The Invention of Lying

[Aspychata]

Do you like to gamble?

Figuring out odds is truly gambling isn't it?

When you go for coffee, you gamble on your fav barista that makes a perfect mocha. When go to work, you gamble on that fact, your boss is in a good mood.

 

[SimonSays]

Figuring out odds is truly gambling isn't it?

Do you like to wager money on those odds?

 

[Judge]

Figuring out odds is truly gambling isn't it?

Don't tell an insurance actuary that. Might hurt his feelings.

 

[Varzar]

I think in numbers, l like to calculate odds, everyday, we think abouts odds. Don't you?

So l will continue to use percentages because it is my quirk, just as you have your wit and (fill in blanks)that define you. And as an after note, l will never go in and criticize your quirks because this is after all, an autism forum, (known for quirkiness). Touche .......

omg, yes. I am exactly the same way. Everything is numbers and probabilities inside my head.

 

[SimonSays]

When you go for coffee, you gamble on your fav barista that makes a perfect mocha. When go to work, you gamble on that fact, your boss is in a good mood.

Just noticed this extra bit...

I see what you mean now. I do this too, but wouldn't have described it as you did, which is why I only understand now.

 

[Aspychata]

Do you like to wager money on those odds?

Do l like to lose vast sums of money based on odds, what do you think?

Have l had success based on some of my choices, yes, l have. But for now l live vicariously just buying lottery tickets, bad odds but still fun.☺

 

[Bert22]

I used to lie. When I was young (teens) I just spoke the truth without reservation. I didn't even notice what others did, but as I grew in high school I found that others tell you truth which they expect you to keep secret. So I learned to lie..

As I got older, I found this harder and harder to deal with, as with each lie it was necessary to file and remember which lie you had told to who, and who was "allowed" to know what. The pressure of trying to keep up with everyone's lies (mine and others) was too great, and I would tend to have truthful outbursts which caused me bigger problems.

So I changed, and tried to avoid lying. But observing people around me it was obvious that most people lie some of the time, even my closest friends. I found that the only way to get honest answers was to provoke responses with statements that were challenging, as people often react too quickly when annoyed and have their own truthful outbursts.

Since then I've learned its not that simple. What people say and how they react varies with their mood. Turns out judging people's moods is not something I can do, unless they wear their heart on their sleeves. Sometimes it still frustrates me when others don't tell the truth, or withhold truth claiming its to save my feelings (when I suspect this is often driven by their desire to avoid conflict as much as anything). But most days I let it slide without too much trouble, and just worry about being as honest as I can without causing offense (when I remember to consider that before speaking!)

House is a great show that explores this topic in great depth. Whether you agree with his assertion that everybody lies is down to personal opinion, I think - in my experience most people just don't remember the past in accurate detail, so even if I perceive that what someone says is not true, I'm not sure that it's always the same as a conscious lie. Since I can't read anyone's mind, it's impossible to work out exactly where lying, accurate recall and withholding truth start, end and overlap!

 

[Aspychata]

I used to lie. When I was young (teens) I just spoke the truth without reservation. I didn't even notice what others did, but as I grew in high school I found that others tell you truth which they expect you to keep secret. So I learned to lie..

As I got older, I found this harder and harder to deal with, as with each lie it was necessary to file and remember which lie you had told to who, and who was "allowed" to know what. The pressure of trying to keep up with everyone's lies (mine and others) was too great, and I would tend to have truthful outbursts which caused me bigger problems.

So I changed, and tried to avoid lying. But observing people around me it was obvious that most people lie some of the time, even my closest friends. I found that the only way to get honest answers was to provoke responses with statements that were challenging, as people often react too quickly when annoyed and have their own truthful outbursts.

Since then I've learned its not that simple. What people say and how they react varies with their mood. Turns out judging people's moods is not something I can do, unless they wear their heart on their sleeves. Sometimes it still frustrates me when others don't tell the truth, or withhold truth claiming its to save my feelings (when I suspect this is often driven by their desire to avoid conflict as much as anything). But most days I let it slide without too much trouble, and just worry about being as honest as I can without causing offense (when I remember to consider that before speaking!)

House is a great show that explores this topic in great depth. Whether you agree with his assertion that everybody lies is down to personal opinion, I think - in my experience most people just don't remember the past in accurate detail, so even if I perceive that what someone says is not true, I'm not sure that it's always the same as a conscious lie. Since I can't read anyone's mind, it's impossible to work out exactly where lying, accurate recall and withholding truth start, end and overlap!

Exactly that, thanks for such a excellent observation.

This is why l don't get into the mindset of did they just lie?

Because sometimes- people change their mind, they don't realize they omitted a fact, they only want to tell white lies, they don't care one way or the other, so they say whatever and don't even remember what they said to you that particular moment of time. So to go through and denounce people as telling lies is kinda of saying off with your head in a queen of hearts moment. I just don't judge. However, l will add up casual lies to see if you are a compulsive liar since l lived with one. When confronted with proof of their lies, they just blew me off.

 

[Varzar]

Exactly that, thanks for such a excellent observation.

This is why l don't get into the mindset of did they just lie?

Because sometimes- people change their mind, they don't realize they omitted a fact, they only want to tell white lies, they don't care one way or the other, so they say whatever and don't even remember what they said to you that particular moment of time. So to go through and denounce people as telling lies is kinda of saying off with your head in a queen of hearts moment. I just don't judge. However, l will add up casual lies to see if you are a compulsive liar since l lived with one. When confronted with proof of their lies, they just blew me off.

Would I be correct to presume you also use your observations over time to calculate a probability that each person is telling the truth in any given situation?

 

[Aspychata]

Would I be correct to presume you also use your observations over time to calculate a probability that each person is telling the truth in any given situation?

I actually do follow the probability scale that 55% people do tell occasional lies whether intentional or not, and totally unrelated to me. That's a white lie, l think it's more 75%. But l have a skewed perspective due to some ongoing issues in my life.

If l am pressed for an answer that l choose not to respond to, l just don't answer. Either l say it's none of your business, l don't have to answer, l don't appreciate you telling me what to do.

 

[Bert22]

I actually do follow the probability scale that 55% people do tell occasional lies whether intentional or not, and totally unrelated to me.

If l am pressed for an answer that l choose not to respond to, l just don't answer. Either l say it's none of your business, l don't have to answer, l don't appreciate you telling me what to do.

Is that 55% drawn from somewhere, or is it an actual calculation?

"88.2% of statistics are made up on the spot"
(Not an accusation, I'm trying to be humorous and curious )

 

[Aspychata]

Actual life experience. Maybe l attract liars, l really don't dwell on it. Maybe honest folks attract liars.

 

[Bert22]

Actual life experience. Maybe l attract liars, l really don't dwell on it, life is trivial.

I'm currently looking at the theory that happiness can be found by accepting that life is pointless. Since life is contradictory, and human nature seems the same, it makes sense that the answer could be too?

 

[SimonSays]

I'm currently looking at the theory that happiness can be found by accepting that life is pointless. Since life is contradictory, and human nature seems the same, it makes sense that the answer could be too?

I would say that the circumstances of life may be pointless, but our state of being matters enormously.
I would say happiness can be found by accepting things as they are. That this moment is as it is, rather than feeling like something is missing or not right.

 

[Bert22]

I would say that the circumstances of life may be pointless, but our state of being matters enormously.
I would say happiness can be found by accepting things as they are. That this moment is as it is, rather than feeling like something is missing or not right.

Mindfulness definitely works. I struggle to slow my mind.. before I know it I've had a dozen thoughts and my mental state has changed. Barring life in a sensory deprivation tank, I'm not sure how to achieve this.

On a counter note, how does one make progress in the world without the desire or intent to make change?

 

[SimonSays]

Mindfulness definitely works. I struggle to slow my mind.. before I know it I've had a dozen thoughts and my mental state has changed. Barring life in a sensory deprivation tank, I'm not sure how to achieve this.

Through the practice of Meditation.

how does one make progress in the world without the desire or intent to make change?

By redefining what constitutes progress.
Progress will still be made. Changes will still occur.
Things flow differently when you are in tune with this moment.

 

[Bert22]

Worth your weight, the gold of meditation

 

[John M]

I would suggest that there is a hard cap on how many resources the human brain can consume. It's typically pulling something like 25% of the blood and the associated resources it brings to bear. I dont' recall where I read that and I'm not going to look for it but it sounds about right. So, moving on, when one is engaged in mediation that individual is allowing the mind to stop consuming said resources and allowing them to be diverted to other portions of the brain in a more egalitarian fashion. There's more than one way to do this. I do it through sleep/dreaming because I'm a terrible cheater but regardless of ones methodology both will bear fruit with patience and persistance.