Why non-verbal?

[Rodafina]

Interesting, but I've seen videos on YouTube of someone asking a non-verbal autistic person a simple yes or no question and they quickly tapped in yes or no on their keyboard without looking like they were thinking about it. What stops them from saying yes or no, or even shaking their head or nodding?

This is how I understand it…

I think it’s like asking you to use something other than your most instinctual way to answer a question. For you and many others, it sounds like a verbal answer is the easiest and the most natural.

For some of us, it is not as instinctual to express ourselves verbally because it is so taxing and can be anxiety inducing. Processing speech (receptive and expressive) and engaging the motor skills to talk can be taxing to some brains and most humans instinctually conserve energy resources for survival. So, learning and acquiescing to verbal communication takes more brain power for some of us.

 

[Ella Spell]

My dx is ASD Level 2 and ADHD. I've also had two strokes. The first one caused me to lose my speech for a while and then I had word salad especially with compound words. I'd always get one half of the compound wrong. The strokes didn't cause this though, because I was in SLP since I was young.

 

[Ella Spell]

Perfect response, @Rodafina!

 

[Judge]

I didn't begin to speak in complete sentences until I was four years old. Many years later my mother once mentioned it to me, and I smiled and said, "I probably just didn't have anything to say at the time."

Though I don't think I was kidding either. I suspect my mother knew it as well. Though beyond that I seem to lead a predictable life going onto kindergarten and the first grade....and so on.

 

[Ella Spell]

Another consideration for me, at least, is trauma. My CPTSD is so profound that I'm afraid of opening my emotional wheel well, lest I burst into tears or have to confront any of it. I'm scared of overwhelming people because I don't even tell close family what I've ben through. Something simple like admitting that I feel happy or sad in a random situation triggers emotional flashbacks on a subconscious level so it's easier to lock the whole thing down and not try articulating emotions at all. Rather than telling someone I feel happy or sad for them I'll do actions, like surprising them with a gift, a thank you card, a celebratory note, or whatever. That way I can take my time and edit how I want it done or written.

 

[Misty Avich]

I'm not exactly familiar with the topic of PDD-NOS. What do you mean? And which ones are "these"? Asperger's or PDD-NOS? It seemed to me that it's a quite broad category... a developmental disorder means that some things are "out of synch" and that the brain has a hard time damping signals for whatever reason, including ADHD, which is also a neurodevelopmental disorder. "Development" in medical terms means damping and synchronization of signals. My diagnosis is Asperger's syndrome. (Of course, it's an outdated diagnostic unit now, but I guess doctors are still using old terms)

For a lot of people on the spectrum it makes sense that they don't identify with a functioning level, which is understandable.
But for some of us, our ASD can be merely a set of complex traits that are usually masked by instinctive verbal skills developed typically from early childhood. People with PDD-NOS or Asperger's can come across as quirky or nervous but otherwise considerably skilled socially in a lot of ways, although it's not an accurate description for everyone with Asperger's or PDD-NOS.

PDD-NOS stands for Pervasive Developmental Disorder-Not Otherwise Specified. I was diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome in childhood but in adulthood I've been told by a psychiatrist that I'm PDD-NOS. Sometimes I don't always know who I am, but the ADHD diagnosis has made me understand myself a bit more, as I identify with more ADHD symptoms than autism symptoms (even though all the ADHD symptoms seem to appear as autism traits in people discussing autism on forums like these, but then again every possible trait and symptom of every possible disorder seems to be a symptom of autism so I'm not sure who has autism and who doesn't any more, but that's a different thread).

 

[Outdated]

For a lot of people on the spectrum it makes sense that they don't identify with a functioning level, which is understandable.
But for some of us, our ASD can be merely a set of complex traits that are usually masked by instinctive verbal skills developed typically from early childhood. People with PDD-NOS or Asperger's can come across as quirky or nervous but otherwise considerably skilled socially in a lot of ways, although it's not an accurate description for everyone with Asperger's or PDD-NOS.

Thanks for this description, it gives me a slightly different perspective on my own view of myself. It appears as far as I can tell that I have just straight autism with no comorbities, and except for the past couple of years I have always been very social. As you described, highly skilled in social interactions in face to face situations to the point that I can be an extremely efficient con man when I want something and I always leave people feeling grateful to me for allowing them to help.

In this regard I have trouble relating to a lot of posts on this forum where people have social struggles. I try to understand and I add my two bob's worth if I think it will help, but a lot of the time I feel like the odd man out here.

 

[Ella Spell]

but then again every possible trait and symptom of every possible disorder seems to be a symptom of autism so I'm not sure who has autism and who doesn't any more, but that's a different thread).

The people who have autism are the people who were dx with it by meeting the right criteria from whichever version of DSM, and / or the ICD. The symptoms of other conditions don't matter.

 

[vergil96]

Sometimes I don't always know who I am, but the ADHD diagnosis has made me understand myself a bit more, as I identify with more ADHD symptoms than autism symptoms (even though all the ADHD symptoms seem to appear as autism traits in people discussing autism on forums like these, but then again every possible trait and symptom of every possible disorder seems to be a symptom of autism so I'm not sure who has autism and who doesn't any more, but that's a different thread).

A lot of symptoms of ASD and ADHD overlap. I was told I have ADHD before, on the other hand and I think I might have both ASD and ADHD.

So... I figure you have traits of ADHD and meet some criteria of ASD as well, but not all of them?

I also don't think I have social difficulties, it's just the eye contact. Often, I can't hear people properly when trying to look at them at the same time. And looking people straight in the eye is overwhelming too, so I look at noses and eyebrows instead. I wasn't aware until recently that I'm doing anything any different than everyone else in that regard. Apart from being aware that I'm distractable. But yeah, info-dumping is an ADHD trait too. Perhaps a person with ADHD would struggle with maintaining eye contact due to understimulation, not overstimulation. Struggling to do a few things like listening and looking at the same time is overstimulation.

Going through the diagnostic criteria, stimming is present in both, routine I'm not sure, special interests can be both, sensory issues could be both, but... I have a friend who has ADHD and he for example is distracted by random noises, but he doesn't find them to completely jam the sound and to be loud like me. He also doesn't get angry at ambulances, because the volume is just too much. I suspect that in the case of routine the reasons for sticking to a routine might be a bit different in ADHD and ASD.

But all in all, maybe the two conditions aren't really that separate and can can overlap. A lot of people have both at the same time. Maybe there is no clear set in stone boundary.

 

[vergil96]

I was diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome in childhood but in adulthood I've been told by a psychiatrist that I'm PDD-NOS.

Oh, I recalled now, for some people the symptoms of ASD and ADHD can get milder or completely disappear with age. For example I know someone who "grew out of" oversensitivities, but not difficulties with eye contact.

For a lot of people on the spectrum it makes sense that they don't identify with a functioning level, which is understandable.

I personally don't think functioning levels carry that much meaning from the standpoint of someone who isn't a doctor. I come from a famiily in which there are many doctors and tbh I suspect that the levels might indicate the presence of intellectual disabilities or comorbidities, not how pronounced the autism symptoms are by themselves. Diagnostic criteria usually work like that - severe means causing an impairment of function, not how pronounced the symptoms are.

 

[Outdated]

Oh, I recalled now, for some people the symptoms of ASD and ADHD can get milder or completely disappear with age. For example I know someone who "grew out of" oversensitivities, but difficulties with eye contact.

I seem to be having the opposite problem, as I'm getting older it's getting harder to tell what's autism and what's grumpy old man syndrome.

 

[Misty Avich]

While my ASD symptoms are less, my ADHD has become more prominent as I'm getting older.

 

[vergil96]

I seem to be having the opposite problem, as I'm getting older it's getting harder to tell what's autism and what's grumpy old man syndrome.

I think I used to hide it more, because I wanted to fit in as a teenager and now I'm doing what I'm comfortable with more often.

 

[Mary Terry]

How beautifully written, I love the picture you painted and imagine my son and I having similar conversations as he grows. I also tell him every day, several times a day, that I love him and wouldn't change a thing about him. And that's the truth!! The reason I'm worried about him not speaking right now is because he is approaching school age and I'm terrified at the thought of taking him to school when he is unable to tell me if something happens.
We are starting speech therapy tomorrow, so I'm hoping we can find a way to communicate before he starts school.
Thank you for sharing your beautiful story

My nephew attended regular public school. He had an IEP (many people here can tell you all about that), an assigned advocate and tutoring assistance throughout school. From all appearances, his experience at school was good. He had friends and teachers who were devoted to him. His senior year of high school, four of the cutest girls (cheerleaders and beauty queen types) invited him to the prom. All four of them took him to the prom in a limousine, danced with him and took numerous photos. Maybe because it was a small school in a rural setting or that the kids at that school were raised to be kind and accepting to others, or maybe he was just lucky, but school was a positive experience for him. I think that if any child had bullied him, that the other kids would have immediately come to his defense.

I hope your son has a similarly good experience at school. Stay vigilant as you are doing, in close contact with his teachers, and ask questions. You and he deserve answers to everything. Schools today are better about helping children who are "different" than they were in the past, and your son may thrive there. But if he doesn't, you may have to find another way to educate him.

This website is a great place for information and support, and I'm pulling for you, Mom.

 

[NB79]

i know non verbal people can be as smart as anyone else, my hit or miss shot at this is that they feel bad talking simple as that, they somehow don't feel comfortable talking, but is not a conscious decision.

 

[tazz]

I'm not trying to be facetious here, I realise this is an important and serious topic, but perhaps a little humor will be appreciated also... this conversation reminds me of this joke about a child who doesn't speak until he's 5 years old:

 

[Outdated]

I'm not trying to be facetious here, I realise this is an important and serious topic, but perhaps a little humor will be appreciated also... this conversation reminds me of this joke about a child who doesn't speak until he's 5 years old:

Not intended to disparage here, just commenting on my own funny quirks. I was unable to follow it and was unable to watch it to the end because of the way they kept swapping from speaker to speaker with the one story. It was too confusing and I couldn't keep up.

It's a shame because I want to hear the end of the joke now. I'll try it again later.

[Edit] I grew up on British humour and grew up among a lot of Brits, I have no trouble with any of the accents, it's just the way they keep swapping back and forth so quickly, it disorients me.

 

[Rodafina]

I'll try it again later.

If you can’t get through it, I’ll write you up a transcript.

 

[tazz]

The joke:


A couple adopt a german baby and he doesn't speak.
They take him to the doctor and they run all sorts of tests.
They think maybe he's deaf or dumb.
He passes all the tests - no-one can understand why he doesn't speak.
Then, one day...
They give him some apple strudel.
The kid tastes it and says "This apple strudel is a little tepid".
The parents are shocked...
They exclaim "Wolfgang, you've never spoken before, after all these years now you finally speak! Why have you never spoken before?"
The kid says...

Spoiler: Punchline

"Up until now, everything has been satisfactory."