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Those pesky emotions...

DogwoodTree

Still here...
This is kind of a spinoff from the other thread about caring...do you ever wish you could MAKE yourself stop caring?

Learned helplessness is such a hard thing to fight. Why do I care so much about wanting to be loved? About wanting to be understood? About wanting to be connected with people? Data wanted to be human. Sometimes I feel like he had the better deal already.

Honestly, I'm a very emotional person. It's all just buried so deeply inside, that sometimes even I can't get to it, much less bring it to the surface for anyone else to know that part of me. Not that they would want to know...but it's so heavy, so painful...it just seems like being able to get it out somehow would help.

There are days I so intensely hate myself. :(
 
I agree with you except for the last line, do not hate yourself, you are the one person you should always be able to know accepts you for who you are.
 
This is kind of a spinoff from the other thread about caring...do you ever wish you could MAKE yourself stop caring?

Learned helplessness is such a hard thing to fight. Why do I care so much about wanting to be loved? About wanting to be understood? About wanting to be connected with people? Data wanted to be human. Sometimes I feel like he had the better deal already.

Honestly, I'm a very emotional person. It's all just buried so deeply inside, that sometimes even I can't get to it, much less bring it to the surface for anyone else to know that part of me. Not that they would want to know...but it's so heavy, so painful...it just seems like being able to get it out somehow would help.

There are days I so intensely hate myself. :(
I think it comes from having purpose, even if for others. When we are needed or loved, it validates us, and offsets our deficits. When we don't love ourselves, we use as much of other people's love as needed,to boost our self esteem. The biggest problem with that scenario for me, is by empowering others to make me feel good about myself, in times of conflict, they can crush me with the same power. It's always hard to be understood, when we don't understand ourselves. Although it's a poor substitute, know that you are understood and accepted here.
 
This is kind of a spinoff from the other thread about caring...do you ever wish you could MAKE yourself stop caring?

Learned helplessness is such a hard thing to fight. Why do I care so much about wanting to be loved? About wanting to be understood? About wanting to be connected with people? Data wanted to be human. Sometimes I feel like he had the better deal already.

Honestly, I'm a very emotional person. It's all just buried so deeply inside, that sometimes even I can't get to it, much less bring it to the surface for anyone else to know that part of me. Not that they would want to know...but it's so heavy, so painful...it just seems like being able to get it out somehow would help.

There are days I so intensely hate myself. :(

I experience same/ similar issues. No advice, but you are not the only one with these struggles

Best wishes
 
Generally speaking, caring is one of the more positive human motivators to action. If I didn't care, then I wouldn't do things I need to do. It is the degree of caring that sometimes concerns me I guess. I don't want my emotional response to be disproportionate to stimuli.
 
you are the one person you should always be able to know accepts you for who you are.

That's really hard to do when I'm so much less than I should be, but thanks.

...by empowering others to make me feel good about myself, in times of conflict, they can crush me with the same power. It's always hard to be understood, when we don't understand ourselves. Although it's a poor substitute, know that you are understood and accepted here.

It doesn't even take conflict...sometimes, just apathy does the trick. But when I don't receive any "feel-good" energy from anyone else, there's nothing left in me to feel good about. I can only give what I've received, right?

This is an honest question...why is it so important to us to be understood? Why do I care so much about someone else understanding me, what makes me tick?

Generally speaking, caring is one of the more positive human motivators to action. If I didn't care, then I wouldn't do things I need to do. It is the degree of caring that sometimes concerns me I guess. I don't want my emotional response to be disproportionate to stimuli.

Another honest question...what does it mean to care? I've told myself in the past, "I know they care because they'd BE THERE for me if anything ever happened." But then...something happens, and they're not really there, not really. It's like...people tell themselves they "care" if they do something nice for someone...but fail to consider the outcome of their efforts. Did they actually make a difference? If not, do they care enough to try something else?

Is it even anyone else's responsibility to see that the outcome is successful? Maybe, really, I'm the only one responsible for my well-being, and if I'm not capable of healing myself, then I simply won't be healed. Because no one else could do it even if they really wanted to.

So then, caring isn't about helping to solve problems, it's simply about witnessing the struggle...cheering from the sidelines. Because really, what else can you do for someone with a mental illness, or financial difficulties, or family dysfunctions, or marriage struggles? There's no one around me who's a magic genie, waiting to snap his fingers in response to my three wishes.

I think my expectations in relationships are simply too high. To think that my efforts will ever be enough to truly please someone else...that's a codependent mentality, taking responsibility for someone else's happiness. To think that I could ever really be the real me with someone...it's an entitlement mentality, to expect the world to tolerate all of my selfishness and fears and eccentricities.

Maybe I can stop wanting to be understood, to be known fully and accepted fully in truth. Those of you who think that being married will give you all of these things...that's a fallacy. It doesn't really exist, even in long-lasting, solid, respectful marriages. Not saying my DH isn't loyal or tolerant, because he is, possibly to a fault. But to have those characteristics, he's also a "follower" kind of personality. He can accept without knowing, without understanding. Maybe that's really the best way to go.
 
This is an honest question...why is it so important to us to be understood? Why do I care so much about someone else understanding me, what makes me tick?

If it helps, I personally only care to the extent it is necessary to accurately communicate and pursue my goals in life. Either there is a benefit, or what does it matter really? I want my wife to understand be because we have fewer arguments, for example. A total stranger could misunderstand me, even to the point of thinking me a lesbian who only likes men, which would be totally irrational on multiple levels, and I wouldn't really care for all intents and purposes. That misconception has no impact for me.

Another honest question...what does it mean to care? I've told myself in the past, "I know they care because they'd BE THERE for me if anything ever happened." But then...something happens, and they're not really there, not really. It's like...people tell themselves they "care" if they do something nice for someone...but fail to consider the outcome of their efforts. Did they actually make a difference? If not, do they care enough to try something else?

Well, some "care" more than others, and some who claim to care don't ... at all. Someone may care enough to help you move heavy furniture, others might only care to pick up your mail while you're out of town. Others claim to care but would rather defecate through their eye sockets than help you. It's a spectrum all its own, I suppose. Granted, there are levels of caring between the mail thing and the eye sockets thing, but you get the point.

Is it even anyone else's responsibility to see that the outcome is successful?

No - many people irrationally hurt someone by acting in a way that they THOUGHT would help.

Caring is sort of like a crime (bear with me).

To commit a crime you need mens rea ("criminal intent," for simplicity sake) + actus reus (an act in furtherance of the criminal intent). If either of these elements are missing, then there is no crime. Different crimes are defined as requiring different levels or degrees of criminal intent (i.e., recklessness vs. malice).

Conversely, to "care," I believe you need to have mental state that is invested in helping the other person and you have to act on that mental state.

Now, it is not necessary to intend the actual result (since we cannot predict the future) if someone means to kill a man, but only manages to wound him, then there is still an attempted murder, which is still a crime. In the same way, someone who out of a legitimate desire to cheer you up buys you flowers is still caring even if he finds out afterwards that you are deathly allergic to most flowering plants.

Does that help you evaluate it?

Maybe, really, I'm the only one responsible for my well-being, and if I'm not capable of healing myself, then I simply won't be healed. Because no one else could do it even if they really wanted to.

You are the only person ultimately responsible for your well-being if you are a competent adult. Others, however, are under a duty to render aid whether they care or not.

Physicians and therapists have sworn oaths to help you and do no harm; moreover, they have entered into contracts to make every reasonable effort to the extent that you are paid up. Family and people who profess to "care" have lesser obligations commensurate with their level of care and moral/ethical convictions.

However, the buck stops with you. If you give up, then most others will too. Don't create a self-fulfilling prophesy where there is no hope. That only hurts you.

So then, caring isn't about helping to solve problems, it's simply about witnessing the struggle...cheering from the sidelines.

Depends on how much I care. Cheering you on is an act in furtherance of a legitimate caring state of mind. However, others may care enough to do more.

Most people who aren't blood relatives only care about you as much as you care about them, though. You want people to care about you, then you have to reciprocate. Some people are parasitic, so move on from them.

Because really, what else can you do for someone with a mental illness, or financial difficulties, or family dysfunctions, or marriage struggles? There's no one around me who's a magic genie, waiting to snap his fingers in response to my three wishes.

It depends on who you are, but a psychiatrist can often help with mental illness. A CPA or other advisor can help with financial difficulties. Family and marital counselors can help with these issues. Most are paid to care, but if you know some personally, then I hope you've invested some time caring about them and can expect some incoming reciprocation.

Others can care by giving you money to pay for the services of the above listed professionals. Magic genies are not necessary. If they were, then none of us would be okay.

I think my expectations in relationships are simply too high. To think that my efforts will ever be enough to truly please someone else...that's a codependent mentality, taking responsibility for someone else's happiness.

Wanting to please someone else is usually a good thing and is only co-dependent if you take it too far, such as by assuming responsibility for their happiness. The correct response is not to stop caring for a person - just to separate your sense of self worth from the results.

To think that I could ever really be the real me with someone...it's an entitlement mentality,

No it's not.

to expect the world to tolerate all of my selfishness and fears and eccentricities.

Would be an entitlement mentality. See - you had it 1/2 right. You can't set the same standards for all of humanity. Some people are closer to you, and you are entitled to expect more acceptance and understanding from them if they are to remain close to you. Total strangers are not obligated to do more than respect your basic legal rights.

Maybe I can stop wanting to be understood, to be known fully and accepted fully in truth.

Good luck with that - to some extent we all need to be understood, though perhaps not fully by everybody. You are mired down in absolutism with this post... S=If you can stop jumping to these extremes, then you will find it easier to be happy.

Those of you who think that being married will give you all of these things...that's a fallacy.

Have you ever been happily married? If not, then you lack the experience needed to support this statement. Of course, "all these things" is a little vague given your above statements. You are right that marriage is not the end all be all to happiness in life, but my wife accepts me, and we are very happy and loving with each other beyond the meaning of caring. I do things for her, and she does things for me. It's not perfect, but it is worthwhile with the right person.

It doesn't really exist, even in long-lasting, solid, respectful marriages.

Again with the extremes. This comment is so incredibly erroneous. Have you been evaluated as histrionic? I don't mean this as an attack, but I almost feel as though this comment is attention-seeking. I am no psychologist, but I sense there is something at issue here we're overlooking with your mental state. I really am just trying to help you through all this, even if that seems like a harsh observation.

I suppose to some extent, I "care," as I have experienced some of what you describe and wouldn't wish it on anyone. Also, I enjoy your posts, and I tend to care about people I like. Also, I am fond of dogwood trees. I'm not going to take a bullet for you or anything, but I hope the above helps.
 
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However, the buck stops with you. If you give up, then most others will too. Don't create a self-fulfilling prophesy where there is no hope. That only hurts you.

Excellent point...something I need to remember.

You want people to care about you, then you have to reciprocate. Some people are parasitic, so move on from them.

I try to. I feel like I actually push people away with my offers to help, as if I'm offering in ways that won't really help but they're being too nice to tell me. So then I get afraid to offer. Does that make sense?

Wanting to please someone else is usually a good thing and is only co-dependent if you take it too far, such as by assuming responsibility for their happiness. The correct response is not to stop caring for a person - just to separate your sense of self worth from the results.

This is one of the most useful statements I've read in a while. Thank you.

Have you ever been happily married? If not, then you lack the experience needed to support this statement.

I would say "yes"...to the extent that I believe it's possible, though maybe there's a whole realm of "soul-matedness" out there that I've yet to encounter.

We've been married for 18 years, neither of us has ever seriously considered leaving, we both work together as a team pretty well, whether that's parenting or finances or whatever. We build each other up with the things we say, both to each other and about each other. We make sacrificial efforts to make life easier and happier for each other. Though I've got to admit...he's been doing more of his fair share of sacrificing these past several months with the stuff I'm going through. But he does it with an honest heart, not with constant guilt trips or anything. I think he understands love a lot better than I do.

Again with the extremes. This comment is so incredibly erroneous. Have you been evaluated as histrionic? I don't mean this as an attack, but I almost feel as though this comment is attention-seeking. I am no psychologist, but I sense there is something at issue here we're overlooking with your mental state. I really am just trying to help you through all this, even if that seems like a harsh observation.

Symptoms of histrionic personality disorder:

http://psychcentral.com/disorders/histrionic-personality-disorder-symptoms/ said:
A pervasive pattern of excessive emotionality and attention seeking, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:

  • Is uncomfortable in situations in which he or she is not the center of attention
  • Interaction with others is often characterized byinappropriate sexually seductive or provocative behavior
  • Displays rapidly shifting and shallow expression of emotions
  • Consistently uses physical appearance to draw attention to themself [sic]
  • Has a style of speech that is excessively impressionistic and lacking in detail
  • Shows self-dramatization, theatricality, and exaggerated expression of emotion
  • Is highly suggestible, i.e., easily influenced by others or circumstances
  • Considers relationships to be more intimate than they actually are

  • I actually despise being the center of attention. I could go into details with specific examples, but probably not necessary. Other than on this board or in emails with my pastors (who have been working with me on this stuff this year), I actually avoid using first-person pronouns whenever possible.
  • No way I'd be classified as sexually seductive. Maybe my history of long-term child abuse (emotional, sexual, spiritual, psychological) has covered that up...but I've had several people, when I confided in them about my history, say they're shocked at how non-seductive I am. They can't quite figure out how I got through all of that without becoming promiscuous...instead, I'm shy, withdrawn, and modest. Actually, I think my tactile sensitivities played a part in preventing me from embracing the promiscuous role that my step-dad tried to create for me.
  • Up until a year ago, I rarely revealed any emotion whatsoever. Even over the past year, with trying to deal with family/background/intimacy issues, expressions of emotion are done only in my writing, not IRL.
  • I do like to dress decently, but always comfort first. I like lots of color, and clothes that help me look even younger than I already do.
  • I use tons of detail when I talk...too much. I do try to use expressive words, because those are more interesting, but as soon as I realize it's coming across as overly dramatic, I back off or even shut up altogether.
  • I am easily influenced by others' opinions of me, but not so much by their opinions of other things. I think this is more of a codependency thing than a histrionic personality thing. My mom's dad was an extreme alcoholic, and both my parents were mentally ill throughout my childhood. Though my mom and sisters and I have come a long way since I left for college, there are still some deep, serious codependent patterns in our family relationships.
  • Thinking that relationships are more intimate than they actually are...that's possible. But I think it also happens in reverse, where I assume people value me less than they actually do.
I get deeply depressed, and cycle through "high" times, too. I really think it's bipolar. I keep trying to find things in my life that I can blame the depression on...but as far as my life *today*, everything looks so perfect and wonderful:

My DH loves me, my kids are healthy and wonderful, my job is fulfilling (other than working with my mom and sister, who are codependent/overdependent), our finances are in decent shape overall, we're physically healthy.

There's a lot of flashbacks and junk making it hard to be comfortable with physical contact, and that makes things difficult in our marriage. Then this AS stuff helps explain why I can't even connect with the people who try to help us on that. So my conclusion is that the depression is here because there's something wrong with me, not something in my environment that I can just problem-solve. If I could just think better thoughts, it should go away, right? But it doesn't. When I think things are going well, a flashback sends me spinning, or a mood swing throws me out of whack, or I get overwhelmed just from life happening and people wanting me to be social.

Fact is, I can pile on all the labels I want. A lot of them do fit. But what's the point, other than to try and understand myself a little better, and the pitfalls I face? In the end, the only thing that changes anything is my choice to keep going, and doing the best I can.

I suppose to some extent, I "care," as I have experienced some of what you describe and wouldn't wish it on anyone. Also, I enjoy your posts, and I tend to care about people I like. Also, I am fond of dogwood trees. I'm not going to take a bullet for you or anything, but I hope the above helps.

I appreciate your comments, I really do. I have a tendency to argue down every offered insight since I've thought this stuff through so many times over the years already, so I apologize if it comes across that way. And I can't tell you how much I appreciate your forthrightness instead of trying to "beat around the bush" and pretend you're not saying what you're actually saying. :)
 
That's really hard to do when I'm so much less than I should be, but thanks.
You are you. There is no norm that says what that means, only you can decide that.
I have one rule I follow - I am the only person I have to live with for the rest of my life. This is by no means a selfish rule. I want to be a person I can like and live with, and I work hard to achieve that. I work on my perfectionism, and I try to accept myself the way I am. It's not always easy, but I believe it's the only way to be a good person, both for myself and for others.

This is an honest question...why is it so important to us to be understood? Why do I care so much about someone else understanding me, what makes me tick?
Maybe being able to connect to another person in a way defines your place in the world. Not being able to connect to someone kind of leaves one hanging in a limbo, if that makes any sense.

Another honest question...what does it mean to care? I've told myself in the past, "I know they care because they'd BE THERE for me if anything ever happened." But then...something happens, and they're not really there, not really. It's like...people tell themselves they "care" if they do something nice for someone...but fail to consider the outcome of their efforts. Did they actually make a difference? If not, do they care enough to try something else?
I believe that caring is essentially a selfish act. We do something for other people in order to make ourselves feel better, to resolve a situation that is causing us discomfort and/or to still our conscience. I always buy stuff for the beggars sitting outside my grocery store, a sandwich, a juice and a treat of some sort. I don't care enough to actively do something about their situation, partly because I feel they made a choice I don't agree with, but I still don't want them to starve. On the other hand, I have a friend who's in a very poor relationship and isn't doing well at all. As soon as I found out how bad things are for her, I decided to move back to the city so I could be closer to her, I found a new apartment and a new job, and meanwhile I make effort to meet her as much as I can, I have no idea if I'll be able to make her see how poorly she's being treated and leave, but I want to know I did all that was in my power. You could say I do this because I care, and it would be true, but it goes back to the same selfish principle of resolving a situation that is troublesome to me and making myself feel better. If it fails, I won't try anything else. It's not because I don't care, but because I care about myself more.



Is it even anyone else's responsibility to see that the outcome is successful? Maybe, really, I'm the only one responsible for my well-being, and if I'm not capable of healing myself, then I simply won't be healed. Because no one else could do it even if they really wanted to.
You are your own responsibility, unless you are incapable of choosing what's best for you anymore, and even then it's debatable. You cannot rely on others to make you happy or even to make you feel all right. It's impossible to help people who don't want to be helped.


So then, caring isn't about helping to solve problems, it's simply about witnessing the struggle...cheering from the sidelines. Because really, what else can you do for someone with a mental illness, or financial difficulties, or family dysfunctions, or marriage struggles? There's no one around me who's a magic genie, waiting to snap his fingers in response to my three wishes.
You can ease the burden. You can feed them for a day, you can cheer them up for a short while and make them remember there are good things in life too. My grandmother passed away last fall, she had a bad stroke and was paralyzed, unable to talk or function on her own, but she was still conscious. I jumped on the first plane and spent her last days sitting by her bed, telling her stories and keeping her company. I didn't fix anything, but she knew I was there, and I'd like to believe that I made her passing at least a little more bearable.

I think my expectations in relationships are simply too high. To think that my efforts will ever be enough to truly please someone else...that's a codependent mentality, taking responsibility for someone else's happiness. To think that I could ever really be the real me with someone...it's an entitlement mentality, to expect the world to tolerate all of my selfishness and fears and eccentricities.
I have a bit different approach to acceptance. While I love myself the way I am, I also feel it's my obligation to myself to be the best I can possibly be. I have the same approach to my partner. I love my boyfriend unconditionally, I accept him with all his stubbornness and social awkwardness, but because of that I also push him to improve and develop, because I feel I owe it to him. I don't want him to blindly accept me for who I am without pushing me to grow.

Maybe I can stop wanting to be understood, to be known fully and accepted fully in truth. Those of you who think that being married will give you all of these things...that's a fallacy. It doesn't really exist, even in long-lasting, solid, respectful marriages. Not saying my DH isn't loyal or tolerant, because he is, possibly to a fault. But to have those characteristics, he's also a "follower" kind of personality. He can accept without knowing, without understanding. Maybe that's really the best way to go.
Have you fully understood and accepted yourself? You can never look for your own fulfillment in others. You can always strive to know and understand better, but is there truly an end to it? I cannot say I know myself, even though I improve my self-knowledge every day. How could I possibly expect to ever truly know anyone else?
 
I get deeply depressed, and cycle through "high" times, too. I really think it's bipolar. I keep trying to find things in my life that I can blame the depression on...but as far as my life *today*, everything looks so perfect and wonderful:

My DH loves me, my kids are healthy and wonderful, my job is fulfilling (other than working with my mom and sister, who are codependent/overdependent), our finances are in decent shape overall, we're physically healthy.
This might be a little odd question, but if you could have exactly anything you want, what would your life be like? Do you have dreams?

There's a lot of flashbacks and junk making it hard to be comfortable with physical contact, and that makes things difficult in our marriage. Then this AS stuff helps explain why I can't even connect with the people who try to help us on that. So my conclusion is that the depression is here because there's something wrong with me, not something in my environment that I can just problem-solve. If I could just think better thoughts, it should go away, right? But it doesn't. When I think things are going well, a flashback sends me spinning, or a mood swing throws me out of whack, or I get overwhelmed just from life happening and people wanting me to be social.

Fact is, I can pile on all the labels I want. A lot of them do fit. But what's the point, other than to try and understand myself a little better, and the pitfalls I face? In the end, the only thing that changes anything is my choice to keep going, and doing the best I can.
Well, depression is a mental illness. It should be approached as such.
 
Well, depression is a mental illness. It should be approached as such.

This is a good point. Sometimes, we tend to attribute all of our issues to our AS or ASD. However, it is possible for someone with AS to also develop depression as a separate issue.

My doctor's approach is - AS is just how you are wired, there is no cure for it. If a person with AS is also depressed, then you treat the depression, just like you would with an NT person who is depressed.

I had a period of severe depression a couple of years ago, and my doctor prescribed an anti-depressant for me. I was on it for about six months and it did help me get through that period. I've been off of it for at least a year with no relapse. So talk to your MD.
 
I had a period of severe depression a couple of years ago, and my doctor prescribed an anti-depressant for me. I was on it for about six months and it did help me get through that period. I've been off of it for at least a year with no relapse. So talk to your MD.

I was treated for depression during college...a couple of different anti-depressants. They may as well have been sugar pills...didn't help at all. It kind of just made me feel zombie-like, but not "better" at all. I'm trying some natural supplements instead, and when I've got my routine going okay, I try to get in some regular exercise (which is supposed to be just as effective as anti-depressants).

I'm sorry I sounded so desperate earlier. That darkness moves in, and I can't even see straight. It's terrible. Then it will lift suddenly, and life is good again. I look over my journal entries from the past several months, and it looks like a roller coaster ride. Some days are positive and upbeat with encouraging insights and revelations about stuff that bothers me, and other days I'm barely holding on. Haven't quite figured out all of the triggers yet, and I can't always circumvent a crash once it starts.
 
This might be a little odd question, but if you could have exactly anything you want, what would your life be like? Do you have dreams?

I've thought about this a lot. And really, other than having healthier relationships with family members, there's not much I would change. For most of my life, I've had big dreams. But for the most part, I'm living that stuff now. Really, my life is great.

But about the time DH and I started walking out our dream of being self-employed...the mess in my relationships with my mom and sisters started revealing itself, and all of my defenses against the flashbacks started failing to where I couldn't stand being intimate with DH anymore. Both of those things caused huge problems for us. I reached out to my pastors for some help, and the deeper we dug for answers, the worse everything seemed to get.

I'm not the kind of person to just walk out whatever life hands me. I'm a fighter, very passionate about being all I'm supposed to be in this life, and helping others to realize their dreams, too. But this stuff has been unbearable, beyond anything I ever expected to have to face with it again.

I thought I had dealt with my past. But really, I had just "stuffed" it. And it came back. I'm not who I thought I was. I've been just as shocked at the things I've written as my pastors have been, maybe more so. I've told them over and over, "This is not who I want to be." "This isn't me." "I don't know who I am anymore."
 
I was treated for depression during college...a couple of different anti-depressants. They may as well have been sugar pills...didn't help at all. It kind of just made me feel zombie-like, but not "better" at all. I'm trying some natural supplements instead, and when I've got my routine going okay, I try to get in some regular exercise (which is supposed to be just as effective as anti-depressants).

I'm sorry I sounded so desperate earlier. That darkness moves in, and I can't even see straight. It's terrible. Then it will lift suddenly, and life is good again. I look over my journal entries from the past several months, and it looks like a roller coaster ride. Some days are positive and upbeat with encouraging insights and revelations about stuff that bothers me, and other days I'm barely holding on. Haven't quite figured out all of the triggers yet, and I can't always circumvent a crash once it starts.
When I'm focused on other people, or busy, I'm generally fairly upbeat. It's the time inside my head that brings the darkness. It feels like when the world stops, I cast no shadow
That without servitude, I'll cease to exist. Fortunately, the exits are clearly marked, and usually I can get out there before I sink too low. I know this is not healthy and a form of avoidance, but I do what I need to do, to survive
 
...the exits are clearly marked, and usually I can get out there before I sink too low. I know this is not healthy and a form of avoidance, but I do what I need to do, to survive

I've gotten better at this. With 4 kids in the house, it's not hard to find someone to serve, lol. Sometimes, though, it comes in so fast, or sneaks in, or tricks me into it...that part about avoidance--yes. That's the trap I fall into a lot. Do I do what it takes to not fall into the void? Or do I face it head-on and hope to find a way to beat it?
 
I've gotten better at this. With 4 kids in the house, it's not hard to find someone to serve, lol. Sometimes, though, it comes in so fast, or sneaks in, or tricks me into it...that part about avoidance--yes. That's the trap I fall into a lot. Do I do what it takes to not fall into the void? Or do I face it head-on and hope to find a way to beat it?
This is the age old question. Although many of us have similar generic issues, our situational environment is a key factor as well. For the most, meeting things head on involves being honest with yourself, and living a more honest life. Being more of yourself, and getting to the know the real you. The difficulty comes when your truth collides with those around you, and again it depends on who they are and whether they're willing to support you.
In my case, meeting things head on, has been catastrophic. My attempts to be open and honest, have offended many within my inner circle. I have found that many of my issues are underpinned by yet more issues. In dealing with one, I've bought further, more complicated issues to the surface. My family has no more patience or want to support me through my issues. As it causes them so much angst, I must suffer in silence, which ultimately means I'm dealing with nothing. My only advice to you DogwoodTree, is don't try and take this on without the support of your family. Your attempts may be taken the wrong way, if they don't have all the facts. Communication is paramount when you are the centre of someone else's world.
 
I've thought about this a lot. And really, other than having healthier relationships with family members, there's not much I would change. For most of my life, I've had big dreams. But for the most part, I'm living that stuff now. Really, my life is great.
This is just something I've observed with myself, I'm not an expert in any way.

When I've worked for a while to achieve something, and finally come to the point where I have most of what I've been hoping for, the feeling of content I had been expecting, wouldn't come. Instead there would be a sense of emptiness, which I felt was inappropriate. I knew I should be happy, but I really wasn't and it became a negative spiral for me.

What I've learned about myself is I am not capable of feeling content without having goals to strive for. I get bored and feel like I'm stagnating. I need to keep myself in constant development in one way or another, I have great need of new input.

I'm not sure if this makes any sense to you, or if it helps in any way.
 
This is just something I've observed with myself, I'm not an expert in any way.

When I've worked for a while to achieve something, and finally come to the point where I have most of what I've been hoping for, the feeling of content I had been expecting, wouldn't come. Instead there would be a sense of emptiness, which I felt was inappropriate. I knew I should be happy, but I really wasn't and it became a negative spiral for me.

What I've learned about myself is I am not capable of feeling content without having goals to strive for. I get bored and feel like I'm stagnating. I need to keep myself in constant development in one way or another, I have great need of new input.

I'm not sure if this makes any sense to you, or if it helps in any way.
There's no doubt that we all need purpose. You only have to look at how many elderly people die, when they retire. Their will to live being tied to their purpose or usefulness.
In most things we pursue, it's not the end we seek, it's the journey to get there. I have built many things in my lifetime, but I rarely use any of them. However the experience, the memories and the growth, I greatly value. Some of these things were just inanimate objects, but their life lessons were profound.
We are essentially perpetual motion, but without purpose we wither and die. When we stop engaging in new challenges, we're telling ourselves there's no more to learn. Is it any wonder we feel empty when we stop.
 
Hi, Dogwood Tree! Whether or not this helps... your thread moved me to share. I also read a bit of your blog.

I've been following this blog lately--A Healing Space... reflections on love and the intimacy of immediate experience, and reflecting on this guy (Matt Licata)'s perspective. This was a new perspective for me.

The gist: there is no "place" we can get to, no "destination" where happiness is, if only we could find our way there. Our whole being includes our darkness as well as our light.

Easier said than done, clearly... I've had a lot to grieve lately, but I can't run from it. I'm not going to get to some stage where I've overcome my emotions. They will always be intense. They are a gift from God, a gift inseparable from each living moment.

It's been weird to try to accept that the path is always going to be a path between falling apart and holding it together, as opposed to trying to run away from falling apart towards holding it together. This is new for me.

I don't know if this makes things better or worse, but either way, you'll be in my prayers! :)
 
The gist: there is no "place" we can get to, no "destination" where happiness is, if only we could find our way there. Our whole being includes our darkness as well as our light.

Easier said than done, clearly... I've had a lot to grieve lately, but I can't run from it. I'm not going to get to some stage where I've overcome my emotions. They will always be intense. They are a gift from God, a gift inseparable from each living moment.

Thanks, Daniel, this looks like a really interesting blog. I just read his posts about darkness and light, and fear of love. Both touch on a study I've been doing for about the past 6 months, about being *real* and giving up on earning love. Have you read any of Dan Allender's books? His book Cry of the Soul runs along these lines--it's the kind of book I'll read over and over, and there aren't many of those! He packs so much depth and wisdom into his books...I've really learned a lot from his writings these past few months.

I'm sorry for the struggles you've been experiencing. But I agree with you...those emotions are a gift from God. There's a part of His heart we can only experience in the midst of deep and abiding grief. It's just really hard to walk that out sometimes...but I truly believe that "the heart of the wise is in the house of mourning, but the heart of fools is in the house of pleasures."
 

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