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Church and Autism

WhitewaterWoman said:
Edward Abbey! We need a few more like him these days. His "church" was alone in the desert.
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Now there is a name to conjure with - Ed Abbey. I read quite a bit by him and enjoyed what I read.

Being in nature and being able to appreciate the environment is one way of honouring the creator, through the creation. However, I do need to meet other people and to interact with them and receive correction and encouragement from them.

As I read Ed Abbey - I think of Thomas Merton another person who understood the value of alone.
 
I'm religious and go to church weekly and it's just very uncomfortable. Loud, long socially weird, long.
 
c flat said:
I'm religious and go to church weekly and it's just very uncomfortable. Loud, long socially weird, long.
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Yeah, I hated church as a kid. I think it's infinitely better to go one of your choosing. It really is like finding a secondary family. My husband is a deacon so I just dress however I like and stim in the back, and keep in touch with most of them via social media.
 
I went to church today. I was hoping to go yesterday but I was so tired today because I have been adjusting to a new situation this year and been trying to find something to do I have to do next in life. I think it has unsettled my sleep as well. I went to church though today. I wasn't sure earlier, but changed my mind. I have mentioned I attend an Anglican church, it is a quiet 30 minutes service. Before this I attended a church and it was 1hrs 30 mins I think. I liked to fellowship with them, but I had to go in later and I felt that is not how I wanted to worship.

As I said I went today and naturally my body just forced me to sit through the entire 30 minutes service. I prefer to be able to be able to stand, but physically I couldn't manage it today and knew my situation was known. But, I found this before in the previous church as well with the standing to sitting unsettled me a bit so I struggled with it years ago before I started to attend this church. I found it easier today to manage seated.

I found it interesting as well though as I read a few weeks ago that some Autistics can find the up and down I think in church difficult. I have been sitting on the end of my row for years like my natural position which they mention in the article. This post is observation, I have to had sit before though for my other issues, but I will see next week hopefully how it goes and don't like to use adaptions I don't need, but if I need it I may take it not just to fit in.

This is what I read.
https://www.chelmsford.anglican.org/uploads/files/Welcoming-those-with-autism.pdf
I came across a writer a few weeks ago called Daniel Bowman. I've not read his book, but he has got a chapter on church life. He is mentioned in this article.
https://www.churchtimes.co.uk/artic...res/autism-adventures-beyond-the-neurotypical
 
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John Muir is also cited as saying

“I’d rather be in the mountains thinking about God than in church thinking about the mountains.”
 
Alexej said:
Now there is a name to conjure with - Ed Abbey. I read quite a bit by him and enjoyed what I read.

Being in nature and being able to appreciate the environment is one way of honouring the creator, through the creation. However, I do need to meet other people and to interact with them and receive correction and encouragement from them.

As I read Ed Abbey - I think of Thomas Merton another person who understood the value of alone.
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Good to hear of another Abbey fan! (sorry, I just saw your post now)
He wrote many good novels; the one I've considered best is Desert Solitaire. Do you have a favorite?

One of his first novels was "Brave Cowboy" which became a western film starring a solitary Kirk Douglas called "Lonely Are the Brave". Walter Matthau and Carroll O'Conner also. Douglas talks to his horse a lot, which is indearing to me.
The movie is not too easy to find. But one can watch the last 7/8ths of it on Vimeo.com. It has a 93% rating on Rotten Tomatoes. Kirk Douglas shines in little-known Western – “Lonely are the Brave”
Cheers
 
Harmonie said:
A huge part of this all was that I became more knowledgeable on the Bible (young Christian me was, as you might expect from the beginning of this post, pretty ignorant. Paying attention in church was extremely hard for me, so I only go the rosy pictures of the stories). When I learned what the Bible said about women, gay people, slavery, etc. it was irreconcilable with my morality.

The irreconcilability with my strong morality was a key factor in the loss of my belief, as once I was at major odds with the Bible on that, I was able to take a step back and realize that I never had a reason to believe in the religion or deity to begin with.
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Harmonie, I have returned to this thread several times and your post I remember vividly. I have seen a few posts by women who have this issue on this forum. I can understand as everyone has their own experiences and how they perceive things. Me myself I am black as my videos in this forum indicate. I am also a female as well. There are several female posters on this forum. For me I am ok with that. I will tell you why, I base things largely on my experiences with the Godhead, that is the Trinity, God the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. I base things on my experiences and how I have been personally treated and I have been treated very well by all of them and know their DNA I say to myself so have really no issues and I know they are righteous.

I would like to answer about gay Christians, but I am not gay myself and I think someone who is gay and a Christian could probably speak to you about how they marry it together and I think it can be done most definetly, but personal is always better. I have got a book a long time ago and I can't even remember how I obtained it, but it is called All of the Women of the Bible by Hebert Lockyer. This is one link but do they paperback if interested. I wish you well, with whatever you do.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Herbert-Lo...n+of+the+bible+herbert+lockyer,aps,127&sr=8-5
 
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Jeff T said:
Good to hear of another Abbey fan! (sorry, I just saw your post now)
He wrote many good novels; the one I've considered best is Desert Solitaire. Do you have a favorite?

One of his first novels was "Brave Cowboy" which became a western film starring a solitary Kirk Douglas called "Lonely Are the Brave". Walter Matthau and Carroll O'Conner also. Douglas talks to his horse a lot, which is indearing to me.
The movie is not too easy to find. But one can watch the last 7/8ths of it on Vimeo.com. It has a 93% rating on Rotten Tomatoes. Kirk Douglas shines in little-known Western – “Lonely are the Brave”
Cheers
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I have only read 2 of his books, "Desert Solitaire" and "A voice Crying in the Wilderness"
 
Jeff T said:
Good to hear of another Abbey fan! (sorry, I just saw your post now)
He wrote many good novels; the one I've considered best is Desert Solitaire. Do you have a favorite?

One of his first novels was "Brave Cowboy" which became a western film starring a solitary Kirk Douglas called "Lonely Are the Brave". Walter Matthau and Carroll O'Conner also. Douglas talks to his horse a lot, which is indearing to me.
The movie is not too easy to find. But one can watch the last 7/8ths of it on Vimeo.com. It has a 93% rating on Rotten Tomatoes. Kirk Douglas shines in little-known Western – “Lonely are the Brave”
Cheers
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I just watched the movie - not a happy ending. ;-(. But I guess that’s Abbey.
 
WhitewaterWoman said:
I just watched the movie - not a happy ending. ;-(. But I guess that’s Abbey.
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Being something of a simpleton, I'm probably preaching to the choir here, but:

Yeah. The movie is a template in how the modern, mechanical New West, was obliterating the Old West. The protagonist and his horse are the symbols of the Old West, therefore they must go to oblivion as well. It does ends on a dark note. But it shows us what we were giving up when we embraced the shiny new future. We were exchanging the old set of evils for the new, different, shiny evils.

I apologize for veering off the this thread's topic of church and autism. I should have started a new thread.
 
Jeff T said:
Being something of a simpleton, I'm probably preaching to the choir here, but:

Yeah. The movie is a template in how the modern, mechanical New West, was obliterating the Old West. The protagonist and his horse are the symbols of the Old West, therefore they must go to oblivion as well. It does ends on a dark note. But it shows us what we were giving up when we embraced the shiny new future. We were exchanging the old set of evils for the new, different, shiny evils.

I apologize for veering off the this thread's topic of church and autism. I should have started a new thread.
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Yes. I got the message. Apologies to the OP
 
AutisticMilly said:
I’m an atheist, but I was raised Christian, and I go to church with my family on holidays to avoid scrutiny from my family. I remember as a kid I always hated church, and I still do. In retrospect, it’s an autistic nightmare: people wanting to shake your hand and making eye contact you as soon as you get in the door, loud music, not being able to stim through a service. I want to know if other people, atheist or not, feel the same way that I do about church.
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After reading your post, it brought back clear memories of my son having reaction to people wanting to shake his hand at the door or after he sat down and claimed "his space". I tried to go to bat for him and educate the church leaders of this but it fell on deaf ears. I am so sorry that you have had to endure those experiences. He is now also an atheist.
 
Jumpinbare said:
Christian means Christ-like, and I fall very short of that standard. While I have fully accepted Christ's teachings (love God, love others as myself), I have great difficulty being physically present in most churches for the same reasons mentioned above (handshakes, loudness, etc).
I tried wearing my t shirt that says "Don't touch me, I'm autistic" to two different churches recently. I kept my hands in my pockets entering and leaving. Still, people would look right at my shirt, then put a hand on my arm or shoulder. Two ladies actually hugged me. To be fair, I think they were trying to be kind and show me being touched wasn't bad.
As a kid and young adult, I found ways to slip in and out of the services unnoticed, and feigned distraction when I was noticed, but as I got older I saw that those techniques didn't work as well.
I began doing my own Bible study and worship time alone.
Since covid, so many churches now stream online services. That's probably the best option for many of us autistics.
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There is a need for education of church leaders. I would encourage families of Autism to come together and meet with the leaders and give them information about the REAL needs of our loved ones; how to observe and pick up on individuals needing their autonomy and space. The freedom to stim without judgment. THAT is love, even though someone may think it is hugging. I hope you can sense the love God tries to convey to you personally in specific ways, tailored just for you!
 
I listen to Sunday service online. I can pace or use my fidget spinner as much as I need to while still hearing the sermon.
 
That has worked best for me. No hugs or handshakes, and I don't even have to dress.
 
These are a couple of links that I reflected on later after writing my own journey with my faith. They are about neurodiversity and the church.
https://www.churchofengland.org/sites/default/files/2018-07/A place to belong Guide.pdf

https://www.churchofengland.org/sit...ities-and-people-on-the-autistic-spectrum.pdf

I like the mention in the below link that perhaps Nicodemus in the New Testatment was autistic.
https://trurodiocese.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Autism-Guide-2019.pdf

I bumped this post to really make this point.

The aftercare that comes with attending church as an autistic person or someone with mental health issues is important as well. I don't think really anyone wants to feel checked on up like on a school register. Perhaps you need to be aware when giving out your details.
Someone has to have the best of intentions, right...but sending messages to some autistic people why they didn't attend church one week can seem like forced talking or a violation of even what autism is about. Not only that you may be asked to talk over things when you find it too difficult at that time and have never been a natural talker.
There needs to be a balance and being left completely if you do not turn up may not work for some people.
 
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Love Church history, Catholic essays and 17th century sermons. It's so rich, and the Church had and has such a huge impact on the world. I found modern-day churches to be underwhelming social clubs. Maybe I should try an Orthodox or Catholic church though.
 
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