The Extrovert Aspie

[icesyckel]

I did a little bit of googling (I know it's not very official, but it will have to do for now).
What Does It REALLY Mean to Be an Extrovert or Introvert?

Introversion and extroversion are commonly misunderstood. Just because someone is shy, doesn’t mean she’s an introvert. Someone who is bubbly, gregarious and the life of the party can, in reality, be an introvert. The difference between introverts and extroverts is simply this:

Where do we gain or lose energy?

Introverts are drained by people and need alone time to recharge.

Extroverts are drained by too much time alone. They need human interaction to recharge.

Yeah, by this standard I am definitely an introvert, although I am by no means shy. Also, to your discussion with Harrison54, I believe performing in front of or giving a speech to an audience is inherently different from socializing in that, while difficult for a shy person, these tasks are not necessarily difficult for an introvert because they do not involve actual socializing. Such public speaking/performing engagements are usually one-sided, and even when interactive involve more clearly delineated structure than regular, informal socializing/conversations.

I actually find public speaking in formal settings with rules (i.e., courtroom performance) far easier and less stressful than routine socializing.

 

[Harrison]

Ha, you'll have to share your list, I'm intrigued

Suffice it to say, I tick the boxes on your list

 

[Vanilla]

Yeah, by this standard I am definitely an introvert, although I am by no means shy. Also, to your discussion with Harrison54, I believe performing in front of or giving a speech to an audience is inherently different from socializing in that, while difficult for a shy person, these tasks are not necessarily difficult for an introvert because they do not involve actual socializing. Such public speaking/performing engagements are usually one-sided, and even when interactive involve more clearly delineated structure than regular, informal socializing/conversations.

I actually find public speaking in formal settings with rules (i.e., courtroom performance) far easier and less stressful than routine socializing.

Yes, by that definition I do agree with you there, although his fondness for greeting strangers at his favourite cafe seems to suggest some extroverted behaviour as well. I'm liking the sound of this new ambivert definition; I'll have to look in to it some more

Also, I did the quick quiz provided by that link I posted above, and received the following result. It doesn't seem to have a weighted percentage, and so only shows results in a very black and white fashion, but judging by my answers to their questions, I seemed to be a generous mix of both:

You're an ambivert. That means you're neither strongly introverted nor strongly extraverted. Recent research by Adam Grant of the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton School of Management has found that ambiverts make the best salespeople. Ambiverts tend to be adept at the quality of attunement. They know when to push and when to hold back, when to speak up and when to shut up. So don't fall for the myth of the extraverted sales star. Just keep being your ambiverted self.

 

[icesyckel]

Meet the Ambivert

Many people fall into what is called an ambivert, meaning they exhibit traits of both. If you want to learn if you might be an ambivert, there’s a cool test here.

Source: The Myth About Introverts & Extroverts–Could You Be an Ambivert? | Kristen Lamb's Blog

I've read the problem with Myers-Briggs is that so many NT's fall in between introversion and extroversion (i.e., ambiverts). MB presumes people are one or the other. The theory of ambiversion presumes that this concept is not so binary/digital.

However, I believe again it is in how you define the terms. To the extent some people are refreshed/re-energized in small groups but not at parties, you might call that ambiversion. I don't know.

While I believe ambiversion is possible, I think when you parse it out, ambiversion is RARE. Why? The concept of introversion vs. extroversion asks the question does socializing energize you (extroversion) or de-energize you (introversion)? This is not really so binary a condition as it seems when you consider that the rate of renegizing/de-energizing changes. Maybe you're drained more slowly in small groups than at large parties, for example, or maybe less around friends than strangers?

Ask yourself this: in small groups of close and trusted friends/family (the least antagonistic social setting, usually), are you energized by it? It is easy to confuse enjoyment with energizing. I ENJOY these sorts of settings, but if I did it for 8 hours solid, then I would be exhausted.

I NEED time alone every day to recharge. I am introverted.

Others NEED time socially every day to recharge. They are extroverted.

Ambiverts NEED both. Meaning they need some of each to stay charged - a balance of sorts.

I've met many who believed they were ambiverts but who, in reality, are drained by social interactions - just at varying rates depending on the circumstances. They do not "NEED" daily socializing to be at peace. Conversely they need to be alone daily to be at peace.

That said, I do believe ambiverts exist. I believe that is the most difficult state of being, however, since you cannot focus on any one thing. Finding the right balance is far more complex and trying than simply being introverted and learning to tolerate a degree of socialization or being extroverted and learning to tolerate a certain degree of isolation.

 

[Vanilla]

I've read the problem with Myers-Briggs is that so many NT's fall in between introversion and extroversion (i.e., ambiverts). MB presumes people are one or the other. The theory of ambiversion presumes that this concept is not so binary/digital.

However, I believe again it is in how you define the terms. To the extent some people are refreshed/re-energized in small groups but not at parties, you might call that ambiversion. I don't know.

While I believe ambiversion is possible, I think when you parse it out, ambiversion is RARE. Why? The concept of introversion vs. extroversion asks the question does socializing energize you (extroversion) or de-energize you (introversion)? This is not really so binary a condition as it seems when you consider that the rate of renegizing/de-energizing changes. Maybe you're drained more slowly in small groups than at large parties, for example, or maybe less around friends than strangers?

Ask yourself this: in small groups of close and trusted friends/family (the least antagonistic social setting, usually), are you energized by it? It is easy to confuse enjoyment with energizing. I ENJOY these sorts of settings, but if I did it for 8 hours solid, then I would be exhausted.

I NEED time alone every day to recharge. I am introverted.

Others NEED time socially every day to recharge. They are extroverted.

Ambiverts NEED both. Meaning they need some of each to stay charged - a balance of sorts.

I've met many who believed they were ambiverts but who, in reality, are drained by social interactions - just at varying rates depending on the circumstances. They do not "NEED" daily socializing to be at peace. Conversely they need to be alone daily to be at peace.

That said, I do believe ambiverts exist. I believe that is the most difficult state of being, however, since you cannot focus on any one thing. Finding the right balance is far more complex and trying than simply being introverted and learning to tolerate a degree of socialization or being extroverted and learning to tolerate a certain degree of isolation.

I found I had issues with the Myers Briggs test too actually. Depending on my mood, I'd receive varying, and sometimes contradictory results. I assumed this was normal, but perhaps not?

At first I wasn't sure, as I was thinking of all the things that I enjoyed doing on my own. I can spend much time alone (I can go days without seeing another person), and be quite content, but there are days when I do crave social interaction, and unless I get some, I can start to feel a little down, and will generally procrastinate from any tasks I should be doing. When I'm with friends, and having a good time, and it's time to go home, I'm tend to feel a little disappointed that the time had gone so quickly too.

 

[icesyckel]

I actually took that (ambiversion) quiz giving several different combinations of answers - you have to be VERY consistent one way or the other to be anything but an ambivert, implying they see introversion and extroversion as static concepts, whereas (based on my understanding from discussing this with my psych) there are degrees of one or the other based upon the rate of energy drain/replenishment. Some can be "more" introverted than another introvert, but this test implies that renders the lesser introvert an "ambivert," which seems to contradict the implied definition of ambiversion from the first link you posted.

Again, it's just semantics/words. The importance is the concept of understanding when and in what situations you are being drained vs. re-fueled. That is VERY good to know, and it is important to remember (I've found) that you can get drained doing something you love/enjoy. You can wear yourself out playing sports. If you're "introverted" (or whatever) you can wear yourself out talking to people with whom you're extremely comfortable and relaxed. Knowing that teaches me to watch myself and make goodbyes before I get worn out - even when having a good time.

As to greeting strangers in a cafe, I do agree this is a sign indication of extroversion or possibly ambiversion. Why approach a stranger without a financial motive if people where you out?

 

[icesyckel]

I found I had issues with the Myers Briggs test too actually. Depending on my mood, I'd receive varying, and sometimes contradictory results. I assumed this was normal, but perhaps not?

The problem with MB is that, even if introversion and extroversion was an entirely binary concept (and I think it is for most but not all people), most of the other factors/elements are not binary and vary on situation. That is why people commonly get varying answers on re-testing. I am rare in that I have always consistently tested INTJ.

At first I wasn't sure, as I was thinking of all the things that I enjoyed doing on my own. I can spend much time alone (I can go days without seeing another person), and be quite content, but there are days when I do crave social interaction, and unless I get some, I can start to feel a little down, and will generally procrastinate from any tasks I should be doing. When I'm with friends, and having a good time, and it's time to go home, I'm tend to feel a little disappointed that the time had gone so quickly too.

I think the word "crave" would need to be further defined. I want to go swim laps sometimes, but it does consistently tire me. When you crave social interaction - do you just want to enjoy it, or do you need it to recharge? If the latter, then you may be ambiverted if you also need time alone in the same day.

 

[Vanilla]

I actually took that (ambiversion) quiz giving several different combinations of answers - you have to be VERY consistent one way or the other to be anything but an ambivert, implying they see introversion and extroversion as static concepts, whereas (based on my understanding from discussing this with my psych) there are degrees of one or the other based upon the rate of energy drain/replenishment. Some can be "more" introverted than another introvert, but this test implies that renders the lesser introvert an "ambivert," which seems to contradict the implied definition of ambiversion from the first link you posted.

Again, it's just semantics/words. The importance is the concept of understanding when and in what situations you are being drained vs. re-fueled. That is VERY good to know, and it is important to remember (I've found) that you can get drained doing something you love/enjoy. You can wear yourself out playing sports. If you're "introverted" (or whatever) you can wear yourself out talking to people with whom you're extremely comfortable and relaxed. Knowing that teaches me to watch myself and make goodbyes before I get worn out - even when having a good time.

As to greeting strangers in a cafe, I do agree this is a sign indication of extroversion or possibly ambiversion. Why approach a stranger without a financial motive if people where you out?

Perhaps we will find a more thorough test some day

 

[Vanilla]

The problem with MB is that, even if introversion and extroversion was an entirely binary concept (and I think it is for most but not all people), most of the other factors/elements are not binary and vary on situation. That is why people commonly get varying answers on re-testing. I am rare in that I have always consistently tested INTJ.



I think the word "crave" would need to be further defined. I want to go swim laps sometimes, but it does consistently tire me. When you crave social interaction - do you just want to enjoy it, or do you need it to recharge? If the latter, then you may be ambiverted if you also need time alone in the same day.

It can depend on my mood, but I have had days when I'm simply bored, and there are days when it has consumed my mind, which is why I do feel down, and tend to procrastinate. It's at these times that I can turn to a very good friend of mine, who understands that I do at times feel lonely, and so will have a quick chat, even if they're busy. While it doesn't satisfy this need, as I desire a more face-to-face interaction, it does help when immediate satisfaction can not be obtained. If they are unable to talk, I tend to resort to social media (either here on the forums, or Facebook), or by bothering the cat

 

[icesyckel]

I wonder if you aren't really an introvert who enjoys social interactions with friends? I think you're "craving" is exactly that: a strong desire to engage in something you enjoy. The deciding factor is, once you have indulged this craving, are you tired or refreshed? I crave a good Thanksgiving dinner, but afterwards I am wiped out.

I never socialize IRL that I am not tired (or at least less energetic) afterwards. Even posting here, I enjoy, but the interaction does leave me tired afterwards (though the rate of the drain is markedly less posting online and here in particular).

 

[AsheSkyler]

"Extroverted Aspie" does still confuse me, but, the first autistic person I had known in person had NO concept of personal space and was highly social, and loved to sing for crowds. And he sure didn't have a problem staring (rather unblinking) in your eye as he talked. Sweet as could be, wouldn't harm a fly and would probably pat it on the back after giving it a cookie, but my need of large personal space and his complete lack of it made it very difficult for me to interact with him.

I used to be INFP but lately I'm scoring more with INTJ. According to one women who made her class take them regularly, she says you're supposed to look more at the numbers per category than the category you're landed with to judge it's accuracy. I always get a high score in I and N and a low in E and S, but the F/T and P/J parts with me tend to just have a few points between them. And I'm definitely introverted, socializing can be tiring. Pleasurable at times, but still exhausting.

 

[Harrison]

This idea of being extrovert has freaked me out a bit, had a restless nightover it.

Since being diagnosed I have looked to develope an understanding of what being an aspie means for me, what I do or don't do. I thought I'd got a fairly good handle on things but now I'm looking at stuff I wasn't even aware of doing. For me that's scary, plus it seems my friends seemed to know but never said anything.

When I was a kid there was a guy who walked around our neighbourhood reading the bible, except he never had one in his hands, we called him the preacher. I got on with him really well and just thought he was someone who'd memorised the bible, chapter and verse. But people would ridicule him behind his back, guess I'm wondering how many people do that to me now.

Maybe I'm the village idiot.

 

[Vanilla]

This idea of being extrovert has freaked me out a bit, had a restless nightover it.

Since being diagnosed I have looked to develope an understanding of what being an aspie means for me, what I do or don't do. I thought I'd got a fairly good handle on things but now I'm looking at stuff I wasn't even aware of doing. For me that's scary, plus it seems my friends seemed to know but never said anything.

When I was a kid there was a guy who walked around our neighbourhood reading the bible, except he never had one in his hands, we called him the preacher. I got on with him really well and just thought he was someone who'd memorised the bible, chapter and verse. But people would ridicule him behind his back, guess I'm wondering how many people do that to me now.

Maybe I'm the village idiot.

Aw, I'm sorry to have worried you; that definitely wasn't the intention. It might be a good idea to talk to someone about it; perhaps your friend, or someone who can offer counselling. If you want, you're welcome to PM me.

I wonder if you aren't really an introvert who enjoys social interactions with friends? I think you're "craving" is exactly that: a strong desire to engage in something you enjoy. The deciding factor is, once you have indulged this craving, are you tired or refreshed? I crave a good Thanksgiving dinner, but afterwards I am wiped out.

I never socialize IRL that I am not tired (or at least less energetic) afterwards. Even posting here, I enjoy, but the interaction does leave me tired afterwards (though the rate of the drain is markedly less posting online and here in particular).

It definitely recharges me, when I'm enjoying the company. It gives me the energy to return from procrastination.

 

[Harrison]

Hey, not your fault. If anything you've opened up a new arena for me to look at once the initial shock has gone

 

[Wintertime]

I actually admin a couple of large groups on FB for Introversion and I can answer any questions insofar as what it actually is and how it works. The MBTI is nonsense and should be regarded as such. It was only loosely based on Jung's theories, it was created in the 1940s by a woman and her daughter who had very little education or scientific basis to back their assertions. It's little more than a pop culture fad, and it bothers me that the corporate world has picked it up and run with it, which in and of itself, should be reason enough to not take it seriously. People are not so static, in my opinion. I can be shy sometimes. Sometimes I am bold. It depends on many variables such as comfort level and familiarity and situation and environment.

The etymology of introvert boils down to 'look within'. That is what I do. Yet I love people and the two states are not mutually exclusive. Not all on a personal level but a humanitarian sense. On a personal level, I am true to introvert (aspie?) form in that I need closer or deeper relationships with fewer people. I simply can't handle more no matter how much I would like to, it is diametrically opposed to my nature, insofar as brain chemistry if we wish to get down to brass tacks. I've been popular from time to time and it wore me out and stressed me quite a bit. So I have a hierarchy of friendships which I think most people do. My time and energy are not an inexhaustable well, so I spend it wisely, with the people who are more important to me in a sense of quid pro quo. I enjoy their company and the comfort I receive from them, and they do me. One hopes it is quid pro quo.

*edit- having said that, I am not including my interaction on this website within that milieux. I care very much for many people on this website, and wouldn't wish any of them to feel as though they don't matter. I'm speaking more in general terms especially with regard to IRL connections.

I will try and post some of the myths and standards of introversion later in case it helps clear up any misconceptions. :]

But off the top of my head, introversion does not equal loner, misanthrope, shy, although they have been commonly associated as such so it is understandable that it would be thought so. Some of the examples I've seen could be attributed to other things such as ADHD (and I use the designation with reservations as I'm uncomfortable with attaching labels that carry stigma but that's another issue entirely, so for the sake of argument...).

 

[Wintertime]

I think the bottom line is, don't panic, you're all beautiful.

 

[Harrison]

I'm at work so ask my buddy -

Do I talk a lot?
Yep

Do I interrupt a lot?
Yep

Do I do weird stuff?
Not really. The way you check your gear is funny, talking to it all and stuff.

You know I'm an aspie?
So what. **** is a Moslem and **** is a Jehovah's Witness. I don't care what you worship.

Gave up at that point

 

[Vanilla]

I'm at work so ask my buddy -

Do I talk a lot?
Yep

Do I interrupt a lot?
Yep

Do I do weird stuff?
Not really. The way you check your gear is funny, talking to it all and stuff.

You know I'm an aspie?
So what. **** is a Moslem and **** is a Jehovah's Witness. I don't care what you worship.

Gave up at that point

Lol

 

[Wintertime]

10 Myths About Introverts | CarlKingdom.com :: Home of Carl King

The neuroscience is sound and should be the standard of measurement. There are a LOT of misconceptions around the internet as introversion has gained visibility in the public eye, which that visibility is of course thanks to people like Susan Cain.

I should probably leave this for today considering my own energy levels. I don't want to be a party to misinformation myself. Or miscommunication. I'm really not as Machiavellian as I might sound in earlier post, Lol. Sigh.

*edit- yeah, sorry. I should not post when I'm out of sorts.

 

[Vanilla]

10 Myths About Introverts | CarlKingdom.com :: Home of Carl King

The neuroscience is sound and should be the standard of measurement. There are a LOT of misconceptions around the internet as introversion has gained visibility in the public eye, thanks to people like Susan Cain.

Ooh, very informative, thanks