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Do you have a problem with authority?

I probably have to say Yes, because my first thought was, no one has any authority over Me, so no I don't find it a problem... I just mostly manage to evade any sources of authority, except the faceless ones, like the ones at the council who make any request for an extra bin go round and round with forms to fill in. Just say no if you mean no, faceless blobby, don't waste my time with pointless pretences....
 
I respect everyone. You don't need to be an authority. Even people I strongly disagree with on issues that are close to me. Respect is actually far more important towards those lower on the food chain. How one behaves towards them is the true measure of a person.

There are differences between respecting a person, respecting their authority, respecting their competence, and respecting their existence as a human being. I'll respect the authority of anyone who is in a position to seriously harm me. That includes bosses, police, teachers, parents, and the nameless bureaucrat who has to sign something I need to be signed. That changes as quickly as conditions change. I no longer respect the authority of teachers because they can no longer influence my life but I would still respect their competence (if they were competent) and I'll always respect their humanity. Respecting humanity is non-negotiable.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

I can quickly lose respect as a person if it appears they are letting their ego get involved, behaving stupidly or greedily or even violently
 
I was wondering if autistic people who have had to live in the mainstream have had a hard time with authority due to certain teachers and bosses coming down on them too much.

I trust my internalizations a lot and if someone can’t debate me or point out the flaws in my arguments, their position and title and power as an authority figure means about as much to me if they were to claim that they are Scooby Doo

It’s not that I am an anarchist or something, I just think that if my reasoning is mistaken, to me, someone should be able to point out why, not rely on their power or influence to punish me for questioning their judgements and expertise just because they have a title or power.
 
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There are a lot of things we need to do just because it is the rulz. A lot of rules exist to make public behavior predictable and therefore safer. Or as a protection against liability claims. Sometimes those rules make sense. Sometimes the rules don't make sense but you take it on faith that there's a reason. Sometimes the rules don't make sense but you follow them just to fit in. Or because your boss is paying you to do something a certain way and you do what you are paid to do and not how you think it ought to be done. Or because there's a significant downside to violating them like fines, bad grades, getting fired, or causing ill will.

In general, I find inconvenient rules to be opportunities for creativity rather than for stubbornness.

OTOH, if everyone is breaking the rule, there may be a higher rule that says you need to follow suit. (Aspie's like me are very bad at picking up on this sort of thing and we get in trouble for misjudging the situation.) Let's say the speed limit is 65 and every car on the road is passing you at 80+. (I've seen that a lot. The higher unspoken rule is to match the flow of traffic.) 65 causes turbulence in the traffic flow, sudden lane changes, and maybe even road rage and unexpected rear-end collisions. You need to speed up for simple self-preservation if nothing else. Don't pretend you are the rock in the river that the water must flow around because you are "right." You can be "dead" right.

Breaking a rule just because someone can't adequately explain it sounds reckless to me. That's just an excess of ego. You can't blithely assume that because of that there can be no adequate explanation. Or that your thinking process could not have gone astray.

Once in a while, there is a rule that, upon investigation, makes no sense and actively interferes with your conscience or your well-being. Then you need to consider how to change the rule and/or how to best engage in civil disobedience.
 
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Breaking a rule just because someone can't adequately explain it sounds reckless to me. That's just an excess of ego. You can't blithely assume that because of that there can be no adequate explanation. Or that your thinking process could not have gone astray.

It's not that.

I dunno about others, but if I've decided a rule is bloody stupid, I *must* be 100% sure of it, by not only understanding said rule, but also examining it in practice, watching others obey it, and considering the structure of the related system.

The ego of the ones in charge is only considered after that.

And really, moronic rules are far more common than you might think... PARTICULARLY in the workplace. As a great many retail workers could tell you, not only are plenty of rules bad, but they directly get in the way not only of efficiency, but of SAFETY. And one common aspect of those making the rules isnt that they're logical or illogical: It's that they have this need to feel that they're in control, this need to match up to their job title. They create silly rules in order to feel that they've done their job. Which is so illogical that it's sort of an anti-logic, but they do it anyway. It's VERY frequent in the workplace. The OTHER common aspect is that they have zero thought for those under them... they think of profit, and ONLY of profit. Profit for themselves, that is. That leads to stupid.

And often, businesses might find themselves struggling not because of people disobeying the rules, but instead it's happening MERELY BECAUSE THE RULES EXIST. And eventually, the particularly braindead/idiotic rules start doing so much damage that things start to fall apart, and workers leave. Now, some companies get around that aspect by ALSO doing really shady things in the background, but for those that dont do that... they tend to collapse over time, or have their reputation utterly broken.

My favorite example is the gaming industry. The AAA side of gaming is NOTORIOUS for work practices that are not only bloody stupid, but that actively hurt both the project and the employees AND the reputation of the company AND can lead to giant lawsuits.

For instance, there's typically rules in place that say that programmers/designers/whatever MUST work EXTREMELY long hours. Often, this is compounded by "unspoken" (yet absolutely enforced) rules that they must ALSO work extreme overtime, often for no pay.

Why is this done? Both powermongering, and utter obsession with profit, while also NOT understanding how development works in the slightest.

Does this lead to a better product? Ye gods, no. It leads to A: a VERY broken mess of a game release, B: employees who are so ridiculously overworked that they have literal mental breakdowns, C: employees that say "screw it" and leave to go do stuff in the indie side of the industry, and D: an absolute tanking of the company's reputation. Every now and then, it also leads to E: high-level lawmakers getting involved. There are multiple companies that are absolutely *loathed* by gamers as a whole. That shouldnt happen. Unfortunately, those same companies counter all that damage by doing very shady and outright dangerous things. Yet at the same time, well... sooner or later they will hit a breaking point. And then the "fun" begins.

Any time I meet an aspiring developer, I always give the exact same advice: DO NOT go work on this side of the industry. It wont profit you like you think it will, but it WILL utterly wreck you and destroy your life. Yes, it's THAT bad. And it's not rare. Almost every company does this.

That sort of nonsense is what I'm speaking of. With many companies, it happens at a much lower intensity, but the nature of the problems are still the same. And with some... it's even worse.

In my case, whenever I encountered something like that... I'd refuse. Absolutely refuse. I'm not going to wreck myself because of your need for profit, or for your need to feel better than everyone else. And if someone tried to push me into it anyway, well... I discovered that the right words, to the right people, tends to cancel them out. Or completely annihilate them. There is always a bigger dog, and those big dogs can be urged into certain actions. There was one manager in particular, at a movie theater I worked at, right. She tried some stuff with me. I gave her a warning. She laughed at me. I then came up with a course of action.

She lasted exactly three more days. And then she was out entirely. Not demoted, just OUT. The others tended to just avoid me after that. Gee, I wonder why...

It is possible to fight back against idiocy like this. The process is often difficult as heck to figure out, but... it can be done. I learned this lesson out of sheer necessity back in high school. It has served me well in the many years since. I dont cheat or do underhanded things to accomplish it, either. No need.



Sorry, rambling a bit. This is one of those issues where I've had to deal with it a few too many times, so when the subject is brought up, it usually leads to a rant.
 
To me, it really depends on how the authority is being enforced. If it's in a kind and thoughtful way I have no problems. If it's negative and severe, that's when I run into issues.

I also dislike having to be in a place where I have to tell people what they should or shouldn't be doing as I believe in common sense and really that is very relative to each person. Maybe that's why I dislike it so much.
 
I want to be able to ask "why".
In our defense, NTs have a problem with respecting personal space, and that makes it very hard to respect their authority.
 
I was once a delinquent. Lol @ those brief days of yon. I can still smell the tobacco fumes and the retched throat afterburn. Yuck!

Bad plant. Me no more smokey you.
 
It's not that.

I dunno about others, but if I've decided a rule is bloody stupid, I *must* be 100% sure of it, by not only understanding said rule, but also examining it in practice, watching others obey it, and considering the structure of the related system.

The ego of the ones in charge is only considered after that.

And really, moronic rules are far more common than you might think... PARTICULARLY in the workplace. As a great many retail workers could tell you, not only are plenty of rules bad, but they directly get in the way not only of efficiency, but of SAFETY. And one common aspect of those making the rules isnt that they're logical or illogical: It's that they have this need to feel that they're in control, this need to match up to their job title. They create silly rules in order to feel that they've done their job. Which is so illogical that it's sort of an anti-logic, but they do it anyway. It's VERY frequent in the workplace. The OTHER common aspect is that they have zero thought for those under them... they think of profit, and ONLY of profit. Profit for themselves, that is. That leads to stupid.

And often, businesses might find themselves struggling not because of people disobeying the rules, but instead it's happening MERELY BECAUSE THE RULES EXIST. And eventually, the particularly braindead/idiotic rules start doing so much damage that things start to fall apart, and workers leave. Now, some companies get around that aspect by ALSO doing really shady things in the background, but for those that dont do that... they tend to collapse over time, or have their reputation utterly broken.

My favorite example is the gaming industry. The AAA side of gaming is NOTORIOUS for work practices that are not only bloody stupid, but that actively hurt both the project and the employees AND the reputation of the company AND can lead to giant lawsuits.

For instance, there's typically rules in place that say that programmers/designers/whatever MUST work EXTREMELY long hours. Often, this is compounded by "unspoken" (yet absolutely enforced) rules that they must ALSO work extreme overtime, often for no pay.

Why is this done? Both powermongering, and utter obsession with profit, while also NOT understanding how development works in the slightest.

Does this lead to a better product? Ye gods, no. It leads to A: a VERY broken mess of a game release, B: employees who are so ridiculously overworked that they have literal mental breakdowns, C: employees that say "screw it" and leave to go do stuff in the indie side of the industry, and D: an absolute tanking of the company's reputation. Every now and then, it also leads to E: high-level lawmakers getting involved. There are multiple companies that are absolutely *loathed* by gamers as a whole. That shouldnt happen. Unfortunately, those same companies counter all that damage by doing very shady and outright dangerous things. Yet at the same time, well... sooner or later they will hit a breaking point. And then the "fun" begins.

Any time I meet an aspiring developer, I always give the exact same advice: DO NOT go work on this side of the industry. It wont profit you like you think it will, but it WILL utterly wreck you and destroy your life. Yes, it's THAT bad. And it's not rare. Almost every company does this.

That sort of nonsense is what I'm speaking of. With many companies, it happens at a much lower intensity, but the nature of the problems are still the same. And with some... it's even worse.

In my case, whenever I encountered something like that... I'd refuse. Absolutely refuse. I'm not going to wreck myself because of your need for profit, or for your need to feel better than everyone else. And if someone tried to push me into it anyway, well... I discovered that the right words, to the right people, tends to cancel them out. Or completely annihilate them. There is always a bigger dog, and those big dogs can be urged into certain actions. There was one manager in particular, at a movie theater I worked at, right. She tried some stuff with me. I gave her a warning. She laughed at me. I then came up with a course of action.

She lasted exactly three more days. And then she was out entirely. Not demoted, just OUT. The others tended to just avoid me after that. Gee, I wonder why...

It is possible to fight back against idiocy like this. The process is often difficult as heck to figure out, but... it can be done. I learned this lesson out of sheer necessity back in high school. It has served me well in the many years since. I dont cheat or do underhanded things to accomplish it, either. No need.



Sorry, rambling a bit. This is one of those issues where I've had to deal with it a few too many times, so when the subject is brought up, it usually leads to a rant.

Hi nice to meet you. Love how your personality came out in that post. Btw, I didn't detect impropriety (but I am new to the forums). I subscribe to what the urban folk say, do you lol. See ya.
 
It's not that.

I dunno about others, but if I've decided a rule is bloody stupid, I *must* be 100% sure of it, by not only understanding said rule, but also examining it in practice, watching others obey it, and considering the structure of the related system.

The ego of the ones in charge is only considered after that.

And really, moronic rules are far more common than you might think... PARTICULARLY in the workplace. As a great many retail workers could tell you, not only are plenty of rules bad, but they directly get in the way not only of efficiency, but of SAFETY. And one common aspect of those making the rules isnt that they're logical or illogical: It's that they have this need to feel that they're in control, this need to match up to their job title. They create silly rules in order to feel that they've done their job. Which is so illogical that it's sort of an anti-logic, but they do it anyway. It's VERY frequent in the workplace. The OTHER common aspect is that they have zero thought for those under them... they think of profit, and ONLY of profit. Profit for themselves, that is. That leads to stupid.

And often, businesses might find themselves struggling not because of people disobeying the rules, but instead it's happening MERELY BECAUSE THE RULES EXIST. And eventually, the particularly braindead/idiotic rules start doing so much damage that things start to fall apart, and workers leave. Now, some companies get around that aspect by ALSO doing really shady things in the background, but for those that dont do that... they tend to collapse over time, or have their reputation utterly broken.

My favorite example is the gaming industry. The AAA side of gaming is NOTORIOUS for work practices that are not only bloody stupid, but that actively hurt both the project and the employees AND the reputation of the company AND can lead to giant lawsuits.

For instance, there's typically rules in place that say that programmers/designers/whatever MUST work EXTREMELY long hours. Often, this is compounded by "unspoken" (yet absolutely enforced) rules that they must ALSO work extreme overtime, often for no pay.

Why is this done? Both powermongering, and utter obsession with profit, while also NOT understanding how development works in the slightest.

Does this lead to a better product? Ye gods, no. It leads to A: a VERY broken mess of a game release, B: employees who are so ridiculously overworked that they have literal mental breakdowns, C: employees that say "screw it" and leave to go do stuff in the indie side of the industry, and D: an absolute tanking of the company's reputation. Every now and then, it also leads to E: high-level lawmakers getting involved. There are multiple companies that are absolutely *loathed* by gamers as a whole. That shouldnt happen. Unfortunately, those same companies counter all that damage by doing very shady and outright dangerous things. Yet at the same time, well... sooner or later they will hit a breaking point. And then the "fun" begins.

Any time I meet an aspiring developer, I always give the exact same advice: DO NOT go work on this side of the industry. It wont profit you like you think it will, but it WILL utterly wreck you and destroy your life. Yes, it's THAT bad. And it's not rare. Almost every company does this.

That sort of nonsense is what I'm speaking of. With many companies, it happens at a much lower intensity, but the nature of the problems are still the same. And with some... it's even worse.

In my case, whenever I encountered something like that... I'd refuse. Absolutely refuse. I'm not going to wreck myself because of your need for profit, or for your need to feel better than everyone else. And if someone tried to push me into it anyway, well... I discovered that the right words, to the right people, tends to cancel them out. Or completely annihilate them. There is always a bigger dog, and those big dogs can be urged into certain actions. There was one manager in particular, at a movie theater I worked at, right. She tried some stuff with me. I gave her a warning. She laughed at me. I then came up with a course of action.

She lasted exactly three more days. And then she was out entirely. Not demoted, just OUT. The others tended to just avoid me after that. Gee, I wonder why...

It is possible to fight back against idiocy like this. The process is often difficult as heck to figure out, but... it can be done. I learned this lesson out of sheer necessity back in high school. It has served me well in the many years since. I dont cheat or do underhanded things to accomplish it, either. No need.



Sorry, rambling a bit. This is one of those issues where I've had to deal with it a few too many times, so when the subject is brought up, it usually leads to a rant.

Your posts are always such a joy to read. Hilarious and witty and fierce! You’re the Ambrose Bierce of the forum. Ha!

Anyway, I completely agree. I was just discussing with a friend the other day that the ACTUAL purpose of elementary/primary school is to teach children to OBEY. We learn to read and write and to understand that 1+1 = 2, but mostly it’s training for later in life: certain people simply “have” authority over us, for no other reason than that society says so. It makes us complacent little slaves in the workplace. It makes us just accept all of the BS you describe. Ugh.
 
I wonder if laddie ever ate his meat so he could have some pudding. Because, after all, how can you have any pudding if you don’t eat your meat?

Always seemed to me that they should have just let the kids eat their pudding first. Would have spared a lot of ill feeling on both sides.
 
Your posts are always such a joy to read. Hilarious and witty and fierce! You’re the Ambrose Bierce of the forum. Ha!

Hm, let's see, Ambrose Bierce search activate. Cool an author - no wait cool an author.
You clever folk and your reading assingments sheesh. So many references and allusions, so little time :p.
 
Hm, let's see, Ambrose Bierce search activate. Cool an author - no wait cool an author.
You clever folk and your reading assingments sheesh. So many references and allusions, so little time :p.

Well shame on you for not knowing about Mr. Bierce. He is Clever Folk Reading 101. Pssht!
 
Yes.
I never trusted those in authority.
Many in authoritative positions have been fine to be around. They treat you like a person and can be helpful
in explanations on the whys.

But, I've seen so many people who take their position as an opportunity to express a personality of
control and are overbearing. The big I, little U complex.
You can see it in their actions and hear it in their voice.

My Mom always said my middle name should have been Don't tell ME what to do!
I like to do things my way. I know I am concientious and will get it done, but, I like to do it my way.

I agree there are many rules too that doesn't make sense. But, if they are the rules, you have to decide
which is the lesser of two evils. Do it the way the boss, teacher or the law says or rebel and break the rules.
Personally I'd rather feel annoyed or even P'd off and go by the rules than end up in jail. Or fired if I need the job, and avoid having all sorts of problems in school.
I just try to avoid any interactions with some authority figures such as the police, then hopefully there
will be no problems.
I've never even gotten a traffic ticket.
 
Your posts are always such a joy to read. Hilarious and witty and fierce! You’re the Ambrose Bierce of the forum. Ha!

Anyway, I completely agree. I was just discussing with a friend the other day that the ACTUAL purpose of elementary/primary school is to teach children to OBEY. We learn to read and write and to understand that 1+1 = 2, but mostly it’s training for later in life: certain people simply “have” authority over us, for no other reason than that society says so. It makes us complacent little slaves in the workplace. It makes us just accept all of the BS you describe. Ugh.

You know, I actually saw a video related to the school thing recently.

And it said pretty much that. Supposedly, the original purpose of the basic school system/structure/ideas was to prepare students for the sorts of jobs that were most common at the time: Factory work. It wasnt meant to give them incredible worldly knowledge. It was just about preparing them for that specific existence.

And because people are dumber than a sack of hammers and tend to simply do things because "that's how it's done", the system was never changed. Boy does it show. It's SO bad that it makes kids specifically want to NOT learn. Show them something, and say that they can learn things from that something, and you've instantly lost them. Because it's like school to them, and school is inherently bad. I think we've all been there. Even without things like the bully aspect, and stuff of that nature... it still all just sucked.

I dunno about everyone else, but I learned pretty much nothing over all of those years. I credit school with teaching me exactly three things: 1: reading. 2: writing. And number 2 later became 3: typing.

And that's seriously it. My family seems to think I'm oh-so-smart and know everything, but it's not that. It's that I didnt even TRY in school, because I saw it as a nonsensical waste of time. So, dont try at all in class, become knowledgable, that was the sequence. Which sounds totally backwards, but it isnt. It means that I just paid attention to other sources of info instead, instead of wasting mental space. Heck, it's why I learned computers (they didnt even teach that in school back then).

Really, if school was truly about learning, they'd try to make it interesting and fun. Instead, they just lecture and give homework (because yeah, taking away a kid's fun time at home is REALLY going to glue them to the lessons). All because "that's how it's done".

The entire system is an example of the sort of nonsense that authority can be, when a lack of proper logic is involved.
 

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