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From a neurotypical's perspective

I thought non-verbal meant level 2 or 3, whether they can understand written language or not. And I thought articulately verbal meant level 1 or 2.

I'm level 1, and even without masking I'm not obvious. I'm eccentric and quirky, but still nothing that screams autism.
 
My ASD3 daughter is pre-verbal, meaning she is infantile and has not yet acquired speech.
Non-verbal used to be called mute. They do not necessarily have cognitive deficits.
 
I have met some people online who can hear, but use sign language, because they have speech dyspraxia - severe problems with pronounciation. Some in the deaf community can speak technically, but don't or experience difficulty. A lot of people are deaf and hard of hearing due to neurological disorders and experience also issues with movement and/or vision. It's not balck and white.
 
Social distancing was mentioned several times on this thread. I can say quite a few words about it.

Everyone understands what physically social distancing means, but why is it so important to maintain it in the COVID era? I am NT, but I don’t understand the reasons behind the COVID social distancing because there are none. This concept was introduced arbitrary with total disrespect of scientific data.

In his book, Uncontrolled Spread, former FDA Commissioner, Scott Gottlieb, criticized the concept as a “stroke of its proponents’ imagination”. An article in The NY Times (the most influential US newspaper) explained how ridiculous the concept is. Well, I didn’t need an explanation, I saw it right from the start how unscientific the concept is. Apparently, the whole idea of social distancing looks moronic to the intelligent autistic people, too.

But there is a huge difference between myself and autistic individuals – if someone claims that I am wrong, my opponent can’t ignore me on the ground that I have some kind of condition. He/she is forced to listen to me and let me have the last word meaning that my arguments are more persuasive than theirs.

Unfortunately, autistic people are not taken seriously, and some stupid psychologists insist they are unable to comprehend the “logic’ of social distancing.
 
I don't know, it's just my autistic friend was in one of the priority groups when the covid vaccines were first rolled out. He said he has no physical health problems but still was prioritised because he has autism, and apparently people with autism or intellectual disability were a priority group apparently. But I wasn't, so I was wondering if it's because my medical records say Asperger's so I got treated like I'm NT, which is what I want when I don't need to be prioritised.
 
vergil96 said:
Not completely.
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What I meant by replaced was that all the related developmental personality disorders related to autism were merged into the ASD category with that being subdivided into the three subsections according (I believe) to need, and it's this that subsequent laws (such as requirement for support, and legal representation, etc) are created to apply to. I didn't mean everyone diagnosed Aspergers is now ASD1.

I'm no expert, but I thought the 1/2/3 was related mostly with support needs, i.e. according to symptom rather than cause? I always assumed this was one of the bones of contention between the need of autistics to understand themselves, and the need for society to provide support for them where needed, and it's the latter the diagnosis system focuses on because that recognised as having the greatest benefit for those who need that support.

vergil96 said:
I don't know what it was supposed to improve and how it's supposed to be more inclusive, it just produces more unnecessary labels.
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But are they unnecessary? If the previous labels were not adequate, then more/new/different labels may be what's needed? (not saying they are, but this isn't just adding new terms for the sake of it, it's more the nature of an immature but evolving area of medicine).
I appreciate it's not nice having the rug pulled out from under you once you've got used to understanding yourself from one frame of reference (Aspergers in this case), that you learnt to live and come to terms with, to have it replaced by something similar but different isn't very helpful, but the nature of the beast is we move toward a better state, which implies things will not be ideal until we reach that state, and the journey there isn't always easy but necessary if we want something better.

Far as I know (or read at least) one reason was that it made autistic diagnoses run on a single scale, in other words Asperger's was recognised as also being a form of autism with enough commonalities to make including those people with the treatment & support available for other autistics as far more effective and efficient (and hopefully fairer). We oft complain that medics don't understand autism, so we need to evolve better methods to improve this, rationalising is one way towards this.
 
Misty Avich said:
I don't know, it's just my autistic friend was in one of the priority groups when the covid vaccines were first rolled out. He said he has no physical health problems but still was prioritised because he has autism, and apparently people with autism or intellectual disability were a priority group apparently. But I wasn't, so I was wondering if it's because my medical records say Asperger's so I got treated like I'm NT, which is what I want when I don't need to be prioritised.
Click to expand...
You shouldn't take it personally. Things like vaccinations are not really intended for individual health benefits, but rather for population health. The rules they apply as to whom should be prioritised are by necessity relatively crude and lacking nuance. If they were done to allow for individuals, the pandemic would be over by the time they worked out who to prioritise and who not to. To say it has nothing to do with things like an autism diagnosis is putting it mildly, it's pretty much the opposite of individualistic. By necessity the authorities have to lump groups together as best they can and sometimes those decisions may well appear quite arbitrary from a personal p.o.v.
 
Boogs said:
I didn't mean everyone diagnosed Aspergers is now ASD1.
Click to expand...
Apparently effectively they are?

Boogs said:
I'm no expert, but I thought the 1/2/3 was related mostly with support needs, i.e. according to symptom rather than cause?
Click to expand...
There is no change if the levels still describe intellectual disability but treat it like an ugly name. There is no support for other people if this is the case.

In my opinion the whole conversation around "support needs" also buys into the harmful trend to call something a "feeling" or "need" only if the individual manifests it in the crudest way possible or doesn't understand their own problem. If you don't know psychological jargon, you'd be inclined to believe that someone with Asperger's doesn't need any support or maybe just going to a psychologist, because the language used implies so.

Boogs said:
I appreciate it's not nice having the rug pulled out from under you once you've got used to understanding yourself from one frame of reference (Aspergers in this case), that you learnt to live and come to terms with, to have it replaced by something similar but different isn't very helpful, but the nature of the beast is we move toward a better state, which implies things will not be ideal until we reach that state, and the journey there isn't always easy but necessary if we want something better.
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Me? No, I'm just frustrated with the whole system. I was diagnosed not long ago and it drives me nuts how a good idea (autism and Asperger's are in fact one condition, but IQ is different) got warped into something that creates even more boxes and creates the wrong impression about the needs of support.

Boogs said:
including those people with the treatment & support available for other autistics as far more effective and efficient (and hopefully fairer).
Click to expand...
I'm not sure how any autistic person without intellectual disability gets any kind of support other than CBT. Certainly not my experience. It was extremely hard to get the tiniest bit of support. I experienced a lot of harm because of medical obliviousness.
 
vergil96 said:
Apparently effectively they are?
Click to expand...
Um, now your confusing me, I though you just said they weren't? Can you explain?

vergil96 said:
There is no change if the levels still describe intellectual disability but treat it like an ugly name. There is no support for other people if this is the case.
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But do they? Is intellect considered an official part of autism diagnosis, and what's the 'ugly name'? I'm not totally sure what you mean.
You say 'if this is the case' but are you saying you think it is? If so what aspects are you referring to? Do the three levels include anything about intellect and if so what? (I've never gone through the process or looked at the details of how diagnosis is managed).

vergil96 said:
I'm not sure how any autistic person without intellectual disability gets any kind of support other than CBT. Certainly not my experience. It was extremely hard to get the tiniest bit of support. I experienced a lot of harm because of medical obliviousness.
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I'm sure you understand autism research and understanding is in it's infancy, and that means instead of getting some things wrong, lots of things are done wrongly. Not through malice or suchlike, but through an immature understanding and general lack of resources.

I don't know if intellect plays a big part in defining support, or in diagnosing autism, but they are not necessarily the same thing, and don't always match up. For one thing, although DSM5 is very heavily used globally, how that relates to the effective diagnosis in your particular country, but separately how the support is allocated which is as much a social and political thing as medical (maybe more so).

Another side to things is the age of diagnosis effects what support is available too. Whenever resource are inadequate (when are they not!) again some sort of prioritisation must take place, and I suspect most of that goes towards children than adults (for multiple different reasons). Same with those with greater intellectual impairment, they need more support than the same person who has all their mental faculties, and have the advantage to be able to navigate society better than those who don't, however hard that my be. A simplistic and crude decider, but nonetheless relevant.
 
I'm not sure how a label changes much, everyone knows Asperger's is autism. I'm sure they get a lot of satisfaction from fiddling about with terminology, it keeps a pointy head busy. Still no funding. I know in the UK if you have aspergers, you're expected to function at the level of an average neuro typical and won't get any leeway. So if you don't have supportive family, or strong adaptability, you'll be at much higher risk of being out on the street. There is a lot of talk of inclusivity, being kind and mental health awareness by the authorities, but it's virtue signalling waffle that gets thrown out at the first hint of trouble. Then all diagnosis' are treated as insincere excuses. They rubberneck the car crash, but not the root cause.
 
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Will I be slung out on the streets? I worry about ending up homeless every day. At the moment I don't expect any support but when it comes to being homeless that's when I WILL need support of some sort because I am terrified of the streets and surely they can't expect a timid, vulnerable woman to just live on the streets. I'd just die.
 
I feel for you saw my brother lose his job due to co- morbidities, lost his marriage, house, unable to find re employment, Even being a genius did not help, lived in my basement for a while rent free. then moved into my brothers, house for a while as he was always away from home due to his job, hard to get insurance on empty house. guess the best safety net is family. We took care of my brother for 30 years, Even through he resisted hand outs. Another brother even offered maid service to maintain his living space as he was not to good at looking after him self.
 
I was unemployed once, while searching for another position, my wife got her notice, fortunately she was attending night school, company new policy educational requirements for her position we had anticipated this, Her employer was paying her tuition, so they retracked the notice. Over time she got her diploma, two year, in accounting. Employer got merged into a large bank. She took more courses, got second diploma, three year in business administration. Actually by her example both my sons followed her both graduated with three thee diplomas before she did, So yes planning works anticipate the future as much as you can.
 
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