Out of curiosity...

[Boogs]

I'm sure I come across as an 'unpleasant person to be avoided' by the general populace (just strangers in public places) and when I think about it, they may well be right to think so (if even for the wrong reasons), but I'm more and more just happy not to have to deal with them in any way and just cruise through them in a really "I'm here, don't get in my way" sort of attitude, though not aggressively (though it probably looks like it).
Being 6ft+ doesn't hurt either, being hirsute and wearing a black leather biker jacket definitely helps too!
And if it isn't raining too hard, the Raybans help too, especially on very rare occasions when stopped, and slowly raise them - seems to invoke a sense of "oh, sorry, doesn't matter mate, thought you were someone else..." from them!

Now I think about it, maybe I'm ostracising them, before they can do so to me?

 

[UFO]

For those who have difficulty in maintaining eye contact with others, do you ever find your gaze kind of "sliding" all over the place in the head region of tge person you're talking to?

If I try to take an eye contact, I can't keep it up long. It turns out to be an unnatural effort where I am just focusing to keep it and not even blink during it. As someone has said "if I make an eye contact, you can be sure that I am not listening you". My gaze won't wander around, it more like turns away to some empty space with as little distractions as possible.

I wouldn't get anything out from an eye contact anyway, as I have near-zero ability to read other person's emotions from his/hers eyes. Focusing on mouth is more practical, that way I can at least hear better what he/she is saying.

I find that if my facial expression seems "expressionless", people will tend to not try to chat.

Which is a good thing

Okay. That was a joke. Seriously saying:

When I have to communicate with people, I have a wide variation of fake expressions and gestures to make them feel more comfortable.

I don't mean that I fake my smile while I don't feel like smiling at all. I mean that if I smile inside, it won't always automatically turn to an actual smile outside, so I have to consciously make it happen.

I am NT, but looking in people's eyes all the time while talking makes not much sense to me too. I look them in the eyes when they are talking, and then often look away when I'm the one talking, because somehow it feels more natural to me.

@Tired Serious question: What it feels to you (as NT who is not in habit of doing eye contact) to make and keep up eye contact?

That's very similar to how it works with tribal Aboriginal people. You look them in the eye when you first meet and shake hands, that seems to be a part of the hand shaking ritual universally, but after that you mostly only talk to one of their shoulders, now and then glancing up to the eyes to add emphasis to a comment.

That's how it works where I come from. Eye contact is generally not required in everyday communication, but considered more of as a challenge, or as a sign of love, or as a demonstration of strength (when first meeting and greeting with an another person, to give a positive impression). So avoiding eye contact is not a problem around here. (Though staring to own feet is...)

I looked up at a very angry girlfriend who said "You haven't heard a single word I've said!". In complete honesty I said "No, I didn't even know you were home.".

Oh god... Done something like that myself. Not meant to be cheeky or anything, it just came out... Not a good line to say to anyone...

 

[Suzanne]

Funny, but before diagnosis of ASD, I could not do eye to eye contact very well and for me, the longer I stared, the bigger their head got and it would quite honestly frighten me.

Now, with diagnosis and I suppose finding an answer to why I could not do eye to eye contact, I am a little better at it now, although if tired or the person is over talking, I do find myself having a struggle to maintain that eye contact.

 

[Boogs]

It is enormously exhausting keeping up that level of focus and concentration as to where to look, and what the signs are they are giving off, while also having to work out what the words coming out mean. I can only really focus on one thing at a time and find switching between the two to be an unpleasant sensation. Also depends on distance, three foot away is much harder than 6 foot away.

 

[Neia]

If I try to take an eye contact, I can't keep it up long. It turns out to be an unnatural effort where I am just focusing to keep it and not even blink during it. As someone has said "if I make an eye contact, you can be sure that I am not listening you". My gaze won't wander around, it more like turns away to some empty space with as little distractions as possible.

I wouldn't get anything out from an eye contact anyway, as I have near-zero ability to read other person's emotions from his/hers eyes. Focusing on mouth is more practical, that way I can at least hear better what he/she is saying.



Which is a good thing

Okay. That was a joke. Seriously saying:

When I have to communicate with people, I have a wide variation of fake expressions and gestures to make them feel more comfortable.

I don't mean that I fake my smile while I don't feel like smiling at all. I mean that if I smile inside, it won't always automatically turn to an actual smile outside, so I have to consciously make it happen.


@Tired Serious question: What it feels to you (as NT who is not in habit of doing eye contact) to make and keep up eye contact?


That's how it works where I come from. Eye contact is generally not required in everyday communication, but considered more of as a challenge, or as a sign of love, or as a demonstration of strength (when first meeting and greeting with an another person, to give a positive impression). So avoiding eye contact is not a problem around here. (Though staring to own feet is...)


Oh god... Done something like that myself. Not meant to be cheeky or anything, it just came out... Not a good line to say to anyone...

I can't read people's expressions either. When I try to keep eye contact I do it because I was told I should.

I'm always wondering what they're thinking about, are they offended because I'm looking at their teeth/nose/eyebrows too much.

Have they noticed I'm looking at their teeth/nose/eyebrows instead of their eyes?

Them comes the: "OH SHOOT. I wasn't listening to them... quick, pay attention to their last words and say something that might sound appropriate."

 

[Boogs]

are they offended because I'm looking at their teeth/nose/eyebrows too much.

oh yes! Know what you mean.

 

[Tired]

Serious question: What it feels to you (as NT who is not in habit of doing eye contact) to make and keep up eye contact?

I just don't care much, it is for me the same as looking at someone's hand, hair or any other body parts, I feel nothing special about looking into someone's eyes. I can of course sometimes think about how someone has pretty eye-color, or how long are their eye-lashes, drifting away from listening to the person talking to me, but that happens rarely. Why I tend to not look in people's eyes much when I talk, is because I feel more focused about what I want to say, looking someone in the eyes sometimes unfocuses me, as I wrote earlier.

 

[Tired]

I can't read people's expressions either. When I try to keep eye contact I do it because I was told I should.

I'm always wondering what they're thinking about, are they offended because I'm looking at their teeth/nose/eyebrows too much.

Have they noticed I'm looking at their teeth/nose/eyebrows instead of their eyes?

Them comes the: "OH SHOOT. I wasn't listening to them... quick, pay attention to their last words and say something that might sound appropriate."

Yes, most people can see where you are looking. And where I live, looking someone in the mouth is impolite and offending. But if you look for example on the nose or eyebrow, most won't mind if you do it from time to time, but if you constantly drift there, it can make people have some insecure thoughts about something being wrong with their nose/eyebrow (like for example if they think they have big nose, and you start looking at their nose, they'll feel more nervous, or think is something sticking from their nose and stuff like that heh).

 

[Neia]

Yes, most people can see where you are looking. And where I live, looking someone in the mouth is impolite and offending. But if you look for example on the nose or eyebrow, most won't mind if you do it from time to time, but if you constantly drift there, it can make people have some insecure thoughts about something being wrong with their nose/eyebrow (like for example if they think they have big nose, and you start looking at their nose, they'll feel more nervous, or think is something sticking from their nose and stuff like that heh).

I can't help it I try so hard, but my eyes don't want to stay put.
And it's not like I have a choice at where I do look, my gaze just drifts without me noticing. And when I do notice I try to correct it. But

 

[Tired]

I can't help it I try so hard, but my eyes don't want to stay put.
And it's not like I have a choice at where I do look, my gaze just drifts without me noticing. And when I do notice I try to correct it. But

You just do what feels natural for you, no worries, I just answered some of your questions

 

[Aspychata]

I drew faces on a piece of paper and put it on the covering over my daughter on her bouncing chair, and she just stared at them. I also lowered her mobile of teddy bears near her feet, and she kicked them as hard as she could.
I often stare at eyebrows, most people can't tell where you are staring anyways.

 

[Boogs]

And it's not like I have a choice at where I do look, my gaze just drifts without me noticing.

Maybe more than you know. The eye's move constantly and more than we can detect. In fact, if your eyes are both totally immobilised you go blind effectively! Hold your thumb out far as you can, and your eye's can roughly see an area the size of your thumb nail and that's it. They have to scan constantly.

 

[Shamar]

For those who have difficulty in maintaining eye contact with others, do you ever find your gaze kind of "sliding" all over the place in the head region of tge person you're talking to?

Now that I have been confronted with the possibility of being autistic, I've started realising that this rude thing I do is probably a characteristic of autism.

I was told, when I was 13-ish, that only cynical people don't look others in the eyes.
Since I didn't want to be cynical, I started trying hard to maintain eye contact when talking with someone.

But my eyes don't want to stay put.
They kind of slide around to the person's eyebrows, nose, ears, hair line, mouth and teeth. I usually spend a lot of time looking at the other person's teeth and wondering if they notice what I'm doing, and if they are feeling offended by that.

I force my eyes back up to the other person's eyes, but seconds later... there they go wandering around the head of the person again.

I could identify some people just by their noses

For me, eye contact is momentary and inadvertent. If I have to create the appearance of eye contact, I look at the wall behind them. Sometimes they even fade away.

 

[Jeff T]

There are societies where eye contact is assumed to be hostile, and some species of animal that take it that way.

Equines, being prey animals, are apparently that way. With my reactive mule, I turn my head enough so that my predator-positioned eyes don't upset him- I see him okay out of 'the corner of my eyes'. With the horse, she's so cheeky that direct eye contact mellows her pushiness some. She likes to give shove-answers to my vocalized questioning/sounds- she doesn't bite or is dangerous.
I wonder if most herbivores are that way?
With dogs, it depends whether you are part of the pack or not?
And cats seem unaffected by bold directness of the eyes?
Gorillas apparently failed the Mirror Self Recognition Test due to eye avoidance- apparently a Gorilla making eye contact with another is bad conduct.

 

[Boogs]

I wonder if most herbivores are that way?

I'd guess that varies wildly from species to species. Some herbivores are far more dangerous than some predators.
It seems diet doesn't predicate level of aggression.
If I had to guess (again) I'd say eye contact has many influences from genetic, to social and environmental, and again can't be simply ascribed one one or two basic attributes. After all, even within species it can vary wildly.