Things you learnt about autism since joining forums

[Misty Avich]

It does seem that autistic people who drink alcohol do have a normal social life. As an Aspie who is teetotal, I don't have a very big social life, as I'm openly shy - although my ADHD can make me seem more outgoing but I do like people and I am naturally socially-orientated but social anxiety prevails. Yes, lots of contradictions going on there, which is why I don't consider myself an introvert nor an extrovert. I prefer to be myself in social situations rather than be under the influence of alcohol to enhance my social skills, because my social skills naturally aren't that bad considering. I'm just a little awkward and don't really do a lot other than smile, make eye contact, greet people, pick up easily on all non-verbal cues, only speak when I'm spoken to, listen more than talk, and only engage in conversation if I feel comfortable around people but I don't ask many questions. Drinking alcohol could loosen my tongue and I fear I might come out with stupid things or become emotional or embarrassing. I much rather be myself, even though sadly it means I have a very small social life and can feel lonely at times. But I do live in a culture where being drunk is valued, so I think my teetotalism and social anxiety is far more socially disabling than my ASD.

 

[Misty Avich]

I think even a lot of teetotal NTs tend to avoid certain social situations unless they're really loud and outgoing.

I hate when people say to me "oh just having one or two drinks won't make you sick", because I don't think "just having one or two" will be enough to relax me that much. I remember one time when I went to a pub I ordered a small bottle of beer, you know, just to look cool , and I started to feel a weird weakness in my legs, the same feeling you would when getting the flu. That wasn't the only time alcohol has done that either. So I sat there, tensely focusing on the weird feeling in my legs and wanting to go home and sleep. It's a horrible feeling.
And even though having a small amount of alcohol won't give you a hangover, as an emetophobic, I still will not trust my body and my mind would start playing tricks on me. "Hey, you know what, you've just drank alcohol and now you're feeling sick. You could puke at any moment, right in front of everyone in this pub, all those judgemental young people will laugh at you and the emotionless bouncers will chuck you out because they'll think you're an alcoholic who can't take responsibility for your drinking. That's what will happen to you."

It isn't worth the anxiety.

 

[Boogs]

Some drugs inspire bouts of schizophrenia in certain individuals, I have read.

You may be thinking of cannabis psychosis, which has been known about for quite some time, and usually relates to a small number of people who most likely have a innate latent psychotic trait which cannabis can potentiate into a full blown psychotic episode. Fortunately these are largely temporary in nature and fade rapidly (days, weeks, not months or years) by avoiding cannabis, but a very small number of people are left with long term effects.

But it would seem autistic people more often run on a different mode with some internal systems making drug response hard to predict. Drugs (I treat alcohol and nicotine etc as drugs too) is an area that I think if someone doesn't like the idea of it or a specific type, then in all likelihood they won't have enough beneficial experience to offset any negative effect.

Personally I ended up finding cannabis was the least harmful and most beneficial for me, but that's not to say cannabis is safe or harmless, all drugs (and more) have a risk/danger factor, and for me I found it to be less damaging mentally than SSRI antidepressants which made me far worse than having nothing. But cannabis also fulfils many benefits for me rather than being targeted at a single symptom.

I felt compelled to self medicate from the moment I learnt there were things that could do this and gravitated in that direction quite deliberately (long before I had peers to pressure me! ), but I'd never advocate it to another, to self medicate just because it's easy never tends to work out well.

 

[Outdated]

You may be thinking of cannabis psychosis, which has been known about for quite some time, and usually relates to a small number of people who most likely have a innate latent psychotic trait which cannabis can potentiate into a full blown psychotic episode.

I've had a couple of friends over the years that had that problem. One was a young bloke with diagnosed schizophrenia and was on medication to help with that but smoking dope triggered a bad episode every time. Yet he kept doing it. Years later I had a mate that was much more responsible - "I can't smoke that stuff, that stuff makes me angry.".

Neurally diverse people have slightly different brain structures to the average and it makes sense that drugs that affect us neurally don't always have the same results for us as they do for the average populace. I've smoked dope since I was 14, not just occasionally either. For me it has a very different effect than it does with most other people, it makes me less exciteable and more thoughtful and it makes everything seem more interesting to me, more fascinating, which helps me to hyperfocus.

Someone once rattled off a list of professions and their preferred drugs to me and to a large degree he was right.
Computer geeks love their marijuana.
Footballers like amphetamines.
Lawyers love their opiates.
etc.

 

[Boogs]

it makes me less exciteable and more thoughtful and it makes everything seem more interesting to me, more fascinating, which helps me to hyperfocus.

That's interesting, as I've used it for similar reasons too. The more physical effects such as relaxation, sleep, appetite stimulant, pain relief, etc, have always been helpful, but from my perception it's helped in my way of thinking. It lets me spend long periods of focussed internal reverie while also disrupting the rigid logical constraints allowing much better (easier?) free association through which I find a lot of ideas come - a little more like having a lucky dip barrel rather than a rigidly ordered list, and the connections can be far more obscure and interesting. A little like the disruption that hallucinogens cause that can make totally new connections, but more moderated, reliable and controllable.

Although nowadays I can't do this to the same degree, when I was learning computers and programming I'd frequently spend maybe six hours a night getting steadily stoned while churning out moderately large and complex bits of code, and the biggest negative impact of the cannabis seemed to be making recall of facts harder, though recalling processes were fine.

The other thing I appreciate about cannabis is that it's such a complex and varied drug comprising hundreds of active compounds, coming in different combinations according to strain, each having a quite different nuance to each other. The endocannabinoid system effects and regulates many different aspects of the body and mind, and the entourage effect of the hundreds of terpenes makes it a subtle and complex tool.

 

[Streetwise]

Although I was diagnosed sooooo incredibly young for a non-obvious, non-stereotypical female Aspie, I was still rather clueless about autism until I joined autism sites at age 20.

I used to think people on the spectrum can't own dogs as pets because of their loud barking (I grew up with cats and was terrified of dogs). It surprised me to learn that so many autistic people own dogs

I used to think all people on the spectrum are diagnosed no later than age 8

I used to think autism is diagnosed by how you behaved at school, particularly on your first day. So whenever someone said about someone being diagnosed with an ASD, I always wondered if they had been 'naughty' on their first day of school in order to get that diagnosis

I used to think autistic teenagers are unable to make friends


This thread isn't about me, it's for general discussion of your experiences. What false things did you used to believe about autism before the internet or when you just relied on Tony Attwood's book on Asperger's Syndrome, which was all completely stereotypical and blanket-statemented?

That it's not an inclusive community, twitter is more inclusive,but it means the very abusive comments i've read on autism forums are making never coming back simpler

 

[WhitewaterWoman]

Neurally diverse people have slightly different brain structures to the average and it makes sense that drugs that affect us neurally don't always have the same results for us as they do for the average populace. I've smoked dope since I was 14, not just occasionally either. For me it has a very different effect than it does with most other people, it makes me less exciteable and more thoughtful and it makes everything seem more interesting to me, more fascinating, which helps me to hyperfocus..

This describes the effects of pot as understood in the 60s culture in the US. I’m not sure how the emphasis on pot and other drugs went from being interesting and mind-expanding to getting wasted.

 

[Seladon]

Footballers like amphetamines.

Also: sleeping pills/xans/zopps, ket, whippits, and painkillers, all washed down with buckets of vodka. And a lot of them even vape or smoke, which you'd think a sports-player who relies on optimal pulmonary function would not do.

For expensive boujee men (people? Idk if such substance abuse is really widespread amongst female players, doesn't seem so but I welcome correction), most of them have absolutely zero taste, let alone sense, in their hedonistic highs legal or otherwise.

They evince a depressing lack of interest in the more natural mind-opening psychedelics, as well. Suppose tablets and pharmaceuticals are more convenient and predictable for their career & lifestyle needs.

 

[Outdated]

For me alcohol and weed was enough. I tried a few other things as a teenager and just didn't like them.

 

[Boogs]

They evince a depressing lack of interest in the more natural mind-opening psychedelics, as well. Suppose tablets and pharmaceuticals are more convenient and predictable for their career & lifestyle needs.

I'd take anything the Sun publishes with a pinch (bucket?) of salt! They and most other populist media will print whatever gets the best readership. Accuracy and precision come a very wobbly second and third.

And drugs have been an all time favourite (in the UK at least) for generating divisive and scapegoating messaging, so there's a huge amount of disinformation and not a lot of common sense. Just the false categorisation between drugs and substances, legal and illegal drugs, serves to obscure the complex nature of our metabolisms and how we respond to external factors.

The drugs from the pharma industry are presented as 'good', 'clean' medicine, in nice packaging and names so hard to pronounce they must be good for us!

I think the (substance mis-use) illnesses shown by people in these high pressure careers are more a reflection of the mental health problems that come with these jobs and the unhealthy lifestyles they are pressured into, more than footballers being naturally more hedonistic and attracted to chaotic drug use.

 

[mysterionz]

Anger issues/mood regulation troubles. I’ve had the ladder since I was in grade school and the former began developing more recently and began to pose a problem for me at work. I credit a mood stabilizer I’ve been put on for saving me.

 

[Boogs]

It does seem that autistic people who drink alcohol do have a normal social life.

For myself it's the other way round. Being intoxicated by alcohol made it so much harder to try and understand people when in conversation. What is hard work and difficult under normal circumstance becomes so much harder it just raises stress and anxiety, plus, as others in the group get drunk, they are harder to communicate with regardless of my state. I find myself more isolated from my friends.

 

[Rodafina]

It does seem that autistic people who drink alcohol do have a normal social life.

Maybe for some that can put on a good show or have learned enough social skills to adapt to their surroundings. On the other hand, for people like me, it can increase feelings of being alone even among others because it can create a whole different level of mask. Only being able to interact with others when intoxicated obfuscates the self and no one ever gets to know you at all. I wouldn't call this a "normal social life" - I would call it a desperate and ultimately ineffective attempt at trying to navigate confusing and overwhelming social experiences.

Additionally, there are those, like me, who did most of their drinking/using drugs all alone. Drinking can be a secretive thing and autistic drinkers do not always present as the happy-go-lucky gal at the party. I suspect many of us are/were quiet drinkers, seeking solitary spaces and using the drink to quell the storm in our mind and senses.

 

[Misty Avich]

What I meant was, it appears that most autistic people who have friends (that are more likely NT) actually drink socially.

In general (though there are exceptions of course) there seems to be two types of autistic people; those that spent their young adult years out at pubs and bars getting drunk with friends, and those who were shut-ins, like me. Some shut-ins drink too, yes, but it's very rare that an autistic person who isn't interested in getting drunk is likely to be invited out to parties with their NT peers.

Ugh, that makes me feel so isolated to admit that. I can remember 20-year-old me, sitting in my bedroom every weekend night, typing on WP how much I hated myself, feeling lonely and miserable and socially isolated, while 99.99% of my NT peers were out partying, even if they didn't like it they still had the guts to experiment, to leave their comfort zones, and to have friends to do such things with.

Thankfully now that I'm in my 30s, married and independent, missing out on clubbing doesn't matter so much any more, not just to me but also to most of my NT peers too. But when I was age 18-23, the peak stage where the vast, vast majority of people do party, I felt the societal pressure intensely and it kept causing me to have bursts of anger. Naturally I was a homely sort of girl who liked my comfort zone, while at the same time feeling guilty for not being out "having fun", so to speak. So I'd get angry with myself and sometimes cry my eyes out and really wanting to be normal like everyone else.

 

[Boogs]

I have to suspect some of that is your perception of it, and in reality, many of those 99.99% were not quite so happy and content with their social lives. From my own experience it seems being autistic isn't having a monopoly of misery and isolation, it's just one route to it.

As best I can make out, many apparently normal people often see everyone else as being involved and included and happy, when they feel disenfranchised too, and often keep up an act (a sort of masking?) of their own as much as many of us may do.

I think the symptoms are more common than it may seem, but have many different causes. It's less the actual activities that are being missed out on, but rather missing the inclusion of being in a like minded group. If all in the group are into playing D&D online together without even meeting in person, I'd say that's as meaningful and important as going out boozing and clubbing etc. (one night stands aside of course! )
(actually, I'd find it more meaningful than reducing myself to a sweating boozy vomiting mess by the end of the evening! )

Many go out to do the party thing because it's what's expected, the peer pressures, not because it's their most sought after activity. It's the socially accepted way to find potential partners, to establish within a sub-culture, it's an acceptable way to be pretend rebellious, it's yet another form of social hierarchy juggling - each finding their 'level' in society, who gets to dominate, who gets dominated, and so on.

The more I saw it for what it was (from my perspective) the less I wanted anything to do with it. I used to join in when young because I didn't know what else there was, and didn't want to lose a small group of friends, but never for the pleasure of it.

 

[Misty Avich]

Many go out to do the party thing because it's what's expected, the peer pressures, not because it's their most sought after activity. It's the socially accepted way to find potential partners, to establish within a sub-culture, it's an acceptable way to be pretend rebellious, it's yet another form of social hierarchy juggling - each finding their 'level' in society, who gets to dominate, who gets dominated, and so on.

That's why I kept beating myself up about it, because I wasn't doing what was suspected and so I felt I wasn't normal. It's like I had these normal instincts yet social anxiety stood in my way.

 

[Boogs]

That's why I kept beating myself up about it, because I wasn't doing what was suspected and so I felt I wasn't normal. It's like I had these normal instincts yet social anxiety stood in my way.

I think I just followed the flow because that's what everyone did (and the one's who didn't weren't visible), but never seemed to 'get it' as to what the great pleasure doing so brought. Seemed so much effort of a mostly disappointing time. The best one's were things like a good gig where it was too noisy and hectic to even have to pretend to be able to talk to people, just enjoy the music and chaos.

 

[DrBadStrings]

Maybe for some that can put on a good show or have learned enough social skills to adapt to their surroundings. On the other hand, for people like me, it can increase feelings of being alone even among others because it can create a whole different level of mask. Only being able to interact with others when intoxicated obfuscates the self and no one ever gets to know you at all. I wouldn't call this a "normal social life" - I would call it a desperate and ultimately ineffective attempt at trying to navigate confusing and overwhelming social experiences.

Additionally, there are those, like me, who did most of their drinking/using drugs all alone. Drinking can be a secretive thing and autistic drinkers do not always present as the happy-go-lucky gal at the party. I suspect many of us are/were quiet drinkers, seeking solitary spaces and using the drink to quell the storm in our mind and senses.

See now my drinking ended secretive and alone trying to "quell the storm in our mind and senses" but it didn't begin that way. It's also important to know that I growing up I was autistic, just thought I was a smart oddball. I only started drinking seriously my 2nd year of university so 19/20 and it was completely to get rid of the social anxiety. I wasn't abusing alcohol then but it was the only way I could socialize comfortably. When I drank it didn't feel like I was forcing a mask anymore. I wasn't nervous to socialize and felt like I could act and communicate in a way that I couldn't sober. I also never drank at home then. Only out at bars/clubs. Until my late 20's where I did start drinking at home to deal with everyday stress of life which ultimately let to a burn out and a stint in Rehab in my early 30's. After which I stayed sober for 26 months. Then started again, again mostly for social reasons. And it was fine until Covid hit then I just started drinking more and more at home until my second major alcohol fueled burnout at 41.

Went to detox to safely stop drinking. Now I'm 9 months sober, just finished my 2nd stint in rehab where I finally found out about the autism at age 42. It's still a lot to process but I definitely see the alcoholism in a different light now. I wouldn't be surprised if there aren't a lot of folks around my age +/- 10 years that are undiagnosed and coping with alcohol and other substances.

 

[UFO]

Being intoxicated by alcohol made it so much harder to try and understand people when in conversation.

When I was young, going to bars with people was the only way for me to feel some kind of connection with them. I kept a good control of my drinking and never got "wasted" or hangover (which might explain my different experience?). But when others were drunk, I finally began to understand them and I felt like I am "on the same frequency" with them. Not that my or their way of thinking would have magically changed, or that it wouldn't have been me worrying less about what they mean, but it was that a drunk person is much more sincere and straightforward. They might not want to say things (for numerous reasons), but they end up saying them anyways. Which helps a lot of understanding what is going on inside their heads.

And then there was also that nice tipsy feeling that just feels good and makes things look less stressful and so on - but that I can get by drinking alone.

When I drank it didn't feel like I was forcing a mask anymore. I wasn't nervous to socialize and felt like I could act and communicate in a way that I couldn't sober.

Alcohol is often considered as an excuse for a behavior. Weird things to say and do are better accepted and forgotten (unless they make funny heroic sagas).

 

[Misty Avich]

I think I just followed the flow because that's what everyone did (and the one's who didn't weren't visible), but never seemed to 'get it' as to what the great pleasure doing so brought. Seemed so much effort of a mostly disappointing time. The best one's were things like a good gig where it was too noisy and hectic to even have to pretend to be able to talk to people, just enjoy the music and chaos.

Well I admire your motivation to give those things a try. I didn't. By the way I meant to say "expect", not "suspect". Damn autocorrect.