School Experiences for Aspies and Autistic

[Buzzerfly]

I attended a Montessori pre-school and did kind of like the hands-on activities (zipping zippers, squeezing my own orange juice, etc.) but my slight enjoyment of school stopped there. Even that school was run by a very eccentric woman whose oddness did seem to trickle down into the personalities of my teachers. And at snack time, it became popular for the other kids to chew their Saltines into the shape of a gun and pretend to shoot you in the head.

I attended public school from grade 1-8, half in suburbia and half inner-city. As an NT, I was supposed to be prepared for school in the proper way: repeatedly told a story of fun, bubbly school buses, exciting learning, and games that would be a blast when played with other happy kids! But my mom was too nuts to know how to do that right. I call it "putting NT kids to sleep". Thus, other children showed up to school with a loyalty to this story and a determination to keep it intact despite any counter feedback. I was like a snail out of my shell.

Public schools are run exactly like prisons...from the fluorescent lights, concrete walls, parading down halls in shameful lines in front of judgemental onlookers, and punishment food on trays to the demand on students/teachers to form cliques, groups and packs that display dominance over others. Recess is held in an ugly building-adjacent yard, usually enclosed by metal fences, and you aren't allowed to leave. When you factor in education, you are receiving the bare-minimum, rigid requirements of what an "inmate" should learn as required by state/federal law, with no attention to children's interests, unique spirits, or desire to learn. I guess it's now apparent that I HATE school.

In high school, I attended a college preparatory in the mountains. The campus was prettier and freer, but I still hated it. It was a half boarding half day school. I was a day student, but over half were boarders. I still couldn't leave. The boarders had been abandoned by their parents and brought their deep-rooted family issues to school everyday. There was a lot of emphasis on sexuality and teachers were in on it too. The educational program was similarly flawed to that in public school. But we had more homework!

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

Did you have any or many friends in your earlier school days, and up through your high school years? If so, were they the geeky type friends, or shyer type? Or other? I had one friend in school, who I didn't hang out with outside of school. I had two friends (within a group of many aquaintances) who I hung out with outside of school. They were all outcasts - goths, mainly.

Or did you feel alone? Despite the friends mentioned above, I still felt alone most of the time.

Were you integrated with NT's, or seperated? Did you yourself ever have a preference? None of my friends were on the spectrum. I didn't even know what Autism/Aspergers was back then.

How did the teachers and most other students treat you? Different? Or just as part of the class? I was a very bright troublemaker, and most of the people I was at school with acted as if I wasn't even there. The rest bullied me.

Were you given any accommodations? No, because I was just a naughty child, I didn't know I had Aspergers then.

Did you feel like the instruction was above your abilities and expectations, or lower than? I don't understand this one.

Did you get bored easily, or have much anxiety? Bored, always. Anxiety yes, because of bullying.

Did you have any unusual quirk or interest in school? I ate the same lunch everyday for the whole 5 years I was at secondary school.

A certain aspect of school you hated most? The other students.

Did you like the teaching style, or did you prefer being taught in a different manner? Aside from one teacher, the rest were too much textbook textbook textbook! rather than trying to get us involved.

What recommendations would you have made to make your school experiences better? Teach the teachers to engage rather than dictate, and treat bullying seriously.

What were the good things about your school experience? That it eventually ended.

Thanks for answers. I agree. When I went to school longer ago, too, it seems like it was just about textbooks and lecturing, and looking the other way with regards to bullying. School administration had their policies, and teachers had their usual stale methods. Anxiety and boredom flourished, especially likely for those who did not fit in, like the social outcasts, ones with conditions, or the ones acting different.

So, I think by your reply, you already answered that question, that you said you were unsure what I meant. You said you felt bright and bored, so that means you likely felt they were teaching in a way that would not bring out your best, and implying that you already knew more than the level they were teaching at. In other words, you got less out of the experience that you desired; They could have challenged your mind more.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

I agree with every single post here. I have had countless bad experiences in school. Locked in a room in preschool because I pooed myself. They wouldn't help me or let me out. My mom dropped me off everyday an hour late dressed in short, bright red gym shorts. The teachers with the hard-ass reputation were usually the nicest, while the supposed sweeties would watch me be attacked and do nothing. Others, while not evil, were a bit sexually perverse and shouldn't be teaching.

Physical bullying from other students was fairly prevalent in lower grades. I was not diagnosed at this time, because my grandfather insisted I was normal, despite much feedback to the contrary. Sort of like Judge, bullying only stopped when I turned myself into a behemoth, lifting weights every night at my house through the winter.

Teachers never would treat me indifferently: I wish they had. I was either HATED by some teachers or made into some sort of prodigy/pet by others, which made students hate me too or resented for he extra "attention".

As to friends, I eventually got a few in middle school and high school, and they were decent enough people, but after school we all knew the paths laid out before us were so different we haven't spoken since.

My personal recommendation is to never send either boy to school. I know you have your hands full with Dylan, and Aaron gets bored at home. I can recommend, however, something my parents sent me too when I was a kid (you might can find something like this): I hated, no abhorred camp, being even worse than school, but I did go most summers to a horse camp, from 9:00 am to 2:00 pm. It was for normals and autistics. It had all the bad attributes of school, but to a much lesser extent. We rode horses, went swimming in pools or springs, worked hard (sometimes), or played pool. A middle-aged woman ran it. We brought our own lunches. I don't know if something like this is an option, but I was very autistic, and I usually enjoyed it, despite my limitations.

Nice post Joel. It explains a lot about your poor school experiences as well. You make a great point too about how nicer teachers could look away, and more assertive ones could actually allow less wrongs. I remember once when I was in a class a bully sitting behind me would keep lifting my chair up with his feet during science class each school day. The teacher seemed abnormally nice by her voice and words to the class, and her friendly style. Yet, she was too scared to look towards us. She kept looking off to the left and right. She had to know what was going on. I was in the center front row.

As for the horse camp idea. It depends on who would run it, but I know both children love animals, especially Aaron. We had an alternative medicine doctor that had a small organic farm. He had all types of animals: goats, horses, sheep, cats, pigs, and so on. Aaron always seemed happy visiting these animals and feeding them. After the visits he would be happy, too. Both Aaron and Dylan love water, too, so yes, we would look into such things. Thanks.

 

[Bella Pines]

You might want to answer one or more of the following questions, or explain things in your way. Did you have any or many friends in your earlier school days, and up through your high school years? If so, were they the geeky type friends, or shyer type? Or other? Or did you feel alone? Were you integrated with NT's, or seperated? Did you yourself ever have a preference?

I'm a 40 something mother of 2 sons, I am on the higher functioning aspergers end of the autism spectrum and my husband is about as neurotypical as possible. Answering the questions is almost free therapy, so whilst I have no clue what is best for anyone else, I have been through the wringer and come out the other side, so can share my experiences.

During primary school (5 to 11), I went to a regular, mixed, fully integrated with NTs, state school. I had no friends whatsoever, but actually didn't realize this until decades later.

Then I went to a grammar school at aged 11 and made a friend. She is intelligent, interesting and has ptsd from an abusive childhood. We were both incapable of expressing emotions and for some reason it just kind of worked, we are still in touch today, 30 years on. We did have a wider friend group and they were all the top performers across the various subjects and somehow different and isolated. One of our friends was unnaturally short but a genius in literature and history.

I did get bullied, not so much because I was different (we were teenage girls and so were all 'different'), but because I was basically in rags because my mum couldn't afford to by a school uniform. However, I didn't react at all and aspergered it away, that worked in my favor. Eventually they got bored and probably went to pick on someone else, it was a minor irritation for me at best. Of course I was at a girls school so it was mental bullying, my husband tells me that boys school bullying is more physical.

Did I feel alone? Not in the NT sense of the word, no. As far as I can tell "lonely" to NTs is equated to sad due to no friends. I have never felt this at all. I deal with so much sensory overload that I need the isolation. Friends do interest me, I don't want to say "like monkeys in a laboratory" because I realize that makes me sound pretentious, but I view friendships as an observer. People interest me, but I don't need them to be happy. I do feel something analogous to sad when I see everyone else having healthy friendships and going on holiday together without me, but it's more like it's a shame but acceptable and I realize it will never change, neither would I want it to.

How did the teachers and most other students treat you? Different? Or just as part of the class? Were you given any accommodations? Did you feel like the instruction was above your abilities and expectations, or lower than? Did you get bored easily, or have much anxiety? Did you have any unusual quirk or interest in school? A certain aspect of school you hated most?

Part of the class, they didn't knew, they just wrote me off as "quirky" and because senior school lasted 7 years (5 plus 2 years 6th form/college), they all just got used to the fact, that I was like that. People are far too self absorbed to dwell on others for too long. Even the most unusual slant eventually becomes the norm.

I found myself ridiculously bored, very very easily bored. I still get bored easily and really can't stick at anything or see things through. This includes the most mundane things like cooking dinner. But some teachers gave me extra work and additional projects with I found fascinating.

I didn't really hate anything, I had a very rigid routine, but the day was packed with new facts and things to learn. Nowadays I hate hate hate working in an office and wish I could go back to school!

Did you like the teaching style, or did you prefer being taught in a different manner? What recommendations would you have made to make your school experiences better? What were the good things about your school experience? Feel free to answer what you want, no matter how brief or long, as we are interested in learning more about Aspie and Autistic educational experiences.

Nope, I would have much preferred a faster paced, more enthusiastic style, maybe Montessori. However, not too much freedom. I struggled a bit at college/university (ages 18-21) because there was no structure, however, if I did it again now, after having learned to function in society and create my own structure, I would really enjoy it. One day when the kids are older and mr mortgage is under control, I hope to return to academia.

So from the aspie, higher functioning end only, I am glad I got plunged alone into NT society because I learned to adapt. Personally, if I had been sheltered at a young age then I may never have learned to function in society and would not have the options I have now.

In conclusion, on the negative side: I think there are a number of things I wished were different, I wish I had subtitles, there are so many things I understand now that confused me then. Like the fact that people don't mean what they say, like the fact that I need quiet time to process the sensory overload, like the fact I need freedom and get anxious in social gatherings, like the fact that I will get obsessed with special projects and can do well if I use this to my advantage. It took my decades to work all this out, whereas if this forum existed back then, it would have been a shorter road.

On the positive side: I ended up gravitating towards physics, neuroscience, graphics and investment banking. All of these areas seem riddled with people like me to the point that I found a place, many places in fact, and consequently a happy life.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

I attended a Montessori pre-school and did kind of like the hands-on activities (zipping zippers, squeezing my own orange juice, etc.) but my slight enjoyment of school stopped there. Even that school was run by a very eccentric woman whose oddness did seem to trickle down into the personalities of my teachers. And at snack time, it became popular for the other kids to chew their Saltines into the shape of a gun and pretend to shoot you in the head.

I attended public school from grade 1-8, half in suburbia and half inner-city. As an NT, I was supposed to be prepared for school in the proper way: repeatedly told a story of fun, bubbly school buses, exciting learning, and games that would be a blast when played with other happy kids! But my mom was too nuts to know how to do that right. I call it "putting NT kids to sleep". Thus, other children showed up to school with a loyalty to this story and a determination to keep it intact despite any counter feedback. I was like a snail out of my shell.

Public schools are run exactly like prisons...from the fluorescent lights, concrete walls, parading down halls in shameful lines in front of judgemental onlookers, and punishment food on trays to the demand on students/teachers to form cliques, groups and packs that display dominance over others. Recess is held in an ugly building-adjacent yard, usually enclosed by metal fences, and you aren't allowed to leave. When you factor in education, you are receiving the bare-minimum, rigid requirements of what an "inmate" should learn as required by state/federal law, with no attention to children's interests, unique spirits, or desire to learn. I guess it's now apparent that I HATE school.

In high school, I attended a college preparatory in the mountains. The campus was prettier and freer, but I still hated it. It was a half boarding half day school. I was a day student, but over half were boarders. I still couldn't leave. The boarders had been abandoned by their parents and brought their deep-rooted family issues to school everyday. There was a lot of emphasis on sexuality and teachers were in on it too. The educational program was similarly flawed to that in public school. But we had more homework!

Thanks much for sharing your experiences. You described things well. As bad as many school are, I agree, it certainly does not help too when we have teachers and parents that are flawed. Add that to the non-creative and discomforting physical setting, and the other kids that have other differing personalities, interests, ideas, and needs then it is hard for students to learn and teachers to look competent, and especially when the administrators may have pressures or agendas, too. Heck, I bet lots of inner city school lack adequate heating, and are decaying, and in rough neighborhoods.. I would not be motivated to learn there.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

I'm a 40 something mother of 2 sons, I am on the higher functioning aspergers end of the autism spectrum and my husband is about as neurotypical as possible. Answering the questions is almost free therapy, so whilst I have no clue what is best for anyone else, I have been through the wringer and come out the other side, so can share my experiences.

During primary school (5 to 11), I went to a regular, mixed, fully integrated with NTs, state school. I had no friends whatsoever, but actually didn't realize this until decades later.

Then I went to a grammar school at aged 11 and made a friend. She is intelligent, interesting and has ptsd from an abusive childhood. We were both incapable of expressing emotions and for some reason it just kind of worked, we are still in touch today, 30 years on. We did have a wider friend group and they were all the top performers across the various subjects and somehow different and isolated. One of our friends was unnaturally short but a genius in literature and history.

I did get bullied, not so much because I was different (we were teenage girls and so were all 'different'), but because I was basically in rags because my mum couldn't afford to by a school uniform. However, I didn't react at all and aspergered it away, that worked in my favor. Eventually they got bored and probably went to pick on someone else, it was a minor irritation for me at best. Of course I was at a girls school so it was mental bullying, my husband tells me that boys school bullying is more physical.

Did I feel alone? Not in the NT sense of the word, no. As far as I can tell "lonely" to NTs is equated to sad due to no friends. I have never felt this at all. I deal with so much sensory overload that I need the isolation. Friends do interest me, I don't want to say "like monkeys in a laboratory" because I realize that makes me sound pretentious, but I view friendships as an observer. People interest me, but I don't need them to be happy. I do feel something analogous to sad when I see everyone else having healthy friendships and going on holiday together without me, but it's more like it's a shame but acceptable and I realize it will never change, neither would I want it to.



Part of the class, they didn't knew, they just wrote me off as "quirky" and because senior school lasted 7 years (5 plus 2 years 6th form/college), they all just got used to the fact, that I was like that. People are far too self absorbed to dwell on others for too long. Even the most unusual slant eventually becomes the norm.

I found myself ridiculously bored, very very easily bored. I still get bored easily and really can't stick at anything or see things through. This includes the most mundane things like cooking dinner. But some teachers gave me extra work and additional projects with I found fascinating.

I didn't really hate anything, I had a very rigid routine, but the day was packed with new facts and things to learn. Nowadays I hate hate hate working in an office and wish I could go back to school!



Nope, I would have much preferred a faster paced, more enthusiastic style, maybe Montessori. However, not too much freedom. I struggled a bit at college/university (ages 18-21) because there was no structure, however, if I did it again now, after having learned to function in society and create my own structure, I would really enjoy it. One day when the kids are older and mr mortgage is under control, I hope to return to academia.

So from the aspie, higher functioning end only, I am glad I got plunged alone into NT society because I learned to adapt. Personally, if I had been sheltered at a young age then I may never have learned to function in society and would not have the options I have now.

In conclusion, on the negative side: I think there are a number of things I wished were different, I wish I had subtitles, there are so many things I understand now that confused me then. Like the fact that people don't mean what they say, like the fact that I need quiet time to process the sensory overload, like the fact I need freedom and get anxious in social gatherings, like the fact that I will get obsessed with special projects and can do well if I use this to my advantage. It took my decades to work all this out, whereas if this forum existed back then, it would have been a shorter road.

On the positive side: I ended up gravitating towards physics, neuroscience, graphics and investment banking. All of these areas seem riddled with people like me to the point that I found a place, many places in fact, and consequently a happy life.

Thanks for the informative reply. It looks like you had some great, good, neutral and not best experiences in school. I mean, of all the posts seen so far, it looks like you were able to find more benefit. I learned more about how your condition impacted you, and how you coped. And I learned of things through your school experiences, and how your perspectives and feelings for certain things may or may not have changed.

I guess one gripe I have about schools administrators and school talk in general, is the talk, not here, is often about the benefits of socializing. Rarely does one hear of other benefits of schooling. That is telling. First of all, administrators and teachers may disagree, but there can be harms for some with such school socializing, if the crowd and timing is not right, and if it does not fit the situation.

If the school environment is not conducive to learning in the ways best for certain students too, and accepting of all, and if students are pressured to socialize before they are wanting, ready or able, and if certain persons hear too much wrong language, feel too much peer pressure, or bullying, this will defeat the purpose of socializing. Yes, in general, persons cannot protect their children from all wrongs, but must the children be around it every day, and be forced to live with that? Some could be molded very negatively by that or model that.

I guess it depends on the person we are talking about, and their stress tolerance levels and desires to be challenged or to face their fears. For some, immersion therapy, in such a setting could help, to overcome things, if there was enough caring persons, and strength to take one step back and two steps forwards. For others, being around lots of children could backfire, in the ways mentioned. Unfortunately, in this society being shy or introverted is not socially acceptable. Every time I hear a teacher or school official say kids need to be around other students to socialize, I cringe.

Students can learn to be social from more natural activities by getting out in public and doing those things they enjoy, and by doing the things they will do in everyday life. This is less forced. Go at the pace best for them, and be in any crowds best for them. Some may prefer one-to-one dealings. After all, society still has not accepted and appreciated most of those with conditions. So, our belief is, they need not accept societal rules of sitting in classes where others do not like them. Be where they are wanted or want to go, and not where others tell them they have to go.

 

[Gritches]

Holy everliving sweet freaking bajeesus school was terrible. I was a sweet, innocent, polite, well-behaved child and school beat that right the hell out of me, sometimes literally. School screwed me right the hell up.

I grew up in a lot of different places, but where I spent the most time was a small, white farming community adjacent to one of the poorest Indian reservations in the country. I was homeschooled for a year, then sent to regular school. The native kids who were bad enough to get kicked out of the school on the res were sent to our school. This resulted in them being the slim majority, the circumstances around which resulting in a sort of open race war that the whites weren't exactly winning and that nobody did much about. I could write a book about it, but yeah, my retrospective opinion on that is: homeschool > race war.

But for school experiences in general, I guess I'll go through it in a linear fashion, but first the generalities:

-No friends to really speak of. The girls were typically nice to me and if I hung around them it was sort of a shield against bullying, sometimes.
-Teachers usually liked me well enough
-In general, bullying was all day, be it in class, in the halls, wherever. I was very socially awkward, so I guess I brought it on myself in a way

I was kicked out of preschool for reasons I don't remember, and kindergarten for not getting along with the other little pukes. First grade, things were fine (only moderate amounts of torment) until I started having meltdowns in second grade. I was expelled from that elementary school for it, and started going to a different one. At this school, they labeled me special ed to keep me out of the classroom and in the special ed room, where the enormous special ed teacher would taunt, tease, and torment me into having a meltdown at which point he would "evacuate" everyone else out of the room, lock the door, and taunt me and beat me until I would just stay down, which didn't happen until I was too physically exhausted to fight him anymore. He would explain my injuries saying I did it to myself during my "temper tantrum" and that by saying it was him I was just trying to get him into trouble. This went on for three years until my family moved again. To his credit, this is actually how I learned to control my meltdowns.

Next was middle school, the race war school. I wasn't on either side, because the whites would go at me too to try to win the native kids' favor, very long and painful story on that. I was never able to get any protection and in fact I was in trouble most of the time because the school's "disciplinary officer" was native and openly hostile towards whites. Once I was finally expelled for defending myself with a hammer against a group of natives that attacked me, my parents just figured I was a lost cause and would never learn to behave myself and kept me out of school until I turned 16 and got a GED. From there I started college, which was somewhat better.

I guess that was more just my experience, but I'm not quite sure what else to say about school.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

Hi Everyone on AspiesCentral,

I don't have an account here, but my husband, "Dadwith2Autisticsons" is a frequent poster here and just posted an interesting question, so I thought I would reply here too, via his account.

Yes, we do homeschool our two Autistic sons, and it has been good experiences so far. Actually, we both decided early on regarding this, knowing that we both had bad experiences with our own schooling years ago, and because of our older son's bad pre-school experience. Homeschooling was an obvious choice for our family. Heck, we even moved farther across the country, just so we could homeschool better, with less regulations here than where we were before.

Our older son loves being homeschooled, and even tells others that he is homeschooled, which is quite the interesting reaction we get. We for the most part let him choose what he wants to learn, in accordance with the basics too. He is interested in math, science, and computers, and likes to read, write, do workbooks, and watch dvds and go on field trips. Our younger son is still nonverbal, but he is slowly learning through his IPad educational computer programs, and all our other different attempts.
.
In answer to my husband's questions, according to my own experiences:

-No, I did not have many friends in my earlier school days, or through my high school years. I did spend time with some people that I was closer to than others, but they were merely more the 'can I borrow your notes' type of friends. Having behaviour (at that time undiagnosed ADHD and anxiety related) issues and getting into trouble in school certainly did not help me much in terms of friendships.

-Amongst the so-called friends that I had, I would say that they were the 'outcasts', if I had to categorize such people. On top of that, the schools that I went to were very culturally diverse, so the groups would be further sub divided by ethnic groups. Overall, I didn't fit into any group regardless, and just kind of 'traveled around' between people who were lonely or had nobody else to hang out with. For example, I hung out with the class nerd/geek, the absentminded artist, the physically disabled persons, the mentally disabled, etc. As well, I hung out with some teachers of my favorite subjects before and after classes, and got to know them on a more personal level too.

-I was surrounded by many people in elementary school and in high school, with each class averaging 36+ students. So even with lots of people, I still felt lonely, but I did not mind it at all. I spent my lunchtimes in the library or in the hallway, by myself, which I preferred as an introvert and found it less overwhelming sensory-wise to do such. Lol....to this day, I still would to such, if faced in such a situation.

-Back in my day, the only special education programs were for those who were academically falling behind, and had learning disabilities. So I did not qualify for such, as my grades were mostly average (except for math, and phys ed which I hated), and I did especially well the subjects that I liked and were interesting to me (such as English lit. ) I was though given psych evaluations, but nothing was ever done about that in terms of accommodations. There were no IEPS or anything. Lol....I would just cause problems, going to the principal's office if I ever got in trouble with the other students, and life would carry on......

-If I had a personal preference, I would have liked to be homeschooled. I liked learning, but could not stand the other students and they could not stand me. I like doing things on my own, and not letting others' pace and learning preferences get in the way. I did try correspondence courses for university/college and liked that, but had to stop as I decided to get married and chose family life instead of academics.

-The teachers for the most part liked me, especially in the subjects that I did well in. In fact, I had a more fun time talking with the teachers than I had with the other students. Some of the teachers though thought that I was not trying hard enough, but did not know the full extent of how my mental health conditions affected me academically and rarely was I ever given any accommodations. So I just did what I could do to survive academically and socially. The other students were ok, as some of them were nice, but the others basically just ignored me or would laugh at me. Basically liked by teachers, but outcasted by other students.

-I always questioned what I was learning in school, and was often very bored. "Why are we doing this?" I would often ask teachers. And all the others students would not raise such concerns, as the schools that I went to were very competitive and all they cared about were getting high grades to get into the best colleges/universities. I had anxiety too in school, as my grades would be low in certain subjects, and if I was not able to meet those grades, others would not be happy with me, at school and at home.

-My unusual quirk and interest in school was in reading. Anything and everything I would read, except for the assigned textbooks. I would sit and read at the oddest of moments, almost as an escape from the world around me. I hated math, physical education, recess, lunch, and school assemblies, as I did not do well in those subjects and I hated being around other people.

-My learning and teaching style is visual and tactile, so I would write notes in class, so that I could keep up. I had a hard time with verbal/auditory directions (and I still do to this day). Also, I would figit and get very distracted in school, so having a pen and a paper would keep me focused on the lesson at hand. At home, I would do my homework on the couch, or I would pace around, as I could not sit still at all.

-If I had to make the same academic choices all over again, I would have been homeschooled from the very start. I preferred to learn on my own or by one on one instructions. The other students got in the way. I am happy in learning what I wanted to learn, instead of what what is being forced down on me because of rigid curriculum requirements.

-Overall, everyone learns individually and I wish that more people can understand that. Life too, is about learning from experiences, and real life experiences have taught me more at times than textbooks and books. "Learning is lifelong...and never stop learning and gaining new knowledge and experiences, so as to be a better person and be happier in life"

Sincerely,
Dadwith2Autisticson's Wife

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

Holy everliving sweet freaking bajeesus school was terrible. I was a sweet, innocent, polite, well-behaved child and school beat that right the hell out of me, sometimes literally. School screwed me right the hell up.

I grew up in a lot of different places, but where I spent the most time was a small, white farming community adjacent to one of the poorest Indian reservations in the country. I was homeschooled for a year, then sent to regular school. The native kids who were bad enough to get kicked out of the school on the res were sent to our school. This resulted in them being the slim majority, the circumstances around which resulting in a sort of open race war that the whites weren't exactly winning and that nobody did much about. I could write a book about it, but yeah, my retrospective opinion on that is: homeschool > race war.

But for school experiences in general, I guess I'll go through it in a linear fashion, but first the generalities:

-No friends to really speak of. The girls were typically nice to me and if I hung around them it was sort of a shield against bullying, sometimes.
-Teachers usually liked me well enough
-In general, bullying was all day, be it in class, in the halls, wherever. I was very socially awkward, so I guess I brought it on myself in a way

I was kicked out of preschool for reasons I don't remember, and kindergarten for not getting along with the other little pukes. First grade, things were fine (only moderate amounts of torment) until I started having meltdowns in second grade. I was expelled from that elementary school for it, and started going to a different one. At this school, they labeled me special ed to keep me out of the classroom and in the special ed room, where the enormous special ed teacher would taunt, tease, and torment me into having a meltdown at which point he would "evacuate" everyone else out of the room, lock the door, and taunt me and beat me until I would just stay down, which didn't happen until I was too physically exhausted to fight him anymore. He would explain my injuries saying I did it to myself during my "temper tantrum" and that by saying it was him I was just trying to get him into trouble. This went on for three years until my family moved again. To his credit, this is actually how I learned to control my meltdowns.

Next was middle school, the race war school. I wasn't on either side, because the whites would go at me too to try to win the native kids' favor, very long and painful story on that. I was never able to get any protection and in fact I was in trouble most of the time because the school's "disciplinary officer" was native and openly hostile towards whites. Once I was finally expelled for defending myself with a hammer against a group of natives that attacked me, my parents just figured I was a lost cause and would never learn to behave myself and kept me out of school until I turned 16 and got a GED. From there I started college, which was somewhat better.

I guess that was more just my experience, but I'm not quite sure what else to say about school.

My wife thought a few of your statements were funny, but lots of that you went through was upsetting we agree. I think your experiences and writing sounds a bit like her. She has had issues in school too, where she showed her outwardly distaste for certain things, and has similar bad experiences, but she has that sense of humor. You had to, to go through all that bad stuff. Though I think you must have that humorous side too, as a way to cope with all that serious stuff.

 

[Manuheleku]

College was great. Everything leading up to it was pretty bad

 

[Gritches]

My wife thought a few of your statements were funny, but lots of that you went through was upsetting we agree. I think your experiences and writing sounds a bit like her. She has had issues in school too, where she showed her outwardly distaste for certain things, and has similar bad experiences, but she has that sense of humor. You had to, to go through all that bad stuff. Though I think you must have that humorous side too, as a way to cope with all that serious stuff.

Sorry to hear about your wife's experiences. Glad she can laugh about it, though.

The way I figure, you can either laugh or cry, and there are only so many tears down that well.

 

[Adora]

I had a traumatic experience at school,back then I didn't know I was on the Spectrum and was bullied for being quiet and got picked on for my interests including drawing,I didn't have many friends and the one I may have had would end up bullying me,I didn't really have any support due to being undiagnosed back then but i ended up leaving school at age 13 and it's also one of the main reasons why I developed C-PTSD on top of me being on the spectrum,so my opinion is maybe try and have your kids home schooled it's a much safer option and they will probably find it easier to focus on studying.

 

[Bella Pines]

I guess one gripe I have about schools administrators and school talk in general, is the talk, not here, is often about the benefits of socializing. Rarely does one hear of other benefits of schooling. That is telling. First of all, administrators and teachers may disagree, but there can be harms for some with such school socializing, if the crowd and timing is not right, and if it does not fit the situation.

Indeed, both physically and mentally harmful, the effects reaching in to their adult life. I have the same concerns for my boys, trying to work out what environment to expose them to. In retrospect I was safe enough, my aspie wall protected me from psychological torment and girls are less inclined to physical bullying, for me, the more exposure to different situations and cultures, the better.

However, for the more empathatic types (my youngest son is one of them), this may not be the best approach. With my sons I try to look to what sort of environment they will end up in, are they headed towards science and academia? Are they mainstream and headed toward the service industry? Are they office bound? What is the most likely (or best) life they will (are able) to lead?

And that is the environment they need to become accustomed to.

 

[Misery]

For the most part, I'm with the "it was a bloody nightmare" group. May as well rant about it.

Gradeschool was fine. From grades 1-5, everything was nice. 5th grade in particular, I have so many fond memories of. My teacher in that grade was excellent. I would often just sit and talk with him about random stuff and/or rant about computers (that being one of my main interests even back then), and he was great with all of the kids. I remember during that year, every now and then at the end of the day when it was nearly time to leave, some older kids from other schools would show up, just to pay him a visit for the heck of it, as they were previous students of his. I did the same thing, later on. I can tell you though, a truly great teacher like that is very, very rare. You cant expect to find any. He was really the only one I can remember who was like that. One way or another though, it was a great year.

But as soon as 6th grade began, stuff started to go wrong.

First: Yeah, bullied alot. It got more than a little irritating, and one big problem is that most teachers cant seem to spot when it's going on. In highschool, it got so much worse. It was just non-stop. The only thing that finally ended it was when I started learning to manipulate situations to where if the bully tried anything, they'd be effectively self-destructing and end up in big trouble. It's hard for a bully to do the bullying if I have total control over everything, was my reasoning. After the first time where one of them got in *really* big trouble, most of them then stayed out of my way after that (I never broke any rules, either... didnt need to). But that was quite some time in, so quite alot of awfulness before that. I know though that most kids that get bullied cant really find a way out of it. Other people I knew that had it happen to them, it just never stopped. I watched it happen so many times, and while I could control situations around myself, actually intervening in the situations of others wasnt exactly a skill I'd mastered.

Teachers? They treated me fine, for the most part, though alot of the time I suspected that they didnt know what to do with me. But they were nice people for the most part. They often seemed a bit overwhelmed by their jobs though... you know, too many loopy students, and only one teacher in any given room to handle them all at once.

PE was the one where I ended up with special accomodations. I'm extremely stubborn and strong-willed, and one way or another, will always end up doing whatever I like. So if I DONT want to do something, nobody is going to manage to get me to do it. And it was like that in PE class. It was always sports there, or running around the track. I hate sports, and even moreso hated most of the other students, so I refused to actually do anything. Well, I'd do the track... except I'd walk, because screw it, I hated it. During sports, I'd just wander around the field. On a couple of occaisions when the ball would land near me, I'd simply kick it hard in some random direction. Eventually this got the message home, and I ended up in a totally seperate, special PE class that I'd had no idea even existed. Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays, we'd go out to the local driving range (which is encased under a giant... er... something, so it's warm even during the winter) and hit golf balls there. Which, to me, was so much more acceptable (I did rather like golf). It also had the odd side effect of me carrying around a golf club all day, on those days. Like, everywhere. I pretty much never went to my locker for any reason, so all of my stuff was always with me, and that included the golf club. These days, that'd NEVER be allowed, with all of the nasty stuff that has happened at so many schools at this point, but back then (1997-2000) nobody tried to stop me. Helped that all of the faculty knew me. Carrying that around also probably lessened the bullying a bit, because, well, big metal golf club. On the two days of the week when I didnt go there, I was in the normal class, but wasnt expected to participate in sports and instead just walked laps around the track regardless of what everyone else was doing. Suited me fine.

And yes, I got bored easily. I remember back then, my parents would sometimes ramble at me about how important it was, and blah blah blah, and I would always say to them: "The stuff they're teaching, I'm NEVER going to need that. Really, I wont". They'd say otherwise. In the end, I was entirely right. I know ALOT of stuff about many subjects now, but almost NONE of it was learned in school. I learned it on my own. The ability to type being the only exception, and the one thing I can thank highschool for. Other than that though, the lessons were dull, slow, and uninteresting, usually on topics that I didnt care about and knew would be of no use to me. Wheras on my own, I taught myself the use of computers (this being back when DOS was still a thing). Among other things.

Generally, in class, I rarely paid attention. It was boring, and I'm not good at focusing on only one thing at a time, so my mind wandered, pretty much the whole day. As such, very little was accomplished, and my grades tended to be terrible. Homework was the worst. It was rare that I even remembered to do it, and really... I didnt care. I loathed school so much and was in a bad mood pretty much non-stop, so it just didnt matter to me. Granted, dark moods are pretty much the default for me (thus my name) but still, it was worse moods than usual on the days when I had school.

Gradeschool at least had been better. Kids werent total jerks, the teachers as a whole actually had an understanding of the concept of fun, and recess was great. I remember me and a friend used to go to the computer lab sometimes at recess, and we had some games (on disks) that we'd bring, and just play those in there. The faculty in THAT school was great, and to them, it didnt matter that it was games: They spotted that we both understood the computers, and that it was useful knowledge, and the games generated an interest in the computers, so they absolutely let us do it. Again, this was during the DOS days, so it took a bit of knowledge to even get the games running... Windows wasnt a thing yet, no user-friendly interface there. If only the grades past 5 could have been so accomodating, but no, they never were. It was always do things ONE way, or trouble would be had.

The only recommendation that I could have made to make my school experience better after grade 5 would have been to not have school at all. Which I suppose would have resulted in homeschooling. It would have been... so much better. Instead, the majority of what I learned was just how nasty people could really be, and as a result, I'm a total misanthrope most of the time and tend to not think very highly of the general population. That's a personality trait gained from all that, and it's never going away.

As for friends, I knew like, TWO others. One of which I'm still close to today. I understand that one reason parents want their kids to go to public schools is for the social aspect, but... honestly, to an autistic child, well, there's a pretty good chance that they dont care about that whatsoever.


Honestly, if an autistic child has a chance at avoiding public school? Absolutely go for it. You'll be saving them SO much trouble and general suffering.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

Indeed, both physically and mentally harmful, the effects reaching in to their adult life. I have the same concerns for my boys, trying to work out what environment to expose them to. In retrospect I was safe enough, my aspie wall protected me from psychological torment and girls are less inclined to physical bullying, for me, the more exposure to different situations and cultures, the better.

However, for the more empathatic types (my youngest son is one of them), this may not be the best approach. With my sons I try to look to what sort of environment they will end up in, are they headed towards science and academia? Are they mainstream and headed toward the service industry? Are they office bound? What is the most likely (or best) life they will (are able) to lead?

And that is the environment they need to become accustomed to.

I was way too shy and empathetic in school, and school is really horrible for those personality types. But, despite me speaking hardly nothing, I was more the leader type and did not want to follow. I had my own ideas, beliefs, abilities and needs. The others had theirs. I often questioned myself why.

Yes, we are often wondering too about our sons. What job, if any, will they be able to work at. Will they pick one they would be good at, or just because that job would make them happy? Or will the environment play a big role because of sensory issues, or personality?

Or will one day they want to work together in some small business? Right now our two sons are so different despite both being Autistic. Sometimes differences attract and can be good,but sometimes repel and grate on nerves. As things are right now, they likely will be doing something separately.

Aaron, our 7-year old, we think will gravitate to some profession that involves science, math or computers, but we would not be surprised or disappointed if he chose something else much less accepted. Our youngest, Dylan, with energetic issues, and who is 5-years old, likely may prefer something entirely different.

It would seem like he may prefer some job where he can move around. He is really small, so that plays a factor in things, so I can safely rule out most professional sports. He could gravitate to the arts and entertainment field, or just want to do something alone. It will take more time and understanding to figure things for each child out.

We just know right now, we could not consider public or private schooling for them. There would be far more risks than benefits. Even when we asked the pre-school administrator four years ago when Aaron was three, "Could Aaron want to model any of those children's behaviors in that special needs classroom they placed him in?" her voice reply coldly was "Perhaps." She did not elaborate further.

At least she was honest though. Despite that, we gave it a three day try, and it did not work out. Had they integrated him in with NT's, I do not think things would have been better, but worse. Regardless, it was not a fit then, and now. We trust our own abilities more than the schools.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

For the most part, I'm with the "it was a bloody nightmare" group. May as well rant about it.

Gradeschool was fine. From grades 1-5, everything was nice. 5th grade in particular, I have so many fond memories of. My teacher in that grade was excellent. I would often just sit and talk with him about random stuff and/or rant about computers (that being one of my main interests even back then), and he was great with all of the kids. I remember during that year, every now and then at the end of the day when it was nearly time to leave, some older kids from other schools would show up, just to pay him a visit for the heck of it, as they were previous students of his. I did the same thing, later on. I can tell you though, a truly great teacher like that is very, very rare. You cant expect to find any. He was really the only one I can remember who was like that. One way or another though, it was a great year.

But as soon as 6th grade began, stuff started to go wrong.

First: Yeah, bullied alot. It got more than a little irritating, and one big problem is that most teachers cant seem to spot when it's going on. In highschool, it got so much worse. It was just non-stop. The only thing that finally ended it was when I started learning to manipulate situations to where if the bully tried anything, they'd be effectively self-destructing and end up in big trouble. It's hard for a bully to do the bullying if I have total control over everything, was my reasoning. After the first time where one of them got in *really* big trouble, most of them then stayed out of my way after that (I never broke any rules, either... didnt need to). But that was quite some time in, so quite alot of awfulness before that. I know though that most kids that get bullied cant really find a way out of it. Other people I knew that had it happen to them, it just never stopped. I watched it happen so many times, and while I could control situations around myself, actually intervening in the situations of others wasnt exactly a skill I'd mastered.

Teachers? They treated me fine, for the most part, though alot of the time I suspected that they didnt know what to do with me. But they were nice people for the most part. They often seemed a bit overwhelmed by their jobs though... you know, too many loopy students, and only one teacher in any given room to handle them all at once.

PE was the one where I ended up with special accomodations. I'm extremely stubborn and strong-willed, and one way or another, will always end up doing whatever I like. So if I DONT want to do something, nobody is going to manage to get me to do it. And it was like that in PE class. It was always sports there, or running around the track. I hate sports, and even moreso hated most of the other students, so I refused to actually do anything. Well, I'd do the track... except I'd walk, because screw it, I hated it. During sports, I'd just wander around the field. On a couple of occaisions when the ball would land near me, I'd simply kick it hard in some random direction. Eventually this got the message home, and I ended up in a totally seperate, special PE class that I'd had no idea even existed. Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays, we'd go out to the local driving range (which is encased under a giant... er... something, so it's warm even during the winter) and hit golf balls there. Which, to me, was so much more acceptable (I did rather like golf). It also had the odd side effect of me carrying around a golf club all day, on those days. Like, everywhere. I pretty much never went to my locker for any reason, so all of my stuff was always with me, and that included the golf club. These days, that'd NEVER be allowed, with all of the nasty stuff that has happened at so many schools at this point, but back then (1997-2000) nobody tried to stop me. Helped that all of the faculty knew me. Carrying that around also probably lessened the bullying a bit, because, well, big metal golf club. On the two days of the week when I didnt go there, I was in the normal class, but wasnt expected to participate in sports and instead just walked laps around the track regardless of what everyone else was doing. Suited me fine.

And yes, I got bored easily. I remember back then, my parents would sometimes ramble at me about how important it was, and blah blah blah, and I would always say to them: "The stuff they're teaching, I'm NEVER going to need that. Really, I wont". They'd say otherwise. In the end, I was entirely right. I know ALOT of stuff about many subjects now, but almost NONE of it was learned in school. I learned it on my own. The ability to type being the only exception, and the one thing I can thank highschool for. Other than that though, the lessons were dull, slow, and uninteresting, usually on topics that I didnt care about and knew would be of no use to me. Wheras on my own, I taught myself the use of computers (this being back when DOS was still a thing). Among other things.

Generally, in class, I rarely paid attention. It was boring, and I'm not good at focusing on only one thing at a time, so my mind wandered, pretty much the whole day. As such, very little was accomplished, and my grades tended to be terrible. Homework was the worst. It was rare that I even remembered to do it, and really... I didnt care. I loathed school so much and was in a bad mood pretty much non-stop, so it just didnt matter to me. Granted, dark moods are pretty much the default for me (thus my name) but still, it was worse moods than usual on the days when I had school.

Gradeschool at least had been better. Kids werent total jerks, the teachers as a whole actually had an understanding of the concept of fun, and recess was great. I remember me and a friend used to go to the computer lab sometimes at recess, and we had some games (on disks) that we'd bring, and just play those in there. The faculty in THAT school was great, and to them, it didnt matter that it was games: They spotted that we both understood the computers, and that it was useful knowledge, and the games generated an interest in the computers, so they absolutely let us do it. Again, this was during the DOS days, so it took a bit of knowledge to even get the games running... Windows wasnt a thing yet, no user-friendly interface there. If only the grades past 5 could have been so accomodating, but no, they never were. It was always do things ONE way, or trouble would be had.

The only recommendation that I could have made to make my school experience better after grade 5 would have been to not have school at all. Which I suppose would have resulted in homeschooling. It would have been... so much better. Instead, the majority of what I learned was just how nasty people could really be, and as a result, I'm a total misanthrope most of the time and tend to not think very highly of the general population. That's a personality trait gained from all that, and it's never going away.

As for friends, I knew like, TWO others. One of which I'm still close to today. I understand that one reason parents want their kids to go to public schools is for the social aspect, but... honestly, to an autistic child, well, there's a pretty good chance that they dont care about that whatsoever.


Honestly, if an autistic child has a chance at avoiding public school? Absolutely go for it. You'll be saving them SO much trouble and general suffering.

Thanks for the reply. It's ok to rant. How you described your educational situation, it was very similar to my wife's. She posted a little about that through one of my posts, but may or may not have focused on her rebellious side and temperamental issues there.

She had no huge issue with the teachers, and found one or more she really liked, but she was stubborn, got bored extremely easily, too, and often tried to get her way for things. She could not concentrate and her mind was elsewhere and overly active in wanting to do something else.

Her assertiveness, at times unruly behavior and creative ways to getting persons to tolerate things or back away scared off lots of teachers and potential bullies.

It is unfortunate, but that is the way some students who feel very different, bored, but able in other ways and unable to express those in school systems, must act when persons do do understand, nor attempt to dig deeper and consider other approaches.

Maybe had she been diagnosed with her attention and hyperactive issues earlier that could have made some difference, but I doubt it. Her mother was in denial of things, as she wanted her daughter to succeed in traditional schools and prestigious universities.

She would have fared way better studying at home at her own pace, and doing the subject coursework in the order she preferred, and hyper focusing on her preferred interests, before doing that less interesting stuf. And she would have avoided all those student conflicts.

 

[Dadwith2Autisticsons]

I had a traumatic experience at school,back then I didn't know I was on the Spectrum and was bullied for being quiet and got picked on for my interests including drawing,I didn't have many friends and the one I may have had would end up bullying me,I didn't really have any support due to being undiagnosed back then but i ended up leaving school at age 13 and it's also one of the main reasons why I developed C-PTSD on top of me being on the spectrum,so my opinion is maybe try and have your kids home schooled it's a much safer option and they will probably find it easier to focus on studying.

We agree, thanks. Even if it just was the potential for bullying, we would have concerns, much less worries if they were teaching in the best ways for each child, and likely unwillingness to give any needed accommodations.

We do not like the one size fits all philosophy. It may work for many students, but not for our children, and for those others who want a more individualized and more caring approach.

 

[Peeweezers]

I found school to be a place where I was (often) respected, because I had the little professor thing of Asperger's going on. I was also the kid in the 6th grade that everyone hated (new school). I grew up in a small rural Kansas town, then moved to LA by the time of high school. I was not diagnosed until I was 52, so I am on the mild side. I think very small towns can be very good for people with autism. Donald Triplett, the first man diagnosed with Autism, still lives in his small town, and the townspeople look after him.

 

[Nicci]

I was not diagnosed as a child but it was pretty clear to everyone that I was different. I went to a public school. I had one friend whose side I never left. That was very helpful. But I still hated school. I was always counting down the minutes, waiting for it to be over. I was not bullied, only because there were other kids in my class who were more fun to bully (I didn't react, while they did) and because my one friend was very likeable and popular.
I was very bored in school and also didn't understand the point of being there. I was never challenged academically during the first 6 or so years, which became a problem later on because I had no idea how to learn or study something new. At one point they considered moving me up a grade in order to challenge me more, but because of my nonexistent social skills they didn't. I don't know if it would have made a difference. In general, the teaching style was completely off for me. Teachers always made things more confusing when trying to explain them. So many unnecessary metaphors I didn't understand the point or relevance of. They always made things seem way more complicated than they were.
I always felt very alone. I didn't understand what it meant to be friends or how people made them. My one friendship was more of a security blanket with someone I could imitate and follow around so I didn't have to engage with anybody else. And if that did happen, she could do the talking instead of me.
I believe things would have been more bearable for me if I'd had some (or just one) likeminded friends. What I remember most from school is feeling like an outsider. Always being lonely but not understanding that was what I felt. Constantly on the outside looking in at confusing people and situations everywhere. I think things would have been different had I had my diagnosis back then. But as things were, I did not learn much in school and I definitely never enjoyed myself there.

 

[toothless]

hi dadwith2sons,hope you are having a good day.
i think it might be a bad thing to read reports on our schooling as we are all grown up and a lot of bad things were allowed to happen back then plus there was no understanding of disabilities,those of us with severe autism and ID were called by the teachers backward and unteachable, people with CP were called spastics,and peopel with ADHD were called wild naughty children.

for me my school day consisted of being hit with wooden rulers throughout the day, being pinned against a table or wall roughly and being thrown down on the floor in the head masters office and kept there all day with no stimulation;left to stay in my own world and a world of confusion on the outside- my behaviors were always disrupting the class or the teacher was very biased about me.
it was a catholic school with a church joined to it,and i would refuse the special bread the priest gives because of sensory issues with it and the teachers would kick off and try and physically force it in me,one of them called me a devil child.

i have PTSD affected by my school education,the only school that ever helped me made progress was a special school but i got expelled at 15 from there for very challenging behavior and was never found another placement so i just sat using a computer in my bedroom 24/7.