Update!: Confused NT not wanting to dig a bigger hole

[Timo_WA]

Sorry this turned out so long. I am NT and admittedly new to all of this and I'm seeking some help understanding. I have an autistic friend that I met online. We have been talking for a few months, and we have recently become a lot closer. We speak every day (text), for hours every day. I have learned a ton in this time (from this friend as well as researching and trying to learn on my own so as to not put that burden solely on my friend) .

They have repeatedly told me, and shown me that they trust me and believe me to understand them quite well for being an NT (obviously still learning and screwing things up sometimes, but in general, it's been pretty smooth). I am not demanding, I keep everything at their discretion, I don't make stupid comments about mask dropping... I know my energy can be quite high at times, and I have mentioned it on many occasions that they can tell me to chill at any time and I won't be bothered, but I have been assured that they like it and they feel comfortable with me.

Our conversations have been pretty intimate, but in a platonic, deep caring kind of way, and that's why I am struggling right now. It went from feeling comfortable and close one day, to me waking up and them saying "don't get too close to me." -- background: we had a previous conversation where they said they were worried that they would drag me down. So my response to this "don't get too close to me" was to explain that I am unsinkable because I know who I am and I will always be ok no matter what goes on around me, and whatever fears they have are ok, and I am not going anywhere.

This was apparently a wrong assumption? Because the response was that they aren't saying it for me, they are saying it for them. They don't want me close, and that they don't worry about other people, only themself, and that me being close was giving them anxiety.

I am so confused because just the day before, having me around seemed to be their favorite thing, and now our entire chat history has been deleted, and I am a stranger. And of course my NT response was to try harder to find out what happened, to understand, and let them know I care, which only made it worse.

I just want to understand what happened. Do I just walk away now? Is he gone forever? Did I do something I wasn't supposed to? There has been zero rejection from either side until now, and from where I am standing, we went to bed perfectly fine and then woke up in a whole new world. The other thing that stands out to me is that I am the only one who is shut out. They are still posting and reaching out to others, which makes me feel like the shutdown is only toward me (if that's even what it is). Is that a thing? A directional shutdown and withdrawal?

I'm just looking for the right thing to do for my friend, and if that's walking away, I will do it. But they are really lonely and don't have many outlets, and that worries me and I miss them.

Gosh, thanks for reading if you made it this far.

 

[Judge]

It doesn't sound like you have done anything wrong. That in such cases perhaps the only thing you can do is to be agonizingly patient, just to see if he does bounce back, having recovered and re-energized. He may, and then again he may not. You appear to be at a disadvantage in that this is all about him- not you.

The one thing I can tell you from personal experience is that in the event of a shutdown, it is imperative that no one whatsoever attempts to intervene, even with the best of intentions. It's something I must come out of all on my own. Just not something I can- or want to share with anyone.

 

[Timo_WA]

It doesn't sound like you have done anything wrong. That in such cases perhaps the only thing you can do is to be agonizingly patient, just to see if he does bounce back, having recovered and re-energized. He may, and then again he may not. You appear to be at a disadvantage in that this is all about him- not you.

The one thing I can tell you from personal experience is that in the event of a shutdown, it is imperative that no one whatsoever attempts to intervene, even with the best of intentions. It's something I must come out of all on my own. Just not something I can- or want to share with anyone.

Thank you for reading through all that and taking the time to reply. I wish it was comforting to know it was nothing that I did. This might sound like a stupid question, but is it still a shut down if it's only me that is on the ban list?

 

[Judge]

This might sound like a stupid question, but is it still a shut down if it's only me that is on the ban list?

No telling how people react individually in a shutdown. Certainly no guarantees of rational behavior either. Been there, done that and deeply regretted some of it.

Some of us can be incredibly self-destructive socially speaking. Not intentional, but that it just happens.

 

[Timo_WA]

No telling how people react individually in a shutdown. Certainly no guarantees of rational behavior either.

So.... zero rules then. :lol: Damn, the uncertainty makes me feel so lost. And not being able to ask questions is winding me up. But I always said everything is at their discretion, and I intend to honor it. The NT instinct is to make sure they know you still care because we would feel like you didn't if there was no contact.. but in this case, the lack of contact is the care, I suppose. Beyond difficult.

 

[Judge]

So.... zero rules then. :lol: Damn, the uncertainty makes me feel so lost. And not being able to ask questions is winding me up. But I always said everything is at their discretion, and I intend to honor it. The NT instinct is to make sure they know you still care because we would feel like you didn't if there was no contact.. but in this case, the lack of contact is the care, I suppose. Beyond difficult.

It's really all there is. If you attempt to intervene even in the most positive way, odds are (IMO) things will go bad quite quickly. And we all have different ways and rates of coming out of such a funk. Where the best course of action is to do nothing.

Or choose to bail, where you were neurologically "over your head". No shame in it. Making connections with autistic people are certainly something only for a select few of NTs.

 

[Timo_WA]

It's really all there is. If you attempt to intervene even in the most positive way, odds are (IMO) things will go bad quite quickly. And we all have different ways and rates of coming out of such a funk. Where the best course of action is to do nothing.

Or choose to bail, where you were neurologically "over your head". No shame in it. Making connections with autistic people are certainly something only for a select few of NTs.

I'm definitely not interested in bailing. I have always had the incredibly fortunate ability to "fill my own cup" as that saying goes, and don't let anyone else drain it, so the roller coaster doesn't bother me for myself as much as I feel for their own suffering. I said that I will always be here, and I do mean it. I am no stranger to difficult or complicated relationships, and the more I learn and understand about ASD, the less the misunderstandings get to me because I know it's not on purpose. It's just difficult to navigate my own natural reactions sometimes not having any other experience specifically with an autistic person. Not to mention my strong craving for things to make sense... I always want to know why, and I have to be ok with there not being a why.

 

[Gerald Wilgus]

For his sake I hope he comes out of it or thinks beyond his overprotective seeming parents, and again connects with you. You need to bide your time. To me this is so sad because you seem accepting and caring, something I had little of until I met my spouse and I know how rare that is.

 

[Timo_WA]

For his sake I hope he comes out of it or thinks beyond his overprotective seeming parents, and again connects with you. You need to bide your time. To me this is so sad because you seem accepting and caring, something I had little of until I met my spouse and I know how rare that is.

Thanks so much for reading all that. He doesn't speak to his parents. He doesn't speak to anyone, really. I just see him reaching out to strangers on another app we are both on. It is sad, and I do hope he comes back. He always talks about battling loneliness, but it seems like he's ensuring it. I know it's not his fault, it's just hard to remember to not take it personally.

But I will listen and just let it be, as unnatural as that feels to me right now.

 

[Gerald Wilgus]

Thanks so much for reading all that. He doesn't speak to his parents. He doesn't speak to anyone, really. I just see him reaching out to strangers on another app we are both on. It is sad, and I do hope he comes back. He always talks about battling loneliness, but it seems like he's ensuring it. I know it's not his fault, it's just hard to remember to not take it personally.

But I will listen and just let it be, as unnatural as that feels to me right now.

I wonder that as your conversation turned more intimate if it triggered anxiety. Perhaps he is inexperienced with women? A good description is here. Inside The Mind Of Guys Who Are Shy And Inexperienced With Women | www.succeedsocially.com and I can confidently state that this applies to Autistics like me who were socially immature and with social anxiety.

 

[Timo_WA]

I wonder as your conversation turned more intimate it triggered anxiety. Perhaps he is inexperienced with women? A good description is here. Inside The Mind Of Guys Who Are Shy And Inexperienced With Women | www.succeedsocially.com and I can confidently state that this applies to Autistics like me who were socially immature and with social anxiety.

His anxiety is definitely triggered. He has had girlfriends in the past, he's not completely inexperienced. I let him lead everything and it's not intimate in a sexual way. Just in a close, human way, and he's the one who took it there. It has been a pretty close relationship from the start, but I guess this week did end up on a deeper level, that's why it's jarring. That level of comfort in an NT relationship of any kind indicates you've got a secure friend for life. To delete all of our chat history feels like he doesn't want to see what it was, and he wants to believe if for how he thinks it was instead. I just don't know what to think.

 

[Aneka]

Sorry this turned out so long. I am NT and admittedly new to all of this and I'm seeking some help understanding. I have an autistic friend that I met online. We have been talking for a few months, and we have recently become a lot closer. We speak every day (text), for hours every day. I have learned a ton in this time (from this friend as well as researching and trying to learn on my own so as to not put that burden solely on my friend) .

They have repeatedly told me, and shown me that they trust me and believe me to understand them quite well for being an NT (obviously still learning and screwing things up sometimes, but in general, it's been pretty smooth). I am not demanding, I keep everything at their discretion, I don't make stupid comments about mask dropping... I know my energy can be quite high at times, and I have mentioned it on many occasions that they can tell me to chill at any time and I won't be bothered, but I have been assured that they like it and they feel comfortable with me.

Our conversations have been pretty intimate, but in a platonic, deep caring kind of way, and that's why I am struggling right now. It went from feeling comfortable and close one day, to me waking up and them saying "don't get too close to me." -- background: we had a previous conversation where they said they were worried that they would drag me down. So my response to this "don't get too close to me" was to explain that I am unsinkable because I know who I am and I will always be ok no matter what goes on around me, and whatever fears they have are ok, and I am not going anywhere.

This was apparently a wrong assumption? Because the response was that they aren't saying it for me, they are saying it for them. They don't want me close, and that they don't worry about other people, only themself, and that me being close was giving them anxiety.

I am so confused because just the day before, having me around seemed to be their favorite thing, and now our entire chat history has been deleted, and I am a stranger. And of course my NT response was to try harder to find out what happened, to understand, and let them know I care, which only made it worse.

I just want to understand what happened. Do I just walk away now? Is he gone forever? Did I do something I wasn't supposed to? There has been zero rejection from either side until now, and from where I am standing, we went to bed perfectly fine and then woke up in a whole new world. The other thing that stands out to me is that I am the only one who is shut out. They are still posting and reaching out to others, which makes me feel like the shutdown is only toward me (if that's even what it is). Is that a thing? A directional shutdown and withdrawal?

I'm just looking for the right thing to do for my friend, and if that's walking away, I will do it. But they are really lonely and don't have many outlets, and that worries me and I miss them.

Gosh, thanks for reading if you made it this far.

Autism is no excuse or explaination for his behaviour, although it does impact his communication skills and style. It might have been a misunderstanding. You should definitely try to contact him. Tell him how you feel.
I grew distant to a friend because I believed she no longer wanted me! Another friend helped us reconnect. We will never be that close again but I now understand to take some time before jumping to conclusions. I need some more time until I have figured out how I feel about people and how people feel about me.

Also, focusing too much on his autism could have turned him away. I know you meant well but it's like constantly pointing out someone's wheelchair in a way (I don't have a better mental image).

 

[Timo_WA]

Autism is no excuse or explaination for his behaviour, although it does impact his communication skills and style. It might have been a misunderstanding. You should definitely try to contact him. Tell him how you feel.
I grew distant to a friend because I believed she no longer wanted me! Another friend helped us reconnect. We will never be that close again but I now understand to take some time before jumping to conclusions. I need some more time until I have figured out how I feel about people and how people feel about me.

Also, focusing too much on his autism could have turned him away. I know you meant well but it's like constantly pointing out someone's wheelchair in a way (I don't have a better mental image).

I did contact him more than a day later, and told him how I felt. He only continued to say the fact that I felt the need to explain and ask questions demonstrates I don't understand and that his worry about me getting too close was true.

I might have misrepresented our relationship. While I am hyper aware of it, I don't think I outwardly focus on his autism, or bring it up at all until he wants to explain something. I think the conventional feeling of the relationship is what lured me into a false sense of comfort with someone who seems fairly incapable of long term comfort.

 

[Atrapa Almas]

Hello,

He probably do have good reasons to what he did. We cant know what did happened, what was his feelings, fears or thougths.

One thing that tends to surprise of Autistic people is on the sensory level. Some of them may hear, smell or be aware of details that for 99% of human population would be impossible.

One thing you could do is to recomend him this forum. Maybe he will solve the mystery by himself.

 

[Thinx]

Sorry you are up against this. I do resonate with the possible confusion and panic he may have felt, and could be that his need to control that has made him act drastically. It could be he might look back on that with a different insight, but that might take some time.

Very difficult for you, you did well to seek understanding elsewhere, though also, I guess we don't know him and our insights about autism may not be the explanation for his situation and behaviours.

I'm a bit uncertain about them saying, they don't worry about anyone else, only themselves? Is that the actual phrase? Have they said that before? How do you think they meant that?

Guess I wonder if your patient steadiness has been a bit too thorough, in that he may feel it's ok to cut off without regard to your feelings? He may think you said that would be ok, and/or he may really be generally oblivious to the feelings of others, in the short term at least. Hard to know.

 

[Timo_WA]

Sorry you are up against this. I do resonate with the possible confusion and panic he may have felt, and could be that his need to control that has made him act drastically. It could be he might look back on that with a different insight, but that might take some time.

Very difficult for you, you did well to seek understanding elsewhere, though also, I guess we don't know him and our insights about autism may not be the explanation for his situation and behaviours.

I'm a bit uncertain about them saying, they don't worry about anyone else, only themselves? Is that the actual phrase? Have they said that before? How do you think they meant that?

Guess I wonder if your patient steadiness has been a bit too thorough, in that he may feel it's ok to cut off without regard to your feelings? He may think you said that would be ok, and/or he may really be generally oblivious to the feelings of others, in the short term at least. Hard to know.

Thanks for taking the time to help. Yes, that was an actual phrase. It was never said before, and certainly never seemed that way until that day. He has had an overload on me before, but smaller, and when I contacted him and told him how I felt, he apologized and everything was great again. Said he wanted to try harder to not be so reactionary.

I really wish our messages weren't deleted, it would be easier to go back and see word for word what was said, but it's all gone now. I do remember one of the last things he said was "It's just who I am. I can be your best friend and then disappear for weeks or months. you shouldn't feel bad though". He just turned into a cold stranger. And then I gave it a day and I wrote back asking what happened, what it all means, and if he didn't want me to be a part of his everyday anymore, or if he wants me to go away altogether, and the only response I got was that my asking all these questions after only a day "proves that I am too close." Personally, all I think it proves is that I care and that I don't like being dropped and confused, but everyone has their perspective.

I have never been any closer than he is. He leads, so if he is panicking because I am too close, that was his own doing. I reciprocate, I don't push. The night before he was very vulnerable and open, and it was a happy day, laughing and joking and just being close friends, and the next day was a stone wall.

I mean, I am ok. I will be ok, but his change came before I mentioned that, and I only did because I was worried that he was going back to that same thinking that he will 'sink me'. Ironically, he's only sinking himself. He is currently on an open forum talking about how lonely he is. I can't wrap my head around it. My NT brain felt like he needed assurance that he's not a burden to me, but it seemed to make it worse, and he turned it around like I am the burden to him, giving him anxiety. Until this point, all he's ever said is how much he likes having me around and how I am comfortable and safe.

Sorry about the novel. :lol: I hate being confused.

Edit: The very last thing that was said to me when he was responding (or not responding, really) to the questions I had was "don't get too close to me. I will push you away. And eventually run away". But I haven't pushed anything. Ever. Unless he counts asking him wtf just happened as pushing.

 

[Tom]

This is not really very unusual. Have read many similar posts. Short answer is all you got to go by is their actions. There is no code book to decipher how 'this' actually means 'that'.

Are you really unsinkable? The Titanic had some sort of separate bulkheads. It didin't work, but the theory had merit, sort of. What do you have?

 

[SusanLR]

Can't know what is going on inside his head, but, from 65 years of my own experience as autistic,
it is a mixed thing: Lonely-yet not wanting to be too close.

I have pushed people away who I thought of as just comfortable friends.
Suddenly they express deeper feelings or the desire for more from the relationship.
Things went alright as long as we both knew it was a relationship that was not going to lead
to romantic "I'm in love with you."
To me that meant it could lead to them wanting to live together, marry, faithful to only each other,
so on and so forth.
The usual things most people want in life.

This was not what I wanted nor was looking for. If they knew and accepted that, fine.
If it was asked for or headed in that direction, no.
I have told a couple of guys I'm not looking for marriage or a really close relationship and left
the relationship.
We aren't all that way.
Many seek a union relationship.
I've known more on the spectrum that don't.

It's not your fault.
And part of it is insecurity from believing if someone really gets to know the real
everyday unmasked me, they won't understand and in time it will lead to hurt.

 

[Timo_WA]

Can't know what is going on inside his head, but, from 65 years of my own experience as autistic,
it is a mixed thing: Lonely-yet not wanting to be too close.

I have pushed people away who I thought of as just comfortable friends.
Suddenly they express deeper feelings or the desire for more from the relationship.
Things went alright as long as we both knew it was a relationship that was not going to lead
to romantic "I'm in love with you."
To me that meant it could lead to them wanting to live together, marry, faithful to only each other,
so on and so forth.
The usual things most people want in life.

This was not what I wanted nor was looking for. If they knew and accepted that, fine.
If it was asked for or headed in that direction, no.
I have told a couple of guys I'm not looking for marriage or a really close relationship and left
the relationship.
We aren't all that way.
Many seek a union relationship.
I've known more on the spectrum that don't.

It's not your fault.
And part of it is insecurity from believing if someone really gets to know the real
everyday unmasked me, they won't understand and in time it will lead to hurt.

Thanks for this insight. I can see how this could happen. But I honestly wasn't taking it there. We are on opposite sides of the planet, there is no chance of this being taken anywhere and I don't think any lines were crossed. It doesn't help that on top of everything else, he's insecure, fears abandonment, depressed, etc.

But I do know that he is seeking a relationship. Not that he's seeking it with me, but just in general. I think it's the one thing he wants most in the world.

 

[Timo_WA]

This is not really very unusual. Have read many similar posts. Short answer is all you got to go by is their actions. There is no code book to decipher how 'this' actually means 'that'.

Are you really unsinkable? The Titanic had some sort of separate bulkheads. It didin't work, but the theory had merit, sort of. What do you have?

haha! it's funny because he mentioned the titanic (Part of him being skeptical of every claim I make). I have an innate aptitude for self preservation. Am I invincible? Surely not. I can get hurt. I am hurt now, but no one is going to sink me. I've been through divorce, betrayal, abandonment, and I am always ok. A friend struggling and sometimes saying and doing things they don't mean is not going to do it, despite how horrible he thinks he is.