Out of curiosity...

[Neia]

There are times when I can see 'eye to eye' so to speak. But usually don't. If I am looking at their face during a conversation, I'll start really studying their face to try to grasp the entirety of what they are saying. Looking for the emotion behind the rhetoric. This intense studying then causes me to lose track of the conversation. Game over!

I don't really get the idea that eye avoidance is part of cynicism?

Yeah... I don't think it's true either. Just another label to throw at someone because it's hard to understand them.

That's what I think now.

When I was growing up, autism was a masculine condition only. I was just a selfish, cold, snobbish, lazy, strange girl.

I was either cold and weird, or too emotional and weird no way to win.

 

[Outdated]

When I was growing up, autism was a masculine condition only. I was just a selfish, cold, snobbish, lazy, strange girl.
I was either cold and weird, or too emotional and weird no way to win.

I was lucky in that I grew up in a strange era. No one had ever heard of autism back then in Australia, I was weird but no one had a label they could put on me. It was also a strange era in our history, in the late 70s and early 80s we had finally smashed the religious dominance of our society and anyone seen as alternative or different was celebrated.

I had a phat time as a teenager.

 

[Jumpinbare]

In the story above I started by looking out the window but I was in a completely different world after just a few minutes.

A big problem with hearing is that it can't be shut off. With sight you can look somewhere else or close your eyes. Hearing is all directions at once and can't be shut offf.

Apparently when I am really involved with an activity I can "turn off" my hearing. I have been told someone was knocking on my door at such-and-such time when I was definitely home. My hearing is normally very sensitive, but I never heard the knocking.

 

[Outdated]

Apparently when I am really involved with an activity I can "turn off" my hearing. I have been told someone was knocking on my door at such-and-such time when I was definitely home. My hearing is normally very sensitive, but I never heard the knocking.

That happens to me too if I'm reading a really good book. I discovered that some part of the brain still listens though.

Many years ago I finished work earlier than my girlfriend so it just made sense that I always cooked tea every night. One night I came home and put a stew on, then sat in a chair with a glass of red wine and a book. It seemed like only a few minutes later the book was snatched out of my hand.

I looked up at a very angry girlfriend who said "You haven't heard a single word I've said!". In complete honesty I said "No, I didn't even know you were home.". She hurled the book across the room and screamed "You were ...... answering me!".

 

[Neia]

Apparently when I am really involved with an activity I can "turn off" my hearing. I have been told someone was knocking on my door at such-and-such time when I was definitely home. My hearing is normally very sensitive, but I never heard the knocking.

I do that
Just last Wednesday I was home the whole day, a friend had sent me a book but I didn't know. It was a surprise gift. She knows I like to write things, make lists and so on, and sent me a prayer diary.
The poor mailman banged on the mailbox, called out for me, but I was doing I don't know what and didn't hear him

 

[Neia]

That happens to me too if I'm reading a really good book. I discovered that some part of the brain still listens though.

Many years ago I finished work earlier than my girlfriend so it just made sense that I always cooked tea every night. One night I came home and put a stew on, then sat in a chair with a glass of red wine and a book. It seemed like only a few minutes later the book was snatched out of my hand.

I looked up at a very angry girlfriend who said "You haven't heard a single word I've said!". In complete honesty I said "No, I didn't even know you were home.". She hurled the book across the room and screamed "You were ...... answering me!".

Yep!!!

I've no idea of the number of times something like that happened with me.

My mother used to get really upset because she thought I was purposely ignoring her.
My boss will just ask if I'm out in space somewhere.

 

[Outdated]

My boss will just ask if I'm out in space somewhere.

I had a boss that used to ask me "Is it dark in there?".

My brother and I always fought as kids and when we did it was full focus, the rest of the world ceased to exist. Mum used to think we were ignoring her when she tried to break it up but we didn't even know she was there.

One day my brother suddenly jumped back from me with honest fear in his eyes and I spun around to see what had frightened him so much. Mum was standing there holding half a broom, she had just broken it over my back. I didn't know and never felt it. Afterwards Dad said that if I ever made her mad enough to break another broom then I was going to get a belting from him when he got home too. But by that stage his threats had very little impact on me.

 

[Jonn]

Personally I avoid eye contact because it feels uncomfortable.

This is were I deviate from many autistics.
I have no trouble looking into someone's eyes.
I see it as "Information Gathering".

This has caused misunderstandings.
Half the women think I am trying to "crack onto them", while half the men think I am trying to do the same.

 

[Jonn]

I don't really get the idea that eye avoidance is part of cynicism?

Neither do I.
I would have thought it was a sign of shyness.

 

[Jonn]

There are times when I can see 'eye to eye' so to speak. But usually don't.

I have had to learn not to do it with women for extended periods.

 

[Neia]

This is were I deviate from many autistics.
I have no trouble looking into someone's eyes.
I see it as "Information Gathering".

This has caused misunderstandings.
Half the women think I am trying to "crack onto them", while half the men think I am trying to do the same.

That can be awkward

 

[Outdated]

I remember trying not to smile to myself in primary school whenever the teacher said "Now class, I want your full attention.". I'd think to myself, "No lady, you really don't.".

 

[Tired]

I am NT, but looking in people's eyes all the time while talking makes not much sense to me too. I look them in the eyes when they are talking, and then often look away when I'm the one talking, because somehow it feels more natural to me. When I talk I sometimes throw glances at their face, just to see their emotions and that's that.
No one ever complained about this my characteristic.

 

[Outdated]

and then often look away when I'm the one talking, because somehow it feels more natural to me.

Interesting. That's very similar to how it works with tribal Aboriginal people. You look them in the eye when you first meet and shake hands, that seems to be a part of the hand shaking ritual universally, but after that you mostly only talk to one of their shoulders, now and then glancing up to the eyes to add emphasis to a comment.

 

[Boogs]

Over in the UK, some cultures such as the Afro-Caribbean's tend (I may be generalising so maybe not all of them) not to look each other in the eye while in conversation, and find some white natives to be rather rude and intimidating because they do look people in the eye too much!

It's interesting as it must be (as mentioned above) in part congenital to many people, but also very cultural too, therefore environmental as well - i.e. for NT folk.

 

[Boogs]

Interesting. That's very similar to how it works with tribal Aboriginal people. You look them in the eye when you first meet and shake hands, that seems to be a part of the hand shaking ritual universally, but after that you mostly only talk to one of their shoulders, now and then glancing up to the eyes to add emphasis to a comment.

That's interesting as my first thought is whether in our far more complex and distracting world, maybe we've (as humans) have developed a more intensive way of face staring/eye contact, to block out the external factors constantly crying for our attention? i.e. the more natural cultures less intensively industrialised and commercialised don't need to do this, can reserve eye contact for more important emphasis? Maybe get more from voice than eye in normal conversation?

 

[Shevek]

There are societies where eye contact is assumed to be hostile, and some species of animal that take it that way. My recent learning is that when I'm speaking, I'm nearly blind, totally focused on thinking of the right words in the time available. I never see reactions to what I say.
I can do eye contact from time to time, but sometimes it is too intense. I learn far more from body language than faces.

 

[Neia]

That's interesting as my first thought is whether in our far more complex and distracting world, maybe we've (as humans) have developed a more intensive way of face staring/eye contact, to block out the external factors constantly crying for our attention? i.e. the more natural cultures less intensively industrialised and commercialised don't need to do this, can reserve eye contact for more important emphasis? Maybe get more from voice than eye in normal conversation?

I think it might have started as a staring contest. Literally!

With dogs, if you want them to submit to you you stare at them in the eyes, and the first to break eye contact is, basically, decreeing the other as the strongest, more powerful.

I'm good with dogs better than with people. With my dogs, or any dog that I wanted to accept me as dominant, I'd do the eye contact thing if they tried to bite me or showed aggression against me. Sometimes I coupled it with the back neck grab.

Maybe the European cultures used eye contact like that originally?
I've no idea it just sounds plausible to me, now that I'm thinking of it.

I might have to research this

 

[Boogs]

I found a funny aspect (well, strange more than funny ha-ha) was that I have to be careful to moderate eye contact as it can creep people out if it's too intense - I have to deliberately keep looking away from the eyes and drift around the face more to avoid it.
I also partially got round my dislike of being around crowds when out and about by using eye control, especially the flesh around the eyes - how your eye's are shaped, narrowed, widened, etc. by using it to give an unapproachable aspect, along with body language to match, but I think it's the upper part of the face, the eye area, that can strongly re-enforce this.
I find cats much easier to get along with than dogs myself.

 

[Neia]

I found a funny aspect (well, strange more than funny ha-ha) was that I have to be careful to moderate eye contact as it can creep people out if it's too intense - I have to deliberately keep looking away from the eyes and drift around the face more to avoid it.
I also partially got round my dislike of being around crowds when out and about by using eye control, especially the flesh around the eyes - how your eye's are shaped, narrowed, widened, etc. by using it to give an unapproachable aspect, along with body language to match, but I think it's the upper part of the face, the eye area, that can strongly re-enforce this.
I find cats much easier to get along with than dogs myself.

I do the same.

I find that if my facial expression seems "expressionless", people will tend to not try to chat.