Don't massage at work,crimney sakes

[mummifiedcircuitry]

The problem is people are so litigious today They would brazenly steal something as an example and if you prevent them or try to ,they will say I will sue you, so somebody could touch you for whatever reason and if you try to prevent them from touching you they could accuse you of trying to assault them especially if you’re working in something like the nursing home a body camera would be a boon

I don't think about all that. A body cam would be an invitation to some ppl to start something. Some ppl would become upset if they think they are being filmed. If they're planning to sue me, I hope they can afford a lawyer. The burden of proof would be on them.

 

[Bolletje]

especially if you’re working in something like the nursing home a body camera would be a boon

I’m fairly sure a body camera would be absolutely prohibited there, because it infringes on the privacy of the clients and/or patients.

 

[Streetwise]

I don't think about all that. A body cam would be an invitation to some ppl to start something. Some ppl would become upset if they think they are being filmed. If they're planning to sue me, I hope they can afford a lawyer. The burden of proof would be on them.

for some people they have the attitude you have for other people they wouldn’t be able to do that

 

[Aspychata]

Think this morning l realized when this co-worker started talking about marriage then it triggered the horrible abuse l went thru with ex. But it took me until the next day to make the connection.

 

[Judge]

I’m fairly sure a body camera would be absolutely prohibited there, because it infringes on the privacy of the clients and/or patients.

Agreed.

In the US, advocates of the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act would have a field day with such practices.

 

[Aspychata]

Excuse me, can you clearly stand in front of my camera? I need to record this for YouTube purposes! State your name clearly and what benefits you receive from people touching at this jobsite, considering it is quite unwelcomed and considered disrespectful to us in the twilight age of our employment life.

 

[Trophonius]

It's hard to pass any judgement.

Casual touching happens, from a gentle tap in the back to holding a shoulder when they talk to someone from the back. It's very common and not an issue for most people, but I understand how it might be for people on the spectrum. It's up to you in this case, to make clear that you are not comfortable with people being touched.

About the massage thing, I apply similar thoughts. As it was not related to you (the fact that you were near was simply casual and could be anyone else) it's not possible to say if it was inappropriate. I've seen co-workers who are either friends or have a strong bond in the workplace give massage to each other (same and opposite sex). Whether something like that is acceptable depends on the personal boundaries of the people involved, the boundaries they have for each other, etc. I think it's very judgmental to believe he was trying to "drum up a girlfriend" - but I saw nothing so I cannot say for certain.

 

[Aspychata]

It's hard to pass any judgement.

Casual touching happens, from a gentle tap in the back to holding a shoulder when they talk to someone from the back. It's very common and not an issue for most people, but I understand how it might be for people on the spectrum. It's up to you in this case, to make clear that you are not comfortable with people being touched.

About the massage thing, I apply similar thoughts. As it was not related to you (the fact that you were near was simply casual and could be anyone else) it's not possible to say if it was inappropriate. I've seen co-workers who are either friends or have a strong bond in the workplace give massage to each other (same and opposite sex). Whether something like that is acceptable depends on the personal boundaries of the people involved, the boundaries they have for each other, etc. I think it's very judgmental to believe he was trying to "drum up a girlfriend" - but I saw nothing so I cannot say for certain.

True, all good points. I have done a excellent job of ignoring this person and will continue to do so. But when things happen and you feel you are being targeted by a certain individual then usually you are correct because females a have a lifetime of being targeted by males (experience.)This person is looking for some older woman and sadly, l guess l fit the bill. But due to the excellent advice, l will say nothing and move on.

 

[Bolletje]

Another sad fact is that, as a woman, reinforcing your boundaries and telling people you’re not into casual touching carries the risk of netting you a reputation as cold and distant. Which doesn’t really help your standing in the office.

 

[Varzar]

True, all good points. I have done a excellent job of ignoring this person and will continue to do so. But when things happen and you feel you are being targeted by a certain individual then usually you are correct because females a have a lifetime of being targeted by males (experience.)This person is looking for some older woman and sadly, l guess l fit the bill. But due to the excellent advice, l will say nothing and move on.

This is sort of off topic, but I sometimes wonder how much of this idea of being targeted has been drilled into little girls' heads as they grow up, that "guys only want one thing"...
I wonder this because I have a female ex-friend that basically cut me out of her life because she "thought I was in love with her".. I asked another female friend if she ever had concerns like that, and she said she did too, but we're still friends, cause she decided it was just in her head...
In both of the above cases, I'd already been happily married for years, but both women still considered my "being nice" as potential "targeting" I guess. It's like a guy can't be nice to a girl without them thinking there are "ulterior motives"..

 

[Aspychata]

Think men truly have no understanding in how much a female can be hit upon. Men aren't really "hit upon" in society like woman are. I constantly do not see a bunch of females going up to "attractive men" for the sole purpose of picking them up. But social norms are that any number of males can think that you are there for the sole purpose of seeing them. The state l live in now l deal with entitlement of males. The other two states l lived in didn't seem to have this. If l ignored a guy, then eventually they would leave me alone. But no matter what type of "no, l am truly not interested signals" l give out here, it is completely ignored like saying no really means yes is the best way to describe it.

 

[Bolletje]

@Varzar there’s a difference between being suspicious of a man’s intentions and knowing you’re being targeted. I haven’t been raised with the idea that men only want one thing, nor do I believe that, but I’ve been in plenty of situations where I’ve found myself the target of unwanted physical attention and sexual advances to know the difference. I’m not suspicious of nice guys. I have trouble with people laying their hands on me or worse.

 

[Aspychata]

Think men truly have no understanding in how much a female can be hit upon. Men aren't really "hit upon" in society like woman are. I constantly do not see a bunch of females going up to "attractive men" for the sole purpose of picking them up. But social norms are that any number of males can think that you are there for the sole purpose of seeing them. The state l live in now l deal with entitlement of males. The other two states l lived in didn't seem to have this. If l ignored a guy, then eventually they would leave me alone. But no matter what type of "no, l am truly not interested signals" l give out here, it is completely ignored like saying no really means yes is the best way to describe it.

 

[Aspychata]

Think men truly have no understanding in how much a female can be hit upon. Men aren't really "hit upon" in society like woman are. I constantly do not see a bunch of females going up to "attractive men" for the sole purpose of picking them up. But social norms are that any number of males can think that you are there for the sole purpose of seeing them. The state l live in now l deal with entitlement of males. The other two states l lived in didn't seem to have this. If l ignored a guy, then eventually they would leave me alone. But no matter what type of "no, l am truly not interested signals" l give out here, it is completely ignored like saying no really means yes is the best way to describe it. Please remember, l am on the spectrum, l like the life of reading, listening to music, and watching movies without having to be with someone for that sole social purpose. But l would like to say this is *NT* men not men on the spectrum so any men reading this will not take offense. I actually enjoy being with spectrum friends because we don't have to explain ourselves to each other, there is a built in decoder on our secret watches!!

 

[Bolletje]

But no matter what type of "no, l am truly not interested signals" l give out here, it is completely ignored like saying no really means yes is the best way to describe it.

The most annoying thing to me is when people can’t take no for an answer and assume you’re playing hard to get.

 

[Varzar]

Think men truly have no understanding in how much a female can be hit upon. Men aren't really "hit upon" in society like woman are. I constantly do not see a bunch of females going up to "attractive men" for the sole purpose of picking them up. But social norms are that any number of males can think that you are there for the sole purpose of seeing them. The state l live in now l deal with entitlement of males. The other two states l lived in didn't seem to have this. If l ignored a guy, then eventually they would leave me alone. But no matter what type of "no, l am truly not interested signals" l give out here, it is completely ignored like saying no really means yes is the best way to describe it.

Our society is built on men being the "askers" and women being the "choosers".. so.. It's not really surprising that you only see men asking the women out and not the other way around..
I can never truly understand the shoes of a woman being hit upon all the time, of having to constantly reject men.. But I do know that being on the side that society expects to "ask" and being constantly rejected over and over isn't even remotely easy.. I don't particularly think women understand how much constant rejection hurts for men..

As for entitlement of men.. I guess I'm not one of those.. If a woman rejects me once, I would never ask again.. That being said, the woman in the example about that thought I was in love with her originally rejected the guy she, a year later, agreed to go out with and eventually married.. So, I guess it was a good thing he didn't take no for an answer the first time..? I have noticed women regularly seem to have a "no", means "no, right now". I'm sure this doesn't apply to all women, but enough that some men have learned that the first "no" might not be definitive..

@Varzar there’s a difference between being suspicious of a man’s intentions and knowing you’re being targeted. I haven’t been raised with the idea that men only want one thing, nor do I believe that, but I’ve been in plenty of situations where I’ve found myself the target of unwanted physical attention and sexual advances to know the difference. I’m not suspicious of nice guys. I have trouble with people laying their hands on me or worse.

Ok, I get that there's a line where it becomes obvious.. I'm just saying that for the former friend of mine, she apparently "knew" I was targeting her enough to end our friendship, even though she was wrong.. Not *all* women seem to know where that line is, and they destroy relationships in the process of thinking that they know. Sometimes the intentions of men are not as clear as women seem to think they are.

 

[Bolletje]

@Varzar I have made sure to always be very clear in my intentions with men so they’re not confused about what I do and do not want. When I like someone, I tell them. I don’t wait to be approached. When I say no, I mean no, not “try again later”. Still, this is somehow a difficult concept to grasp for many men I’ve encountered over the years. And in my personal experience, 100% of the guys that offered me a friendly neck massage tried to initiate sex even if I made it very clear I was not interested in sex. Which is why I don’t allow anyone to massage me unless I plan on letting them touch other parts of my body too.

I’m not saying all men are like this, at all. But I have learned to keep my guard up against unwanted attentions because I get those on such a regular basis.

 

[Bolletje]

Ha, I just heard a perfect rebuttal for when someone grabs your arm: “that’s my arm, you have two of your own.”

 

[Varzar]

@Varzar I have made sure to always be very clear in my intentions with men so they’re not confused about what I do and do not want. When I like someone, I tell them. I don’t wait to be approached. When I say no, I mean no, not “try again later”. Still, this is somehow a difficult concept to grasp for many men I’ve encountered over the years. And in my personal experience, 100% of the guys that offered me a friendly neck massage tried to initiate sex even if I made it very clear I was not interested in sex. Which is why I don’t allow anyone to massage me unless I plan on letting them touch other parts of my body too.

Fair enough.. I personally like your approach better. But of course, we here are among the neuro-diverse. So I would not be surprised that you, and probably @Aspychata, are not the women I'm describing. Those women would likely all be NTs.

I also have little doubt that the former friend situation for me has something to do with my neurodiversity. It's highly probable that I don't treat women the same way that NT men do.

So really, we are neurodiverse people that don't like/don't agree with the way NT men and women behave with each other. And then when they interact with us in the same way, not realize we are not like them, it's frustrating.. For you and @Aspychata, the NT men aren't respecting "no" the message you're sending, for me, NT women think I'm "too nice" and have "ulterior motives" when I just prefer to be friends.

 

[Varzar]

I just realized @Aspychata's third post of the triple-post above had a paragraph I hadn't read yet that said just about the same thing I just said.. lol