My Daughter Possibly on the Spectrum

[Starfire]

The OP came here with suspicions of their child being on the spectrum and looking for guidance. I don't see what they wrote as being a demonstration of psychological abuse or unduly critical. It was an example of a confused parent listing behaviour traits as examples, in order to see if those on the spectrum could identify or not. I could identify with most of it as an officially diagnosed Aspie father of an officially diagnosed Aspie daughter. I could have gone further by mentioning explosive bouts of anger or threats of violence for example, which we have had to endure as a family.

Because a person is confirmed neurodiverse does not mean they are automatically to be put forward for sainthood, it does not mean that their behaviour is above criticism either!

I appreciate your passion in speaking up for neurodiverse people, but you are putting yourself across as extremely aggressive and unnecessarily confrontational. The OP was given some good advice to look into which I think she may take note of and look into. I think all you may have achieved Jana is to be blocked or ignored, that won't help you get your message across.

 

[Progster]

I can see how some on the comments of the OP may come across as critical and be triggering to autistic people, but to be fair to her, she did think to at least approach autistic people and ask them their opinion. It's more than what some people do.

 

[Butterfly-ink210]

The OP came here with suspicions of their child being on the spectrum and looking for guidance. I don't see what they wrote as being a demonstration of psychological abuse or unduly critical. It was an example of a confused parent listing behaviour traits as examples, in order to see if those on the spectrum could identify or not. I could identify with most of it as an officially diagnosed Aspie father of an officially diagnosed Aspie daughter. I could have gone further by mentioning explosive bouts of anger or threats of violence for example, which we have had to endure as a family.

Because a person is confirmed neurodiverse does not mean they are automatically to be put forward for sainthood, it does not mean that their behaviour is above criticism either!

I appreciate your passion in speaking up for neurodiverse people, but you are putting yourself across as extremely aggressive and unnecessarily confrontational. The OP was given some good advice to look into which I think she may take note of and look into. I think all you may have achieved Jana is to be blocked or ignored, that won't help you get your message across.

Starfire -- this was my intent -- to give examples of her behavior, hoping that some would be recognized as traits on the spectrum. Some that are listed have been ongoing for years. I joined here yesterday because some of the male friend behaviors mirrored hers. I am hesitant to add to my other thread due to my implied homewrecker status.

Being accused of blatant psychological abuse of the child that my husband and I waited 9 years for is utterly pathetic.

Thank you for stating that you were able to identify with what I wrote.

 

[Bolletje]

@Butterfly-ink210 I hope you don't get scared off by some of the less-than-friendly replies you've got.

I wish my parents had a resource like these forums back when I was a kid. There was no internet, and people didn't know about Aspergers at the time. As a kid I never knew this, but now, as an adult in my thirties, I know how worried and helpless I made them feel sometimes. They didn't let me feel their worries though, they made me feel loved. I think that's very important for a child, no matter what happens, to know their parents love and accept them.

Sadly a lot of people on the spectrum haven't felt much acceptance. Instead it was made clear to us from a young age that we were too different, too weird, just didn't belong with the rest of the world. Being excluded (if not bullied) for extended periods of time makes some people very suspicious of and angry towards the outside world. I guess that's what happening in this topic as well.

 

[Fridgemagnetman]

Being accused of blatant psychological abuse of the child that my husband and I waited 9 years for is utterly pathetic.

I don't think there is a need to call anyone pathetic.
Some people express themselves quite strongly and with good reason sometimes.
Emphasis sometimes.

People on the spectrum have often had a lifetime 'outside'
Being misunderstood, mislabelled,abused,bullied.

You've come to an autism forum for help.

Perhaps a greater display of empathy on here as well as in your own life would help?

Don't be so quick to label people as pathetic if they say something you don't like hearing.

My guess some of what was said may apply. Some won't.

In the neurotypical world the 'delivery' of the message can take on more importance than in the spectrum world.

Everyone has something to learn.

 

[Jana Delaney]

Having just been mobbed, in an attempt to force me to acquiesce to groupthink and false consensus, I have decided to leave this forum. I cannot force change, and the uphill battle of attempting to do so is draining. I shan't log back on to see whatever other disingenuous replies are made to this post, because they will only be further attempts to mob and 'correct' me back around to the manufactured consensus, which is driven by a need to pathologise autism and keep it forever classed as a disorder, when the meaning of the word 'disorder' is inherently bad, no matter how it is framed. I will not deny that my treatment in this thread has reminded me of childhood bullying, particularly in the family home, but behind all bullying behaviour is a pathetic attempt to hold illusions together, the illusion in this case being that difference is a problem, which must be classed as a 'disorder'.

With plenty of talk about why parents of autistic people come here, and despite what any of you say, it is not for 'help', it is to get conditioned autistic people to corroborate that there is indeed something 'wrong' with their child, because their child has a 'disorder', there has been no talk of why I came here, and so this I will state.

I came to this forum looking for like minds who were able to proactively discuss the real problems faced by autistic people rather than the illusory manufactured ones which doctors and parents tell us we face. With a tiny number of exceptions, I instead found people intent on preserving the status quo. Any talk of how to correct anomalies such as the enormous unemployment rates, levels of bullying and isolation of autistic people were minimal, if not non-existent. In order to find a solution to a problem, the problem itself must first be honestly identified, and the problem facing autistic people is not autism itself, but rather, the way that people treat us because we are autistic.

Many of the autistic people on this forum, instead of allowing me to engage with parents of autistic people in an open, honest, direct way, have instead mobbed and sanctioned me for attempting to advocate for autistic children who otherwise will grow up to have a morass of neuroses and psychological traumas because they will never know what unconditional acceptance feels like. This might explain why depression and anxiety are rife on the autism spectrum.

I do not consider any of you 'bad' people, just brainwashed, in many cases. This is not a criticism. I was once a brainwashed person too, but woke up. I hope within your lifetimes all of you can do the same.

 

[Mathalamus]

Jana, even aspies are still held to a specific standard. that is just a fact of life. we are not brainwashed, we just know that even we aspies cannot ever be truly ourselves, because it is, for the most part, socially impolite, if not just outright banned. its sad, but, that's just the realistic fact of life.

 

[Starfire]

Well I genuinely think it's a real shame that Jana has decided to leave. I would have been very interested to hear her thoughts on 'conditioned' autistic parents such as myself, with 'different' children, rather than dumping on NT parents looking for help for their children. If they don't get it here where will they get it?

I will never say there is anything wrong with my child or myself, because there isn't. We are only different in that we are in a 1 in 68 minority. I do feel different from the 68 but what is the alternative? Perhaps Jana was suggesting a radical type autistic only community free from NTs out in the wilds and off grid? How would that work, we can't even agree with each other on a forum?

The reality is my child needs to eat and have a roof. In order to provide that I have little choice but to engage with the majority, the NT world.

Jana is right that depression, anxiety, unemployment, bullying, drug and alcohol abuse is rife in our community, I have suffered from them all. But again, where is this autistic utopia where we can all live happily and be ourselves our own way?

It's location is, nowhere, it doesn't exist. Until it does, we need to treat concerned, worried, confused and loving parents who seek information from us better. If we don't and are abusive, unfriendly, and uncompassionate with them, then we are treating them no better than the way many of us have been treated for years and years.

 

[Beguiling Orbit]

 

[Bolletje]

Off topic: lemurs are awesome.

 

[Ylva]

My daughter is 12 and in 7th grade. In the past 8 years, she has made 2 friends. She had been best friends with a girl she met in K4 and the other is a neighborhood boy that she grew up with.

When she was younger, she participated in classes, camps, piano lessons, soccer, volleyball, swimming, etc...and she is willing to try new things. She is very shy and has a hard time starting a conversation with someone she doesn't know. It seems she doesn't know what to say, even though we give her suggestions.

Her communication with family is minimal. She answers questions with yes or no. She doesn't ask them questions or want to continue the conversation. To avoid embarrassment, we would answer questions for her, but we stopped doing that.

In class, she is not afraid to speak up, but in group projects, she would rather do the work with her best friend. This friend is very outgoing and makes friends very easily. I think my daughter gets jealous when she has to compete with others for her attention.

My daughter is very smart, straight A student, very conscientious and takes her work very seriously, sometimes to the point of perfectionism. She memorizes facts quickly and is able to learn in 1-2 repetitions. Her best friend is very academically challenged and borders on learning-disabled.

She always has to have the tags removed from clothing. She wears the same clothes over and over. She has never liked taking a bath or showers. When she was 4-5 years old, she would fall down on the floor on purpose. She would never be really excited about anything. She opened presents very slowly and thought about each present and how to respond. She had meltdowns, crying for an hour or more.

In the past two years, we have noticed a lack of empathy. If I am sick or injured, she tells me to stop being a baby and deal with it. When I cry in front of her, she is uncomfortable. She didn't cry at her grandpa's funeral. She almost never cries. Having a two way conversation with her is difficult. I do most of the talking and if I ask a question, her response is either I don't know or I don't care. She pretends to forget what I just said.

She has never been s touchy-feely person. If you touch her without warning, she gets upset. She doesn't like hugging me, but she does hug my husband. She is very attached to our dog and has lots of stuffed animals and beanie boos.

I have suspected high functioning autism in the past, but being in the friendship with the male I mentioned in a previous post has made me take notice of the parallels between the two.

She hasn't been tested. I am unsure where to begin--pediatrician or a therapist she has gone to several times for low self esteem.

I am hoping to find good information here.

 

[Vera]

Why not embrace different? Open our hearts and minds... find joy in the opportunity to share new ideas.. thoughts .. ways others think .. I find reading all your answers so enlightening!
Different perspectives .. I just joined tonight.. thank all who participate ..
there is truth in all of the responses. .. My wise grandmother always told me ...
if you can’t help someone, don’t hurt them ..

 

[LooseEnds]

@Butterfly-ink210, I understand your concerns completely, they echo mine very much about my own child and, increasingly, myself. I read your post not as criticism at all but as a list of traits/behaviours you think might make sense looked at in a certain light and asking whether that rang true for others. With a view to helping her and you understand how you might negotiate the world more comfortably. I'm brand new here and gobsmacked at the attack on your post... Will think a bit more before posting myself! Hugs x

 

[Katleya]

Hi @Butterfly-ink210


I think it's great that you're looking into ways to better understand your daughter and help her adapt into a world that is not necessarily built for her. That's the first step toward helping her get through life with less bullying and challenges than most of us here have faced.

You might want to read a few articles about autism presenting differently in girls than in boys, to begin with. Because females are often shunned aside, female traits are less widely known than male traits (but the same could be said of females and heart disease, so it's not just about neurodevelopment).

Here are 2, but there are many more available (I read a testimony once on yhe BBC's website, and a couple of US-based articles, too. It takes a little digging, but it's really worth it).
Gender and autism - NAS
'Social Camouflage' May Lead To Underdiagnosis Of Autism In Girls

If you type autism and female or autism in women in the searchbox on the forum, many threads should pop up about how many of us, as girls or women, were misdiagnosed, or only got a diagnosis later in life. I feel that these would be very useful, because if your daughter is indeed on the spectrum, she is at greater risk from different types of abuse, that you will need to find ways to protect her from. That includes medical abuse, too, such as receiving a label of mental illness and being heavily medicated for a pathology she doesn't have (or even committed, in some cases), which can truly destroy someone. There are other risks, too, but I don't want to scare you.

As for pursuing a diagnosis, my personal preference would go toward getting the diagnosis, since it's a lengthy process anyway; afterwards, you're free to use it or not, but like @Warmheart said, that's your best shot at having support, even if it's later down the road. I feel it's also very useful to help your daughter understand herself and the way her brain works better, rather than let her wonder the entire time why she isn't like other people, if something is wrong, or trying to fit in, which can be immensely trying and exhausting (and depressing, too). On that topic, sometimes I discuss my childhood and teenage years with my mother, and she feels terrible that she sometimes didn't realize how much I was struggling with things, because I was able to hide it so well. Except back then, I wasn't hiding the struggles on purpose, I was just convinced it was the same for everyone, so it never occurred to me to tell her about it.

Anyways, long story short, welcome, and this place is full of resources.[/USER]

 

[Starfire]

Hi @Butterfly-ink210
I think it's great that you're looking into ways to better understand your daughter and help her adapt into a world that is not necessarily built for her. That's the first step toward helping her get through life with less bullying and challenges than most of us here have faced.

You might want to read a few articles about autism presenting differently in girls than in boys, to begin with. Because females are often shunned aside, female traits are less widely known than male traits (but the same could be said of females and heart disease, so it's not just about neurodevelopment).

Here are 2, but there are many more available (I read a testimony once on yhe BBC's website, and a couple of US-based articles, too. It takes a little digging, but it's really worth it).
Gender and autism - NAS
'Social Camouflage' May Lead To Underdiagnosis Of Autism In Girls

If you type autism and female or autism in women in the searchbox on the forum, many threads should pop up about how many of us, as girls or women, were misdiagnosed, or only got a diagnosis later in life. I feel that these would be very useful, because if your daughter is indeed on the spectrum, she is at greater risk from different types of abuse, that you will need to find ways to protect her from. That includes medical abuse, too, such as receiving a label of mental illness and being heavily medicated for a pathology she doesn't have (or even committed, in some cases), which can truly destroy someone. There are other risks, too, but I don't want to scare you.

As for pursuing a diagnosis, my personal preference would go toward getting the diagnosis, since it's a lengthy process anyway; afterwards, you're free to use it or not, but like @Warmheart said, that's your best shot at having support, even if it's later down the road. I feel it's also very useful to help your daughter understand herself and the way her brain works better, rather than let her wonder the entire time why she isn't like other people, if something is wrong, or trying to fit in, which can be immensely trying and exhausting (and depressing, too). On that topic, sometimes I discuss my childhood and teenage years with my mother, and she feels terrible that she sometimes didn't realize how much I was struggling with things, because I was able to hide it so well. Except back then, I wasn't hiding the struggles on purpose, I was just convinced it was the same for everyone, so it never occurred to me to tell her about it.

Anyways, long story short, welcome, and this place is full of resources.

What a wonderful post! I wish I had the ability to write like this. In my opinion this is a great example of exactly the sort of way we need to learn to communicate with parents who come here looking for help and guidance.

These are the parents who will be bringing up the next generation of Aspies, myself included. If we can teach, inform and educate them about autism and what it is like to be on the spectrum, our communities and individuals needs and difficulties, strengths and abilities etc, they should never feel the need to seek out extreme 'treatments' or abusive 'therapies' which many do out of ignorance or sheer desperation of what to do for the best!

 

[Streetwise]

Butterfly-Ink, I understand your concerns completely, they echo mine very much about my own child and, increasingly, myself. I read your post not as criticism at all but as a list of traits/behaviours you think might make sense looked at in a certain light and asking whether that rang true for others. With a view to helping her and you understand how you might negotiate the world more comfortably. I'm brand new here and gobsmacked at the attack on your post... Will think a bit more before posting myself! Hugs x

welcome, ive got to say neurotypicals have attacked me !bear in mind !the info passed on this forum and others I imagine means we are aware of how neuro typical view us !One member posts articles!!!! quite a few of them are news articles about autistic people being abused!!! and not by autistic people.if you become a member and you are you are neurotypical tell us something about yourself. posts by neuro typicals are always of the same ilk -describing traits of their child which sounds extremely negative.

 

[Progster]

posts by neuro typicals are always of the same ilk -describing traits of their child which sounds extremely negative.

Yes, I agree, I think that this was the issue here, and the OP triggered some really negative emotions without intending to do so. I must admit that when I saw it, my first reaction was negative, "Oh, here we go again, another parent come to complain about the 'inadequacies' of their child, and why can't she be the same as other children her age, etc". Ditto people coming here to complain about their ASD partners, another thing I see a lot of. But then it did occur to me that at least she was asking for our perspective and approaching us - many just assume and judge without bothering to ask us our opinion and try to see things from our perspective.

There is a lot of negativity and stereotypes in the media and press about autism, and one way to dispel these is to inform and educate - so I don't think we should be discouraging parents from coming here to ask us for advice and opinions - as long as, of course, they do so in an appropriate and sensitive manner.

 

[Streetwise]

Yes, I agree, I think that this was the issue here, and the OP triggered some really negative emotions without intending to do so. I must admit that when I saw it, my first reaction was negative, "Oh, here we go again, another parent come to complain about the 'inadequacies' of their child, and why can't she be the same as other children her age, etc". Ditto people coming here to complain about their ASD partners, another thing I see a lot of. But then it did occur to me that at least she was asking for our perspective and approaching us - many just assume and judge without bothering to ask us our opinion and try to see things from our perspective. There is a lot of negativity and stereotypes in the media and press about autism, and one way to dispel these is to inform and educate - so I don't think we should be discouraging parents from coming here to ask us for advice and opinions - as long as, of course, they do so in an appropriate and sensitive manner.

that's why I said tell us something about yourself it's like communicating with a nebulous entity .

 

[Ylva]

@Progster "There is a lot of negativity and stereotypes in the media and press about autism, and one way to dispel these is to inform and educate..."

Another way is to be sarcastic, dispelling the notion that autistics don't understand sarcasm.

Maybe that can give us "negative press" as well, but the method where we are nice to people who are prejudiced against us perpetuates the notion that we are pushovers.

Note: This is in general, and not aimed at the OP of this thread in particular.

 

[Fridgemagnetman]

Another way is to be sarcastic, dispelling the notion that autistics don't understand sarcasm.

Maybe that can give us "negative press" as well, but the method where we are nice to people who are prejudiced against us perpetuates the notion that we are pushovers.

Note: This is in general, and not aimed at the OP of this thread in particular.

Yeh right