitted that he did not, but according to him I should not take that personally (he doesn't have any idea what he wants or expects from his life in the future). This was a little over a month ago and although we're trying to move forward, I'm having a hard time letting it go.

I wonder if anyone recognizes these problems and/or has any advice on how to work on these problems from either his, mine or both sides. I know that communication (especially about his emotions) can be difficult for him, so I try to be as understanding as possible. However, his words (or should I say, lack of words referring to the uncomfortable silence) have hurt me a lot and I'm not sure if we're able to deal with this as there has been so little improvement (referring to the problems with communication and intimacy). Two of my close friends feel like my partner and I are or might be too incompatible, but they are both NT, therefore I would love to gain some perspective from the other side (but of course responses from NTs are also very much welcome!).

Thank you so much if you've read all of this and are willing to share your thoughts!

 

[Mr. Stevens]

It's hard to comment since we don't know you both, but if he doesn't see a future, then it's hard to argue with that. It may be best to see it as a relationship that doesn't work, while knowing it's not personal. Especially as you are both young.

It's admirable to not give up too easily, but you're also not a couple who's been married thirty years. You should both think of what you're righting for: is it your connection, or the promise of one?

If he's hesitant now and unsure what he wants, that will probably mean heartbreak for you, and feeling suffocated for him. It may be best to love what you had and move toward what you'd really love for the long term.

 

[kenaij]

I think @Mr. Stevens is spot on. And I wanted to comment something very similar. Mostly because of him not seeing a future. It might have been very hard for him to admit it. And to just keep hanging on to each other won't help either of you.
This ofcourse based on the information you provided and us not knowing either of you.

 

[leoxsi]

It's hard to comment since we don't know you both, but if he doesn't see a future, then it's hard to argue with that. It may be best to see it as a relationship that doesn't work, while knowing it's not personal. Especially as you are both young.

It's admirable to not give up too easily, but you're also not a couple who's been married thirty years. You should both think of what you're righting for: is it your connection, or the promise of one?

If he's hesitant now and unsure what he wants, that will probably mean heartbreak for you, and feeling suffocated for him. It may be best to love what you had and move toward what you'd really love for the long term.

Thank you for your response! What bothers me a lot is that I'm not sure if I put too much weight on the phrase that he doesn't see a future with me, because he also doesn't nessecairily see a future without me. He was willing to fight for it, but he may have said that out of pressure and guilt, as my tears were all over the place. Anyway, he just had no idea about his future according to him, but I suppose in that case your final argument still counts. If we were to part ways, I wonder if his hesitance would really become less or stay more or less the same with another person. At least he would have a chance to find out or at least he may find someone who would be less upset about it.

We do share a connection and care a lot about each other. We also agree that we complement each other well in certain areas, but at this moment the question is probably: is it enough? I feel like I have needs which he cannot always provide for, while he probably finds me ungrateful at times or feels like he's lacking despite all of his efforts (especially when I'm losing control of my emotions). It doesn't seem fair to neither of us and these are the types of problems that only become more problematic with time when unable to solve.

Anyway, thank you again! Will definately take this view into consideration during our next conversation and see how he thinks about this promise of connection idea! It will be though, but nessecairy

 

[Magna]

Even NTs can have intimacy issues so personally I wouldn't automatically conclude it's due to ASD.

If I were to continue the relationship I wouldn't hound him about the intimacy issue but I'd return back to it if he kept his distance in that regard.

There was an autism related documentary about an autistic couple who were engaged if I recall correctly. She wanted intimacy, he didn't. She would press him about it and he'd say that he needed more time (to become comfortable with intimacy). I think they would kiss and hug but no sex. It was a constant concern of hers and each time he said he needed more time. As a viewer of the film I got the feeling that he was likely asexual and she was clearly not (because she wanted sexual intimacy with him). By the end of the film I ended up thinking that they might not be compatible with each other in a very significant and important way and I hoped for her sake that they didn't get married. I thought about how awful it would have been for her if after marriage he kept stalling and avoiding sex by giving the same excuse in perpetuity. That would be sad and tragic.

Wonderful documentary BTW

 

[Rodafina]

Hi again, @leoxsi.

Sometimes familiarity can keep us in patterns that are not necessarily the best choice. And I don’t mean “us” as in those with autism. I mean “us” as in humans.

Being in a familiar situation, even if it is not wonderful, can be very comforting, while the unknown can be scary. If things are not particularly bad, it can be very hard to take any action that would make a big change. I don’t think this is always a bad thing, but sometimes it can mean accepting something that is mediocre or something that is slowly deteriorating.

 

[Magna]

Thank you for your response! What bothers me a lot is that I'm not sure if I put too much weight on the phrase that he doesn't see a future with me, because he also doesn't nessecairily see a future without me. He just has no idea, but I suppose in that case your final argument still counts. If we were to part ways, I wonder if his hesitance would really become less or stay more or less the same with another person. At least he would have a chance to find out or at least he may find someone who would be less upset about it.

We do share a connection and care a lot about each other. We also agree that we complement each other well in certain areas, but at this moment the question is probably: is it enough? I feel like I have needs which he cannot always provide for, while he probably finds me ungrateful at times or feels like he's lacking despite all of his efforts (especially when I'm losing control of my emotions). It doesn't seem fair to neither of us and these are the types of problems that only become more problematic with time when unable to solve.

Anyway, thank you again! Will definately take this view into consideration during our next conversation and see how he thinks about this promise of connection idea! It will be though, but nessecairy

I've read and can attest in my own life that it can be difficult for autistic people to visualize their own futures. I'm not sure or don't recall why that is but part of it could be that just navigating each day to get through it is a significant challenge.

It's rather difficult to focus on the concept of an unknown future when a lot of energy is spent on surviving the present.

 

[Rodafina]

I've read and can attest in my own life that it can be difficult for autistic people to visualize their own futures.

I can definitely relate to this. Very difficult for me to imagine my own future.

 

[Hypnalis]

I have a different take on this than most of the others, but perhaps a bit more practice too (which isn't anything to be proud of, but it gives me some experience)..

Most Aspies have a different "emotional palette" to NTs. It seems to be typically true that NTs and Aspies can't usefully discuss feelings as often or deeply as some NTs can..
And don't forget there's a very large F/M mismatch too, and it's greatest regarding relationship status.

You haven't stated your objective in your post. Remember this is an ASD forum - you should make no assumptions here either.

I've assumed the most likely objective, which is that you're doing a second pass at a "stay/split analysis".

Make your own decision (this isn't a good place for that kind of advice) - i.e. Prefer split unless certain conditions are met, or prefer stay if certain conditions are met.

Then discuss it factually with him. Pared down, your choices are (1) "Split up unless he explicitly commits", and (2) "Wait a bit longer".

For (1), just tell him: directly, clearly, as briefly as possible, but still complete. Don't waste time comparing emotional states, or providing a 15 minute multi-faceted analysis of your emotional journey during the relationship (half joking, but only half - it's likely to be counter-productive.

I could set it up and ask the question in 3 or 4 lines of text. Take that as a goal for how much you say.

For two, decide on realistic conditions. Decide what you ant to share with him (if anything). Avoid the appearance of blackmail/pressure (Aspies lean towards being stubborn about things like that, so it could backfire.

After you've decided what to say, package and deliver as above.

And remember - never ever surprise anyone with this discussion, nor make a huge thing out of it, especially one of us. Make sure there's enough time as discreetly as you can, Intro (1 min), pitch (2-3), elicit a response with on unbiased open question.

If you get a stay signal, and you want to, ask if you can extend the discussion, and cover eg "intimacy". Note that most LTRs without it fall apart of their own accord. Don't ignore this topic, even if you must defer it.

 

[leoxsi]

Even NTs can have intimacy issues so personally I wouldn't automatically conclude it's due to ASD.

If I were to continue the relationship I wouldn't hound him about the intimacy issue but I'd return back to it if he kept his distance in that regard.

There was an autism related documentary about an autistic couple who were engaged if I recall correctly. She wanted intimacy, he didn't. She would press him about it and he'd say that he needed more time (to become comfortable with intimacy). I think they would kiss and hug but no sex. It was a constant concern of hers and each time he said he needed more time. As a viewer of the film I got the feeling that he was likely asexual and she was clearly not (because she wanted sexual intimacy with him). By the end of the film I ended up thinking that they might not be compatible with each other in a very significant and important way and I hoped for her sake that they didn't get married. I thought about how awful it would have been for her if they did get married and he kept stalling and avoiding sex by giving the same excuse in perpetuity. That would be sad and tragic.

Thank you for your thoughts! I really appreciatie it! I definately agree that intimacy issues occur everywhere. The reason I automatically connected it to ASD (at least for some part) was that we did try to have intercourse a few times, but it was a very long time ago and didn't go well. One time he tried it without condoom (I wasn't amused and refused, he felt guilty and apologised) and the second time he didn't manage to put on the condom, because he said it felt too strange on his skin. Further, he doesn't like being touched because the slightest touch tickles him a lot in an unpleasant manner, so this doesn't really has something to do with me. (My dogs aren't allowed to sit on his lap for the same reason, even though he loves dogs.)

The documentairy sounds very relatable. I don't mind giving someone time at all, but I could not live my whole life like this. I feel like it's better to part ways while we still have our whole lives ahead of us instead of 10 years from now. I don't think he's asexual since he watches stuff and touches himself. He's actually been working on minimizing that to see what the effects are , because he assumed it might influence he (so far he doesn't feel very different).

 

[chincey_james]

I do relate somewhat to the sensitivity issues mentioned in this thread. I don't think mine goes quite as extreme as what you're describing, but early in my relationship my partner found my intense ticklishness and reticence for some types of intimacy confusing.

I was a late bloomer and never had even kissed someone before (no shame to anyone currently in that boat). For me, the experiences were wildly overwhelming even when I was enjoying them somewhere beneath a layer of anxiety. I can only speak for myself, but it took many years to become comfortable being fully intimate.

None of my story is relevant if you think it's best for you both to part ways though. Your situation sounds much more complicated than what I've experienced. Good luck to you!

 

[leoxsi]

I have a different take on this than most of the others, but perhaps a bit more practice too (which isn't anything to be proud of, but it gives me some experience)..

Most Aspies have a different "emotional palette" to NTs. It seems to be typically true that NTs and Aspies can't usefully discuss feelings as often or deeply as some NTs can..
And don't forget there's a very large F/M mismatch too, and it's greatest regarding relationship status.

You haven't stated your objective in your post. Remember this is an ASD forum - you should make no assumptions here either.

I've assumed the most likely objective, which is that you're doing a second pass at a "stay/split analysis".

Make your own decision (this isn't a good place for that kind of advice) - i.e. Prefer split unless certain conditions are met, or prefer stay if certain conditions are met.

Then discuss it factually with him. Pared down, your choices are (1) "Split up unless he explicitly commits", and (2) "Wait a bit longer".

For (1), just tell him: directly, clearly, as briefly as possible, but still complete. Don't waste time comparing emotional states, or providing a 15 minute multi-faceted analysis of your emotional journey during the relationship (half joking, but only half - it's likely to be counter-productive.

I could set it up and ask the question in 3 or 4 lines of text. Take that as a goal for how much you say.

For two, decide on realistic conditions. Decide what you ant to share with him (if anything). Avoid the appearance of blackmail/pressure (Aspies lean towards being stubborn about things like that, so it could backfire.

After you've decided what to say, package and deliver as above.

And remember - never ever surprise anyone with this discussion, nor make a huge thing out of it, especially one of us. Make sure there's enough time as discreetly as you can, Intro (1 min), pitch (2-3), elicit a response with on unbiased open question.

If you get a stay signal, and you want to, ask if you can extend the discussion, and cover eg "intimacy". Note that most LTRs without it fall apart of their own accord. Don't ignore this topic, even if you must defer it.

Hi,

Thank you for the elaborate response! This is actually quite useful, including the advice on the objective.

I must admit that I was not sure about the objective before creating this topic. I suppose the split/stay analysis makes the most sense, but in the end I think I was hoping for a bit of everything. Do people recognize parts of this situation? Should I take his disinterest in intimacy and what he said about the futures personal or not? Are there effective ways to work on our problems (problems which I also could have presented better)? And finally, do people believe this relationship could work from an aspie perspective? So I could take all these ideas into account during my own analysis and our next conversation.

I'm guilty of 'providing a long multi-faceted analysis of my emotional journey' followed by askind 'do you understand?/does that make sense?' multiple times. I admit this often overwhelmed my partner, but to me that's hoe I learned to communicate (in a polite way). It's great to have a strategy now to communicate with him in a way that's less tiring for him and more effective for us both.

 

[leoxsi]

I do relate somewhat to the sensitivity issues mentioned in this thread. I don't think mine goes quite as extreme as what you're describing, but early in my relationship my partner found my intense ticklishness and reticence for some types of intimacy confusing.

I was a late bloomer and never had even kissed someone before (no shame to anyone currently in that boat). For me, the experiences were wildly overwhelming even when I was enjoying them somewhere beneath a layer of anxiety. I can only speak for myself, but it took many years to become comfortable being fully intimate.

None of my story is relevant if you think it's best for you both to part ways though. Your situation sounds much more complicated than what I've experienced. Good luck to you!

Thank you for opening up and sharing your story. I'm so happy that you learned to feel comfortable with being intimate. Especially as it was something that brought you joy (and probably/hopefully still does). I haven't made my decision yet and I don't think I can without another good conversation with my partner. Anyway, I will remember your story especially if my partner and I decide to continue, because I wouldn't be surprised if he sometimes feels the same. My situation may sound complicated, but I think everyone is facing there own challenges. For you to overcome your anxiety must have been difficult and I respect it so much. Thank you for helping me out and I wish you all the best!

 

[Hypnalis]

@leoxsi

Some additional points to consider:

We're all different - I'm generalizing below, but nothing about us as a group can be more than 80% correct at best.

ASD isn't an illness (some of us don't like the "D" part at all). We're not a special subset of "Introvert" either, though I think we're more likely to be introverted than NTs.

In terms of communication style, you can think of it like this: there's an M/F difference which is real, but not uncontroversial in every environment. One common way to see it as differences in rational/factual vs emotional/consensus styles. (there's an Evolutionary Psychology explanation for this BTW - I probably got the terms wrong though)
Aspies are biased towards rational/factual, so the "gap" between NT F and ASD M is larger than NT F and NT M. This can be handled - but it shouldn't be ignored by the NT, because most of us can't "turn off" the bias. That doesn't mean we don't know it exists though - it's easy enough for the right people to learn to accommodate this.

Relationship-wise Aspies do just fine on loyalty, respect, and duty (matters a lot with kids), The other factor, "clear and honest communication" is there too, but in a modified form.
There are more factors in relationships OFC, including the one I mentioned in my previous post, but IMO the ones above are easy to forget, but if any one of them is missing in either party you're "playing to lose".

 

[Neri]

Hi,

Thank you for the elaborate response! This is actually quite useful, including the advice on the objective.

I must admit that I was not sure about the objective before creating this topic. I suppose the split/stay analysis makes the most sense, but in the end I think I was hoping for a bit of everything. Do people recognize parts of this situation? Should I take his disinterest in intimacy and what he said about the futures personal or not? Are there effective ways to work on our problems (problems which I also could have presented better)? And finally, do people believe this relationship could work from an aspie perspective? So I could take all these ideas into account during my own analysis and our next conversation.

I'm guilty of 'providing a long multi-faceted analysis of my emotional journey' followed by askind 'do you understand?/does that make sense?' multiple times. I admit this often overwhelmed my partner, but to me that's hoe I learned to communicate (in a polite way). It's great to have a strategy now to communicate with him in a way that's less tiring for him and more effective for us both.

One thing I'd like to add, regarding the sexual/intimacy issue, is that, my sexual experience with both my neurodiverse, long term sexual partners, is that neither of them could handle or liked wearing condoms.

 

[VictorR]

I'm not saying this is the case, but sometimes two people may make good friends but not partners. I've known people who came to realize this and have had amicable divorces and have both had better lives since then, while remaining as friends (and co-parents).

 

[AO1501]

I asked him if he sees a future with me and he kept quiet. After a long uncomfortable silence he admitted that he did not, but according to him I should not take that personally (he doesn't have any idea what he wants or expects from his life in the future).

I think there are times when it is more useful to hear what is being actually said, rather than what it might be interpreted as meaning. In this instance, it seems quite likely to me that when he admitted that he did not see a future with you, that he actually meant exactly that, and not anything else.

As difficult as it is for most NT people to understand, there are many ND people who have little or no capability to project themselves into the future - or indeed any unknown. There is a skill required to do this, which as I know myself, can simply not be there at all, or be very limited in nature.

The fact he has no sense of what he wants for the future would tend to suggest this, so the question itself is so open-ended and lacking in framework to judge by, that there isn't an answer clear enough to give. Add to that the additional pressure of what answer you would see as right and what might be the wrong thing, and the most likely response to the question is silence.

It also seems to me that he told you how he perceives the problem, that the relationship is 'too unstable'. Since this was the core of his response, that's the question that really needs to be addressed, and whether he sees a future for the two of you is actually a tangent which takes you away from the crux of it.

My suggestion is to go back to that issue, and ask him in what ways the relationship seems too unstable, and for suggestions as to how it could be stabilized better. What you, and he, can do to establish something that is more rewarding for you both.

It's only when you both know the answers to this and agree what ways you can move forward, that either of you can really and realistically have a sense of whether the future can be together or not.

 

[leoxsi]

@leoxsi

Some additional points to consider:

We're all different - I'm generalizing below, but nothing about us as a group can be more than 80% correct at best.

ASD isn't an illness (some of us don't like the "D" part at all). We're not a special subset of "Introvert" either, though I think we're more likely to be introverted than NTs.

In terms of communication style, you can think of it like this: there's an M/F difference which is real, but not uncontroversial in every environment. One common way to see it as differences in rational/factual vs emotional/consensus styles. (there's an Evolutionary Psychology explanation for this BTW - I probably got the terms wrong though)
Aspies are biased towards rational/factual, so the "gap" between NT F and ASD M is larger than NT F and NT M. This can be handled - but it shouldn't be ignored by the NT, because most of us can't "turn off" the bias. That doesn't mean we don't know it exists though - it's easy enough for the right people to learn to accommodate this.

Relationship-wise Aspies do just fine on loyalty, respect, and duty (matters a lot with kids), The other factor, "clear and honest communication" is there too, but in a modified form.
There are more factors in relationships OFC, including the one I mentioned in my previous post, but IMO the ones above are easy to forget, but if any one of them is missing in either party you're "playing to lose".

Thank you so much for pointing this out!

Hopefully I didn't hurt someone by referring to the term ASD, as I totally agree it's not an illness or something bad. I've seen quite some people refer to the word 'aspie'. It's not a common used word in my mother language, but I will try to use it more.

Also the general relationship advice is nice! My partner and I are both quite young and don't have much relationship experience so it's nice to know which factors are important according to people who have this experience. I think I've never met someone as loyal and respectful as my partner, but communication is were we struggle I believe (both him and I). Thank you for your sharing your wisdom!

 

[leoxsi]

One thing I'd like to add, regarding the sexual/intimacy issue, is that, my sexual experience with both my neurodiverse, long term sexual partners, is that neither of them could handle or liked wearing condoms.

Yeah, I don't think anyone (men/women/aspie/neurodiverse/people) really likes the feeling of them haha. However, I have a strong feeling that your partners were able to put them on at least and might like other things such as oral, which doesn't apply to my partner. I've never met someone as sensitive before (which is totally okay!, but makes things more difficult for us). Since I know that aspies often have higher sensitivity, which can be great at some times but challenging at other times, I hoped to find people on here who may have had similar experiences and advice on how to overcome these struggles.

Nevertheless, I really appreciate your point of view! Your and @Hypnalis' comment also challenge me to view the problems from a different perspective, which is: how would I approach the situation if I didn't know he was an aspie? Obviously I want to emphasize with him (as much as he want to emphasize with me), but emphasizing to much may also result in untrue assumptions and losing track of our own personal needs...

 

[Steelbookcollector217]

One of you is asexual?