"Bad" people

[Vanilla]

I have extreme reactions to some people as well. Thankfully it's only a handful of people. I just get the feeling that I should stay away from them because they will be trouble, or be manipulative. There's something I can't put my finger on and it upsets me a bit because I genuinely get on ok with most people.

It's not always the case, but people who are unnaturally "charming", or "people pleasers" can be prone to being manipulative. You could be picking up on something along those lines perhaps?

 

[wyverary]

I have a very acute empathic sense, and I often will pick up the essence of a person with very little information. It's more a feeling. It's like, intuitive. Sometimes it can be interfered with insofar as 'is this legitimate intuition, or am I being silly, I should give this person the benefit of the doubt', but I have learned to differentiate between the two to a certain degree of accuracy and I trust my perception. Usually I can identify and articulate the reason but once in awhile it'll just be an incomprehensible feeling.

I have learned in my life to trust my judgment and it is extremely rare that I am wrong about my intuition. I have had a lot of practice, however. The times where I think to myself, 'wow, I've misjudged that person' are few and far between.

This. I didn't used to be as good at it, but now, if I'm in a social situation, say, where there are people I haven't met before, I can usually tell within the first minute of conversation whether I like or dislike someone.

 

[icesyckel]

I have extreme reactions to some people as well. Thankfully it's only a handful of people. I just get the feeling that I should stay away from them because they will be trouble, or be manipulative. There's something I can't put my finger on and it upsets me a bit because I genuinely get on ok with most people.

This is it for me - not many people set off that red flag, and those that do I avoid. Can't put my finger on it.

 

[icesyckel]

My experience is that people are not bad, they just act that way because of feelings or what they have been taught. I do not believe that anyone (call me naive) gets out of bed in the morning and wonders, How Can I Hurt Someone Today?.

I like you Peace, but I have to disagree with you if you think people are basically good. I am not saying people are basically murdering thieves either, but I think most people are selfish.

I agree that most people don't get out of bed and try to think of ways to hurt people (though some do). I also do not believe the majority of people are altruistic by nature (though some are).

Most people do get out of bed, however, and start focusing on themselves and their needs first and foremost. People who are primarily focused on themselves and meeting their own needs may not set out to hurt others, but those who get in the way of their self-serving goals/desires tend to become collateral damage. Maybe they didn't set out to do this, but it happens all the same.

Take the schoolyard bully - most of them engage in bullying not out of malice to others so much out of a desire to feel better about themselves. It serves their needs. If two coworkers are after the same promotion, then even if they like each other they are going to put themselves first.

People hurt other people most often out of negligence/carelessness and often on purpose when it serves their selfish desires. Most won't go out of their way to hurt others for no reason (nothing in it for them), but give them a reason, and watch them go.

That said, we may be talking about different things. Most people don't set my spider sense a'tingling no matter how selfish. Only those with a certain hidden malice do. That doesn't mean the people I am not getting red flags for are good, though.

 

[DogwoodTree]

I often feel like an innocent child, trying to pass myself off as one of the adults. It's even stranger as you get older, as even the adults who are younger than you somehow seem older

Yes, this exactly. I feel like I'm a 10-year-old trapped in a 40-year-old's life.

 

[May Black]

Trying to categorize what seems "off" about all of them...they all feel "needy" to me, like they need someone else to validate their existence, their value, their identity.

In contrast, the people I feel the most admiration toward, are those who seem more "self-assured", like they know who they are, they choose who they want to be, and they don't need anyone else to validate those choices for them. These are the people I've tried so hard to emulate.

I think part of my repulsion towards those needier people is that I see myself in them. I want to be validated, too. I need someone to substantiate my value, legitimize my identity.

Y'all, I'm so screwed up. I'm sure this is all about "daddy issues", right? I just don't have a clue how to fix that...

I kind of just wish I could give you a hug and it would be a good thing.

Okay, silly question. Is it normal to just not "like" someone? ...someone who isn't "bad", just someone you don't particularly enjoy? I really think the problem is that they remind me of things about myself that I don't like. Maybe if I could learn to like myself better, I might like them better, too? Could it be that "simple"?

There are people I perceive as fake, it can be a smile, a tone of their voice. I trust my senses around people. As Turk accurately observed, it's very common among NT. I have found that the older I get the less I can tolerate.

 

[DogwoodTree]

There are people I perceive as fake, it can be a smile, a tone of their voice. I trust my senses around people. As Turk accurately observed, it's very common among NT. I have found that the older I get the less I can tolerate.

Out of curiosity (and an honest question...not accusing), have you ever asked one of these people who you perceive as fake, if they feel like they're being genuine with you?

There's one person in particular I'm thinking about for me. And I have had conversations with her about this...okay, long story, sorry...hope it makes sense.

She brought it up, because she said that my mom had told her that she (Mom) felt she (my friend) wasn't being genuine with people. (They were having lunch together for the purpose of getting to know each other.)

My friend took the comments from my mom in this conversation very hard. She had to go to some of her close friends for encouragement to figure out if the feedback from my mom was accurate, which they said it was not (people I trust, by the way).

The reason this friend told me about this later is because I had, through a series of events I didn't have much control over, ended up seeing her for some lay-counseling kind of help in dealing with some of my issues. That's when, at some point, she shared with me about my mom's comments.

And she shared that as she had pondered those comments over the ensuing months, she had come to the conclusion over and over that she was being as genuine and authentic with people as she knew how.

But Mom and I both have felt like there's something "off" and, well, not-genuine, about this woman (and her son, but that's another story).

I'm not "ganging up" with my mom against this lady. Putting the two side-by-side, they both have their strengths and weaknesses, and they're both living life the best they know how. They both have big hearts for other people, and though they both screw things up, especially with their own families, they also accomplish a lot of good in the community.

So this isn't about Mom-and-me being "good" and this other lady being "bad".

I'm just trying to figure out where this impression would come from, that this lady is not being authentic with people, even though she feels like she is and also tries very hard to be as real as she knows how.

I feel like I'm chasing my tail in this post, lol. Does it make any sense whatsoever?

 

[karla]

Yes, I just feel badly for rejecting them on such ridiculous standards that don't even make sense to me. They're nice people. Seems like I should be able to like them, right?

I thinks Turk is right, sometimes we just don´t like people and don´t even understand why. We don´t have to like everyone. But I understand the feeling, it´s like a guiltiness because they haven´t done anything bad to you.

 

[May Black]

Out of curiosity (and an honest question...not accusing), have you ever asked one of these people who you perceive as fake, if they feel like they're being genuine with you?

No, I feel that would be rather inappropriate. My grandmother who I loved deeply had this fake way of laughing. I never mentioned it to either her or anyone else, I think she did it when she was insecure about how to response to something. I keep what I sense to myself unless someone else brings it up, or mentions something negative the person in question had done.

I think people often wear a mask when they want to hide their feelings for one reason or another. It might not even be feelings directed towards you, which is why someone would still believe they're being genuine, even though you're picking up the double play.

 

[Peace]

I do agree with you to a degree here Peace, though I do feel that while everyone is human, I do know for sure that there are those few individuals that do go out of their way to hurt others. We wouldn't have bullies otherwise. Even if their actions come from their own insecurities, they tend to feed off the misery of others. It's important to balance both; realising their humanity, while remembering to protect yourself from those who mean to harm us. I wouldn't call it naive so much, as inexperienced; which is a good thing. It suggests that you've been treated well, and are surrounded by good people

I actually have had a difficult life, suffering abuse and many poor relationships as friends and lovers. It hurt me so badly that I try to combat it with kindness now. I feel that in some way, I balance out the bad with the good. I also try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt. I now have a very high tolerance for "Mean", and I try to help those people see what they are doing to others.
My parents are old now and have come to accept me, even praise once in a while (which I do not know how to handle). My kids are grown and we have a great relationship. This is the only constant positive I have, but it is a lot.
Thank You.

 

[Peace]

I like you Peace, but I have to disagree with you if you think people are basically good. I am not saying people are basically murdering thieves either, but I think most people are selfish.

I agree that most people don't get out of bed and try to think of ways to hurt people (though some do). I also do not believe the majority of people are altruistic by nature (though some are).

Most people do get out of bed, however, and start focusing on themselves and their needs first and foremost. People who are primarily focused on themselves and meeting their own needs may not set out to hurt others, but those who get in the way of their self-serving goals/desires tend to become collateral damage. Maybe they didn't set out to do this, but it happens all the same.

Take the schoolyard bully - most of them engage in bullying not out of malice to others so much out of a desire to feel better about themselves. It serves their needs. If two coworkers are after the same promotion, then even if they like each other they are going to put themselves first.

People hurt other people most often out of negligence/carelessness and often on purpose when it serves their selfish desires. Most won't go out of their way to hurt others for no reason (nothing in it for them), but give them a reason, and watch them go.

That said, we may be talking about different things. Most people don't set my spider sense a'tingling no matter how selfish. Only those with a certain hidden malice do. That doesn't mean the people I am not getting red flags for are good, though.

Well said my friend, and better wording for what I was trying to say. I believe it is this way because of society and the media pushing the "Consumer Driven" lifestyle. You should have everything you want. Don't worry about paying for it, just charge it (and become a slave). If your neighbor has it, you should too (Keeping up with the Jones's).
Back before modern conveniences, we needed each other, and so were sympathetic toward each other. That has been removed by "Just Push A Button", or make a phone call. It was a much better world when we had to get our own food.

 

[Vanilla]

I actually have had a difficult life, suffering abuse and many poor relationships as friends and lovers. It hurt me so badly that I try to combat it with kindness now. I feel that in some way, I balance out the bad with the good. I also try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt. I now have a very high tolerance for "Mean", and I try to help those people see what they are doing to others.
My parents are old now and have come to accept me, even praise once in a while (which I do not know how to handle). My kids are grown and we have a great relationship. This is the only constant positive I have, but it is a lot.
Thank You.

I'm sorry to hear that Peace, and sorry I jumped to conclusions. I can understand that logic though; being conditioned to having a high tolerance to "mean" people.

 

[Peace]

I'm sorry to hear that Peace, and sorry I jumped to conclusions. I can understand that logic though; being conditioned to having a high tolerance to "mean" people.

I know you meant nothing but good by it. your words are always polite and your advice sound. I believe it is helpful when you know where words and advice come from. Often times, those who were hurt the most are the nicest because they know what it feels like.

 

[radasp]

We're told all the time that "feelings" are what count, but it's what people DO that counts. First define for yourself what YOU WANT from other people and then observe what they do. Does their behavior match what they say? Do they follow through on promises and commitments? We ASDs need to trust people, and that takes proof, which takes time. Yes, sometimes our intuition does spot "bad" people, but to be fair, we need to use our brains to confirm that. There are people I've had strong negative impressions about who turned out to be good friends.

 

[SyAn]

When I wake up in the morning the world has a clean slate. If you have hurt me yesterday, sleep will wash it away. So you can start your day with a clean slate.

I don't know whether this is a good thing or not. I was born this way, I cannot hold grudges.

Of course I hurt. But holding grudges does not help me heal.
I have lots of scars. They remind me of healing.

 

[Harrison]

When I wake up in the morning the world has a clean slate. If you have hurt me yesterday, sleep will wash it away. So you can start your day with a clean slate.

I don't know whether this is a good thing or not. I was born this way, I cannot hold grudges.

Of course I hurt. But holding grudges does not help me heal.
I have lots of scars. They remind me of healing.

My father told me something like this too.

'When you sleep you die, a little death, to the day that has gone. When you wake you are new, in a new day.'

As a Taoist I still (mostly) live by it.

 

[etbe]

I think that Aspies and NTs tend to look for different things when recognising emotions. One example of this is the assessment of actors. I've found that sometimes the performance of an actor seems unconvincing to me but convinces NTs who see the same movie. Anyone who's going to do minimal effort acting (or acting under pressure) will (without consciously realising) probably only really try to convince NTs. If they convince the 99% of the population who have the most social power then losing the other 1% isn't such a big deal.

Sometimes I get a bad vibe about people who NTs seem to trust. For such people I try to avoid any situation where they have power over me and try not to deal with them when there aren't witnesses. Psychopaths comprise between 1% and 4% of the population and they prefer to target Aspies. If you don't think that 1% of the people you meet are psychopaths then you aren't recognising them.

 

[Randomperson]

Psycopaths are definitely more then 1% of the pop, I would put it closer to 10%.

 

[icesyckel]

Psycopaths are definitely more then 1% of the pop, I would put it closer to 10%.

It almost HAS to be more than we think it is when you really stop to consider. I've read that, unlike sociopaths, psychopaths can usually blend in or "fake it" like me hiding my autism at work. There has to be a HUGE percentage that go unnoticed/undiagnosed.

There is actually a really great episode of House devoted to a man with a psychopathic wife admitted to Princeton Plains. The husband has no idea that she cheats on him and basically lives a double-life fooling everyone until they run a brain scan while trying to diagnose her. Granted, it's just TV, but when she dropped the "act," it made for a great 40 or so minutes of TV.

 

[etbe]

There doesn't seem to be a clearly accepted difference between sociopath and psychopath. The words are often used interchangeably.