For the single men in this forum.

[Jordy]

If you and Magna can find some data that support this kind of thinking, that is perfectly acceptable, but there are always outliers and in many realms, people with autism thrive among the outliers.

There is plenty of data. What i see here is just people being in denial of uncomfortable truths.

 

[Sasha22]

As a woman you may not always attract men you want but that's better than not being to attract anything period.

Not necessarily. As a woman you know you can attract a number of men because they want sex (not always just that of course - but many random guys aren't looking for deep conversation). They want sex with you because you're female and you happen to be nearby at a given moment. You could be exchanged for another relatively ok-looking female and that female would likely get the same "attention" from the guy.
That doesn't mean you're "datable" to them. It happens a lot when you're young, and you get that "attention" from older men, or from all kinds of weirdos, which can be scary. In some cases it can feel like you're prey.
Is that better? worse? it's a different experience.
I've had random guys hit on me - that can be pretty lonely. So it all depends on who you are and who you meet. There's no way of accurately coming up with such a priori judgments of another person's experience really

 

[Rodafina]

There is plenty of data

I believe everyone that says it exists. I have noticed no one has presented it. But, I trust that it will support what people are saying.

My point was to look for the outliers. There are exceptions to data.

But again, no one is posting the data here.

 

[Jordy]

You know I have just given up on the whole thing. I rarely think about woman like that anymore or try to talk with them.

 

[Knower of nothing]

It's a solid conviction to find peace with something that's hurting you. If it takes asserting this reality for that to work then so be it frankly. If you ever attain that acceptance you'll find reasoning falls by the wayside anyway. It's a temporary glue.
I have found though that the most normal looking people will at some point feverishly iterate over and over again that they are ugly. And I think what's happening is that rejection comes first and from this pain comes the idea that being rejected is the definition of being ugly. So no matter what you look like, if you are rejected you are ugly. Stay with this idea for long enough and you'll never be able to comfortably look at yourself in the mirror again.
I think ugliness exists of course. There are clearly things that are uncomfortable to look at, very broad patterns in opinion too. But there are very few people who's appearance itself is ugly, way less than there are autistic people for sure. It can be dangerous to bloat the notion of ugly up to the scale of "anyone that doesn't want to be in a relationship with me thinks I'm repulsive looking". Living your life to the opinionated whimsy of superficial people in turn makes you superficial too as you reflect their ideas back at the world. And that's not very pretty.

 

[Aspychata]

The problem is that many men are looking for a pretend girlfriend, and don't care to commit. So many woman get wise and just quit dating. Are they wrong, are men wrong, no, it's just how it works out. I don't blame, and just say everybody is wired differently, and has their own definition of a relationship. I sadly, don't really like commitment and l stress out about it. It's hard for me to see someone over two years and not ask for something more however. Alot of guys here say their girlfriend found them, which l find interesting.

 

[Rodafina]

Another perspective:

https://www.themodernman.com/dating/do-women-like-fat-men-the-truth.html

Spoiler: Partial Article Text

Do Women Like Fat Men? The Truth​

Not all women will accept a fat man, but some women will. Why?

Many women (not all) are much more flexible about what they find attractive in a man than most guys realize.

If a fat man is able to make a woman feel attracted to him in other ways (e.g. he is confident, charismatic, charming, has a masculine vibe, makes her laugh, etc), then some women will stop caring that he doesn’t have a perfectly fit and toned body.
How is this possible?

When a woman feels attracted to a guy for other reasons, she then starts to look at his physical appearance in a more positive light. Instead of saying, “Ewww, gross – you’re fat” she will say, “I like your belly, it’s sexy” or “I like how cuddly you are.”

To guys who have been brainwashed by the media into thinking that they have to be tall, handsome and rich to attract hot women, this will come as quite a shock.
Most guys will waste their entire life thinking that they have to look perfect to attract hot women, but the truth is that you can attract women in ways other than looks, money, height and social status. It really is true.

Yes, there are some fat men out there who only get laid because they are mega rich, but think about it…

Most guys in this world are not rich and are either working a normal job or working a fairly low paying job and just making ends meet. The reason why they can attract a hot woman is that women CAN be attracted in other ways.
Some women are extremely picky and will not accept a fat guy, but the vast majority of women are much more flexible about what they find attractive in a guy than most men realize. It really is true.

Attracting Women as a Fat Man​

In If you’re a fat guy and you’re looking to get laid, get a girlfriend or find yourself a wife, what you need to do is improve your ability to attract women when you interact with them.
For example: When you’re interacting with a woman, your style of conversation, your vibe and your behavior is either going to be turning her on or not. If you don’t know how to turn her on during an interaction and are actually turning her off in subtle ways (e.g. being nervous, putting on an act of being an even nicer guy than you really are, being too polite, etc), then she will begin to look at your weight in a negative light.
However, if you are turning her on during the interaction (e.g. by talking to her in a confident way, making her laugh, being masculine, having a subtly sexual vibe, etc), then she will look at your weight in a more positive light.
So, if you’ve been getting rejected by women lately and are struggling to get a date, don’t put it all down to your weight. In almost all cases, the real reason why a guy will get rejected is explained in this video…
As you will discover by watching the video above, the reason why you see other fat guys with women is that most women (not all) judge a man on his personality and confidence, rather than his looks.

If women selected men purely on physical appearance then most guys in this world wouldn’t be able to get laid or get a girlfriend, because most guys are tall, handsome male models with a perfect body.
Most guys are either fat, thin or have an average body type and they are still able to get laid, get a girlfriend or get married to a hot woman because it really is true that women can be attracted in ways other than looks, money, muscles and social status.

Here’s the thing…
If a good-looking guy is nervous around women and doubts himself, most women won’t feel much or any attraction for him. Women will see him as being “good-looking,” but since he lacks confidence (the most important thing to a woman) and isn’t very masculine (in the way he thinks and behaves), most women just won’t be very interested.

Why? Women are attracted to the strength in men (e.g. confidence, masculinity) and turned off by the weakness (e.g. nervousness, shyness, insecurity). Some women (usually unattractive, drunk, old or desperate women) will accept an insecure good looking guy, but most women won’t.

I know that it’s hard to believe, especially when all that you see on TV commercials are messages suggesting that you have to be tall, good-looking and have six pack abs to be attractive to women, but if you want to stop wasting your life thinking that you’re not good enough for women, you have to accept that most women do not solely judge a man on his looks.

When a fat guy asks me, “Do women like fat men?” it is usually because he is self-conscious about being overweight and feels as though he doesn’t fit the stereotype that is pushed by TV commercials and magazines.

In fact, most guys who ask me “Do women like fat men?” already believe that their weight (not their inability to attract a woman during a conversation) is what has been preventing them from enjoying the success with women they want.

True Attractiveness​

If you’re asking, “Do women like fat men?” because you have insecurities about your weight, then it is clear that you currently don’t have the number one trait that women look for in a man: Confidence.

Likewise, if you’re a guy of normal weight with insecurities and a lack of self-confidence, then you’re not any more attractive than an insecure fat guy.

Almost all women (excluding unattractive women) are turned off by insecure men. Women instinctively feel attracted to confident men because we live in a challenging world and it often takes confidence, courage and strength of character to push onwards to success.
Guys who lack confidence in themselves make a woman’s instincts trigger feelings of repulsion. Instinctively, she doesn’t want to get stuck with a guy who will crumble under pressure if life gets tough, or who will become insecure and controlling in a relationship.

A guy might look good on the outside, but if is shy or nervous around women, then he simply doesn’t have the qualities that women instinctively feel attracted to in a man.
If you want to go through life believing that women don’t like fat men, then you’re going to have to lie to yourself EVERY TIME you see a woman with a fat man from now on.
You’re going to come up with an excuse like, “Oh, he must be rich” or “He must be well hung” instead of accepting the truth that women can be attracted to men for a variety of reasons that have nothing to do with looks, money or social status.

​

 

[Rodafina]

Another perspective:

https://www.themodernman.com/dating/do-women-like-fat-men-the-truth.html

More from the article:

Instinctive Attractiveness​

The world may have changed beyond all recognition over the last few thousand years, but women are still looking for a man who can protect them and keep them safe.
Whether a guy is short, tall, thin or overweight, the main thing that a woman looks for is whether or not he will be able to keep her safe and gather enough resources to survive and live a good life.
In other words, her instincts will be telling her whether or not you’d be good at surviving, thriving and prospering in this world. If she gets the sense that you lack the mental and emotional strength to make her feel safe and protected, she will naturally feel turned off by you whether you have a fat, thin, average or althletic physique.
Some of the traits that trigger a woman’s instinctive attraction for a man include…

1. Confidence
A man with the type of confidence that is attractive to women is a man who knows what he wants, how to get it and will stop at nothing until he achieves it. He believes in himself and pushes forward with unrelenting confidence and determination until he achieves his goal.
Women are naturally attracted to men like this because they give a woman a feeling of safety and protection, where she can relax into being the woman and let him lead the way as the man.
A truly confident guy doesn’t need to pretend to be anything other than himself – he knows who he is and he is confident in himself. So, faking confidence as the “larger than life” happy, fat man won’t wash with women if it doesn’t truly match up with your body language, thinking, words and actions.
If you want to attract women with your confidence, it has to be authentic. You have to truly believe that you are good enough for her and you will be able to achieve whatever you want to achieve in life.

2. Masculinity
Genuine masculinity isn’t about loud, chest beating, macho and over-the-top behavior; it’s about how you think, behave, speak and take action as a man.
Being masculine means that you display the type of alpha male qualities that make other men respect you. When you have true masculinity, women literally feel “weak at the knees” around you and that is a feeling they simply cannot resist.
It doesn’t matter if you are fat, short or bald – if you can make a woman feel that way, she will be unable to stop herself from feeling attracted to you. A woman’s attraction a man’s masculinity is automatic and instinctive and cannot be turned off.
Of course, there are some women out there who like wimpy, feminine guys, but as you may have noticed, those women are usually very masculine or unattractive. If you want to attract a beautiful, feminine woman, you need to display masculinity when you interact with her.

3. Social Intelligence
In today’s world, being successful at life has a lot to do with your ability to communicate and get along with other people. Without a high level of social intelligence, you are usually less favored by people, get promoted less often and have less friends than the average person.
To a woman, this makes you a much less attractive man than one who has the social skills needed to get along well with others and be a better protector and provider for her, yourself and any offspring that you may have together as a couple.
On the other hand, when you can display the type of social intelligence that naturally attracts women, you will find it incredibly easy to get laid or get a girlfriend…

 

[Jordy]

More from the article:

Internet psychology articles aren't a great source for anything really.

 

[BoltzmannBrain17]

Hmm...

You define yourself as "Narcissistic, intelligent, physically unattractive."
https://www.autismforums.com/threads/define-yourself.43124/post-960735

But in this photo you don't look unattractive at all:
https://www.autismforums.com/thread...rself-thread-round-2.838/page-110#post-957679
When I was 19, I felt I knew some stuff about the world. But now I'm 50+ I realise I didn't actually know that much. I'm still learning now.

I feel my capacity to parse through mathematical truth probably translates well into my ability to deconstruct human social dynamics. I think I have things fairly thoroughly figured out tbh. My moral stances in regards to what I believe should be done about what I perceived will likely shift over time but I'm not inclined to think my views on modern dating will shift unless modern dating shifts.

 

[Jordy]

It's a solid conviction to find peace with something that's hurting you. If it takes asserting this reality for that to work then so be it frankly. If you ever attain that acceptance you'll find reasoning falls by the wayside anyway. It's a temporary glue.
I have found though that the most normal looking people will at some point feverishly iterate over and over again that they are ugly. And I think what's happening is that rejection comes first and from this pain comes the idea that being rejected is the definition of being ugly. So no matter what you look like, if you are rejected you are ugly. Stay with this idea for long enough and you'll never be able to comfortably look at yourself in the mirror again.
I think ugliness exists of course. There are clearly things that are uncomfortable to look at, very broad patterns in opinion too. But there are very few people who's appearance itself is ugly, way less than there are autistic people for sure. It can be dangerous to bloat the notion of ugly up to the scale of "anyone that doesn't want to be in a relationship with me thinks I'm repulsive looking". Living your life to the opinionated whimsy of superficial people in turn makes you superficial too as you reflect their ideas back at the world. And that's not very pretty.

There are more ugly than autistic people.

 

[Rodafina]

Internet psychology articles aren't a great source for anything really.

Please note where I said “another perspective.“ Technically, that is accurate for what I presented.

 

[Forest Cat]

I feel my capacity to parse through mathematical truth probably translates well into my ability to deconstruct human social dynamics. I think I have things fairly thoroughly figured out tbh. My moral stances in regards to what I believe should be done about what I perceived will likely shift over time but I'm not inclined to think my views on modern dating will shift unless modern dating shifts.

You're 19, give it some time. For 19 year olds dating can mostly be about looks and pretty faces. But people change. Life changes.

 

[Aspychata]

It's true that we are even attracted by an individual's smell.

 

[Gerontius]

This is going to be controversial but IMO autism is a contributing factor in that at it's core it is a dysgenic disorder and most autistic people are unattractive physically because of these bad genes.

Hey, here's a possibility--Are autistic people attractive to other autistics? That would be my question. Autistic people look unique. Eyes are a little odd, faces are odd, but we seem to look cool in a different, well-camouflaged sort of way. Most autistic people are more interesting to other autistics--Perhaps if we play by NT rules we end up with very poor odds of making lasting connections with people.

 

[Rodafina]

https://www.chemistclick.co.uk/news/how-the-ideal-male-body-has-changed-throughout-history

as the old saying goes, ‘beauty is in the eye of the beholder’, and the ‘ideal male body’ simply doesn’t exist. While media, advertising and society more generally may all try to shape, change and alter your body, just remember that the idea of perfection is subjective, making body ideals relatively meaningless. Here at Chemist Click, we are on a mission to remind men that there is no such thing as a perfect or typical body - everyone is unique. Whatever body type you have, or aspire to have, don’t allow self-consciousness to knock your confidence or affect your physical health, mental wellbeing or sexual performance

 

[Rodafina]

@phantom,
Before you come at me for the things I am posting, all that I am arguing for is the existence of different opinions. When it comes to finding mates in the world, there are very few cold hard facts.

Any sources I have provided are not to be considered data. They are differing perspectives and the places where I found them.

Until somebody posts an actual study, we are all just discussing opinions here.

 

[Sasha22]

Internet psychology articles aren't a great source for anything really.

Well it's just a perspective
This one written by a guy with a 385K audience (not meaning that his word is truth, but he seems to have some people paying attention)

 

[Rodafina]

Part of why I am invested in this conversation is because for many generations women were held to impossible beauty standards that could physically affect their health (i.e., high heeled shoes).

In my lifetime, since the 1980s, there has been great strides made in accepting all types of beauty for women. Fashion and style has changed for the ordinary woman and being comfortable in one’s own skin has been the focus of addressing body image issues on a wide scale.

I fear that it is the men who are now being held to impossible beauty standards. Or standards of attractiveness if you prefer. In my opinion, men have been made to feel less than in so many ways because many traditionally masculine roles in society have changed. But, it is important, indeed essential, for men to feel their value and attractiveness in the world.

Women have had the beginning of being able to live in a more accepting society in the world that I am in, and I am hoping that the same will happen for men, because it is not fair that they are held to impossible and ridiculous standards when they are just humans too.

Just being a good man, one with confidence, kindness, the ability to understand a partner, and the notion that they are simply a flawed human like every other person on this earth is certainly valuable, and to many, very desirable.

 

[Jordy]

@phantom,
Before you come at me for the things I am posting, all that I am arguing for is the existence of different opinions.

Alright I will be merciful and not come at you for these opinionated pop psychology blog posts.