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Aspie boyfriend?

I bet. Is autism more prevalent nowadays than it used to be? Or just more understood? Why are there so many out there, undiagnosed, skewing stats?

IMO only the ability of medical science is improving to account for more people on the spectrum. Despite the political and economic pushback by politicians and insurers in reducing medical costs and containing government budgets.

That it's more likely we're the result of genetic considerations more than environmental ones. The CDC officially calculates us as being one in every sixty-eight persons. Many of us statistically unaccounted for suspect this is a low-balled figure for good reason.

Not to mention a fundamental tenet of many on the spectrum. That we learn to mask ourselves sufficiently to appear to blend in to avoid everyday persecution. Something not to be confused with any real sense of "social adaptation".
 
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Interesting. The topic of environmental causes and non-environmental causes interests me greatly because of the environmental nature of my own condition.
 
Interesting. The topic of environmental causes and non-environmental causes interests me greatly because of the environmental nature of my own condition.

That's one of the most profound observations I've made since joining this community and being able to compare my sensory issues with others. I also have such olfactory difficulties which have at times made my daily life miserable. Particularly cigarette smoke...which causes a fight/flight response. And then I have other issues such as abrupt high and low frequency sounds.

Where before I just surmised along with my hay fever that I had a myriad of allergies. Never realizing that they are sensory issues more likely related to my neurology.
 
Many of us with Multiple Chemical Sensitivities also have sensory processing issues. I've been that way since I was a kid, but I also have severe sensitivities to VOCs and fragrances. I can 100% relate to noise and light overstimulation. I can't handle loud, especially loud pitched noises. Car motors, motorcycles, lawnmowers, beeping smoke alarms, anything like that totally messes with me.

What's interesting is that we display symptoms of neurotoxicity. My symptoms are mainly neurological. Slurred speech, confusion, poor memory, sensory overload, muscle paralysis, seizure-like twitches and convulsions. Those are all neurological in nature.

What are your olfactory difficulties?
 
Many of us with Multiple Chemical Sensitivities also have sensory processing issues. I've been that way since I was a kid, but I also have severe sensitivities to VOCs and fragrances. I can 100% relate to noise and light overstimulation. I can't handle loud, especially loud pitched noises. Car motors, motorcycles, lawnmowers, beeping smoke alarms, anything like that totally messes with me.

What's interesting is that we display symptoms of neurotoxicity. My symptoms are mainly neurological. Slurred speech, confusion, poor memory, sensory overload, muscle paralysis, seizure-like twitches and convulsions. Those are all neurological in nature.

What are your olfactory difficulties?

It's a narrow list, with cigarette smoke absolutely at the top. Other forms of tobacco nowhere near as irritating. Pot wouldn't even make the list. And cheap perfumes...oh my. Elderly women creating their own "vapor trails" in stores. Sends me running in the opposite direction.

Heavy-duty chemicals don't necessarily send me running, although I don't like them. Accept perhaps ammonia, but then that sends most humans running.

As a child, I used to smell everything I hadn't tried before I would consider eating it. So my sense of smell could be used for good and evil. :eek: :p
 
Being exposed to large amounts of DDT as a young child probably didn't help. :eek:
 
Haha, is that a joke?

Nope. I lived on Guam for a spell where they used DDT as a primary pesticide in the late 50s.

It was a place that was well...incredibly toxic to my senses/allergies. We ended up leaving prematurely as both my brother and my mother also had a terrible time for similar reasons. With my father left behind because of his duty posting as a naval officer.
 
Wow. I grew up next to a tape factory (Tuck Tape) and smelled adhesives all the time. I had chronic everything.
 
Wow. I grew up next to a tape factory (Tuck Tape) and smelled adhesives all the time. I had chronic everything.

I once applied for a job at Jelly Belly's factory in Fairfield, CA.

The smell was lovely, and must have been prevalent for at least a half-mile radius. :)

Didn't get the job, but they sure gave me a bunch of candy. :cool:
 
@Any Fake,

Rather than try to reply to your individual points, I'll try and gather them and reply here.

Helping him learn to communicate better isn't change, it is learning. We're not incapable of discovering we can do things a better way for the sake of someone we care about, and we're not incapable of understanding that the way we do things at the outset isn't working as well as we want. But until you are able show us, we have no idea what is wrong or what can be done about it. That is the improvement I refer to. That simple example I gave before, that I demonstrated my feelings for my wife by doing things for her, and thought that was so obvious that this would prove it, when what she needed was for me to tell her. As soon as I knew that, I knew I needed to demonstrate it with words, not (just) deeds. That improved my ability to communicate with her, and express something she needed, and didn't have before. I will admit that I never really understood why my practical demonstrations were not enough when a few words were, because that puzzles me still, but I loved her and I wanted her to know it, so it was obvious that the words were necessary and I adjusted.

You talk about his emotional and compassionate side, which indicates that he is capable of things you want from him, but that does not mean he is also not black and white, logical, and analytical. Indeed, the fact he has difficulty expressing his emotions and his emotional status tends to suggest that the logical and analytical process is his primary operating mode. I recognise this because I am pretty much exactly the same - your description of his outward facing qualities is also me. I am deeply emotional, sensitive and I take care of people. People, things, matter to me in fundamental ways, and I connect to people emotionally, I also have a great sense of humour (I'm told), but I am also principally an analytical and strategic thinker. I suspect that's why you're having so much problem, because you read him as driven in a way that he is not, so the result you get is frustrating and confusing.

I don't mean this unkindly at all, quite the opposite, but the fact you are debating with a number of Aspies the quality and nature of your Aspie tends to show that you haven't yet got it - that we, and he, really are as we describe. There isn't an exactness to it because we are all very different, but our foundations are generally much the same.

I don't know that I could tell you how to read him, and I know I have a slightly better range of facial expressions which perhaps helped, but my wife got it right almost every time. I was curious how she did it because it hadn't happened before and though I didn't know then that I was an Aspie, I still brought typical Aspie curiosity to understanding how she was able to tell, so I asked her. She said she had realised she needed to stop thinking about reading me, because thinking made her focus on what worked for other people - facial expression, eyes (particularly), and body language. She said that these didn't work and gave her confusing results, because I might be smiling, but have ice-cold eyes. She used posture, how I stood or sat, or moved, how I was breathing, the timing of my movements, patterns of movements. It didn't make much sense to me because internally I knew how I felt and didn't know or care how that outwardly appeared, but one day she said 'I know you're upset because you're sitting angry'. As far as I knew, I was just sitting, but she was right, I was angry. I was actually pushing myself into the seat harder than usual.

One thing for sure though, if there are times when you can tell how he is feeling, you have a foundation for learning how to read him. But you'll need to discard the preconceived ideas that come from observing everyone else, because they don't apply. He has a language that is very different from others.

The authenticity is, I think, what has attracted people to me, because it is something that can be trusted entirely, and that trust is really much harder to achieve with others. In your Aspie, you clearly know you've got the real deal, and perhaps your history has made you rather more sensitive to the lack of a foundation of trust, so you are attracted to this facet of him. If that is important to you, the fact that you haven't been able to read your Aspie, and misjudge his reactions to you because you've only just come to realise his difference, doesn't mean you can't, and won't learn how.

Your comment on focusing on when you laugh is a perfect example of how this works. In seeing the frustrations of mismatched expectations, perhaps it is easy to ignore the times when everything is right. It isn't the pit of frustrations that you would learn from, but a foundation of when things are good. That's the place to start.

Sorry, I may have missed some of your comments, but there is one thing I think relevant that I have seen posted in this thread - compatibility. In my view in practice, people are about as compatible, or not, as they choose to be, because unlike emotions, attitude, including how we relate to others, is a choice.

Edited to add:
BTW, the 'Causes of Autism' article you liked to does not do its own credibility any good by starting off declaring that autism is a disease. That view, expressed many times, does not do autistic people any good at all.
 
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If you have no idea why a person is simply outright ignoring you, it's pretty understandable to wonder if the person is bored with you, uninterested, or what-have-you.

If I have no idea that a person is on the spectrum and have expectations based on a neurotypical person, then of course my expectations will be off. And yes, of course I expect a person to answer when I've spoken directly to them. I have never experienced this before where a person just tunes out.

I have never experienced someone who is all over me and then the next week, completely absent. The only frame of reference I have for that is a malicious Narcissist, so yes, I had a hard time with that and I make no apology if I didn't have the right information to understand him.

I had tremendous regard for his needs and desires. I asked him, I opened up conversations. I asked him how he feels, what he wants, what works for him. He stayed silent. He kept it to himself.

And some time later, he would blurt out angrily, "I don't want to..." or whatever it was. How am I supposed to know? I can't read his mind. If he's an Aspie and just can't express himself, then I'm not blaming him, but don't blame me for not considering him.

If a person doesn't tell you his needs and desires, it's pretty damned impossible to help him meet them.
 
@AO1501

I really appreciate your thoughtful reply. Very much so.

Helping him learn to communicate better isn't change, it is learning.

Ok, I see what you mean.

You talk about his emotional and compassionate side, which indicates that he is capable of things you want from him, but that does not mean he is also not black and white, logical, and analytical.

This is really helpful, thank you. You're right, I don't understand how a compassionate, sensitive, funny man is also primarily analytical. A looooong time ago I dated someone who I would say was absolutely analytical. It drove me bonkers. The guy in question now isn't like that. He's easily touched, he has a "person for the day", which is a new person who he meets and learns their name and talks to them about their life, and he doesn't base things on rational thoughts. He bases everything on his intuition and gut feeling.

I do know that he clings to his original emotional reaction of something I've said, even after I think we've talked about it and come to an understanding and even if I explain how he misunderstood. If he felt hurt, he often continues to feel hurt.

I don't mean this unkindly at all, quite the opposite, but the fact you are debating with a number of Aspies the quality and nature of your Aspie tends to show that you haven't yet got it - that we, and he, really are as we describe. There isn't an exactness to it because we are all very different, but our foundations are generally much the same.

I'm not sure I understand this. What am I debating? My intention is to A) see if there's any truth to my suspicions (which it seems there is) and B) whether or not it's workable.

As far as reading his expressions, wow your wife sounds really attuned to you and that's so sweet. I've learned some things about how he is and I can tell by the way he says, "Ok" when he's feeling hurt. But I do find it hard to read him and continue to find it mysterious, especially when I think we've talking about something and discover he's upset about it later.

He has a language that is very different from others.

Great advice, thank you.

the fact that you haven't been able to read your Aspie, and misjudge his reactions to you because you've only just come to realise his difference, doesn't mean you can't, and won't learn how.

Thank you. This is very kind. Yes, it takes time to get to know someone. And especially, especially if you've been burned by a manipulative person. It's very common to take a while to trust again and you become highly sensitized to things like being suddenly ignored.

Your comment on focusing on when you laugh is a perfect example of how this works. In seeing the frustrations of mismatched expectations, perhaps it is easy to ignore the times when everything is right. It isn't the pit of frustrations that you would learn from, but a foundation of when things are good. That's the place to start.

Thank you.

Sorry, I may have missed some of your comments, but there is one thing I think relevant that I have seen posted in this thread - compatibility. In my view in practice, people are about as compatible, or not, as they choose to be, because unlike emotions, attitude, including how we relate to others, is a choice.

This is a really interesting perspective. I guess some people treat compatibility like a binary: you either are or aren't. And other people grow over time. They keep separate interests and find ways to connect with each other. They see it as a choice, like you've pointed out.

Thanks so much for your insights. Very much appreciated.
 
Actually, I'm going to rephrase this bit to make absolutely sure I've been clear about what I mean:

And some time later, he would blurt out angrily, "I don't want to..." or whatever it was. How am I supposed to know? I can't read his mind. If he's an Aspie and just can't express himself, then I'm not blaming him, but don't blame me for not considering him.

What I mean is:

After asking him for his input (feelings, needs, thoughts, concerns), he would keep it to himself, so I would have no idea what was going on for him. And then later, he would blurt out how he felt and what was bothering him.

So, I was and still am at a loss of what it is I could have said or how I could have approached him in order to have a conversation where both people have their input and we come to a mutually agreed upon, fair plan that considers both of us.

Knowing he might be an Aspie helps me gain an understanding about why he didn't tell me how he feels or what he wants.

And at the same time, I don't want to be blamed for not mind-reading what he felt because this isn't a skill I have. Nor for not having a frame of reference for understanding why someone would not express his feelings.

If I'm to blame, then ok. That makes this whole situation pretty simple. I walk away, take the blame, and wish him all the happiness in the world.
 
This is really helpful, thank you. You're right, I don't understand how a compassionate, sensitive, funny man is also primarily analytical. A looooong time ago I dated someone who I would say was absolutely analytical. It drove me bonkers. The guy in question now isn't like that. He's easily touched, he has a "person for the day", which is a new person who he meets and learns their name and talks to them about their life, and he doesn't base things on rational thoughts. He bases everything on his intuition and gut feeling.

I do know that he clings to his original emotional reaction of something I've said, even after I think we've talked about it and come to an understanding and even if I explain how he misunderstood. If he felt hurt, he often continues to feel hurt.

I think this is an example of how easy it is to translate past experiences into the present or future. Usually those experiences help, and you quite reasonably have applied experiences into this relationship too, because how could you not?

The problem is it doesn't work, because if your boyfriend is on the spectrum, nothing you have experienced before will give you a clue. Indeed, all those experiences which make you relationship-wise with normal people will make you relationship-dumb with an Aspie.

I get very emotional, and I am known for gathering up broken people and fixing them, yet my job requires a very logical and strategic mode that simply wipes everything else out. And that logic and strategy determine how I deal with emotive issues too. It may not look like it on the outside, because after all, they are emotive issues so them being present at all seems emotive, but that doesn't mean they are not seen (by me) as part of a logical and strategic purpose.


I'm not sure I understand this. What am I debating? My intention is to A) see if there's any truth to my suspicions (which it seems there is) and B) whether or not it's workable.

I apologise, that is me being blunt when I should have perhaps said that when you post in response to one of us identifying a trait, characteristic or component of your Aspie's behaviour, if it doesn't match what you think, you seem to be a little assertive about where your view is coming from. That is reading the words, (which is how we function). Interpreting what you say it doesn't come over like that, but we don't do 'interpreting' well.

As far as reading his expressions, wow your wife sounds really attuned to you and that's so sweet. I've learned some things about how he is and I can tell by the way he says, "Ok" when he's feeling hurt. But I do find it hard to read him and continue to find it mysterious, especially when I think we've talking about something and discover he's upset about it later.

My wife was very tuned - at least for 15 years! After that, her health deteriorated and she lost any desire to make the effort, which I could understand.

You have a foundation. That may seem tiny, but tuning in to the way he says 'ok' is a major step, because it means he does have 'tells', you just have to pick up on them.

I think you just have to want to. That's easy for me to say because I don't have anyone I need to read, but I am used by my employer to read people who come in for interviews and the like, because I can read them like a book. Not from their faces, because I can't see faces at all, but from the way they sit, stand, sound, move in their seat. Tiny tells that everyone has, even Aspies.

hank you. This is very kind. Yes, it takes time to get to know someone. And especially, especially if you've been burned by a manipulative person. It's very common to take a while to trust again and you become highly sensitized to things like being suddenly ignored.

Yes, you certainly do. And it is clear you are working to try and adjust. I think most people never discover they should.

This is a really interesting perspective. I guess some people treat compatibility like a binary: you either are or aren't. And other people grow over time. They keep separate interests and find ways to connect with each other. They see it as a choice, like you've pointed out.

Thanks so much for your insights. Very much appreciated.

It's never a binary, and if someone thinks it is, run away fast. Compatibility is about fractional compromises and constantly changing landscape. It can't be any other way when we change by tiny amounts as people every day, and that means our position in the relationship changes too, as does our partner's. If I decide I want to be with someone, as I did with my wife, I make a conscious decision about my attitude to her that makes her compatible, and keeps us in orbit around each other - at least for as long as it lasts.
 
I get very emotional, and I am known for gathering up broken people and fixing them, yet my job requires a very logical and strategic mode that simply wipes everything else out. And that logic and strategy determine how I deal with emotive issues too. It may not look like it on the outside, because after all, they are emotive issues so them being present at all seems emotive, but that doesn't mean they are not seen (by me) as part of a logical and strategic purpose.

Wow. You're right. I don't get it at all. I think it's endearing, to be honest. The closest I think I can understand is the mode I go into when I'm helping troubled kids. I was a respite care foster mother and I worked with violent, troubled kids. I had to go into a certain mode that was both compassionate, but methodical.

I apologise, that is me being blunt when I should have perhaps said that when you post in response to one of us identifying a trait, characteristic or component of your Aspie's behaviour, if it doesn't match what you think, you seem to be a little assertive about where your view is coming from. That is reading the words, (which is how we function). Interpreting what you say it doesn't come over like that, but we don't do 'interpreting' well.

You have nothing to apologize for. I appreciate blunt. And if I'm doing something, call me out on it, please. I appreciate that. You're right, if it doesn't match what I think I assert my POV in order to be understood so that I can understand. Maybe that's not a useful way to go about it.

You have a foundation. That may seem tiny, but tuning in to the way he says 'ok' is a major step, because it means he does have 'tells', you just have to pick up on them.

Well, that's hopeful! Thanks. I have started to find him more and more endearing in the last few days. I just laugh.

If I decide I want to be with someone, as I did with my wife, I make a conscious decision about my attitude to her that makes her compatible, and keeps us in orbit around each other - at least for as long as it lasts.

Wow. I don't think most people see it this way and your perspective is refreshing. People seem to think there's a magic chemistry and all is taken care of on its own. I've rarely found this to be the case.
 

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