I am yet again trying another new church on Sunday.

[Tony Ramirez]

Again not date. Just friendships.

 

[jsilver256]

Again not date. Just friendships.

Single Christian women generally are not friends with other single men in the way you have described. Religious people are strict about that kind of thing.

Again. I am trying to support you and prevent further disappointment for you.

 

[Tony Ramirez]

Single Christian women generally are not friends with other single men in the way you have described. Religious people are strict about that kind of thing.

Again. I am trying to support you and prevent further disappointment for you.

Sorry I don't buy that. I wish I can take pictures and videos too prove it but that would make things worse if I got caught but trust me if you see what I see in NYC it's not true.

 

[jsilver256]

Sorry I don't buy that. I wish I can take pictures and videos too prove it but that would make things worse if I got caught but trust me if you see what I see in NYC it's not true.

How do you know these people are 1) Christian 2) are single and 3) not dating?

My husband is a deacon. The leadership in church are literally not allowed to interact with others of the opposite sex alone who they are not intending to date (typically for marriage) or are already married to. While this rule doesn't extend to the rest of the congregation, the leadership serves as a model for the congregation to emulate.

The church is not a place to find single women friends. They, however, are a good place to find male friends or to go out on group male-female married couple outings. Which ... is exactly what you've been saying has been happening.

 

[Tony Ramirez]

I seen and known some of them. I don't know where you are from but it's totally different here in NYC. Guys and girls hang out all the time christian or not which is why I get irritated that I can't achieve it no matter how hard I try the past 5 years not even one time a 0% success rate.

 

[jsilver256]

I seen and known some of them. I don't know where you are from but it's totally different here in NYC.

Tony, trust me, this is an universal principle across devout churches. Perhaps you should go to an Unitarian Universalist church, which I have heard is very relaxed about that kind of thing.

Guys and girls hang out all the time christian or not which is why I get irritated that I can't achieve it no matter how hard I try the past 5 years not even one time a 0% success rate.

You seem to have an excellent success rate with men and married couples in a church.

 

[Judge]

The church is not a place to find single women friends.

Tony, trust me, this is an universal principle across devout churches. Perhaps you should go to an Unitarian Universalist church, which I have heard is very relaxed about that kind of thing.

I've tried to imply this to Tony a number of times. However I didn't have the right words as I believe you do under the circumstances. While I'm not an atheist, neither am I a fan of organized religion in general. That I follow a very different path spiritually speaking.

That to me it just seems a fundamentally inappropriate venue for a man to be looking for a mate rather than spiritual salvation. Yet I also recognize that my perception is going to be alien to most anyone so connected to any organized religion.

So I believe your words might resonate far better with Tony that mine ever can. Thanks.

 

[honeytoast]

Why do you need to be friends with single women rather than be friends with anyone else?

 

[Tired]

Why do you need to be friends with single women rather than be friends with anyone else?

Single beautiful women.

 

[Judge]

Why do you need to be friends with single women rather than be friends with anyone else?

Perhaps because it was never exclusively about friendship, but rather courtship.

That for many of us, the social rigors and rituals of conventional "dating" just won't work for us. Definitely in my own case, as well as other autistic males I've met here over the years.

Developing friendships with the opposite sex a possible conduit to courtship. But it's always critical to emphasize that this comes with no guarantees. Besides, some personalities are more suited as friends than lovers anyway. In any event, for myself it's always been a suitable way to socialize in comparison with the rituals and expectations associated with dating.

Oddly enough, when I was a child I always preferred the company of men. However as an adult, I've always preferred the company of women. Whether friends or lovers didn't really matter.

-Beautiful or not. Though that aspect of the equation may differ to Tony- or Markness. I don't really know. But I think it's fair to put it out there.

 

[jsilver256]

I've tried to imply this to Tony a number of times. However I didn't have the right words as I believe you do under the circumstances. While I'm not an atheist, neither am I a fan of organized religion in general. That I follow a very different path spiritually speaking.

That to me it just seems a fundamentally inappropriate venue for a man to be looking for a mate rather than spiritual salvation. Yet I also recognize that my perception is going to be alien to most anyone so connected to any organized religion.

So I believe your words might resonate far better with Tony that mine ever can. Thanks.

Thank you for your support, and your perspective as a person of a different faith is very valuable here

I'd like to add a bit of nuance strictly for Tony's edification. Technically, it is encouraged for like-minded young single adults to attend a church in hopes of a like-minded spouse. That's why "singles groups" exist in some churches.

But if it is clear to either party that a connection will not result in marriage, they aren't encouraged to hang out anymore. This implicitly excludes the possibility of friendship. The courting period is typically much shorter than with secular people.

I feel that Tony is getting caught up in churches because the Christian commandment is strong to not to reject people seeking help, and he is experiencing this friendliness and acceptance.

But ultimately to truly integrate with a church, you have to actually believe in its tenets and come to a mindset of serving the church rather than having the church serve you. As long as the priority is to find single female friends and his faith continues to be conditional on that, he will continue having a 0% success rate while he has a much higher success rate with men and married men/women.

In sharing this information, I am explaining why he has been experiencing what he perceives as immense trauma, supporting him in his quest to find single female friends, and finally, preventing further trauma.

 

[Judge]

For me, most any religious institutions reflect too many similarities to dating itself. Where there exist a set of rules, nebulous dogma and rituals. Along with so many expectations colored with a moral outlook of how one is expected to carry themselves based on the above considerations.

Which simply put for any number of us, is emotionally overwhelming. Too much pressure in a scenario that needs as little pressure as possible for many of us just to be ourselves.

At least IMO.

Though I also recognize that Tony has limited resources in general to physically go beyond his local community, which may well limit his prospects in seeking out socialization based on some other premise than religion.

New faces can sometimes alter the social chemistry, but that religion and everything it encompasses is likely to overshadow such expectations, and not necessarily in a positive way.

 

[jsilver256]

Though I also recognize that Tony has limited resources in general to physically go beyond his local community, which may well limit his prospects in seeking out socialization based on some other premise than religion.

It's Brooklyn. Based on his posts, he has access to multiple churches, coffee shops, and donut shops, so I assume he has access to a number of opportunities he can pick and choose.

If I understand him correctly, he is wanting to find a friend who is simultaneously a single attractive woman and engages in deep, platonic emotional conversation with him. I will admit that I do not know where or how he can get that connection, and I don't know if anyone knows.

But if he wants to adjust his expectations of what kind of connections he wants to make, I am sure all of us will have great advice.

 

[Judge]

It's Brooklyn. Based on his posts, he has access to multiple churches, coffee shops, and donut shops, so I assume he has access to a number of opportunities he can pick and choose.

If I understand him correctly, he is wanting to find a friend who is simultaneously a single attractive woman and engages in deep, platonic emotional conversation with him. I will admit that I do not know where or how he can get that connection, and I don't know if anyone knows.

But if he wants to adjust his expectations of what kind of connections he wants to make, I am sure all of us will have great advice.

I'm just not willing to assume much of anything given his social opportunities must realistically contend with one common denominator. -Very limited funds. Though I would hope that being in such an urban environment helps under such circumstances. But I can only guess. Sometimes it would seem he detests certain aspects of that same urban environment. One I can't say I can truly relate to, either in my adulthood or my own childhood.

 

[Aspychata]

This is fantastic advice. Thank you, everyone. Tony, this is very spot on advice, members here are politely suggesting to reframe your thinking of how you approach your dilemma of seeking company. Maybe change your standards, and talk to woman based on their personality instead of their looks.

 

[tree]

Still too early. Once it's approved my mother can look for a therapist.

You're waiting for your mother to find a therapist for you.

What about you?
Have you been looking?

 

[Aspychata]

Tony, being angry with us at this forum doesn't accomplish anything. Many of us here struggle to make friends, so perhaps show a little compassion in how you approach others here.

 

[Tony Ramirez]

My current church is practically kicking me out after what I write on their Facebook page about how I was ignored at the park event. Now the pastor says I am not invited to any future gatherings because some women there who I know shunned me reported it him and now I am a few of them wants to gather with me for a consultation.

I told my mother she is furious with me blaming me and the way I can't hide my autism and act normal. I hate my life. I want to die since I don't belong anywhere every damn neurotypical person reports my ass if I do one just one atypical mistake life group, yoga and now here. Just kill me some one kill me.

 

[jsilver256]

a few of them wants to gather with me for a consultation.

Tony, this is a great thing. The church isn't kicking you out; the church wants to help you. Go to the consultation and listen to them.

I told my mother she is furious with me blaming me and the way I can't hide my autism and act normal

I think this whole sequence of events has little to do with autism and much more to do with how tightly coupled emotions are with mindset, but I am not a professional. Get a therapist ASAP. At the consultation, maybe you can suggest that the church find you a therapist or even pay for one until Medicaid covers it.

 

[honeytoast]

Taking out your anger/upset emotions on a Facebook page is not going to benefit you or anyone else.

I second that it is a good thing they want to talk to YOU personally so that they can provide you with some help before you get a therapist.

I wonder if it's also because of what you've said previously in your trauma dumping with them, they're just concerned.