A school aspies club

[Christian T]

Okay, so could you say anything about those two issues they raised - thanks so much for what you've already suggested, I really appreciate it.

 

[Soup]

The entire team picking thing stopped in our schools over 20 yrs ago because the harm it did to less popular or capable students was apparent & cruel. Even for such things as group projects, students are never in the position to pick favourites. In this last situation, strong students would immediately form a super group since everyone knew who was good at what.

Part of what's incredibly hard about teaching is that you may have 27 kinds in a classroom, 5-7 of whom have been deemed 'special needs' students. One may be an Autie or have Down's Syndrome, another has oral/aural challenges & the others have ADHD or ADD. Then come the other 20. Two-three are bound to be gifted or very strong students. The rest have their own issues ranging from poverty, to family problems, to defiance or other things. 'Normal' really doesn't exist. Those who are older than I often never received much teacher specific training: they entered with a BA in English or some other discipline & were allowed in some areas, to teach. BIG MISTAKE.

These people are not trained to be doing this. they never studied child development, educational psych, education systems & philosophy, instructional maths, brain development, pedagogy & a whole range of other specific areas we spend 4 yrs at Uni learning & that after 2 yrs of CEGEP plus previous experience working with kids (babysitting doesn't count!). In QC, the laws have changed requiring all new teachers (as of 2006) to do the full 4 yr programme regardless of any other degrees they may hold. Before that, if you had a degree in another area, you could do 2 yrs of education & get a teaching license.

We need to be very flexible in a 1 size fits all system. Each kid has his own learning style & we need to be able to modify our teaching techniques in order to enable all students to learn. Time constraints plus the presence of sometimes quite severely impacted special needs students in regular classrooms renders this almost impossible. We're being expected to wear too many hats. Here in QC we also have a massive influx of new immigrant kids from countries where neither English nor French are spoken. Some schools offer des classes d'accueil for them, but sometimes there are too many to integrate adequately. Immigrant kids are here because their families chose QC. Adapting is still difficult, but the most challenged kids are from refugee families. When my son was young, there was a sudden influx of Tamil refugees fleeing a crisis in SriLanka. The school suddenly became over 40% Tamil overnight. These poor kids had witnessed horrors, lost loved-ones, some had been shot themselves AND they had no idea where the heck they were!!! Most were from rula severely underdeveloped areas & had never seen the technologies we take for granted. Few had ever even seen a non-Indian-type person since they didn't have tv & rural Sri Lanka is not a tourist Mecca. Same goes for the Dinka kids from Sudan who found themselves in rural Calgary.

THere are massive cultural differences & communication problems with parents. Some come from strict patriarchies & have a hard time understanding that they must respect female authority figures here & boy students cannot just push or smack a female one out of the way, or shout over her. Simple things like learning that a woman in pants is NOT a criminal (in parts of Sudan it is a death penalty offence!) is new to them. Since they didn't choose to be here, it's even harder.

We're expected to be social workers, guidance counsellors, psychologists, nutritionists & sometimes police officers! All this interferes with the ability to teach effectively. The entire system (here & in many other places) needs to be re-vamped.

 

[Christian T]

Thankyou very much for that excellent insight. I've always tried to have as much respect for teachers as possible, because I'm constantly learning more of the complexities of their job. Handling the refugee influx sure sounds tough, I couldn't imagine something that challenging - everyone knows the Australia government's attitude towards refugees (at least I think they do).

Still, good to hear they've added those extra qualifications, and that team picking was abolished in Canada - it's sadly still going over here.

I think I'll remind the club members of how difficult it is on both sides - for teachers and students. It seems to me that it really is a joint effort that's required there.

Thanks again.

 

[Soup]

Thanks for the support! We need all of it we can get. Please try speaking to your teachers about the impact team picking has on students. Suggest alternative methods like ability grouping instead: many teachers love to hear from engaged students about teaching issues. The teacher knows who is good at this or that & can ensure that teams are evenly distributed. Odds are this balances out elsewhere where the kid who sucks at a team sport is good at computers, maths or sciences & can then assist the kid who may not be as proficient in these subjects.

While it is hard on both sides, the primary responsibility has to be on the teachers & staff since we're the trained pros & the kids have no training of any kind AND no choice but to be there every day.

I've read extensively about the problems in Australia with refugees, immigrants & racism in general. The irony of it isn't lost on people here since we all know who the indigenous people of Australia are & what their sad & disturbing fate has been. Who has really posed the threat to whom? All history aside, the world is becoming smaller: not larger & we must learn to live with & among people who are different to ourselves peaceably & civilly. For us Aspies, this is especially true: we simply cannot afford to look askance at each other because this Aspie's skin, that one's eye shape, the other guy's accent is different to our own. We're a minority within all other minorities & bigotry is a luxury we can't afford (or more accurately a vice in which we cannot afford to indulge).

 

[Christian T]

We've now had a couple more meetings and the group is starting to solidify. I've been unsure of whether to give it more structure or just leave it as a general place for discussion, but it seems that people are comforted just be us getting together, having a chat and being there for each other. Just a few days after it was formed, the school had a teary mother calling in to ask for help with her even more teary anxious 13-year-old aspie son who's finding it impossible to talk to any of his scary peers, and taking all of the other boys' lighthearted comments very seriously. From what I can gather, so many chaotic signals are confusing him. The mum really appreciated being referred to our group, rather than getting empty words, but at the moment he seems to shy to even speak to us, so I'll be meeting with him and/or his mum and the assistant principal to help him. I hope I can use my insider knowledge to help, but I haven't actually met him yet so it's difficult to say much more.

The very silent member of the club is contributing, but again only when I specifically ask him to. I've asked him openly about his silence, which he didn't mind, and to which he just explained that he prefers to stay quiet and just listen, except when he's with family and very close friends. I'll give him time - he's a great kid, and we're slowly getting to know him.

Sorry I haven't updated this for a whole week, but the school workload has been quite heavy for me over the last few days.

 

[Soup]

THanks again for finding time to update us! This is one thread I watch for. Congratulations on the wya you've slipped so naturally into a leadership role here. You will make a huge difference in these kids' lives with your club. Your insider's knowledge is one thing: your openness & commitment to helping others is noteworthy & flies in the faces of those who say we Aspies are incapable of empathy. Like with many other things, we just express it differently so the NT world often misses it. We're NOT the only ones who miss things: it goes both ways.

 

[Christian T]

Thanks so much Soup, that really means a lot to me to hear that from you.

Like with many other things, we just express it differently so the NT world often misses it. We're NOT the only ones who miss things: it goes both ways.

That's so perfectly put, I couldn't agree more with you. We feel and understand emotions just as much as any NT - it's in the communication of these emotions that things get messy, and where a lot of things are lost in translation.

I'm sure that distraught boy is a very kind, compassionate, fun-loving soul. His classmates just need to learn his language, and he needs to learn theirs.

 

[Christian T]

Our latest meaning was fun - the first time we played a game together (celebrity heads) just to see how it worked with 8 aspies. Pretty much the same as NTs really - it was as unexpectedly complicated as ever. As a last note, I asked them whether they find that they frequently interrupt people, or miss opportunities to speak in large groups and classrooms (the simplistic social rule is that its rude to interrupt people, but realistically NTs are hardly offended if someone does so. It's another complexity of the senseless battlefield that is social interaction). They agreed, but we didn't really have time to add much else.

It was a very enjoyable meeting, enhanced by the attendance of a curious teacher who's empathetic towards people with disabilities and wanted to see what we had here. He plans to come again, which is great, and we also have another curious NT with some aspie tendencies who has expressed interest in coming in order to educate herself.

Sadly, it's the last meeting I'll have with them for a while. It's the end of term, and the French trip spills over to the first week of next term, so I won't see them for a month. They said they'll tell me what happens in the next meeting, and also said that it'll be interesting without me because I'm almost always relied upon to keep the conversation going. I'm sure it'll be good though, this club isn't just about me.

Oh, and since I forgot to post about last session (sorry!): I lent a couple of members the DVD of Mary and Max and the novel The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Nighttime. I thought they'd appreciate these two humorous yet poignant stories as entertainment that they can relate to a bit better. We also had a boy drop in for a few minutes out of curiosity to listen to our discussions, and we talked about whether we start conversations on inspiration, or move to start one and wait for the inspiration to come.

 

[Soup]

Thanks again for remembering to update us! I bet this thread has many fans. I almost feel like a long distance member of this club. As for the trip away, the month will fly by & you'll have much to discuss from your travels. The other Aspies will have interesting stuff to share about how they address the issues surrounding maintaining a conversation. Also, it'll be an experience to learn what happens when you have a group of Aspies & the conversation does stop. Perhaps it won't be a big deal for them since the gaps in chattering NTs find socially awkward, we sort of expect.

Also, if the subject you guys discussed (the role of inspiration) arises again, you might want to ask more specifically something like this: 'What makes you want to talk to someone else (aside from having a specific need such as when ordering food or buying something)?' The whole 'inspiration' thing would've confused the daylights out of me in the context of reaching out to converse with someone: I bet your club members did better with the topic than I would have.

Your club seems to be attracting new members & curious onlookers every time you meet! I hope someone is writing down what occurs at each meeting. This would help you chart progress & monitor interest in the different topics & activities. You've really started something great here!

 

[Geordie]

I read this thread's posts all over, and I feel really proud of you, Christian.

Now I think everyone has a way to communicate with others, so well, we'll all eventually discover the strengths of everyone else

 

[Christian T]

Thanks so much Geordie and Soup. I'm so happy with the way it's been going.
I think the gaps in conversation might be partly due to the fact that they know I'm there to steer it along. Without me there, I'm sure they'll take the initiative themselves, and won't end up sitting in silence for half an hour! But yes, we're all very tolerant of awkward pauses (particularly those where I accidentally overload that extremely quiet boy!)

It's not surprising, Soup, that you were baffled by the inspiration question, because I just threw you a really brief and vague outline of the topic. The topic usually becomes clearer, fuller and more specific as we go along with the discussion, but thanks for that suggestion, I will take it on board if I bring it up again with them.

And, I suppose I really should be keeping more records, although I posts on here have served much of that purpose!

It's great that you feel like a long-distance member. If there's anything you wanted me to ask them for you, just tell me. The teachers who've been supervising it have asked if there's anything in the classroom that they could do differently to benefit aspies. We haven't really had the time to discuss that fully, but of course that's a topic you'd be especially interested in. What do you teach, by the way?

Oh, et d?cidemment, j’attends ce s?jour avec beaucoup d’impatience ! Je suis s?r qu’il sera inoubliable et tr?s enrichissant.

 

[Geordie]

Yeah, I also think myself as a long-distance member of your school's Aspie club, too

My school's management had not been supportive for the club, though, because I was referred to my local autism society for support. Well, I have nothing against them... They got to realise Aspies are everywhere, anywhere.

 

[Soup]

More gregarious Aspies like the 2 of you are very important to the fledgling Aspie international/scholastic/cultural landscape. Since many of us are total hermits, others are not very social & some are too shy or anxious to be vocal, we really need our intelligent extroverts. Many who won't speak up about concerns & needs to a NT will do so to people like yourselves. This will give many a voice they never had.

 

[Geordie]

We'll speak up for all Aspies in our communities

 

[Megan]

That sounds like a great idea. I would definitely join a club like that if my college had one.

 

[Geordie]

My college has a few Aspies, but according to my college's regulations, they only approve clubs when there are 15 members, current students of my college. There are less than 15 Aspies in my college...

Do read regulations very, very carefully

 

[Christian T]

I think that's a ridiculous rule! Even if you have five members, you still have a worthy club, and you can still do worthwhile activities. How is the local autism society, then?

 

[Christian T]

I must say I'm becoming happier and happier with this club. I missed two meetings because of my trip to France (which was truly amazing and unforgettable, in so many ways) but everyone still showed up and ran the sessions without me, which was fantastic to hear. For the first week they did celebrity heads again, because it's fun and no other ideas really came to them. They were a bit stuck for the second week - I was planning to go, but was still heavily jet-lagged - so the teacher who's been supervising, and her student teacher, got them to tell her things that teachers should be aware of when teaching aspies - clear instructions, chaotic colours on the whiteboard, proper turn-taking because it's often hard to tell when the teacher has invited you to talk, etc. On my first day back with them, we played word association - where you take it in turns to say a word, and one word inspires the next, eg: cat, dog, snoop, nosey, ears, rabbit, easter etc. - and then did a version with sentences, eg: "I have a rabbit named Twinkle" - "the first song I ever learnt was 'Twinkle, Twinkle, Little Star" - "I've noticed that that tune is the same as the one for the alphabet song." The underlying point being that this is an incredibly fair way of having a conversation, and makes it easier for everyone to contribute, but real conversations are never like this. It was impossible to stop people saying things when it wasn't their turn in the game, because it is human nature.

The week after, we played the board game "Don't Panic," where you have at most 30 seconds to name a certain number of things in a certain category. I must say that the shy boy, Lachlan, has COMPLETELY changed. He talks without being talked to, he banters, he jokes, he comments, and he's very relaxed now. It's a relief to see him finally open up with us, and let us in to his little group of people that he can confidently chat away with.

And, we have a new member, who I met on the French trip. He's very friendly, with one of those amazingly encyclopedic minds overflowing with facts from all fields that he always enjoys explaining, in great deal, and can often, unintentionally come across as cocky. He finds it very hard to start conversations though, and usually looks for links to a fact that he can recall. This was his first session, and he's already very comfortable. There was no great fanfare about him joining, he just basically walked through the door, identified with us all straight away and slotted into our little group.

It's been an uphill battle catching up with homework the last few weeks, hence no posts from me for over a month, but it's great to be back!

 

[Geordie]

I think that's a ridiculous rule! Even if you have five members, you still have a worthy club, and you can still do worthwhile activities. How is the local autism society, then?

True, because of it, I asked my school counselor to base our group in an external CCA. I myself am making some headways in my school's Psychology Society and Peer Support Group, though I am graduating soon. I am willing to pop back in school to be the special needs students club's advisor, if time still allows, even accounting for my job commitments.

My local autism society has an adult society, but it runs with a top-down approach with many structured activities. Three years ago, I did mention to the autism society that we need a club for Adult Aspies, by Adult Aspies. I even went all the way to say we can have a baseline, so long as there is some involvement of Aspies in the adult group of Aspies. My ideas got rejected by both my local group, due to them not being comfortable with involvement of whom they see as 'patients', as well as the adult Aspies themselves, who proceeded to form an adult autism group independently.

Fortunately, for everything else, there's still Aspies Central.

 

[Soup]

@ Geordie: Despite them having rejected your idea, it is an excellent one. Here, we have groups run by & for Schizophrenics. They have a face & an art co-op they also run. Profits from the art sales & the cafe help keep it funded. These people seriously are patients & if they can manage, we Aspies could do so readily. We don't need to be managed & controlled like livestock. We're as smart & for the most part smarter than our 'handlers'.

@Christian T: Bienvenue! C'est un veritable plaisir de te revoir parmi nous! Your club makes me wish I had a time machine so I could go back & join it. there was nothing for a kid like I was back when I was in high school in the late 70's/early 80's (graduated in '82). Look at the difference you guys are making in Lachlan's life: he's gone from being self conscious & repressed to an active participant! It'll be life altering for him to see that he really is an interesting person worth listening to & that others like him. What you've started here is going to mushroom into something much bigger. I could see it serving as a model for other schools to implement. The encyclopaedic mind kid sounds fascinating! I love that kind of info Aspie because I tend to collect what those around me call 'useless information' (then they call me asking for facts about this or that). Are you going to tell us about your adventures in France?