I'm feeling conflicted and unhappy with my family situation. May I have some validation and/or advice? (trigger warning, also, I think)

[autism-and-autotune]

For instance, I don’t like referring to spanking as ‘hitting’ my child. While spanking is obviously a form of hitting, the latter is a catch-all word that encompasses forms far from acceptable when discussing discipline. So, I’m not going to answer a question based on that premise. Other than spanking, I would say that there is no form of hitting that would be acceptable.

So slapping across the face, too, is off limits in your mind? My mother did this to me plenty.

 

[autism-and-autotune]

I’d probably want to back away from the corporal punishment thing to take on that question. Wouldn’t want to come up with a special-case definition.

For instance, I don’t like referring to spanking as ‘hitting’ my child. While spanking is obviously a form of hitting, the latter is a catch-all word that encompasses forms far from acceptable when discussing discipline.

Here's another question: at what age did you stop spanking your children? Did you continue to do it to them throughout young adulthood and even their teenage years? Why, or why not?

 

[Neonatal RRT]

Well said; control can be good if used as a means to protect them form dangers of the world. Yet teaching by example and discipline---not in the form of physical punishment alone--is probably a better way to raise your children. Get them to talk, and be able to voice themselves rather than fear pain upon doing so.

Is one disciplined in the workplace with the same method you suggest--emotional pairing to an event?

I think that the fact that there are blurry or invisible lines between what is abuse and what isn't is really the heart of the issue. Hitting your spouse is abuse; hitting your dog is abuse; but hitting a child? 'Hmmm,' some folks may say. The fact that Pandector is in the fence about this is what has me riled up.

I'm not sure what to make of your final paragraph. I trust that even if my parent's hadn't abused me and disciplined me I would not be in jail or at issues with legal authority. Your examples are very very far-reaching, perhaps because I cannot relate to your thought process. I wonder if there is correlation to parents who do abuse their children and those children grow up to commit crimes or be in trouble with the law? If this is the case, I guarantee physical discipline does more harm than good.

1. Getting them to talk through things requires some level of mental maturity. Something that small children struggle with because they are inexperienced in life. I think this varies from child to child, but typically once they reach school age, a parent and child can have these discussions. However, I do think, on rare occasions when they are truly guilty of the sorts of things that would get an adult in trouble with the law, then that requires a swift, hard stop, and harsh disciplinary action is needed. Far better they learn these life lessons as children rather than as an adult.

2. Your example of the workplace, can be an emotional event if you truly did something wrong, are caught, and then had to have a disciplinary session with your boss, or worse, fired. That definitely would be an emotional pairing event.

3. The fact that you are riled up about someone else's thoughts regarding this is normal. Like I suggested earlier, us older folks experienced this transition, went through this period of questioning, then saw the results in our younger generations, and now we think there may have been some mistakes in how we approached this transition in parenting skills. A lot of our children, now in their 20's and 30's are struggling with mental health issues, a loss of purpose and responsibilities, a loss of morality and discipline, combined with feelings of entitlement, become offended easily, and a sense of arrogance that no one should disagree with them. "I feel, therefore I am." "I identify as, ______". Association or causation, but these are things that are new to our society, specific of that generation, in the broader sense. It's messed up, and as parents, we have to look in the mirror and admit some responsibility and guilt for that. Imagine a pendulum swinging from one extreme to the other, and now trying to figure out some sort of medium ground, a more tempered approach, where both harsh discipline can and should be used in specific cases, but also with a bias towards a more positive reinforcement in most other cases. Furthermore, how does one instill a sense of "duty", "code of conduct", responsibility, self-discipline, whilst allowing for individuality of person and thought? Feelings are important to express, but we absolutely can not allow feelings dictate our actions, and this is often what happens now-a-days with disastrous results. It is not WHAT we do, but rather HOW we do that is critical, and I think a lot of parents struggle with this, as each child presents with unique challenges. Children don't come with instruction manuals. Everything is trial and error, and as a parent, you just pray you have more successes than failures, but for certain, a parent will make mistakes.

4. As far as my examples being far reaching, I think it may be the difference between two worlds, a generational gap perhaps. I've lived through the before and after and have witnessed the results. Everything I said is true, in my world. That is my experience.

5. Yes. I do think there is a correlation between truly abusive parents and their children coming in contact with the law. But I also think that there is a continuum between discipline and abuse, and it can get confusing as to when one becomes the other. Also, keep in mind, we are autistic, so how we interpret our world is going to be different than others, and yes, that can mean that because of our social and communication naivity and difficulties, we could come in contact with law enforcement.

 

[The Pandector]

Your guarantee of how my children feel about me would be laughable if it hadn’t come from a quiet desperation. You know nothing but your own prejudice and anger, and your imagination is twisted by bitterness.

And then, there’s the rest of you, which as far as I can tell is a really good and reasonable guy. But, like most of us, there’s that ugly scar of bitter resentment. Yours seems evident.

Maybe this is off subject…
I was emotionally abused as a child. My mother and older brother had a weird relationship and I was the piñata. Mom was absolutely blind to how brother was manipulating both of us. I could - seriously - fill a book with how she refused to listen to me or take control. Stepdad - the old-fashioned kind where a step child is just a hole to feed - would protect his own three children when she got outrageous, but let her sink with us. Until big bro moved on to the social scene, my life was hell. And it never got better at home.

Talk about a heart and life filled with resentment! Frankly, I didn’t make it through alive. The abuse tainted everything else in my life, including the way I raised my children.

Well into my forties, Mom and Dad came to visit, right after visiting big bro. Mom was pasty, drained; I figured one of them had a terminal diagnosis. Nope. Big bro had laughed about how he actually had done all of the outrageous things I had accused him of.

She saw the enormity of what she had done to me, and was devastated. She invited me to tell her point blank how I felt about her parenting. I said nothing. I read to her on her deathbed, but never had a heart to heart about anything. She never again asked for closure, and I didn’t offer any.

Looking back, I wish I had said something. Not there at her confession, because I was emotionally stunned. I’m sorry I didn’t state clearly to her the lifelong damage she perpetrated on me. Not that it would matter in her life, but because I needed that in my life.

Now, I’m going to let the old man out.

Son, until you raise up your own and send them out, you don’t know jack. Why, when I was a boy, divorce and mass murders were rare and we had to walk backwards through the snow… blah blah blah. But, like it or not, you’re in no position to judge me; I respect your opinion and consider your words, but you’ve stepped out of your league when you start dictating reality to me.

I don’t know if you’ve reached that place in life where you realize that friction is a natural and desirable thing in a family. A son is supposed to tire of his parent’s rule and strike out on his own. Fathers naturally tire of a young whippersnapper in the house with a pair to prove. Those things fade over time.
What isn’t so liable to fade away is the bitter gall in your heart. If you don’t want to live and die with it, and if you don’t have a god to lay it before, I strongly recommend you deal with it where it needs to be dealt with. Before you can only wish you had.

Peace and love on you, brother. I hope you walk the path without carrying that load.

 

[The Pandector]

So slapping across the face, too, is off limits in your mind? My mother did this to me plenty.

Yes, I think slapping crosses the line because it’s dangerous.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

Incorrect. I knew it was wrong because it hurt me, and I knew that hurting people was wrong.

Since that is your response, I am thinking the how's and why's of our parents expressing "discipline" were different.

The reason I never had any thought at all that what my parents were doing wrong is because I knew I was guilty of wrong doing well before my father got out the belt. I had time to think it through sometimes for hours before I had my punishment dealt to me. I knew it was coming. The other part, was that during that time, this was the way parents dealt with children's discipline and there was no conversation out there suggesting something alternative at the time. Certainly, this sort of discipline was relegated to young children, as older children, parents figured out that work, removal of privileges, etc. was often more effective. Furthermore, we were far more emotionally disconnected. Nobody ever asked anyone how they felt. People didn't care how you felt. Expressing feelings was not something you could do in front of people. If you did, you were "out of control" and were quickly shut down, even physically removed. It was not socially appropriate behavior. If you cried, you were weak, and even that was a punishable offense. Growing up in that sort of environment, we never had any thought in our head that what was going on was wrong in any way.

Now, it sounds to me you grew up in a very different environment than I. As they say, "apples and oranges". So, if your parents were being physical with you or being mentally and psychologically abusive or manipulative, then that is a totally different situation. If you were subject to this sort of behavior because of you being you, not because of some truly punishable behavior, then that's a different situation. You may have recognized that, in some cases, they may have been treating you unfairly and what you were experiencing was not always within the context of discipline, but rather some personality-disordered controlling behavior, or perhaps anger, or perhaps they just needed an outlet for their own frustrations and pain. Yeah, if you recognized the injustice of that, then I could see where you knew what they were doing was wrong.

 

[autism-and-autotune]

Yes, I think slapping crosses the line because it’s dangerous.

I'll try not to be too baffled by the double standard, but I respect your opinion.

 

[autism-and-autotune]

Your guarantee of how my children feel about me would be laughable if it hadn’t come from a quiet desperation. You know nothing but your own prejudice and anger, and your imagination is twisted by bitterness.

And then, there’s the rest of you, which as far as I can tell is a really good and reasonable guy. But, like most of us, there’s that ugly scar of bitter resentment. Yours seems evident.

Maybe this is off subject…
I was emotionally abused as a child. My mother and older brother had a weird relationship and I was the piñata. Mom was absolutely blind to how brother was manipulating both of us. I could - seriously - fill a book with how she refused to listen to me or take control. Stepdad - the old-fashioned kind where a step child is just a hole to feed - would protect his own three children when she got outrageous, but let her sink with us. Until big bro moved on to the social scene, my life was hell. And it never got better at home.

Talk about a heart and life filled with resentment! Frankly, I didn’t make it through alive. The abuse tainted everything else in my life, including the way I raised my children.

Well into my forties, Mom and Dad came to visit, right after visiting big bro. Mom was pasty, drained; I figured one of them had a terminal diagnosis. Nope. Big bro had laughed about how he actually had done all of the outrageous things I had accused him of.

She saw the enormity of what she had done to me, and was devastated. She invited me to tell her point blank how I felt about her parenting. I said nothing. I read to her on her deathbed, but never had a heart to heart about anything. She never again asked for closure, and I didn’t offer any.

Looking back, I wish I had said something. Not there at her confession, because I was emotionally stunned. I’m sorry I didn’t state clearly to her the lifelong damage she perpetrated on me. Not that it would matter in her life, but because I needed that in my life.

Now, I’m going to let the old man out.

Son, until you raise up your own and send them out, you don’t know jack. Why, when I was a boy, divorce and mass murders were rare and we had to walk backwards through the snow… blah blah blah. But, like it or not, you’re in no position to judge me; I respect your opinion and consider your words, but you’ve stepped out of your league when you start dictating reality to me.

I don’t know if you’ve reached that place in life where you realize that friction is a natural and desirable thing in a family. A son is supposed to tire of his parent’s rule and strike out on his own. Fathers naturally tire of a young whippersnapper in the house with a pair to prove. Those things fade over time.
What isn’t so liable to fade away is the bitter gall in your heart. If you don’t want to live and die with it, and if you don’t have a god to lay it before, I strongly recommend you deal with it where it needs to be dealt with. Before you can only wish you had.

Peace and love on you, brother. I hope you walk the path without carrying that load.

Inside, yes; bitterness, anger, and pain are definitely below the surface. I cannot deny that I was shaped by both the good and ill put on me by my parents. Evident? Yep; once I was out of their household, all I could think about was how few happy memories I had.

I'm sorry to read what you went through as a child--it was wrong. The kind of environment you grew up in...I cannot imagine, but I am glad that you managed to get out and become your own person. Although hearing what you had to put up with is the same reason that I will never ever have children, simply because I have issues not worth passing down (my autism) and I do not want to become my father.

I'm sorry to hear that there wasn't pure closure between you and your mother. I think about my parents dying and I wonder how I'll feel. But with parents like that...if we state what they did to us, would it really matter to them? Wouldn't they just say "Well I did what I had to do!" or "you didn't make it easy!"? To us it's abuse; to them, it's Tuesday.

Your closing advice is appreciated, but as I stated above--I have no interest whatsoever in siring children. On that regard I will never relate to you. Obviously you've made your choices, and have your views, which while they may differ from mine I can do nothing about the fact.

I think that's what I'm trying to do now--deal with it. I'm angry at my parents for so much--not just inheriting the autism but everything else. And you're right too; I'm handling it poorly. But isn't it normal to be this angry when your compare upbringing to the one I love and realize that my childhood was just messed up? Unfairly and without need?

And I agree with you--it's not healthy to carry this angry burden. But I feel like as long as my parents are alive I'll never truly be free of it. I'm sorry for being a whipper-snapper over the past few days; I guess anger is just a part of the mourning process.

 

[The Pandector]

I'll try not to be too baffled by the double standard, but I respect your opinion.

Not a double standard. Nor am I straddling a fence as you stated to another. I am where I’ve been all along when you walk by and dictate where the line is. Much of our search for truth is predicated on our definition of terms.

FTR - I hated my mother and brother for using me. A few years ago, I found out I’m ASD. Soon after, I realized my mom was autistic. Now I hear that brother is in a broken state with obvious autism issues. If I understand the science, there’s a pretty good chance one of your parents is dealing with undiagnosed autism. Helps me understand mom just hiding her head in the sand. I think undiagnosed autism is much harder to deal with.

 

[The Pandector]

Inside, yes; bitterness, anger, and pain are definitely below the surface. I cannot deny that I was shaped by both the good and ill put on me by my parents. Evident? Yep; once I was out of their household, all I could think about was how few happy memories I had.

I'm sorry to read what you went through as a child--it was wrong. The kind of environment you grew up in...I cannot imagine, but I am glad that you managed to get out and become your own person. Although hearing what you had to put up with is the same reason that I will never ever have children, simply because I have issues not worth passing down (my autism) and I do not want to become my father.

I'm sorry to hear that there wasn't pure closure between you and your mother. I think about my parents dying and I wonder how I'll feel. But with parents like that...if we state what they did to us, would it really matter to them? Wouldn't they just say "Well I did what I had to do!" or "you didn't make it easy!"? To us it's abuse; to them, it's Tuesday.

Your closing advice is appreciated, but as I stated above--I have no interest whatsoever in siring children. On that regard I will never relate to you. Obviously you've made your choices, and have your views, which while they may differ from mine I can do nothing about the fact.

I think that's what I'm trying to do now--deal with it. I'm angry at my parents for so much--not just inheriting the autism but everything else. And you're right too; I'm handling it poorly. But isn't it normal to be this angry when your compare upbringing to the one I love and realize that my childhood was just messed up? Unfairly and without need?

And I agree with you--it's not healthy to carry this angry burden. But I feel like as long as my parents are alive I'll never truly be free of it. I'm sorry for being a whipper-snapper over the past few days; I guess anger is just a part of the mourning process.

Yeah. I didn’t know about autism but was uncertain about having kids because I could see some of my mom in myself. However, my wife encouraged me and life was never the same. Now, knowing, I wouldn’t have had children.

I’m saddened by your situation, but don’t want to assume this is your outcome. No, like I said about wishing I had verbalized to mom, it wouldn’t have changed her or history. Maybe it’s just me, but things are easier to sort when both sides have had their say. I wish I had had my say.

I do think bitterness gets harder to root out the longer it’s fed. I’m far from done.

 

[autism-and-autotune]

Since that is your response, I am thinking the how's and why's of our parents expressing "discipline" were different.

The reason I never had any thought at all that what my parents were doing wrong is because I knew I was guilty of wrong doing well before my father got out the belt. I had time to think it through sometimes for hours before I had my punishment dealt to me. I knew it was coming. The other part, was that during that time, this was the way parents dealt with children's discipline and there was no conversation out there suggesting something alternative at the time. Certainly, this sort of discipline was relegated to young children, as older children, parents figured out that work, removal of privileges, etc. was often more effective. Furthermore, we were far more emotionally disconnected. Nobody ever asked anyone how they felt. People didn't care how you felt. Expressing feelings was not something you could do in front of people. If you did, you were "out of control" and were quickly shut down, even physically removed. It was not socially appropriate behavior. If you cried, you were weak, and even that was a punishable offense. Growing up in that sort of environment, we never had any thought in our head that what was going on was wrong in any way.

Now, it sounds to me you grew up in a very different environment than I. As they say, "apples and oranges". So, if your parents were being physical with you or being mentally and psychologically abusive or manipulative, then that is a totally different situation. If you were subject to this sort of behavior because of you being you, not because of some truly punishable behavior, then that's a different situation. You may have recognized that, in some cases, they may have been treating you unfairly and what you were experiencing was not always within the context of discipline, but rather some personality-disordered controlling behavior, or perhaps anger, or perhaps they just needed an outlet for their own frustrations and pain. Yeah, if you recognized the injustice of that, then I could see where you knew what they were doing was wrong.

Hmm...it's interesting to read your experience in the first paragraph. I never knew what I'd done wrong to warrant getting spanked or slapped; my parents just had mean tempers and could 'lose it.' I seem to have grown up in a similar household; we too were emotionally disconnected. We only come together in times of big things happening, like when my mother found out my sister was harming herself--but it was just a pity-party so could state that she 'felt like a bad mother' instead of actively changing her behaviour. It's really really sad to think that this was how we once all were.

It's all abuse under the same umbrella--at least, that's my take on it. To be the proverbial punching bag was just...hurtful. Sometimes I just hate them so much.

 

[autism-and-autotune]

Yeah. I didn’t know about autism but was uncertain about having kids because I could see some of my mom in myself. However, my wife encouraged me and life was never the same. Now, knowing, I wouldn’t have had children.

I’m saddened by your situation, but don’t want to assume this is your outcome. No, like I said about wishing I had verbalized to mom, it wouldn’t have changed her or history. Maybe it’s just me, but things are easier to sort when both sides have had their say. I wish I had had my say.

I do think bitterness gets harder to root out the longer it’s fed. I’m far from done.

Well, your wisdom is securing my stance on having kids; I'd rather regret not having them than having them.

It's often said that we regret what we didn't do more in life than what we did do; does this apply to you? For your sake I wish you could've had the opportunity to clear your chest.

Yeah, I agree with you. Some days I feel like I can let it roll off me; others...well, look at me and the past couple days!

 

[autism-and-autotune]

Not a double standard. Nor am I straddling a fence as you stated to another. I am where I’ve been all along when you walk by and dictate where the line is. Much of our search for truth is predicated on our definition of terms.

FTR - I hated my mother and brother for using me. A few years ago, I found out I’m ASD. Soon after, I realized my mom was autistic. Now I hear that brother is in a broken state with obvious autism issues. If I understand the science, there’s a pretty good chance one of your parents is dealing with undiagnosed autism. Helps me understand mom just hiding her head in the sand. I think undiagnosed autism is much harder to deal with.

All right; I see what you mean. My stance cannot be changed, nor yours; let's agree to disagree, I guess.

I've had the same realization--mostly about my father, but my mom may have it too. That makes me angriest of all. There's nothing worse than neurodivergent folk stuck thinking they're neurotypical; all it does is hurt themselves, and others around them. Forced blindness and ignorance just...I don't know if I pity them or hate them for not trying to find out more about themselves. The worst thing a person can do is to never endeavor to learn about themselves. I had something else I wanted to say but I forgot it.

 

[autism-and-autotune]

1. Getting them to talk through things requires some level of mental maturity. Something that small children struggle with because they are inexperienced in life. I think this varies from child to child, but typically once they reach school age, a parent and child can have these discussions. However, I do think, on rare occasions when they are truly guilty of the sorts of things that would get an adult in trouble with the law, then that requires a swift, hard stop, and harsh disciplinary action is needed. Far better they learn these life lessons as children rather than as an adult.

2. Your example of the workplace, can be an emotional event if you truly did something wrong, are caught, and then had to have a disciplinary session with your boss, or worse, fired. That definitely would be an emotional pairing event.

3. The fact that you are riled up about someone else's thoughts regarding this is normal. Like I suggested earlier, us older folks experienced this transition, went through this period of questioning, then saw the results in our younger generations, and now we think there may have been some mistakes in how we approached this transition in parenting skills. A lot of our children, now in their 20's and 30's are struggling with mental health issues, a loss of purpose and responsibilities, a loss of morality and discipline, combined with feelings of entitlement, become offended easily, and a sense of arrogance that no one should disagree with them. "I feel, therefore I am." "I identify as, ______". Association or causation, but these are things that are new to our society, specific of that generation, in the broader sense. It's messed up, and as parents, we have to look in the mirror and admit some responsibility and guilt for that. Imagine a pendulum swinging from one extreme to the other, and now trying to figure out some sort of medium ground, a more tempered approach, where both harsh discipline can and should be used in specific cases, but also with a bias towards a more positive reinforcement in most other cases. Furthermore, how does one instill a sense of "duty", "code of conduct", responsibility, self-discipline, whilst allowing for individuality of person and thought? Feelings are important to express, but we absolutely can not allow feelings dictate our actions, and this is often what happens now-a-days with disastrous results. It is not WHAT we do, but rather HOW we do that is critical, and I think a lot of parents struggle with this, as each child presents with unique challenges. Children don't come with instruction manuals. Everything is trial and error, and as a parent, you just pray you have more successes than failures, but for certain, a parent will make mistakes.

4. As far as my examples being far reaching, I think it may be the difference between two worlds, a generational gap perhaps. I've lived through the before and after and have witnessed the results. Everything I said is true, in my world. That is my experience.

5. Yes. I do think there is a correlation between truly abusive parents and their children coming in contact with the law. But I also think that there is a continuum between discipline and abuse, and it can get confusing as to when one becomes the other. Also, keep in mind, we are autistic, so how we interpret our world is going to be different than others, and yes, that can mean that because of our social and communication naivity and difficulties, we could come in contact with law enforcement.

I. Good point; children are inexperienced because they're children. Wait...in trouble like the law, like what? Murder? Theft? Battery?

II. Uh, okay. I guess I'll get there when I get there.

III. At least you can admit that some admit to their mistakes, for which I applaud. It's fair for your to generalize and critique things like identity and other things, I understand this due to none of that being a discussion in your day and age. But I do agree that a medium and tempered approach should and can be found. I..agree to some extent about not letting our emotions get the better of us, but due to my upbringing and remembering being struck out of anger alone, I'm unsure how to fully respond. I'm joking here, but maybe now that everyone is admitting and fully realizing that raising children is difficult and such a mountain to climb...why keep having kids?

IV. Well said.

V. Okay; feel free to think that way.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

I. Good point; children are inexperienced because they're children. Wait...in trouble like the law, like what? Murder? Theft? Battery?

II. Uh, okay. I guess I'll get there when I get there.

III. At least you can admit that some admit to their mistakes, for which I applaud. It's fair for your to generalize and critique things like identity and other things, I understand this due to none of that being a discussion in your day and age. But I do agree that a medium and tempered approach should and can be found. I..agree to some extent about not letting our emotions get the better of us, but due to my upbringing and remembering being struck out of anger alone, I'm unsure how to fully respond. I'm joking here, but maybe now that everyone is admitting and fully realizing that raising children is difficult and such a mountain to climb...why keep having kids?

IV. Well said.

V. Okay; feel free to think that way.

1. Wait...trouble like the law, like what?

You've missed the context. The types of behaviors, that IF they were adults, they would be arrested for. But because they are children, the parents have to deal with it with discipline and teaching. So, examples would be stealing, property damage, hitting another person maliciously, lying to authority figures, etc. I literally did all of that when I was a little kid, that is, until I got caught and was disciplined. Never as an adult.

2. As an autistic person, no one has ever falsely accused you in the workplace? You've never made a mistake in the workplace that landed you in the supervisor's office? The first 20 years at my job I found myself in the supervisor's office frequently. It sucks having that buildup of fear and anxiety of not knowing if you still had a job after the talk. Most of it was people running around behind my back trying to sabotage me, interpreting my communication and actions falsely, complaining to the boss about things that, they too, were guilty of, so on and so forth. It was never patient care things, but always about how I interacted with the team, how someone was offended, etc. Welcome to autism in the workplace.

3. One, you should never have been struck out of anger. That's different from what I was talking about. I was just talking about childrearing, in general. Your second comment regarding "why keep having kids?" Another topic, but relevant. Well, many have chosen not to have children, and in some countries, this may lead to economic and social collapse. Although many seem to think there are too many people on this planet, the data suggests we will reach a peak and then decline rapidly over this next decade. Some developed countries have been in population decline since around 1972. China used to have a 1 child policy, then 2, now 3. Japan is in significant trouble, as they are in rapid decline as of 10 years ago. The US will follow within the next decade as the baby boomers die off. Fewer and fewer young, working people supporting an ever-increasing geriatric population. The adult diaper-to-baby diaper ratio is changing rapidly. It could lead to an economic crisis in some countries.

5. There are facts to back that statement. Do a scientific research article search on "childhood abuse" and "legal system" or "incarceration". You will find several articles on the topic. Yes, a history of childhood abuse is quite common in these individuals. Likewise, doing a search for "autism spectrum disorder" and "incarceration" there is also appears to be a higher percentage of incarcerated men with an ASD (roughly 2X higher), as compared to the general population. Regarding the continuum of discipline and abuse, perhaps another perspective: What Is the Difference Between Discipline and Child Abuse?